WAC Expansion: UTSA/Texas St to give formal presentations

[Silenoz]

Ours were, what, $230?

I don't feel like doing actual math, so... CASE CLOSED

[∞∞∞]

At James Madison, they are $1,400 per student per year. Old Dominion and Appalachian State are about $700 per student/year; while the average in the Big Sky Conference is $200/student/year.

ODU's student athletic fees are (barely) higher than JMU's, so I'm not sure where he's getting the $700 figure. Plus they're both around $1100, not $1400.

Heck, had we gone to the WAC a few years ago, we’d probably be in a much more lucrative Mountain West Conference right now with schools we consider on academic par – Wyoming, Colorado State, etc.

Not that he isn't saying the truth, but there's nothing more attractive than the AD you're courting saying that they'd rather be in the MWC...and showing that they'd move from the WAC as soon as they get the chance. And in another indirect way, he just dissed the WAC's academic standards compared to the MWC. If I was the WAC's commissioner, I'd be really upset at the above statement. But then again, the WAC is a helluva desperate league right now.

Otherwise, the letter gives great insights into the Montana situation, and the FCS as a whole.

[89Hen]

Our season tickets are $120. Now someone figure it out.

Ours were, what, $230?

Then I take back my bullshit call and change it to incredulous.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Our season tickets are $120. Now someone figure it out.

Ours were, what, $230?

Then I take back my bullshit call and change it to incredulous.

$230 was the absolute min. also for endzone seating.

[BearIt]

The FCS playoff system is hurting financially. We produced $1.1 million of last year’s budget of $2.5 million. The other 11 games produced less than $1 million TOTAL.

Wow, The FCS is pretty financially dependent on the Griz being there.
I wonder how long the playoff system will survive if Montana isn't there for several seasons whether it is from not qualifying or moving to FBS.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

The FCS playoff system is hurting financially. We produced $1.1 million of last year’s budget of $2.5 million. The other 11 games produced less than $1 million TOTAL.

Wow, The FCS is pretty financially dependent on the Griz being there.
I wonder how long the playoff system will survive if Montana isn't there for several seasons whether it is from not qualifying or moving to FBS.

I wasn't trying to be a prick to a lot of the posters that are always bitching about the home playoff games for MT, App, & Delaware but I've been saying this for years now. They want to cry about the fact that the NCAA has to be able to float this playoff on the back of these teams. Well see how fucking long it lasts without the heavyweights bringing in the dough to support it.

I've maintained that pretty much any team not named MT, App., or Delaware ought to be fucking thanking us for the largesse we provide them instead of crying about the home games we get.

[DJH]

Oh BS. Technically the NCAA is supposed to be a non-profit organization anyway. I'm sure the FBS bowl games, and the NCAA basketball tournament are the ONLY sports to actually make money. Are they going to start cutting EVERY other postseason for EVERY other sport? Because you can bet your ass that women's lacrosse and swimming and diving teams all over the country are losing money for the NCAA too. The NCAA has plenty of money.

The FCS and the FCS playoffs are not going anywhere. Personally, I wish Montana would just shit or get off the pot. If you want to leave, just GTFO, and stop talking about it.

[dbackjon]

Oh BS. Technically the NCAA is supposed to be a non-profit organization anyway. I'm sure the FBS bowl games, and the NCAA basketball tournament are the ONLY sports to actually make money. Are they going to start cutting EVERY other postseason for EVERY other sport? Because you can bet your ass that women's lacrosse and swimming and diving teams all over the country are losing money for the NCAA too. The NCAA has plenty of money.

The FCS and the FCS playoffs are not going anywhere. Personally, I wish Montana would just shit or get off the pot. If you want to leave, just GTFO, and stop talking about it.

yup. Other than men's basketball, no post-season tourney makes money. Men's hoops subsidize the whole system.

[∞∞∞]

Yeah, I think that email is more doom and gloom than some are giving it credit for. I mean, it's an AMAZING piece of information, but Montana isn't the end all be all of the FCS playoffs. If they go FBS, others will take their place. Not to toot my own horn here, but ODU for one is probably a good example...and we're here to stay for the forseeable future. JMU is another, and I'm sure there are more.

By the way, if the Griz move up, does Montana St. begin getting their former FCS pool of recruits? Does MSU pick up the legacy what UM will leave behind in that state?

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

The first thing they'd do is trim expenses if it was losing too much money. That's the fact Jack.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

Yeah, I think that email is more doom and gloom than some are giving it credit for. I mean, it's an AMAZING piece of information, but Montana isn't the end all be all of the FCS playoffs. If they go FBS, others will take their place. Not to toot my own horn here, but ODU for one is probably a good example...and we're here to stay for the forseeable future. JMU is another, and I'm sure there are more.

By the way, if the Griz move up, does Montana St. begin getting their former FCS pool of recruits? Does MSU pick up the legacy what UM will leave behind in that state?

Possibly a little bit. I know that I will be traveling to MSU to watch playoff football if this all comes to fruition. It is extremely doubtful that the Griz will be in a bowl game that I will give a flying fuck about. I will become a lot more of a fan of MSU Football than I have ever been in the past. To be honest though, I've always rooted for them if they weren't playing us.

[∞∞∞]

The first thing they'd do is trim expenses if it was losing too much money. That's the fact Jack.

Does this email change your mind about not wanting to move up? I feel like it paints a bleak picture for UM, but I'm trying to see this from the perspective of an AD who may simply be trying to find a reason for making the jump. There's a lot of reasons why Montana should go, but I think very little for why they shouldn't. Maybe there really aren't many reasons UM shouldn't, but my gut is telling me that there are and he purposely didn't include them in the email.

[DJH]

The first thing they'd do is trim expenses if it was losing too much money. That's the fact Jack.

Actually, the first thing they would/did do is ADD teams to the playoffs. That IS a fact, jack.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

The first thing they'd do is trim expenses if it was losing too much money. That's the fact Jack.

Does this email change your mind about not wanting to move up? I feel like it paints a bleak picture for UM, but I'm trying to see this from the perspective of an AD who may simply be trying to find a reason for making the jump. There's a lot of reasons why Montana should go, but I think very little for why they shouldn't. Maybe there really aren't many reasons UM shouldn't, but my gut is telling me that there are and he purposely didn't include them in the email.

I think it was fairly open and honest. It doesn't change my mind because it is slanted in the direction you've expressed a little bit though. As with UM they always lay out the expenses very clearly but the revenues are somewhat glossed over. A lot of the revenue that SHOULD be classified as football revenue are not. I'm sure if the BSC members were to let us have the money WE are responsible for then it would tip the scales slightly.

On one hand he talks about the TV revenue that is accorded to the home school when the Griz are involved. I get that, but how about in OUR OWN school, at our own games we accord the money made AT OUR games to our own football program?

There was a ton of good info. in there but it was skewed that direction for a reason. As I said about a year ago what you do to get the fan base moving the way you want them to go is lay out a couple of options...one shitty that you know they won't go for, one that may not be what a lot of the fan base wants but is better than the less attractive option, while saying that staying with what you're doing is untenable.

Adding things like "the faculty doesn't consider BSC members as peer institutions" seems like an emotional bunch of BS that had no business being in there.

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

The first thing they'd do is trim expenses if it was losing too much money. That's the fact Jack.

Actually, the first thing they would/did do is ADD teams to the playoffs. That IS a fact, jack.

Very likely. They would then completely regionalize it like D2. Good stuff right?

[frinq]

If you ask any faculty anywhere who they compare themselves to, the answer will always be several academic rungs above where they actually are. I agree; this is AD BS. I chuckled when I read that "Montana faculty" figured they were on par with U. Washington (or most of the others mentioned).

[Ursus A. Horribilis]

If you ask any faculty anywhere who they compare themselves to, the answer will always be several academic rungs above where they actually are. I agree; this is AD BS. I chuckled when I read that "Montana faculty" figured they were on par with U. Washington (or most of the others mentioned).

Exactly. It was as unnecessary as it gets.

If that truly is part of all this then integrity of it just went down quite a few notches.

[SDHornet]

In the email he also put quite a bit of stock in making money at a bowl game which isn't fact unless its a BCS bowl game or one of the very few non-BCS bowl games (Holiday Bowl has a decent payout, no idea about others).

[chris]

eGriz.com was mentioned in CBS's College Football Blog

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entr ... 8/25072871

Montana's AD Jim O'Day has heard these concerns, and replied with a remarkably long, detailed e-mail that was circulated among Montana fans before being posted to eGriz.com, a popular Montana Grizzlies fan board. We have confirmed with the Montana athletic department that the letter is genuine. And while it's much too long to post here in full, there was one particularly scary detail about how the school currently struggles with finances (bolded emphasis ours):

[Fresno St. Alum]

In the email he also put quite a bit of stock in making money at a bowl game which isn't fact unless its a BCS bowl game or one of the very few non-BCS bowl games (Holiday Bowl has a decent payout, no idea about others).

I think the minimum pay out for a bowl is 750K per team. I'm not 100% on it, it was in the local paper a few years ago. I know it 750K(my rainman instinct says so) but the fresno bee might be wrong.

[Fresno St. Alum]

What's funny is you guys bitching about a probable future rule that won't matter one bit to UTSA, Texas St., Montana if they want to move up. Let me simplify what Quinn(csi) said. WAC is a desperate ho looking for dick. Montana, UTSA, Texas St., have dicks and want to bang her. Montana is the only one worried about STDs. Denver & Seattle are girls with dildos and the WAC is flirting with them too. Point is they'll be in the WAC if they whip it out. The NCAA won't cock block that

[chris]

now that is an analogy for the record books

[Willie]

What's funny is you guys bitching about a probable future rule that won't matter one bit to UTSA, Texas St., Montana if they want to move up. Let me simplify what Quinn(csi) said. WAC is a desperate ho looking for dick. Montana, UTSA, Texas St., have dicks and want to bang her. Montana is the only one worried about STDs. Denver & Seattle are girls with dildos and the WAC is flirting with them too. Point is they'll be in the WAC if they whip it out. The NCAA won't cock block that

[freebird]

Yeah, I think that email is more doom and gloom than some are giving it credit for. I mean, it's an AMAZING piece of information, but Montana isn't the end all be all of the FCS playoffs. If they go FBS, others will take their place. Not to toot my own horn here, but ODU for one is probably a good example...and we're here to stay for the forseeable future. JMU is another, and I'm sure there are more.

By the way, if the Griz move up, does Montana St. begin getting their former FCS pool of recruits? Does MSU pick up the legacy what UM will leave behind in that state?

Montana only has around 30 in state players on their roster (covering all 5 eligibility years). I'm not sure how many of those are walk ons and some might still be on their roster if they were recruiting at the BCS level. So MSU would probably pick up some in state recruits, but it would not appear to be a significant number.