Immigration "reform"

[JohnStOnge]

More liberal/progressive speak. Immigration "reform" means "reward people and/or their children who came into the country illegally by allowing them to stay here and eventually become citizens."

It's crap. Nobody who came here illegally should EVER be allowed to stay here. And their children should NOT be allowed either. If anything, if we want to talk about reform, we should be talking about Amending the Constitution so that it's clear that your kid doesn't become a US citizen because you sneak across the border and drop a rug rat here.

What we should be talking about is how we're going to make life as unpleasant as possible for people who are hear illegally so that they don't want to be here. And, yes, we should be talking about every effort to deport however many million there are. This thing about "We can't deport X million people" is nonsense. We don't talk about that with other laws. Like we don't say "We can't arrest X million people who smoke marijuana."

What we CAN do is deport people who are here illegally consistently when we find them. And we can make things unpleasant for those that are here. We can change things so that people who are illegal cannot receive any kinds of benefits, etc. I'm talking about if we had the will and the consensus.

But we don't because we're idiots. Not counting the disgusting Hispanics who are already here who are pushing to have their buddies in as well. I'm talking about the rest of us who are not Hispanic and put up with this crap.

[kalm]

I've found many Hispanics to be well kept and hygiene aware.

[BlueHen86]

More liberal/progressive speak. Immigration "reform" means "reward people and/or their children who came into the country illegally by allowing them to stay here and eventually become citizens."

It's crap. Nobody who came here illegally should EVER be allowed to stay here. And their children should NOT be allowed either. If anything, if we want to talk about reform, we should be talking about Amending the Constitution so that it's clear that your kid doesn't become a US citizen because you sneak across the border and drop a rug rat here.

What we should be talking about is how we're going to make life as unpleasant as possible for people who are hear illegally so that they don't want to be here. And, yes, we should be talking about every effort to deport however many million there are. This thing about "We can't deport X million people" is nonsense. We don't talk about that with other laws. Like we don't say "We can't arrest X million people who smoke marijuana."

What we CAN do is deport people who are here illegally consistently when we find them. And we can make things unpleasant for those that are here. We can change things so that people who are illegal cannot receive any kinds of benefits, etc. I'm talking about if we had the will and the consensus.

But we don't because we're idiots. Not counting the disgusting Hispanics who are already here who are pushing to have their buddies in as well. I'm talking about the rest of us who are not Hispanic and put up with this crap.

Is it legal if they kill the people that are already here? Native Americans want to know.

[BDKJMU]

More liberal/progressive speak. Immigration "reform" means "reward people and/or their children who came into the country illegally by allowing them to stay here and eventually become citizens."

It's crap. Nobody who came here illegally should EVER be allowed to stay here. And their children should NOT be allowed either. If anything, if we want to talk about reform, we should be talking about Amending the Constitution so that it's clear that your kid doesn't become a US citizen because you sneak across the border and drop a rug rat here.

What we should be talking about is how we're going to make life as unpleasant as possible for people who are hear illegally so that they don't want to be here. And, yes, we should be talking about every effort to deport however many million there are. This thing about "We can't deport X million people" is nonsense. We don't talk about that with other laws. Like we don't say "We can't arrest X million people who smoke marijuana."

What we CAN do is deport people who are here illegally consistently when we find them. And we can make things unpleasant for those that are here. We can change things so that people who are illegal cannot receive any kinds of benefits, etc. I'm talking about if we had the will and the consensus.

But we don't because we're idiots. Not counting the disgusting Hispanics who are already here who are pushing to have their buddies in as well. I'm talking about the rest of us who are not Hispanic and put up with this crap.

Yep. The "can't" is BS. The won't is true. We need another Eisenhower's Operation Wetback. In a year 1k+ border patrol agents had deported 1 million in the 1st year alone.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0706/p09s01-coop.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
And now we have a BP about 20 times as big, 21k agents according to wiki..

[CitadelGrad]

I've found many Hispanics to be well kept and hygiene aware.

Then you've never had a whore in Tijuana.

[CID1990]

I've found many Hispanics to be well kept and hygiene aware.

Then you've never had a whore in Tijuana.

You leave Juanita out of this, motherfvcker

[Skjellyfetti]

tldr version

disgusting Hispanics

[kalm]

Then you've never had a whore in Tijuana.

You leave Juan out of this, motherfvcker

[JohnStOnge]

Is it legal if they kill the people that are already here? Native Americans want to know.

If the "Native Americans" had law I'm sure they'd say "no." But that's the way it went. A civilization with superior technology and carrying diseases to which the indigenous population was naive took over.

What happened back then is not an argument for us allowing illegal aliens to stay here now or for rewarding them for coming into the country illegally. If anything, it's a historical lesson. Things didn't work out real well for the people already here in that scenario.

[JohnStOnge]

tldr version

disgusting Hispanics

It's not a matter of being disgusting by virtue of being "hispanic." It's disgusting by virtue of taking a political position and voting in a way so as to support rewarding people who came into this country illegally because one has an ethnic "connection" to the interlopers involved.

The other day my wife was talking about a Liberal guy she knows who said that the reason people are upset about illegal immigration is that it's "brown people." I told her that the real problem of "racial" outlook on this issue is the fact that Hispanics who are already here are taking positions based on the overwhelming majority of illegal aliens having an ethnic connection to them.

If the big problem of illegal immigration involved, say, ethnic Asians, Hispanics here would be as opposed to letting them stay here as anybody else is. The way in which the majority of Hispanic US citizens are behaving with respect to this issue IS disgusting.

[Gil Dobie]

I think it's great that we have a country that people want to move to and live in. I also don't care how they get here, if they want to become citizens and have no hidden agenda's, welcome to America. If immigrants fail to obey the law after becoming citizens, they will be treated like citizens and required to take responsibility for their actions. Stories that lump a certain group into a category, smells very much like racism or bigotry.

[Pwns]

It's a losing strategy to try and get immigrants to leave. It's a loser politically plus it just won't stop illegal immigration. You only need to look at how Alabama and Georgia's immigration laws have failed to see how it's pointless.

I've said it before, what the republicans need to do is come up with a plan that can negate what it is that the democrats are really after (which is more Democrat voters).

Let the anchor baby-mammas have the options a lot of citizens have but don't let them vote in any federal elections for a long time, if ever.

Republicans also need to start hammering democrats about how enthusiastic they are to make citizens out of people with little education and job skills but won't do much to help immigrants who are engineers and scientists.

[Skjellyfetti]

Republicans also need to start hammering democrats about how enthusiastic they are to make citizens out of people with little education and job skills but won't do much to help immigrants who are engineers and scientists.

Huh? I'm certainly for immigration of high-skilled workers as well.

And Democrats have been working toward making this happen... and have been stymied by Republicans.

From May 2014:

Newly proposed rules for highly skilled immigrants to the United States, including a provision to allow their spouses to work, are aimed at making it easier to keep those talented science, technology and engineering workers in the country, officials said on Tuesday.

"These individuals are American families in waiting," Commerce Secretary Penny Pritzker said. "Many tire of waiting for green cards and leave the country to work for our competition. The fact is we have to do more to retain and attract world-class talent to the United States and these regulations put us on a path to do that."

One of the two proposed regulation changes would allow the spouses of holders of H-1B visas, which are given to workers in fields such as science, technology and engineering, to have jobs in the United States while their spouses' green card applications are being considered. Spouses of U.S. visaholders currently are not given permission to work.

Deputy Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas, who announced the new regulations with Pritzker, said that change could affect as many as 97,000 people in the first year and some 30,000 annually after that.

The other proposed regulation change would give employers a wider range of methods to document that immigrant researchers and professors are among the best in their fields. The regulations would go into effect after a 60-day public comment period.

Pritzker said approximately 28 percent of new businesses in the United States are started by immigrants and that about 40 percent of the Fortune 500 companies were started by immigrants or their children.

Pritzker also supported President Barack Obama's push to overhaul the U.S. immigration system so that it would allow the United States "to staple a green card to the degrees of graduate students instead of forcing potential innovators and job creators to leave after being trained at our universities."

Senator Jeff Sessions, a Republican from Alabama and opponent of immigration reform, denounced the proposed changes. "Yet again, the administration is acting unilaterally to change immigration law in a way that hurts American workers," he said.

"This will help corporations by further flooding a slack labor market, pulling down wages. It is good news for citizens in other countries who will be hired. But for struggling Americans, it will only reduce wages, lower job opportunities, and make it harder to scrape by."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/05/ ... QL20140506" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Ibanez]

I'd love to watch you try and conceive a plan to hunt, arrest, deport and keep out 12 million or more illegal immigrants. And remember John, you can't just go after the brown ones.

[Skjellyfetti]

And remember John, you can't just go after the brown ones.

yup

haven't seen him call the irish illegals disgusting yet
http://irishlobbyusa.org/about-us/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Ibanez]

It's a losing strategy to try and get immigrants to leave. It's a loser politically plus it just won't stop illegal immigration. You only need to look at how Alabama and Georgia's immigration laws have failed to see how it's pointless.

I've said it before, what the republicans need to do is come up with a plan that can negate what it is that the democrats are really after (which is more Democrat voters).

Let the anchor baby-mammas have the options a lot of citizens have but don't let them vote in any federal elections for a long time, if ever.

Republicans also need to start hammering democrats about how enthusiastic they are to make citizens out of people with little education and job skills but won't do much to help immigrants who are engineers and scientists.

So DHS estimates that about half of the 12 million illegal immigrants were orginally here legally. Regardless. Which is wiser: foolishly try to arrest and deport theses people OR have an enrollment period where we advertise: If you are here illegally, go to a certain office, get a from in the mail, etc... to become a citizen. You will become a legal citizen (which means you can now get paid minimum wage and benefits. No more under the table) which also means you'll be a taxpayer. Which means that the IRS will garnish your wages until your immigration fee is paid off (make it reasonable). Which means no more hiding in the shadows.


It may not be a perfect idea, but it's better than rounding them up and sending them off to some country, many of them have never been to b/c they were born here.

[Ibanez]

And remember John, you can't just go after the brown ones.

yup

haven't seen him call the irish illegals disgusting yet
http://irishlobbyusa.org/about-us/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Shocking, I know.

[Pwns]

It's a losing strategy to try and get immigrants to leave. It's a loser politically plus it just won't stop illegal immigration. You only need to look at how Alabama and Georgia's immigration laws have failed to see how it's pointless.

I've said it before, what the republicans need to do is come up with a plan that can negate what it is that the democrats are really after (which is more Democrat voters).

Let the anchor baby-mammas have the options a lot of citizens have but don't let them vote in any federal elections for a long time, if ever.

Republicans also need to start hammering democrats about how enthusiastic they are to make citizens out of people with little education and job skills but won't do much to help immigrants who are engineers and scientists.

So DHS estimates that about half of the 12 million illegal immigrants were orginally here legally. Regardless. Which is wiser: foolishly try to arrest and deport theses people OR have an enrollment period where we advertise: If you are here illegally, go to a certain office, get a from in the mail, etc... to become a citizen. You will become a legal citizen (which means you can now get paid minimum wage and benefits. No more under the table) which also means you'll be a taxpayer. Which means that the IRS will garnish your wages until your immigration fee is paid off (make it reasonable). Which means no more hiding in the shadows.


It may not be a perfect idea, but it's better than rounding them up and sending them off to some country, many of them have never been to b/c they were born here.

I agree, but I don't like the idea of not attaching some kind of stipulations. What kind of message does that send to people who came to America legally?

[Ibanez]

So DHS estimates that about half of the 12 million illegal immigrants were orginally here legally. Regardless. Which is wiser: foolishly try to arrest and deport theses people OR have an enrollment period where we advertise: If you are here illegally, go to a certain office, get a from in the mail, etc... to become a citizen. You will become a legal citizen (which means you can now get paid minimum wage and benefits. No more under the table) which also means you'll be a taxpayer. Which means that the IRS will garnish your wages until your immigration fee is paid off (make it reasonable). Which means no more hiding in the shadows.


It may not be a perfect idea, but it's better than rounding them up and sending them off to some country, many of them have never been to b/c they were born here.

I agree, but I don't like the idea of not attaching some kind of stipulations. What kind of message does that send to people who came to America legally?

There should be a penalty. And maybe you can't vote until that penalty has been paid. This, of course, would require a unified Voter ID system and an improved system.

When I voted this month I went to one station where my ID was scanned, and then the volunteered yelled down the table to an old man who then had me sign my name on a line. Technology exists to make this more streamlined. We already have so much data out there on us, what's one more data point that says you can't vote.

Of course, this would require police or some sort of authority figure to escort off the premises those that are clueless and/or get hostile.

[CAA Flagship]

So if you grant the current illegals amnesty on a Sunday, and allow them to become citizens, what happens when more illegals come into the country on Monday, Tuesday, etc. after that? Do we have an Amnesty Day each year and make them citizens too?

[Ibanez]

So if you grant the current illegals amnesty on a Sunday, and allow them to become citizens, what happens when more illegals come into the country on Monday, Tuesday, etc. after that? Do we have an Amnesty Day each year and make them citizens too?

Part of the plan is ACTUAL ENFORCEMENT OF OUR FUCKING LAWS!!!

[JohnStOnge]

I'd love to watch you try and conceive a plan to hunt, arrest, deport and keep out 12 million or more illegal immigrants. And remember John, you can't just go after the brown ones.

Just do what we do with any other law. We don't decide on whether or not to enforce other laws based on the idea that we're not going to catch everybody who violates it.

The other part of the equation is to make it unpleasant for them to be here. No children of illegal immigrants in our schools. No federal benefits. Nothing. And that starts with no water stations in the desert. Make them feel hunted. Do all that can be done to make being here illegally a bad experience. Amend the Constitution as necessary to contradict court decisions doing things such as forcing public schools to admit them, etc. Also Amend the Constitution to say that if you're in this country illegally and have a kid while you're here that kid is not a citizen of the United States.

All those things are possible given the will to do them.

As far as looking at the "brown" ones; that relates to the fact that we're not allowed to use profiling when it works. It would be very easy to work out a conceptual and even a mathematical model for identifying people who are associated with a high probability of being here illegally and focusing our efforts like that.

And you know what? The reality is that you'd end up focusing more on people who had an appearance of hispanic ethnicity and who cannot speak or have difficulty in speaking English. You'd be much more effective and efficient in identifying and taking action to remove people in the country illegally by doing that.

Mind you, I'm not saying you reach a final conclusion based on that. But you focus your efforts. Absolutely nothing wrong with or truly unconstitutional about that. But in our system we are compelled to ignore the obvious.

[Ibanez]

I'd love to watch you try and conceive a plan to hunt, arrest, deport and keep out 12 million or more illegal immigrants. And remember John, you can't just go after the brown ones.

Just do what we do with any other law. We don't decide on whether or not to enforce other laws based on the idea that we're not going to catch everybody who violates it.

The other part of the equation is to make it unpleasant for them to be here. No children of illegal immigrants in our schools. No federal benefits. Nothing. And that starts with no water stations in the desert. Make them feel hunted. Do all that can be done to make being here illegally a bad experience. Amend the Constitution as necessary to contradict court decisions doing things such as forcing public schools to admit them, etc. Also Amend the Constitution to say that if you're in this country illegally and have a kid while you're here that kid is not a citizen of the United States.

All those things are possible given the will to do them.

As far as looking at the "brown" ones; that relates to the fact that we're not allowed to use profiling when it works. It would be very easy to work out a conceptual and even a mathematical model for identifying people who are associated with a high probability of being here illegally and focusing our efforts like that.

And you know what? The reality is that you'd end up focusing more on people who had an appearance of hispanic ethnicity and who cannot speak or have difficulty in speaking English. You'd be much more effective and efficient in identifying and taking action to remove people in the country illegally by doing that.

Mind you, I'm not saying you reach a final conclusion based on that. But you focus your efforts. Absolutely nothing wrong with or truly unconstitutional about that. But in our system we are compelled to ignore the obvious.

Swing and a miss.

[JohnStOnge]

And remember John, you can't just go after the brown ones.

yup

haven't seen him call the irish illegals disgusting yet
http://irishlobbyusa.org/about-us/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Illegal immigrants of any ethnicity are indeed disgusting but that's not who I called "disgusting" earlier. I called Hispanics who support allowing those who entered the country illegally to stay here because they had an ethnic connection with them disgusting. And they are. If there are people of Irish ethnicity who support it because of an ethnic connection to Irish illegals they are also disgusting.

But we all know what's going on politically. The overwhelming majority of illegal aliens in this country are Hispanic. I'll use this article at the Huffington Post, since the Huffington Post is typically on the "liberal" side, as a reference: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/2 ... 42061.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They aren't. Of the estimated 11.1 million undocumented immigrants residing in the United States as of 2011, some 81 percent were born in Latin America, according to Pew Hispanic Center.

And Hispanics who are already citizens want those illegal immigrants allowed to stay here. It's very reasonable to believe that they see this issue as a question of legalizing a bunch of Hispanics.

Meanwhile, the fact that some very small percentage of illegal immigrants are Irish doesn't change my outlook at all. Make life as miserable as we can for illegal immigrants and kick them out when we catch them regardless of their ethnicity.

[JohnStOnge]

Swing and a miss.

Not at all. Profiling works. And it's done all the time. It's just that there are some "forbidden" areas with respect to its application.