Jesus H. Christ, is Obama REALLY that Shallow???

[93henfan]

Well let the historical record stand (obviously)
Throughout history it's been far more difficult being white...
Everybody knows that

So how long are we going to let people use an institution that was abolished 150 years ago as a crutch? Shouldn't they be able to adapt and overcome on their own eventually, or do we have to continue to have a double standard to prop them up (often to the detriment of more deserving citizens)? Are they even capable, as a group, of being self sufficient? I mean, how much of our tax money was pumped into fancy urban projects in the 50s and 60s and 70s that quickly turned into wastelands worse than Beirut? How much continues to be pumped into Section 8 housing, welfare, head start, etc. for people with absolutely ZERO ambition, work ethic, or pride?

[kalm]

Well let the historical record stand (obviously)
Throughout history it's been far more difficult being white...
Everybody knows that

So how long are we going to let people use an institution that was abolished 150 years ago as a crutch? Shouldn't they be able to adapt and overcome on their own eventually, or do we have to continue to have a double standard to prop them up (often to the detriment of more deserving citizens)? Are they even capable, as a group, of being self sufficient? I mean, how much of our tax money was pumped into fancy urban projects in the 50s and 60s and 70s that quickly turned into wastelands worse than Beirut? How much continues to be pumped into Section 8 housing, welfare, head start, etc. for people with absolutely ZERO ambition, work ethic, or pride?

Valid point that they should be improving by now and that in many ways...the hand-out has not succeeded. Still there are many that HAVE succeeded. Pulled themselves up by the boot straps and such. And there are still more whites on the public dole. Some of them are billionaires....

[93henfan]

And there are still more whites on the public dole.

False.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/welfare-statistics/

[kalm]

And there are still more whites on the public dole.

False.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/welfare-statistics/

Pretty sure I stated "public dole" and not welfare. But thanks for the link, blacks per capita are certainly larger percentage...which is no surprise.

Add in corporate and subsidies and we're starting to get somewhere. Hint: Michelle Bachmann's hubby's gay therapy clinic and her family farm are recipients. Wait I might be unfairly morphing Bachmann with Rand Paul's family farm...but you get the picture.

[Chizzang]

Well let the historical record stand (obviously)
Throughout history it's been far more difficult being white...
Everybody knows that

So how long are we going to let people use an institution that was abolished 150 years ago as a crutch? Shouldn't they be able to adapt and overcome on their own eventually, or do we have to continue to have a double standard to prop them up (often to the detriment of more deserving citizens)? Are they even capable, as a group, of being self sufficient? I mean, how much of our tax money was pumped into fancy urban projects in the 50s and 60s and 70s that quickly turned into wastelands worse than Beirut? How much continues to be pumped into Section 8 housing, welfare, head start, etc. for people with absolutely ZERO ambition, work ethic, or pride?

I don't know " butthat's a good question
and being white and having a very easy life I'm not the person to answer that question
But I do know that your post back there previously was pretty stupid



I've posted the black american graduation rates and sad cultural decline statistics on this forum
I'm no stranger to the problem...

[Ivytalk]

False.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/welfare-statistics/

Pretty sure I stated "public dole" and not welfare. But thanks for the link, blacks per capita are certainly larger percentage...which is no surprise.

Add in corporate and subsidies and we're starting to get somewhere. Hint: Michelle Bachmann's hubby's gay therapy clinic and her family farm are recipients. Wait I might be unfairly morphing
Bachmann with Rand Paul's family farm...but you get the picture.[/quote]

There you go again, Dennis, dragging the corporatist crap into it. Lovely filth down here!

[93henfan]

So how long are we going to let people use an institution that was abolished 150 years ago as a crutch? Shouldn't they be able to adapt and overcome on their own eventually, or do we have to continue to have a double standard to prop them up (often to the detriment of more deserving citizens)? Are they even capable, as a group, of being self sufficient? I mean, how much of our tax money was pumped into fancy urban projects in the 50s and 60s and 70s that quickly turned into wastelands worse than Beirut? How much continues to be pumped into Section 8 housing, welfare, head start, etc. for people with absolutely ZERO ambition, work ethic, or pride?

I don't know " butthat's a good question
and being white and having a very easy life I'm not the person to answer that question
But I do know that your post back there previously was pretty stupid

What was stupid about it? I was born in 1971. Both of my parents worked full time jobs (my dad as a factory worker for Playtex and my mom a GS-4 supply clerk at Dover AFB) and rented a trailer. They saved enough money to later buy a house when I was 8 years old. I worked hard and did well in school. I was the first person in my family to graduate from college. I worked 20+ hours a week to pay for college and my parents kicked in as much as they good. I went to school with black kids with worse grades who got full rides to Harvard, Duke, etc. When I tried to join a certain branch of the military, I was, in so many words, told that they didn't need white officers at the present time. The military had instituted a program called 12-12-5 that mandated that the total force needed to get to 12% black officers, 12% Hispanic officers, and 5% Asian officers ASAP, and the only way to do that was not bring in white candidates. So I enlisted in the Marine Corps, worked my ass off, and obtained an OCS slot via the enlisted commissioning program. I see the same deal now in the Federal civilian workforce, time and again. Then look at federal contracts. Preference and set-asides are given to minority and urban zone contractors.

If you are black in this country and can't be successful, you aren't trying.

Yes, black people have it easier than white people if they just have one ounce of ambition in their body.

[YoUDeeMan]

Bullshit. Z, Blueballs, and Cluck would've ended up EXACTLY where they're at if evem if they HAD been born in a black ghetto. On account of hard work and right decisions and stuff. They're THAT good.

they'd all be in jail actually

Nah...I had my opportunity to go bad. But, I was selfish and figured out I would have a better life if I made better decisions.

EVERYONE has that same choice.

Spare me the crap about white or black...everyone has the same choice in life: sacrifice and win in the long run, or take the easier route and face the consequences.

[kalm]

Pretty sure I stated "public dole" and not welfare. But thanks for the link, blacks per capita are certainly larger percentage...which is no surprise.

Add in corporate and subsidies and we're starting to get somewhere. Hint: Michelle Bachmann's hubby's gay therapy clinic and her family farm are recipients. Wait I might be unfairly morphing
Bachmann with Rand Paul's family farm...but you get the picture.

There you go again, Dennis, dragging the corporatist crap into it. Lovely filth down here![/quote]

It's posts like these that prove you HATE competition and LOVE big government. Turn in your conservative card at the counter...

[YoUDeeMan]

I don't know " butthat's a good question
and being white and having a very easy life I'm not the person to answer that question
But I do know that your post back there previously was pretty stupid

What was stupid about it? I was born in 1971. Both of my parents worked full time jobs (my dad as a factory worker for Playtex and my mom a GS-4 supply clerk at Dover AFB) and rented a trailer. They saved enough money to later buy a house when I was 8 years old. I worked hard and did well in school. I was the first person in my family to graduate from college. I worked 20+ hours a week to pay for college and my parents kicked in as much as they good. I went to school with black kids with worse grades who got full rides to Harvard, Duke, etc. When I tried to join a certain branch of the military, I was, in so many words, told that they didn't need white officers at the present time. The military had instituted a program called 12-12-5 that mandated that the total force needed to get to 12% black officers, 12% Hispanic officers, and 5% Asian officers ASAP, and the only way to do that was not bring in white candidates. So I enlisted in the Marine Corps, worked my ass off, and obtained an OCS slot via the enlisted commissioning program. I see the same deal now in the Federal civilian workforce, time and again. Then look at federal contracts. Preference and set-asides are given to minority and urban zone contractors.

If you are black in this country and can't be successful, you aren't trying.

Yes, black people have it easier than white people if they just have one ounce of ambition in their body.

I can supply similar stories from the corporate front. We HAD to hire and promote minorities even though we had better qualified white applicants. Fact. I had to tell people they didn't get the job, and then they had to watch some fool get promoted.

We promoted some serious crap...and lost some good talent...due to those decisions.

[JohnStOnge]

Black thug killed by an Hispanic American, Obama speaks out saying "if I had a son he would look like Trayvon".
White baby shot by two black thugs...not a word from Obama
White baseball player shot by 3 black thugs...not a word from Obama
Black lady talks down a white shooter who turns himself in....Obama calls her personally to tell her how wonderful she is.

He's a racist. Plain and simple.

In fairness, there is a substantial distinction in that when Martin was killed by Zimmerman no arrest was made. I think that was a catalyst.

However, all the other incidents y'all are talking about are reminders that there is a lot more reason for Whites to worry about being attacked by Blacks than there is for Blacks to worry about being attacked by Whites.

[JohnStOnge]

Otherwise, there is a lot of merit to the idea that Blacks born in the last 40 years or so have it "good" in terms of how they are officially treated. Yes they are at disadvantages in certain respects but it's not because of the way they are treated in law and practice.

They get preference for everything. They don't have to meet the same standards as Whites have to meet. When they screw up excuses are made for them. Absolutely no doubt about it.

They are disadvantaged at this point largely because of their own cultural tendencies. And it's time for them to stop blaming everybody else for their problems. They're not the only group of people who have slaves as ancestors. They're not the only group of people who have been discriminated against. It's time for the excuses to stop.

[Chizzang]

they'd all be in jail actually

Nah...I had my opportunity to go bad. But, I was selfish and figured out I would have a better life if I made better decisions.

EVERYONE has that same choice.

Spare me the crap about white or black...everyone has the same choice in life: sacrifice and win in the long run, or take the easier route and face the consequences.

No everyone does not have the same choices...
but I understand your point / and for the most part agree

but let me add something to the general tone of this thread
I can assure you that middle-class white people do not want to see what would happen if we stopped paying welfare and food stamps and the general dole

We really need to understand that... it's a small price to pay
50% of Americans make under $30K a year / that's a lot of people who are already angry regardless
Do not poke the bear

[93henfan]

Nah...I had my opportunity to go bad. But, I was selfish and figured out I would have a better life if I made better decisions.

EVERYONE has that same choice.

Spare me the crap about white or black...everyone has the same choice in life: sacrifice and win in the long run, or take the easier route and face the consequences.

No everyone does not have the same choices...
but I understand your point / and for the most part agree

but let me add something to the general tone of this thread
I can assure you that middle-class white people do not want to see what would happen if we stopped paying welfare and food stamps and the general dole

We really need to understand that... it's a small price to pay

At the rate the white middle-class is being diminished, this will be sooner rather than later.

As I mentioned somewhere around here a couple of days ago, load up on guns and bring your friends.

[Chizzang]

No everyone does not have the same choices...
but I understand your point / and for the most part agree

but let me add something to the general tone of this thread
I can assure you that middle-class white people do not want to see what would happen if we stopped paying welfare and food stamps and the general dole

We really need to understand that... it's a small price to pay

At the rate the white middle-class is being diminished, this will be sooner rather than later.

As I mentioned somewhere around here a couple of days ago, load up on guns and bring your friends.

This country is extremely peaceful
You can walk down damn near any street in this country anytime anywhere
There are a few notable exceptions / but basically that statement is true

And we have wide sweeping peacefulness BECAUSE we appease the poor and destitute
(And that is good)

[BDKJMU]

Nah...I had my opportunity to go bad. But, I was selfish and figured out I would have a better life if I made better decisions.

EVERYONE has that same choice.

Spare me the crap about white or black...everyone has the same choice in life: sacrifice and win in the long run, or take the easier route and face the consequences.

No everyone does not have the same choices...
but I understand your point / and for the most part agree

but let me add something to the general tone of this thread
I can assure you that middle-class white people do not want to see what would happen if we stopped paying welfare and food stamps and the general dole

We really need to understand that... it's a small price to pay
50% of Americans make under $30K a year/ that's a lot of people who are already angry regardless
Do not poke the bear

The median household income in the US was over 50k in 2011, and that doesn't include govt bennies.

The bear has gotten awfully fat and lazy....

[Ivytalk]

Pretty sure I stated "public dole" and not welfare. But thanks for the link, blacks per capita are certainly larger percentage...which is no surprise.

Add in corporate and subsidies and we're starting to get somewhere. Hint: Michelle Bachmann's hubby's gay therapy clinic and her family farm are recipients. Wait I might be unfairly morphing
Bachmann with Rand Paul's family farm...but you get the picture.

There you go again, Dennis, dragging the corporatist crap into it. Lovely filth down here!

It's posts like these that prove you HATE competition and LOVE big government. Turn in your
conservative card at the counter... [/quote]
You just see what you want to see. Why don't you start over at the beginning.

[kalm]

There you go again, Dennis, dragging the corporatist crap into it. Lovely filth down here!

It's posts like these that prove you HATE competition and LOVE big government. Turn in your
conservative card at the counter...

You just see what you want to see. Why don't you start over at the beginning.[/quote]

Which beginning?

You defend the NSA spying programs and entrenched financial power at the top that's propped up by government. Bachmann and Paul have both taken money from the government they didn't really need. Paul Ryan's family made it big on government construction contracts and SS paid for part of his schooling etc. Am I missing something?

[AZGrizFan]

Well let the historical record stand (obviously)
Throughout history it's been far more difficult being white...
Everybody knows that

Bullshit. Z, Blueballs, and Cluck would've ended up EXACTLY where they're at even if they HAD been born in a black ghetto. On account of hard work and right decisions and stuff. They're THAT good.

Well, I can't speak for Blueballs and Cluck, but you know nothing about my upbringing or background to even JOKE about something like that.

Oh, and I AM....THAT good.

[kalm]

Bullshit. Z, Blueballs, and Cluck would've ended up EXACTLY where they're at even if they HAD been born in a black ghetto. On account of hard work and right decisions and stuff. They're THAT good.

Well, I can't speak for Blueballs and Cluck, but you know nothing about my upbringing or background to even JOKE about something like that.

Oh, and I AM....THAT good.

My bad. IIRC, Something along the lines of a big family in Deer Lodge or somewhere near the Pintlers that wasn't exactly the second coming of the Copper Kings. So fine...you're a poor example...my apologies. But you do get my point.

[AZGrizFan]

Well, I can't speak for Blueballs and Cluck, but you know nothing about my upbringing or background to even JOKE about something like that.

Oh, and I AM....THAT good.

My bad. IIRC, Something along the lines of a big family in Deer Lodge or somewhere near the Pintlers that wasn't exactly the second coming of the Copper Kings. So fine...you're a poor example...my apologies. But you do get my point.

The one who REALLY had every opportunity in the world to "go bad" was my father. 100% Irish at a time when Irish were considered the equal of the black man; 5th of 6 children, sharecropper's son; father killed by a horse when my dad was 10, mother committed suicide when my dad was 11; shipped from foster home to foster home; worked essentially as a slave at the Poor Farm in Opportunity for two years (that story would curl your hair, seriously); 9th grade drop-out....you get the picture.

Instead, he picked himself up by HIS bootstraps, learned a trade, eventually married the Anaconda police chief's daughter and for the most part was a good, loving, hard-working dad who held three full-time jobs until I was 12 to put food on the table.

I, personally, had a very good example to follow. He, on the other hand, did not.

So, no. I do NOT get your point. ANYONE has the ability to pull themselves out of their current situation. All they require is a backbone and clarity of vision. When the need for a backbone is eliminated by public "assistance", the only thing we're assisting them with is perpetuation of their existing situation.

[kalm]

My bad. IIRC, Something along the lines of a big family in Deer Lodge or somewhere near the Pintlers that wasn't exactly the second coming of the Copper Kings. So fine...you're a poor example...my apologies. But you do get my point.

The one who REALLY had every opportunity in the world to "go bad" was my father. 100% Irish at a time when Irish were considered the equal of the black man; 5th of 6 children, sharecropper's son; father killed by a horse when my dad was 10, mother committed suicide when my dad was 11; shipped from foster home to foster home; worked essentially as a slave at the Poor Farm in Opportunity for two years (that story would curl your hair, seriously); 9th grade drop-out....you get the picture.

Instead, he picked himself up by HIS bootstraps, learned a trade, eventually married the Anaconda police chief's daughter and for the most part was a good, loving, hard-working dad who held three full-time jobs until I was 12 to put food on the table.

I, personally, had a very good example to follow. He, on the other hand, did not.

So, no. I do NOT get your point. ANYONE has the ability to pull themselves out of their current situation. All they require is a backbone and clarity of vision. When the need for a backbone is eliminated by public "assistance", the only thing we're assisting them with is perpetuation of their existing situation.

So unlike a large number of blacks, you at least had a dad. Not to mention there might be a chance that you didn't experience the same level of violence and danger growing up in Montana that a black kid sees in the inner city. You were just chastising me for making assumptions about your upbringing and opportunities yet aren't you making the same mistake that since your dad was able to do it, and you were able to do it, (with help set by his excellent example) that others should be able to as well?

I agree that it's time for the black community to lift THEMSELVES up more. I DO recognize the cultural component of this. I also agree that there's a serious issue of generational dependence that has been created by the welfare state. But I also recognize that there are MANY black Z's out there just as I recognize there are MANY white failures as well. Lazy, dumb, non-self reliance does transcend culture and skin color.

[AZGrizFan]

The one who REALLY had every opportunity in the world to "go bad" was my father. 100% Irish at a time when Irish were considered the equal of the black man; 5th of 6 children, sharecropper's son; father killed by a horse when my dad was 10, mother committed suicide when my dad was 11; shipped from foster home to foster home; worked essentially as a slave at the Poor Farm in Opportunity for two years (that story would curl your hair, seriously); 9th grade drop-out....you get the picture.

Instead, he picked himself up by HIS bootstraps, learned a trade, eventually married the Anaconda police chief's daughter and for the most part was a good, loving, hard-working dad who held three full-time jobs until I was 12 to put food on the table.

I, personally, had a very good example to follow. He, on the other hand, did not.

So, no. I do NOT get your point. ANYONE has the ability to pull themselves out of their current situation. All they require is a backbone and clarity of vision. When the need for a backbone is eliminated by public "assistance", the only thing we're assisting them with is perpetuation of their existing situation.

So unlike a large number of blacks, you at least had a dad. Not to mention there might be a chance that you didn't experience the same level of violence and danger growing up in Montana that a black kid sees in the inner city. You were just chastising me for making assumptions about your upbringing and opportunities yet aren't you making the same mistake that since your dad was able to do it, and you were able to do it, (with help set by his excellent example) that others should be able to as well?

I agree that it's time for the black community to lift THEMSELVES up more. I DO recognize the cultural component of this. I also agree that there's a serious issue of generational dependence that has been created by the welfare state. But I also recognize that there are MANY black Z's out there just as I recognize there are MANY white failures as well. Lazy, dumb, non-self reliance does transcend culture and skin color.

Sure, there are exceptions to every rule. And excuses are like assholes, klammy. And that's what all those things sound like.

Obama thinks he's "helping", when in fact all he's doing is perpetuating the "victim" complex that is what's REALLY held down (essentially) an entire race of people. Then again, if that race WERE to become successful, the Donks couldn't count on them for their votes so there's not a lot of incentive for Donks to try and help make blacks successful. They'd rather just keep them on the dole.

[D1B]

So unlike a large number of blacks, you at least had a dad. Not to mention there might be a chance that you didn't experience the same level of violence and danger growing up in Montana that a black kid sees in the inner city. You were just chastising me for making assumptions about your upbringing and opportunities yet aren't you making the same mistake that since your dad was able to do it, and you were able to do it, (with help set by his excellent example) that others should be able to as well?

I agree that it's time for the black community to lift THEMSELVES up more. I DO recognize the cultural component of this. I also agree that there's a serious issue of generational dependence that has been created by the welfare state. But I also recognize that there are MANY black Z's out there just as I recognize there are MANY white failures as well. Lazy, dumb, non-self reliance does transcend culture and skin color.

Sure, there are exceptions to every rule. And excuses are like assholes, klammy. And that's what all those things sound like.

Obama thinks he's "helping", when in fact all he's doing is perpetuating the "victim" complex that is what's REALLY held down (essentially) an entire race of people. Then again, if that race WERE to become successful, the Donks couldn't count on them for their votes so there's not a lot of incentive for Donks to try and help make blacks successful. They'd rather just keep them on the dole.

Bullshit, asshole. Donks are providing a minimal safety net so they can lift themselves up, an millions do. You, Baldy and BDEATSCCK and the rest of conk nation concentrate solely on the failures and hold them up as the norm.

The truth is, and you know this you fucking scumbag, the thing that's ultimately holding them back is old, white fucks like you who won't give them a job. The minute you see Shaniqua Collins or Trayvon Jones on a resume, it goes in the trash This just being the tip of the institutional racism iceberg.

Bottom line - conks need to keep african americans poor and on COPS. Without this, their voter base who are primarily white low-life, welfare hogging, stinky, uneducated and violent failures will have no one to blame all their problems on. With out this distraction/ruse, they might actually figure it's you fucks who are the problem and fucking kill you.

[D1B]

Got damn, it was fucking Z the whole time! Where does that asshole live?