Fabulous Alabama

[Skjellyfetti]

BTW, ceasing the practice of calling people dumb because they disagree with us would serve all well. Moore is a West Point grad and Gohmert is a Baylor Law School grad. Those may not be as selective as Harvard and Yale but they are still highly selective institutions. You are not getting in unless you have demonstrated aptitude that suggests you're way above average in terms of intelligence.

I like how you use someone's university to argue for their intelligence - but, only if they're white. If they're a minority - the only reason they were allowed to attend a prestigious university is quotas.

To me, what's foolish is continuing to accept the idea of government by oligarchy; the idea that the direction of society should be determined by unelected and unaccountable officials who are not at all restrained by what the Constitution actually says or by any honest effort to proceed according to the understanding of those who crafted and ratified any given language from it. We are governed by the personal philosophies of people who have no accountability at all cramming their own beliefs down the throats of the People.

I won't say anybody who thinks we are governed by the Constitution at this point is dumb but they sure are way off the mark. The Constitution has become just a word that's used to lend some air of credibility to Judicial edicts.

I don't think Roy Moore is dumb. He's quite smart and has made a quite successful career pandering to the dumb, uninformed, bigoted rednecks in Alabama. He probably doesn't actually believe half the shit he spews from his mouth. If he thought the things he said and did wouldn't get him elected/reelected he wouldn't say or do them. Plain and simple.

[Ibanez]

Are you serious? Jefferson was the poster child for Deism. Hell, he removed all the miracles, magic and mythology from the bible. You should really read up on Deism. You aren't often wrong, but here you are.

As I said, Jefferson was not an Evangelical Christian, but he was a believer. He was Anglican/Episcopalian but saw religion and Christianity in a more Unitarian type philosophy and most probably didn't believe in the divinity of Christ.

To the corruptions of Christianity I am indeed, opposed; but not to the genuine precepts of Jesus himself. I am a Christian, in the only sense in which he wished any one to be; sincerely attached to his doctrines, in preference to all others; ascribing to himself every human excellence; and believing he never claimed any other.

Deists, especially ones in the 17th and 18th century believed worshiping God was unnecessary. However, Jefferson regularly attended worship services all throughout his life, and never actually claimed to be a Deist.

he was a believer but his philosophy was Deism. He's regarded as such along with men like Franklin.

[kalm]

As I said, Jefferson was not an Evangelical Christian, but he was a believer. He was Anglican/Episcopalian but saw religion and Christianity in a more Unitarian type philosophy and most probably didn't believe in the divinity of Christ.



Deists, especially ones in the 17th and 18th century believed worshiping God was unnecessary. However, Jefferson regularly attended worship services all throughout his life, and never actually claimed to be a Deist.

he was a believer but his philosophy was Deism. He's regarded as such along with men like Franklin.

And Thomas Paine.

[Baldy]

As I said, Jefferson was not an Evangelical Christian, but he was a believer. He was Anglican/Episcopalian but saw religion and Christianity in a more Unitarian type philosophy and most probably didn't believe in the divinity of Christ.



Deists, especially ones in the 17th and 18th century believed worshiping God was unnecessary. However, Jefferson regularly attended worship services all throughout his life, and never actually claimed to be a Deist.

he was a believer but his philosophy was Deism. He's regarded as such along with men like Franklin.

Yes, he's regarded by many that way. Since Jefferson was the father of the "Wall of Separation", many activists have hijacked his religion and painted him as a Deist (pretty successfully actually). The facts say something different. His philosophy was Unitarian more than anything. He never called himself a Deist, but did refer to himself as a Christian.

[Baldy]

he was a believer but his philosophy was Deism. He's regarded as such along with men like Franklin.

And Thomas Paine.

[dbackjon]

Most evangelicals claim Unitarians aren't ChristIan

[Baldy]

Most evangelicals claim Unitarians aren't ChristIan

Far too many evangelicals are philosophical whack jobs anyway.

[JohnStOnge]

I like how you use someone's university to argue for their intelligence - but, only if they're white. If they're a minority - the only reason they were allowed to attend a prestigious university is quotas.

Well, I'm sorry, but it is a factor. I think that if a person makes it into an institution like Baylor Law School they are more intelligent than average but the bar does vary according to race.

What I say is that if you see a Black person granted entry into a prestigious institution like Baylor Law School is that it's very possible they would not have been admitted had they not been Black. If you are about to randomly select a Black person who gained entrance into an institution like that you know the odds are way better than even that you will select a person who would not have gained entrance had they not been Black.

As I've noted before, you can get some insight into that by looking at the GRUTTER v. BOLLINGER Supreme Court decision pertaining to the Michigan Law School (http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/g ... vol=02-241" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;). Do a find on "Raudenbush" and you will find this statement:

Dr. Stephen Raudenbush, the Law School's expert, focused on the predicted effect of eliminating race as a factor in the Law School's admission process. In Dr. Raudenbush's view, a race-blind admissions system would have a " 'very dramatic,' " negative effect on underrepresented minority admissions. App. to Pet. for Cert. 223a. He testified that in 2000, 35 percent of underrepresented minority applicants were admitted. Ibid. Dr. Raudenbush predicted that if race were not considered, only 10 percent of those applicants would have been admitted. Ibid. Under this scenario, underrepresented minority students would have comprised 4 percent of the entering class in 2000 instead of the actual figure of 14.5 percent. Ibid.

If you do the math your conclusion will be that only about 28 percent of the "underrepresented minority" students who were admitted with the Michigan Law School 2000 class would have been admitted if they had not been members of an "underrepresented minority."

It is what it is.

There are other factors. Like GW Bush would not have been accepted to Yale had he not been a legacy. But we have other information in the form of his SAT score that allows us to get an idea as to how he falls in the intelligence distribution. And he falls high.

Louis Gohmert? I looked and I cannot find any reason for him gaining entrance to Baylor Law School other than he earned it under circumstances where he did not get favorable treatment as a member of an "underrepresented minority." Maybe you can find something.

[andy7171]

Most evangelicals claim Unitarians aren't ChristIan

I had some clown tell me I wasn't a Christian when he heard I was Catholic. I told him to go fuck himself.

[kalm]

I like how you use someone's university to argue for their intelligence - but, only if they're white. If they're a minority - the only reason they were allowed to attend a prestigious university is quotas.

Well, I'm sorry, but it is a factor. I think that if a person makes it into an institution like Baylor Law School they are more intelligent than average but the bar does vary according to race.

What I say is that if you see a Black person granted entry into a prestigious institution like Baylor Law School is that it's very possible they would not have been admitted had they not been Black. If you are about to randomly select a Black person who gained entrance into an institution like that you know the odds are way better than even that you will select a person who would not have gained entrance had they not been Black.

As I've noted before, you can get some insight into that by looking at the GRUTTER v. BOLLINGER Supreme Court decision pertaining to the Michigan Law School (http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/g ... vol=02-241" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;). Do a find on "Raudenbush" and you will find this statement:

Dr. Stephen Raudenbush, the Law School's expert, focused on the predicted effect of eliminating race as a factor in the Law School's admission process. In Dr. Raudenbush's view, a race-blind admissions system would have a " 'very dramatic,' " negative effect on underrepresented minority admissions. App. to Pet. for Cert. 223a. He testified that in 2000, 35 percent of underrepresented minority applicants were admitted. Ibid. Dr. Raudenbush predicted that if race were not considered, only 10 percent of those applicants would have been admitted. Ibid. Under this scenario, underrepresented minority students would have comprised 4 percent of the entering class in 2000 instead of the actual figure of 14.5 percent. Ibid.

If you do the math your conclusion will be that only about 28 percent of the "underrepresented minority" students who were admitted with the Michigan Law School 2000 class would have been admitted if they had not been members of an "underrepresented minority."

It is what it is.

There are other factors. Like GW Bush would not have been accepted to Yale had he not been a legacy. But we have other information in the form of his SAT score that allows us to get an idea as to how he falls in the intelligence distribution. And he falls high.

Louis Gohmert? I looked and I cannot find any reason for him gaining entrance to Baylor Law School other than he earned it under circumstances where he did not get favorable treatment as a member of an "underrepresented minority." Maybe you can find something.

Watch any clip of Gohmert talking.

[JohnStOnge]

Watch any clip of Gohmert talking.

I actually thought about that. I think there is a tendency to ascribe lack of intelligence to the accent he has. And I think that is a mistake.

[kalm]

Watch any clip of Gohmert talking.

I actually thought about that. I think there is a tendency to ascribe lack of intelligence to the accent he has. And I think that is a mistake.

His accent isn't what I'm talking about. I have southern friends who are smart.

[houndawg]

I don't know where you get this nonsense. I really don't. But you're wrong again as tends to be your custom. Just like the Ivies its about who you know. Dad is an Admiral? You're in. Parents big contributors to your congressperson? You're in. Please, John.

You can't be serious. Seriously. Are you seriously going to say that you think you're going to find a single student at West Point that's not of above average IQ? Think about it. You go to West Point right now and give everybody there an IQ test. Do you REALLY believe you're going to get any results that aren't above average?

Same with the Ivies.

John McCain.

[/thread]



Really, John. I'm surprised at you. You know that Congresspersons often appoint the offspring of friends and big donors. Its common knowledge. It really is.

[houndawg]

Are you serious? Jefferson was the poster child for Deism. Hell, he removed all the miracles, magic and mythology from the bible. You should really read up on Deism. You aren't often wrong, but here you are.

As I said, Jefferson was not an Evangelical Christian, but he was a believer. He was Anglican/Episcopalian but saw religion and Christianity in a more Unitarian type philosophy and most probably didn't believe in the divinity of Christ.

To the corruptions of Christianity I am indeed, opposed; but not to the genuine precepts of Jesus himself. I am a Christian, in the only sense in which he wished any one to be; sincerely attached to his doctrines, in preference to all others; ascribing to himself every human excellence; and believing he never claimed any other.

Deists, especially ones in the 17th and 18th century believed worshiping God was unnecessary. However, Jefferson regularly attended worship services all throughout his life, and never actually claimed to be a Deist.

That was just to meet pussy.

[JohnStOnge]

His accent isn't what I'm talking about. I have southern friends who are smart.

And do you REALLY think someone who has no connections as far as I can tell and who obviously did not benefit from any "affirmative action" policies who is NOT smart could do what it takes to get into then get through Baylor Law School. Do you REALLY think that's even possible?

Have you ever watched someone do what it takes to get through Law School? I have twice. And you're not going to be "dumb" and do it. Add to that the fact that Baylor is a pretty selective Law School. It's not the Yale Law School in those terms. But most people who get into most Law Schools in the United States would not get into Baylor.

The guy is not dumb. If you buy into that you're kidding yourself.

[houndawg]

I like how you use someone's university to argue for their intelligence - but, only if they're white. If they're a minority - the only reason they were allowed to attend a prestigious university is quotas.

Well, I'm sorry, but it is a factor. I think that if a person makes it into an institution like Baylor Law School they are more intelligent than average but the bar does vary according to race.

What I say is that if you see a Black person granted entry into a prestigious institution like Baylor Law School is that it's very possible they would not have been admitted had they not been Black. If you are about to randomly select a Black person who gained entrance into an institution like that you know the odds are way better than even that you will select a person who would not have gained entrance had they not been Black.

As I've noted before, you can get some insight into that by looking at the GRUTTER v. BOLLINGER Supreme Court decision pertaining to the Michigan Law School (http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/g ... vol=02-241" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;). Do a find on "Raudenbush" and you will find this statement:

Dr. Stephen Raudenbush, the Law School's expert, focused on the predicted effect of eliminating race as a factor in the Law School's admission process. In Dr. Raudenbush's view, a race-blind admissions system would have a " 'very dramatic,' " negative effect on underrepresented minority admissions. App. to Pet. for Cert. 223a. He testified that in 2000, 35 percent of underrepresented minority applicants were admitted. Ibid. Dr. Raudenbush predicted that if race were not considered, only 10 percent of those applicants would have been admitted. Ibid. Under this scenario, underrepresented minority students would have comprised 4 percent of the entering class in 2000 instead of the actual figure of 14.5 percent. Ibid.

If you do the math your conclusion will be that only about 28 percent of the "underrepresented minority" students who were admitted with the Michigan Law School 2000 class would have been admitted if they had not been members of an "underrepresented minority."

It is what it is.

There are other factors. Like GW Bush would not have been accepted to Yale had he not been a legacy. But we have other information in the form of his SAT score that allows us to get an idea as to how he falls in the intelligence distribution. And he falls high.

Louis Gohmert? I looked and I cannot find any reason for him gaining entrance to Baylor Law School other than he earned it under circumstances where he did not get favorable treatment as a member of an "underrepresented minority." Maybe you can find something.

Oh dear. John. Stop. Take a deep breath.

Now. Which is it, Johnny? The above or: "Are you seriously going to say that you think you're going to find a single student at West Point that's not of above average IQ?"?

Argue both sides of the question much, John?"

You're starting to sound like Tman when he began his descent into lunacy.

[JohnStOnge]

Really, John. I'm surprised at you. You know that Congresspersons often appoint the offspring of friends and big donors. Its common knowledge. It really is.

Dude, people of below average IQ do not get into West Point. Here is one site providing information on the subject that as far as I can tell has no affiliation with the school itself:

http://collegeapps.about.com/od/GPA-SAT ... at-act.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The United States Military Academy at West Point has one of the lowest acceptance rates in the country. West Point provides a high quality education for free, although all students will have a five-year service requirement after graduation. To get accepted, applicants will need grades and test scores that are above average. In the graph above, the blue and green dots represent accepted students. Most successful applicants had a GPA of 3.5 or higher, and they also tended to have SAT scores above 1800 and an ACT composite score of 25 or higher. Higher test scores and grades obviously improve your chances of getting an acceptance letter, and a 4.0 GPA is your surest bet for being admitted.

Would I be surprised to find that "connections" are a factor? No. But you're not getting into West Point if you haven't done things demonstrating that you have an above average IQ. Not going to happen.

[Grizalltheway]

ACT of 25 or higher? You don't belong in any college if you can't at least pull that off.

[houndawg]

Really, John. I'm surprised at you. You know that Congresspersons often appoint the offspring of friends and big donors. Its common knowledge. It really is.

Dude, people of below average IQ do not get into West Point. Here is one site providing information on the subject that as far as I can tell has no affiliation with the school itself:

http://collegeapps.about.com/od/GPA-SAT ... at-act.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The United States Military Academy at West Point has one of the lowest acceptance rates in the country. West Point provides a high quality education for free, although all students will have a five-year service requirement after graduation. To get accepted, applicants will need grades and test scores that are above average. In the graph above, the blue and green dots represent accepted students. Most successful applicants had a GPA of 3.5 or higher, and they also tended to have SAT scores above 1800 and an ACT composite score of 25 or higher. Higher test scores and grades obviously improve your chances of getting an acceptance letter, and a 4.0 GPA is your surest bet for being admitted.

Would I be surprised to find that "connections" are a factor? No. But you're not getting into West Point if you haven't done things demonstrating that you have an above average IQ. Not going to happen.

Which is it John?

[JohnStOnge]

Now. Which is it, Johnny? The above or: "Are you seriously going to say that you think you're going to find a single student at West Point that's not of above average IQ?"?

I think you need to read what I wrote in the post to which you were responding. I wrote that I think that anybody who gets admitted into an institution like Baylor Law school is of above average IQ but that the bar DOES change based on race.

I do think a Black person who gets admitted to something like Baylor Law school is of above average intelligence. But I also think there are Black people who get admitted to such institutions that would not have been admitted if they weren't Black.

It's like this: Maybe a White person would have to be at the 99th percentile of the intelligence distribution while a Black person would only have to be at the 90th percentile of the intelligence distribution. That sort of thing.

But, Black or White, you're not getting admitted to West Point if you're not above average in intelligence. Not going to happen. Well...there is some possibility it might happen if you're there for athletics. Like a football player or a basketball player. But otherwise no.

[houndawg]

Now. Which is it, Johnny? The above or: "Are you seriously going to say that you think you're going to find a single student at West Point that's not of above average IQ?"?

I think you need to read what I wrote in the post to which you were responding. I wrote that I think that anybody who gets admitted into an institution like Baylor Law school is of above average IQ but that the bar DOES change based on race.

I do think a Black person who gets admitted to something like Baylor Law school is of above average intelligence. But I also think there are Black people who get admitted to such institutions that would not have been admitted if they weren't Black.

It's like this: Maybe a White person would have to be at the 99th percentile of the intelligence distribution while a Black person would only have to be at the 90th percentile of the intelligence distribution. That sort of thing.

But, Black or White, you're not getting admitted to West Point if you're not above average in intelligence. Not going to happen. Well...there is some possibility it might happen if you're there for athletics. Like a football player or a basketball player. But otherwise no.

Gen. G.S. Custer [/thread]


Sorry John...

[JohnStOnge]

ACT of 25 or higher? You don't belong in any college if you can't at least pull that off.

A 25 is at about the 81st percentile. In other words among the top 20% of those taking a test in order to gain college admission. So you'd be a little bit higher up the percentile range for the general population.

Even if you just went with the 81st percentile without trying to adjust for the fact that the test is primarily taken by people who are trying to get admitted to college, you'd estimate an IQ of 113.

Besides, you have to do more than get a 25 ACT. West Point has the 10th lowest acceptance rate among US schools. Lower than Duke and Northwestern, for example. You're not going to get in without an above average IQ. Not going to happen.

I suspect that if someone is going to get in with a 25 ACT they're either going to have to have a lot of other accomplishment stuff to "overcome" that or they're going to have to be a member of an "under represented minority."

[BDKJMU]

BTW, ceasing the practice of calling people dumb because they disagree with us would serve all well. Moore is a West Point grad and Gohmert is a Baylor Law School grad. Those may not be as selective as Harvard and Yale but they are still highly selective institutions. You are not getting in unless you have demonstrated aptitude that suggests you're way above average in terms of intelligence.

I like how you use someone's university to argue for their intelligence - but, only if they're white. If they're a minority - the only reason they were allowed to attend a prestigious university is quotas.

To me, what's foolish is continuing to accept the idea of government by oligarchy; the idea that the direction of society should be determined by unelected and unaccountable officials who are not at all restrained by what the Constitution actually says or by any honest effort to proceed according to the understanding of those who crafted and ratified any given language from it. We are governed by the personal philosophies of people who have no accountability at all cramming their own beliefs down the throats of the People.

I won't say anybody who thinks we are governed by the Constitution at this point is dumb but they sure are way off the mark. The Constitution has become just a word that's used to lend some air of credibility to Judicial edicts.

I don't think Roy Moore is dumb. He's quite smart and has made a quite successful career pandering to the dumb, uninformed, bigoted rednecks in Alabama. He probably doesn't actually believe half the **** he spews from his mouth. If he thought the things he said and did wouldn't get him elected/reelected he wouldn't say or do them. Plain and simple.

How intolerant of you..

[Ivytalk]

I like how you use someone's university to argue for their intelligence - but, only if they're white. If they're a minority - the only reason they were allowed to attend a prestigious university is quotas.



I don't think Roy Moore is dumb. He's quite smart and has made a quite successful career pandering to the dumb, uninformed, bigoted rednecks in Alabama. He probably doesn't actually believe half the **** he spews from his mouth. If he thought the things he said and did wouldn't get him elected/reelected he wouldn't say or do them. Plain and simple.

How intolerant of you..

Analjelly prefers the dumb, uninformed, bigoted, Donk rednecks from western North Carolina. He's probably a closet John Edwards fan.

[kalm]

His accent isn't what I'm talking about. I have southern friends who are smart.

And do you REALLY think someone who has no connections as far as I can tell and who obviously did not benefit from any "affirmative action" policies who is NOT smart could do what it takes to get into then get through Baylor Law School. Do you REALLY think that's even possible?

Have you ever watched someone do what it takes to get through Law School? I have twice. And you're not going to be "dumb" and do it. Add to that the fact that Baylor is a pretty selective Law School. It's not the Yale Law School in those terms. But most people who get into most Law Schools in the United States would not get into Baylor.

The guy is not dumb. If you buy into that you're kidding yourself.

Perhaps they got dumb after law school?