The Ukraine Crisis

[SeattleGriz]

Only guys who've never served and have no skin in the game are alright with sending hundreds of thousands young men to their death to sharpen a country's military and industry.

Klam Romney.

You're assuming that these men won't fight and die if US aid is stopped. It's entirely possible that they see this as a fight for Ukraine's very existence and that they'll server their country and fight anyway.

More could die without US assistance than with it.

Russia has destroyed three full inventories of military equipment. How much more do you want to prolong this war? Like I said to Klamala, you offer up your kids to go fight if you believe so much in Ukraine.

On 23 January, NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg stated that he saw no direct or imminent threat from Russia to any NATO member state, though the Alliance has increased its vigilance to prevent an attack.

https://news.yahoo.com/no-direct-threat ... ATO%20Ally.

[kalm]

Had to post twice about this, Slappy?

Only a Russian troll would want to deny UKR the aid theyre asking for.

Seattlegrizopov.

If it means so much to you, how about you offer up your kids to go fight?

They’re adults. That’s their choice. And we’re not Russian.

[UNI88]

You're assuming that these men won't fight and die if US aid is stopped. It's entirely possible that they see this as a fight for Ukraine's very existence and that they'll server their country and fight anyway.

More could die without US assistance than with it.

Russia has destroyed three full inventories of military equipment. How much more do you want to prolong this war? Like I said to Klamala, you offer up your kids to go fight if you believe so much in Ukraine.

On 23 January, NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg stated that he saw no direct or imminent threat from Russia to any NATO member state, though the Alliance has increased its vigilance to prevent an attack.

https://news.yahoo.com/no-direct-threat ... ATO%20Ally.

How badly do you want to damn the the Ukrainian people to genocide and the nation of Ukraine to a paragraph in history books?

Cutting off aid is more likely to bring the eventual end of Ukraine then it is to bring peace.

[SeattleGriz]

If it means so much to you, how about you offer up your kids to go fight?

They’re adults. That’s their choice. And we’re not Russian.

Oh. Guess Ukrainian freedom doesn't mean that much to you after all.

[SeattleGriz]

Russia has destroyed three full inventories of military equipment. How much more do you want to prolong this war? Like I said to Klamala, you offer up your kids to go fight if you believe so much in Ukraine.



https://news.yahoo.com/no-direct-threat ... ATO%20Ally.

How badly do you want to damn the the Ukrainian people to genocide and the nation of Ukraine to a paragraph in history books?

Cutting off aid is more likely to bring the eventual end of Ukraine then it is to bring peace.

Dude, they've lost already. The longer this drags on, the less there will be of Ukraine. This is why it's important to remember the US and the UK have scuttled multiple peace talks and one deal.

Once again. When you have no skin in the game, you're sure quick to sacrifice other's children.

[kalm]

They’re adults. That’s their choice. And we’re not Russian.

Oh. Guess Ukrainian freedom doesn't mean that much to you after all.

Of course it’s important. That’s why the west should keep providing them with aid. Democracy and honoring alliances matters.

We’ve given them way less than we have Israel. Why do you hate Palestinian children?

[Caribbean Hen]

You're assuming that these men won't fight and die if US aid is stopped. It's entirely possible that they see this as a fight for Ukraine's very existence and that they'll server their country and fight anyway.

More could die without US assistance than with it.

Russia has destroyed three full inventories of military equipment. How much more do you want to prolong this war? Like I said to Klamala, you offer up your kids to go fight if you believe so much in Ukraine.

On 23 January, NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg stated that he saw no direct or imminent threat from Russia to any NATO member state, though the Alliance has increased its vigilance to prevent an attack.

https://news.yahoo.com/no-direct-threat ... ATO%20Ally.

SG,

I’ll ask you as you seem to be the most knowledgeable and real person on this thread

What’s the U.S. end game strategy with Ukraine?

I’m of the opinion that giving more and more aide isn’t going to defeat Russia

[houndawg]

You have to be playing dumb on purpose. I hope.

It's like this, son: when someone invades your country, you fight.

Don't make it more complicated than it is

What the heck are you even talking about… you sound like Biden at his yearly press conference…. Dazed and confused

First of all, nobody has invaded the US since when? Never

Do you think this younger generation is going to fight?

Do you believe the military is stronger now then it was 30 years ago? It’s not

The Ukraine is not gonna defeat Russia the way we’re trying to go about it now, so what do you think is going to ultimately happen?

What a pinhead. Look at the title of the thread - pinche bavoso

[Caribbean Hen]

What the heck are you even talking about… you sound like Biden at his yearly press conference…. Dazed and confused

First of all, nobody has invaded the US since when? Never

Do you think this younger generation is going to fight?

Do you believe the military is stronger now then it was 30 years ago? It’s not

The Ukraine is not gonna defeat Russia the way we’re trying to go about it now, so what do you think is going to ultimately happen?

What a pinhead. Look at the title of the thread - pinche bavoso

The thread was started when?

All this time and no ideas

[houndawg]

You're assuming that these men won't fight and die if US aid is stopped. It's entirely possible that they see this as a fight for Ukraine's very existence and that they'll server their country and fight anyway.

More could die without US assistance than with it.

Russia has destroyed three full inventories of military equipment. How much more do you want to prolong this war? Like I said to Klamala, you offer up your kids to go fight if you believe so much in Ukraine.

On 23 January, NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg stated that he saw no direct or imminent threat from Russia to any NATO member state, though the Alliance has increased its vigilance to prevent an attack.

https://news.yahoo.com/no-direct-threat ... ATO%20Ally.

Yet another Red Herring from the King of Gotnuthin.

[BDKJMU]

Oh. Guess Ukrainian freedom doesn't mean that much to you after all.

Of course it’s important. That’s why the west should keep providing them with aid. Democracy and honoring alliances matters.

We’ve given them way less than we have Israel. Why do you hate Palestinian children?

In the last 2 years have given and/or approved 113 billion for Ukraine.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/us ... r-AA1n15Zd

Us aid to Israel is 4 billion a year through 2028.

[houndawg]

Of course it’s important. That’s why the west should keep providing them with aid. Democracy and honoring alliances matters.

We’ve given them way less than we have Israel. Why do you hate Palestinian children?

In the last 2 years have given and/or approved 113 billion for Ukraine.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/us ... r-AA1n15Zd

Us aid to Israel is 4 billion a year through 2028.

Money well spent to degrade our enemy.

[BDKJMU]

In the last 2 years have given and/or approved 113 billion for Ukraine.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/us ... r-AA1n15Zd

Us aid to Israel is 4 billion a year through 2028.

Money well spent to degrade our enemy.

Yeah that’s why Russia’s economy is defying expectations right now. US pissed away 100+ billion for a war that Russia is going to win anyway..

[houndawg]

Money well spent to degrade our enemy.

Yeah that’s why Russia’s economy is defying expectations right now. US pissed away 100+ billion for a war that Russia is going to win anyway..

Russia only wins if Gutless Mikey Sock-Puppet reneges on his deal - have I not been telling you feebs for weeks that Mighty JoeB was going to close the border and deprive his opponent of his only issue to run on? Party over country.... typical conkfuck traitor..

You should pay attention when I tell you theses things, son, I won't always be here to help you through life.

[kalm]

Money well spent to degrade our enemy.

Yeah that’s why Russia’s economy is defying expectations right now. US pissed away 100+ billion for a war that Russia is going to win anyway..

Right now being the key word. (You really should hesitate with that quick dunce emoji trigger finger.)

The good news, however, is limited to the short term. In the medium term, the economy is threatened by a series of “time bombs”, to use the words of Russian economist Alexandra Prokopenko.

The first is the exodus of talent. The tight labour market is also due to the emigration of qualified workers after the Ukraine invasion. According to an estimate by Re: Russia, an independent publication, between 800,000 and 900,000 Russians have left the country since February 2022. They include many highly skilled workers, notably in the tech industry, and employees of foreign-based firms or organisations. That will, over time, affect the economy’s growth potential.

The second threat is the ailing rouble . The Russian currency is down 30% since its January high. Its fall has accelerated since the June mutiny of Putin’s former ally Yevgeny Prigozhin and his Wagner mercenaries. The Bank of Russia has been unable to stem the slide even after raising its key rate from 7.5% to 13% this year.

Russia’s prospects when military spending starts shrinking are dire. The partial circumventing of sanctions does not make up for the loss of technology transfers from Europe or the United States. Shrinking public investment in schools and education, due to the priority given to the military, will add to the loss of productivity over the medium and long term. And in a country where life expectancy at birth is already below 70 years – compared to more than 80 years in Europe, 78 years in China and 76 years in the U.S. – reduced investment in the health system will aggravate the country’s terrible demographics.

Worse still, Russia will emerge from the current moment as a financial vassal to its big neighbour. The economic boom comes at the price of growing financial dependence on China. Trade between the two countries has soared as Beijing has bought much of the oil Russia can no longer sell to Europe. And the yuan has replaced the dollar as Moscow’s currency of choice.

Russia is displaying all the problems of an “emerging” economy with the growth rate of a mature industrial one. And it is forced to rely on a currency that is not fully convertible, managed by another government to suit its own interests. Those may prove, over time, the most potent economic and strategic time bomb.

The economy is already showing strains and the IMF expects GDP growth to halve to 1.1% next year. Putin may be tempted to double down and keep spending, especially because he will seek re-election in 2024. Even though there is little doubt about the outcome, more spending on pensions and social services would still help buttress his standing. Forcing the economy to run at the current pace will, however, exacerbate its current problems and only delay the major bust that they will trigger.

https://www.reuters.com/breakingviews/r ... 023-10-25/

[SeattleGriz]

Russia has destroyed three full inventories of military equipment. How much more do you want to prolong this war? Like I said to Klamala, you offer up your kids to go fight if you believe so much in Ukraine.



https://news.yahoo.com/no-direct-threat ... ATO%20Ally.

SG,

I’ll ask you as you seem to be the most knowledgeable and real person on this thread

What’s the U.S. end game strategy with Ukraine?

I’m of the opinion that giving more and more aide isn’t going to defeat Russia

The simplest answer. Some form of economic imperialism. Control Ukraine and then allow the multinational corporations to move in and start exfiltrating money from Ukraine.

It's been the US plan for Russia since Gorbachev. When Putin put a stop to that, he became the villain.

Back when Clinton illegally went after Serbia, to paraphrase, he essentially said business couldn't be done because of the conflict. He didn't give two shits about lives, just that the people he represented could make money. That's why Serbia had to be slapped around.

This is all about gaining economic control over that area of the world.

[houndawg]

You don’t negotiate with authoritarian aggressors. Much less compliment or encourage them.

The expense is a red herring. It’s cost us comparatively little in aid to seriously diminish Russia’s military capability.

Only Russian loving, democracy hating, sheep see otherwise.

Only guys who've never served and have no skin in the game are alright with sending hundreds of thousands young men to their death to sharpen a country's military and industry.

Klam Romney.

Good ol' SlappyG, change the subject on a seconds notice.

When your country is invaded, you fight. Simple as that.

But you know whats funny? I'm areligious and never paid much attention to the subject, at least when they aren't trying to force-feed me their superstitions, but I sure do remember that back in the day the churchy types were opposed to the idea of sitting still while godless communists overran a smaller, weaker, christian, neighbor. Yes they were, and being accused of sympathizing with them could ruin your life - and the people doing it were the same crowd bending over for Vladimir Putin today. God-fearing christians

[houndawg]

SG,

I’ll ask you as you seem to be the most knowledgeable and real person on this thread

What’s the U.S. end game strategy with Ukraine?

I’m of the opinion that giving more and more aide isn’t going to defeat Russia

The simplest answer. Some form of economic imperialism. Control Ukraine and then allow the multinational corporations to move in and start exfiltrating money from Ukraine.

It's been the US plan for Russia since Gorbachev. When Putin put a stop to that, he became the villain.

Back when Clinton illegally went after Serbia, to paraphrase, he essentially said business couldn't be done because of the conflict. He didn't give two shits about lives, just that the people he represented could make money. That's why Serbia had to be slapped around.

This is all about gaining economic control over that area of the world.

Nobody can belabor the obvious like good ol' SlappyG....

4,000 years ago somebody said that all wars are fought for money - nobody is disputing that nothing has changed.

[kalm]

SG,

I’ll ask you as you seem to be the most knowledgeable and real person on this thread

What’s the U.S. end game strategy with Ukraine?

I’m of the opinion that giving more and more aide isn’t going to defeat Russia

The simplest answer. Some form of economic imperialism. Control Ukraine and then allow the multinational corporations to move in and start exfiltrating money from Ukraine.

It's been the US plan for Russia since Gorbachev. When Putin put a stop to that, he became the villain.

Back when Clinton illegally went after Serbia, to paraphrase, he essentially said business couldn't be done because of the conflict. He didn't give two shits about lives, just that the people he represented could make money. That's why Serbia had to be slapped around.

This is all about gaining economic control over that area of the world.

This is one of your better posts.

[Caribbean Hen]

The simplest answer. Some form of economic imperialism. Control Ukraine and then allow the multinational corporations to move in and start exfiltrating money from Ukraine.

It's been the US plan for Russia since Gorbachev. When Putin put a stop to that, he became the villain.

Back when Clinton illegally went after Serbia, to paraphrase, he essentially said business couldn't be done because of the conflict. He didn't give two shits about lives, just that the people he represented could make money. That's why Serbia had to be slapped around.

This is all about gaining economic control over that area of the world.

This is one of your better posts.

I choose him for a reason!

[kalm]

This is one of your better posts.

I choose him for a reason!

Well in that case I take it back.

[Caribbean Hen]

SG,

I’ll ask you as you seem to be the most knowledgeable and real person on this thread

What’s the U.S. end game strategy with Ukraine?

I’m of the opinion that giving more and more aide isn’t going to defeat Russia

The simplest answer. Some form of economic imperialism. Control Ukraine and then allow the multinational corporations to move in and start exfiltrating money from Ukraine.

It's been the US plan for Russia since Gorbachev. When Putin put a stop to that, he became the villain.

Back when Clinton illegally went after Serbia, to paraphrase, he essentially said business couldn't be done because of the conflict. He didn't give two shits about lives, just that the people he represented could make money. That's why Serbia had to be slapped around.

This is all about gaining economic control over that area of the world.

and do you think their is any realistic chance of that happening using current strategy?

If not, what needs to change ?

If so, Ukraine becomes totally dependent on the USA like a Puerto Rico without the palm tress and we will be paying for their snap cards for 50 years

[SeattleGriz]

The simplest answer. Some form of economic imperialism. Control Ukraine and then allow the multinational corporations to move in and start exfiltrating money from Ukraine.

It's been the US plan for Russia since Gorbachev. When Putin put a stop to that, he became the villain.

Back when Clinton illegally went after Serbia, to paraphrase, he essentially said business couldn't be done because of the conflict. He didn't give two shits about lives, just that the people he represented could make money. That's why Serbia had to be slapped around.

This is all about gaining economic control over that area of the world.

and do you think their is any realistic chance of that happening using current strategy?

If not, what needs to change ?

If so, Ukraine becomes totally dependent on the USA like a Puerto Rico without the palm tress and we will be paying for their snap cards for 50 years

I do not think the current strategy will work. For some reason, Russia was underestimated militarily and industrially and they now have both those sectors humming. Putin holds all the cards right now and I think he'll require a huge chunk of Ukraine to be incapable of damaging Russia.

The only way I see anything but the inevitable happening is if the neocons quit pushing the war and let E Europe chill. If the US stays out of their business, Europe will find a way to cooperate. The US may not get to dictate who gets to do what in Ukraine anymore, but you know the monied interests will find a way in, especially if they promise to rebuild Ukraine.

I find it interesting that the US threatened Russia over Nordstream and then blew it up, then became a huge supplier of natural gas to Europe, but yet, people will deny the US is involved in anything more than supplying money and equipment.

[SeattleGriz]

The simplest answer. Some form of economic imperialism. Control Ukraine and then allow the multinational corporations to move in and start exfiltrating money from Ukraine.

It's been the US plan for Russia since Gorbachev. When Putin put a stop to that, he became the villain.

Back when Clinton illegally went after Serbia, to paraphrase, he essentially said business couldn't be done because of the conflict. He didn't give two shits about lives, just that the people he represented could make money. That's why Serbia had to be slapped around.

This is all about gaining economic control over that area of the world.

This is one of your better posts.

Well you know what they say about a broken clock. Just need that other one to come around soon.

[houndawg]

and do you think their is any realistic chance of that happening using current strategy?

If not, what needs to change ?

If so, Ukraine becomes totally dependent on the USA like a Puerto Rico without the palm tress and we will be paying for their snap cards for 50 years

I do not think the current strategy will work. For some reason, Russia was underestimated militarily and industrially and they now have both those sectors humming. Putin holds all the cards right now and I think he'll require a huge chunk of Ukraine to be incapable of damaging Russia.

The only way I see anything but the inevitable happening is if the neocons quit pushing the war and let E Europe chill. If the US stays out of their business, Europe will find a way to cooperate. The US may not get to dictate who gets to do what in Ukraine anymore, but you know the monied interests will find a way in, especially if they promise to rebuild Ukraine.

I find it interesting that the US threatened Russia over Nordstream and then blew it up,then became a huge supplier of natural gas to Europe, but yet, people will deny the US is involved in anything more than supplying money and equipment.

Not without Trump and Sock Puppet Johnson's help

When did you decide to change your story about Poland blowing the gas line? Or are you just conflating various lines oil bullshit?