Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by D1B »

Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote: You've become so steeped in hyperbole. That's why I asked what's become of you lately. :coffee:
You're certainly cherry picking to suit your weak point...
But my general point stands and is accurate
and you avoided my question as well
89Hen - in his 40's and still caught up in that shit. Got his kids hooked on it too.

What a dumb ass.
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by 89Hen »

Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote: You've become so steeped in hyperbole. That's why I asked what's become of you lately. :coffee:
You're certainly cherry picking to suit your weak point...
But my general point stands and is accurate
and you avoided my question as well
Cherry picking? When you make claims and reiterate them in all caps like "there would zero.... ZERO..." I guess I took that at face value. Did you really not mean that? And when you start sentences with "frankly" I also take that to mean what follows is your belief. However, I gave you the benefit of the doubt and called it hyperbole. Sorry if that's not the case.

Not sure which question you asked me. If it is in regards to the church having done more harm to itself than anyone/anything else... of course. First, pretty much anything that goes wrong with any party is the party's fault to begin with. Second, I don't think anyone can deny that the church has screwed up royally over the last century with regards to the pedophile issue. I could choose to leave the church and let them settle it themselves. Or I could stay with the church and try to help fix the problem. I chose the more difficult path.

I love how DB1 likes to make it out like I'm taking the easy way out by staying with the church. It's not easy to withstand the slings and arrows, but I don't care. I enjoy going to church every week. Lots of good info there. I also understand it's not for everyone. Have you ever seen me here trying to convert people? Honestly, I should be as it's part of my duty, but this is a football message board. If I can impart even a little point of view here and there without forcign myself on any of you, I'm happy with that.
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by D1B »

89Hen wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
You're certainly cherry picking to suit your weak point...
But my general point stands and is accurate
and you avoided my question as well
Cherry picking? When you make claims and reiterate them in all caps like "there would zero.... ZERO..." I guess I took that at face value. Did you really not mean that? And when you start sentences with "frankly" I also take that to mean what follows is your belief. However, I gave you the benefit of the doubt and called it hyperbole. Sorry if that's not the case.

Not sure which question you asked me. If it is in regards to the church having done more harm to itself than anyone/anything else... of course. First, pretty much anything that goes wrong with any party is the party's fault to begin with. Second, I don't think anyone can deny that the church has screwed up royally over the last century with regards to the pedophile issue. I could choose to leave the church and let them settle it themselves. Or I could stay with the church and try to help fix the problem. I chose the more difficult path.

I love how DB1 likes to make it out like I'm taking the easy way out by staying with the church. It's not easy to withstand the slings and arrows, but I don't care. I enjoy going to church every week. Lots of good info there. I also understand it's not for everyone. Have you ever seen me here trying to convert people? Honestly, I should be as it's part of my duty, but this is a football message board. If I can impart even a little point of view here and there without forcign myself on any of you, I'm happy with that.

You're so noble, sticking with the church. :rofl: Nice one, dumb ass. You should be a lawyer.

*What "good information" are getting at church? :rofl:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by 89Hen »

D1B wrote:You're so noble, sticking with the church. :rofl: Nice one, dumb ass. You should be a lawyer.

*What "good information" are getting at church? :rofl:
Nope, not noble, but also not a lazy, dumb ass, you lazy, dumb ass.

I'm fortunate to have good priests who give great homilies on a regular basis. :thumb:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by D1B »

89Hen wrote:
D1B wrote:You're so noble, sticking with the church. :rofl: Nice one, dumb ass. You should be a lawyer.

*What "good information" are getting at church? :rofl:
Nope, not noble, but also not a lazy, dumb ass, you lazy, dumb ass.

I'm fortunate to have good priests who give great homilies on a regular basis. :thumb:

Yeah, what did you learn? What "good information" did you get.

Answer the question, dumbfuck.

Fuck it, the truth is you didn't learn anything and you did'nt get good information other than being told that you're going to heaven to be with jesus, if you comply with the church. :nod: That aint new, they tell you that shit every time in the exact same way. It's also supreme bullshit you coward. :lol:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

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D1B wrote:Fuck it, the truth is you didn't learn anything and you did'nt get good information other than being told that you're going to heaven to be with jesus, if you comply with the church. :nod: That aint new, they tell you that shit every time in the exact same way. It's also supreme bullshit you coward. :lol:
Funny how the folks who don't go to church think they're experts on what goes on in church. :lol: You stopped going while you were still picking boogers and examining them for an hour.
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

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89Hen wrote:
D1B wrote:Fuck it, the truth is you didn't learn anything and you did'nt get good information other than being told that you're going to heaven to be with jesus, if you comply with the church. :nod: That aint new, they tell you that shit every time in the exact same way. It's also supreme bullshit you coward. :lol:
Funny how the folks who don't go to church think they're experts on what goes on in church. :lol: You stopped going while you were still picking boogers and examining them for an hour.

:rofl: Exactly as I thought - nothing. You can't come up with one fucking thing.

I've been to mass more times in the last year than 90% of all catholics. :nod:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by 89Hen »

D1B wrote:
89Hen wrote: Funny how the folks who don't go to church think they're experts on what goes on in church. :lol: You stopped going while you were still picking boogers and examining them for an hour.

:rofl: Exactly as I thought - nothing. You can't come up with one fucking thing.

I've been to mass more times in the last year than 90% of all catholics. :nod:
This isn't the schoolyard DB. Your bully tactics don't work here. :coffee:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by D1B »

89Hen wrote:
D1B wrote:

:rofl: Exactly as I thought - nothing. You can't come up with one fucking thing.

I've been to mass more times in the last year than 90% of all catholics. :nod:
This isn't the schoolyard DB. Your bully tactics don't work here. :coffee:
As I suspected, you can't come up anything. I'm not saying there isn't good shit that occasionally sticks to the wall, you just don't remember. :lol:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by 89Hen »

D1B wrote:
89Hen wrote: This isn't the schoolyard DB. Your bully tactics don't work here. :coffee:
As I suspected, you can't come up anything. I'm not saying there isn't good shit that occasionally sticks to the wall, you just don't remember. :lol:
I remember fine, but it's stuff you wouldn't appreciate... like how to be a better person.
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by Chizzang »

My question was in response to Catholicism being "all about Jesus" / To which I came out of hiding to reply
I was staying out of the original debate because honestly I don't care / I'm not concerned nor even talking about the pedophilia issues

But its a HUGE leap to claim Catholicism is "all about Jesus"
What little we can actually attribute to Jesus is a dramatic stretch to liken back to Catholicism
Church Doctrine / Liturgy / Traditions and entire body of policy is pretty much nothing like what Jesus preached / Catholicism is giant mountains of "other stuff" piled on top of a few simple quotes

In fact I would argue that if Jesus indeed "came back"
He wouldn't recognize Christianity (and certainly not Catholicism) as his work
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by JoltinJoe »

Chizzang wrote: In fact I would argue that if Jesus indeed "came back"
He wouldn't recognize Christianity (and certainly not Catholicism) as his work
Oh, you are quite wrong about that. But he would be upset about those things about Catholicism that are the only things you seem to notice.
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by D1B »

JoltinJoe wrote:
Chizzang wrote: In fact I would argue that if Jesus indeed "came back"
He wouldn't recognize Christianity (and certainly not Catholicism) as his work
Oh, you are quite wrong about that. But he would be upset about those things about Catholicism that are the only things you seem to notice.
:lol:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

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89Hen wrote:
D1B wrote:
As I suspected, you can't come up anything. I'm not saying there isn't good shit that occasionally sticks to the wall, you just don't remember. :lol:
I remember fine, but it's stuff you wouldn't appreciate... like how to be a better person.
Tell me one thing the priest said about being a better person. :coffee:

:lol:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

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D1B wrote:
JoltinJoe wrote:
Oh, you are quite wrong about that. But he would be upset about those things about Catholicism that are the only things you seem to notice.
:lol:
Ok, you win. I'm on your side now.

All our sacrifices are for naught. All our hopes and dreams are illusions. Those who risk their lives for others are fools. Little children who starve to death -- little babes too insignificant for us to even notice -- never get their justice; their pained cries for help just go silent and are never heard or attoned for. Hitler, Stalin now rest as peacefully as you will some day. Yes, I'm happy to be a "freethinker." :cry:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

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JoltinJoe wrote:
D1B wrote:
:lol:
Ok, you win. I'm on your side now.

All our sacrifices are for naught. All our hopes and dreams are illusions. Those who risk their lives for others are fools. Little children who starve to death -- little babes too insignificant for us to even notice -- never get their justice; their pained cries for help just go silent and are never heard or attoned for. Hitler, Stalin now rest as peacefully as you will some day. Yes, I'm happy to be a "freethinker." :cry:
:rofl:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by Chizzang »

JoltinJoe wrote:
Chizzang wrote: In fact I would argue that if Jesus indeed "came back"
He wouldn't recognize Christianity (and certainly not Catholicism) as his work
Oh, you are quite wrong about that. But he would be upset about those things about Catholicism that are the only things you seem to notice.

Joe I've paid almost zero attention to the Catholic faith in the last 30 years
What I noticed, I noticed a long long time ago as a teenager and it hasn't changed

You feel the way you feel about the church
I feel something different
we both have our conflicting observations

I am fond of Jesus
I do not need a HUGE mountain of other crap piled up between me and him
It's just that simple

:nod:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

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The Quakers kick the fuck out of the Catholics when it comes to living the values of Jesus.

If the catholic kale brains here were truly interested in honoring the Jesus' teaching, they'd abandon that scam and become Quakers. They won't cuz they're lazy, greedy, weak, spoiled and they like getting jerked off by scamming priests.

Priests-the most worthless fucks on the planet.
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

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JoltinJoe wrote:
D1B wrote:
:lol:
Ok, you win. I'm on your side now.

All our sacrifices are for naught. All our hopes and dreams are illusions. Those who risk their lives for others are fools. Little children who starve to death -- little babes too insignificant for us to even notice -- never get their justice; their pained cries for help just go silent and are never heard or attoned for. Hitler, Stalin now rest as peacefully as you will some day. Yes, I'm happy to be a "freethinker." :cry:
Joe, here's your church:
1. Throughout the world, Catholic bishops have engaged in a systematic, organized effort going back decades to cover up for priests who molest children, pressuring the victims to sign confidentiality agreements and quietly assigning the predators to new parishes where they could go on molesting. Tens of thousands of children have been raped and tortured as a result of this conspiracy of silence.

2. Strike one: "What did the pope know and when did he know it?" The current pope, when he was Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, was personally implicated in a case from the 1970s in which at least three sets of parents reported that a priest in his diocese had sexually abused their children. In response, Ratzinger assigned the priest to therapy, without notifying law enforcement, and washed his hands of the matter. That priest was back on duty in just a few short days and went on to molest more children.

3. Strike two: In 1981, again when the current pope was Cardinal Ratzinger, he got a letter from the diocese of Oakland asking him to defrock a priest who had acknowledged molesting two children. Ratzinger ignored this letter, and several followup letters, for four years. Finally, in 1985, he wrote back saying that more time was needed, and that they had to proceed very slowly to safeguard "the good of the Universal Church" in light of "the young age of the petitioner" -- by which he meant not the victimized children, but the pedophile priest. (By contrast, when a rogue archbishop ordained married men as priests, he was laicized six days later.)

4. Strike three: In 2001, Cardinal Ratzinger wrote a letter, De Delictis Gravioribus, to all Catholic bishops advising them how to handle accusations of sex crimes by priests. There was no recommendation to contact the police, but rather an instruction for them to report such cases only to the Vatican and tell no one else: "Cases of this kind are subject to the pontifical secret."

5. Some church officials, like the American friar Benedict Groeschel, have blamed the epidemic of child molestation on sexually wanton boys who tempt priests into assaulting them.

6. They threaten to cut off funding for immigrants' rights advocates because they sometimes work with gay-rights advocates. Preventing immigrants from getting legal and medical aid is less important than ensuring the church isn't contaminated by even indirect contact with anyone who helps gay people.

7. In a sign of how ridiculously disproportionate and unhinged the church's martyrdom complex is, the current pope has compared expanding the rights of women and gay people to the murderous anticlerical violence of the 1930s Spanish civil war.

8. They've used their official UN observer status to team up with Islamic theocracies like Iran and Libya to oppose calls for family-planning services to be made available in the world's poorest nations.

9. They've gone to desperately poor, AIDS-ravaged regions of Africa to spread the life-destroying lie that condoms don't prevent transmission of HIV.

10. In the mid-20th century, they appointed a special papal commission to study whether Catholicism should permit the use of birth control. When the commission almost unanimously recommended that they should, they ignored that recommendation and doubled down on their absolute ban on contraception.

11. They excommunicated the doctors who performed an abortion on a pregnant 9-year-old who'd been raped by her stepfather.

12. They did not excommunicate the stepfather.

13. Savita Halappanavar wasn't the first: Catholic-run hospitals are willing to let women die rather than get lifesaving abortions, even when a miscarriage is already in progress and no possible procedure could save the fetus.

14. They refused to provide contraception or abortion to women who were abducted and forced to work as prostitutes, and then filed a lawsuit complaining it was violating their religious freedom when the government took away their contract.

15. In Poland, they ordered politicians to vote for a law banning IVF and threatened to excommunicate any who didn't comply.

16. They were a major source of the pressure on the Komen Foundation that led to its disastrous decision to cut ties with Planned Parenthood.

17. They've announced an inquisition into the Girl Scouts to get to the bottom of its association with morally suspect groups like Doctors Without Borders and Oxfam.

18. They've been one of the major forces attacking Obamacare, filing lawsuits arguing that non-church Catholic employers should be able to decide whether or not employee health insurance plans will cover contraception. This is effectively an argument that a woman's employer should be allowed to force her to pay more for medical coverage, or even place it out of her reach altogether, based on his religious beliefs.

19. In Australia, they allegedly derailed a police investigation of an accused pedophile, putting pressure on higher-ups to get an investigating officer removed from the case.

20. They demanded that Sunday school teachers sign a loyalty oath agreeing to submit "will and intellect" to the proclamations of church leaders.

21. Some top church officials, including the current pope, have advocated denying communion to politicians who support progressive and pro-choice political ideas. Notably, although the church also opposes preemptive war and the death penalty, no conservative politician has ever been denied communion on this basis.

22. They've cracked down on American nuns for doing too much to help the poor and not enough to oppose gay marriage, condemning them for displaying a seditious "feminist spirit."

23. In Germany, where parishioners pay an officially assessed tax rate to the church, they've tried to blackmail people who don't want to pay the church tax, threatening to fire them from jobs in church institutions. In some cases, if the person opts out but later loses the paperwork, they demand on-the-spot repayment of decades of back taxes.

24. In America, bishops have compared Democratic officeholders, including President Obama, to Hitler and Stalin and have said that it jeopardizes a person's eternal salvation if they don't vote as the bishops instruct them to.

25. They fight against equal marriage rights for same-sex couples. It's not enough for the Catholic church hierarchy that they refuse to perform church weddings for gay and lesbian couples; they want to write that prohibition into the civil law and deny marriage equality to everyone who doesn't fit their religious criteria, and have invested vast amounts of money and effort into doing so. In the 2012 election cycle alone, the church spent almost $2 million in an unsuccessful fight to defeat marriage-equality initiatives in four states.

26. They've compared gay sex to pedophilia and incest and called for it to be forbidden by law, saying that "states can and must regulate behaviors, including various sexual behaviors."

27. They've shut down adoption clinics rather than consider gay people as prospective parents. The church's official position, apparently, is that it's better for children to remain orphans or in foster care than to be placed in a loving, committed same-sex household.

28. They barred an anti-LGBT bullying group, anti-teen-suicide foundation from a Catholic school ceremony, explaining that the group's mission is "contrary to the teachings of the Catholic church."

29. They told a teenager he wouldn't be allowed to go through confirmation because he posted a pro-gay-rights status message on Facebook, and they expelled a preschooler from a private Catholic school because his parents were lesbians.

30. They have a history of dumping known pedophile priests in isolated, poor, rural communities, where they apparently assumed that local people wouldn't dare to complain or that no one would listen if they did.

31. They've given huge payouts -- as much as $20,000 in some cases -- to pedophile priests, to buy their silence and quietly ease them out of the priesthood, after specifically denying in public that they were doing this.

32. When the Connecticut legislature proposed extending statute-of-limitations laws to allow older child-abuse cases to be tried, the bishops ordered a letter to be read during Mass instructing parishioners to contact their representatives and lobby against it.

33. To fight back against and intimidate abuse-survivor groups like SNAP, the church's lawyers have filed absurdly broad subpoenas demanding the disclosure of decades' worth of documents.

34. In the Netherlands, some boys were apparently castrated in church-run hospitals after complaining to the police about sexual abuse by priests.

35. When a Catholic official from Philadelphia, William Lynn, was charged with knowingly returning predator priests to duty, his defense was to blame those decisions on his superior, Cardinal Anthony Bevilacqua, thus acknowledging that the corruption reaches to the highest levels of the church.

36. When confronted with hundreds of complaints about child-raping priests spanning decades, a Dutch cardinal used the same "we knew nothing" excuse once given by Nazi soldiers. Several months later, it was reported that this same cardinal had personally arranged to move a pedophile priest to a different parish to shield him from accusations.

37. In one case, Mother Teresa successfully persuaded the church to return a suspected pedophile priest to duty because he was a friend of hers. Eight additional complaints of child abuse were later lodged against him.

38. In yet another case, they appointed a priest with a history of child molestation to a board that advises the church on what to do when they get reports of priests molesting children.

39. And after all this, they've had the audacity to plead for money and ask parishioners to pick up the tab for legal costs and settlements.

40. They abducted tens of thousands of babies from unwed mothers who gave birth in Catholic-run hospitals all over the world throughout the 20th century, forcing drugged or helpless women to give their newborn children up for adoption against their will.

41. They tried to have the Indian skeptic Sanal Edamuruku charged with blasphemy and imprisoned for debunking a claim of a miraculous weeping statue.

42. They publicly supported the Russian Orthodox church's decision to have the punk band Pussy Riot charged and imprisoned for blasphemy.

43. Their finances are a disorganized mess, lacking strong accounting controls and clear internal separations, which means parishioners who give to the church can have no assurance of what the money will be used for. According to an investigation by the Economist, funds meant for hospitals, cemeteries and priests' pensions have been raided to pay legal fees and settlements in several diocesan bankruptcies.

44. They've said in public that the sexist prohibition on women priests is an infallible part of Catholic dogma, and hence can never be changed.

45. They've silenced priests who call for the ordination of women and other desperately needed reforms, exhorting them to instead show "the radicalism of obedience."

46. They've excommunicated at least one priest for advocating the ordination of women.

47. They lifted the excommunication of an anti-Semitic, Holocaust-denying bishop who also thinks women shouldn't attend college or wear pants.

48. When it comes to the question of who's financially responsible for compensating the victims of sex abuse, they argue that priests aren't employees and therefore the church bears no responsibility for anything they do.

49. They canonized Mother Teresa for doing little more than offering a squalid place for people to die. Outside observers who visited her "Home for the Dying" reported that medical care was substandard and dangerous, limited to aspirin and unsterilized needles rinsed in tap water, administered by untrained volunteers. The millions of dollars collected by Mother Teresa and her order, enough to build many advanced clinics and hospitals, remain unaccounted for.

50. They announced that voluntary end-of-life measures, such as terminal patients' directives for when they wish to have a feeding tube removed, won't be respected at Catholic hospitals.
You should be embarrassed. You supported all of this with your silence.
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by 89Hen »

JoltinJoe wrote:
Chizzang wrote: In fact I would argue that if Jesus indeed "came back"
He wouldn't recognize Christianity (and certainly not Catholicism) as his work
Oh, you are quite wrong about that. But he would be upset about those things about Catholicism that are the only things you seem to notice.
:nod:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by 89Hen »

Chizzang wrote:I am fond of Jesus
I do not need a HUGE mountain of other crap piled up between me and him
It's just that simple

:nod:
That's fine, but that's not even close to what you've been saying in this thread. I agree, you don't need the church to have a relationship with Jesus (or whomever you believe in).
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by Chizzang »

89Hen wrote:
Chizzang wrote:I am fond of Jesus
I do not need a HUGE mountain of other crap piled up between me and him
It's just that simple

:nod:
That's fine, but that's not even close to what you've been saying in this thread. I agree, you don't need the church to have a relationship with Jesus (or whomever you believe in).
play it down all you want...
But Catholicism isn't "all about Jesus"
I'm going to go with: It's a shameful abomination

:mrgreen:
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by 89Hen »

Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote: That's fine, but that's not even close to what you've been saying in this thread. I agree, you don't need the church to have a relationship with Jesus (or whomever you believe in).
play it down all you want...
But Catholicism isn't "all about Jesus"
I'm going to go with: It's a shameful abomination

:mrgreen:
I think you were the one who came up with the "all about Jesus" stuff in this thread (along with several other wild claims.) :?
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by Chizzang »

89Hen wrote:
Chizzang wrote:
play it down all you want...
But Catholicism isn't "all about Jesus"
I'm going to go with: It's a shameful abomination

:mrgreen:
I think you were the one who came up with the "all about Jesus" stuff in this thread (along with several other wild claims.) :?
No...
Joe did - the resident Catholic Theologin
But I have to admit I was thrilled when I saw it

:mrgreen:

BTW: WTF is Catholicism all about anyway..?
I can't quite rummage my way through all the extraneous bullsh!t

Convoluted nonsense is the first thing that comes to mind... but I'm open for your thoughts
Q: Name something that offends Republicans?
A: The actual teachings of Jesus
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D1B
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Re: Six Famous Documentaries Shockingly Full of Crap

Post by D1B »

Chizzang wrote:
89Hen wrote: I think you were the one who came up with the "all about Jesus" stuff in this thread (along with several other wild claims.) :?
No...
Joe did - the resident Catholic Theologin
But I have to admit I was thrilled when I saw it

:mrgreen:

BTW: WTF is Catholicism all about anyway..?
I can't quite rummage my way through all the extraneous bullsh!t

Convoluted nonsense is the first thing that comes to mind... but I'm open for your thoughts
Hen can't even remember all the "good information" his great priests gave him last Sunday. He doesn't have a clue what catholocism is. He just does what he's told. :lol:
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