VMI, ETSU and Mercer on their way to the SoCon

[OL FU]

I doubt too many Socon fans are happy with replacing GSU and ASU with the three mentioned.But that wasn't the choice. The choice was to replace them with someone. I am sure most of us would have been much happier with W&M but from what I understand that would require Richmond and they would only be a football member and the same may be the case with W&M. The yucks don't bother me. It is what it is. Football will still be good. Wofford is always good. Chattanooga, Samford and The Citadel making good strides. Hopefully Furman can get back in the game.

I can see why The Citadel folks like VMI, long time rival. For me, well I did think Lexington was a pretty town

[DSUrocks07]

Aside from raiding the CAA, what do you suggest?

Yeah I've asked that question several times here and on AGS and then of course..... crickets.


Sent from the center of the universe.

If they had their shit together, I would say SC State, A&T, and Norfolk State would all be good additions to the SoCon. No FBS aspirations there and would bring large fanbases. However even if they were viable options. I'm sure that politics would keep them out.

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[CID1990]

Yeah I've asked that question several times here and on AGS and then of course..... crickets.


Sent from the center of the universe.

If they had their **** together, I would say SC State, A&T, and Norfolk State would all be good additions to the SoCon. No FBS aspirations there and would bring large fanbases. However even if they were viable options. I'm sure that politics would keep them out.

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A few years ago there was a cabal of us (myself included) who thought SC State should be the next invite. But in the last couple years, SCSU has become a financial basket case, with no real end in sight to it. A&T, I agree with. I could use the occasional trips back home to the triad for some football! Not sure why we didn't look at them, but it would take a political perfect storm for an HBCU to take that kind of plunge.


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[OL FU]

If they had their **** together, I would say SC State, A&T, and Norfolk State would all be good additions to the SoCon. No FBS aspirations there and would bring large fanbases. However even if they were viable options. I'm sure that politics would keep them out.

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A few years ago there was a cabal of us (myself included) who thought SC State should be the next invite. But in the last couple years, SCSU has become a financial basket case, with no real end in sight to it. A&T, I agree with. I could use the occasional trips back home to the triad for some football! Not sure why we didn't look at them, but it would take a political perfect storm for an HBCU to take that kind of plunge.


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I agree. I would have jumped at SC State years ago. Their financial issues make it tough.

[Ibanez]

I haven't suggested anybody, but if I were to make a suggestion the three schools being added would be well down the list.

Sad thing is Mercer is probably the best of the three and they have years of work to do before they are anywhere close to being SoCon worthy in football.

VMI was a doormat when they left the SoCon, they have been a doormat in the Big South, and they will be a doormat in the SoCon again.

ETSU dropped football because it wasn't working. The only reason they are contemplating adding it back is because the resulting eviction from the SoCon hurt basketball.

Adding these three schools simply ensures that the SoCon is a one bid, probably a first round playoff league from here on out.

Sounds a lot like the Big South with CCU.

If the SoCon added nobody they would still be a 2 bid conference. The 2013 champs might even be someone other than ASU or GSU.

Some folks are starting to sound like the ASU - GSU crowd on the SunBelt BBS- "you need to invite us or your conference will die"

Folks need to give it up. CCU is not going to the SoCon. Look on the bright side. Being in the Bug South gives CCU a much better yearly chance id getting to go to the playoffs.


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CCU gets into the playoffs even when we aren't #1. We'd like to leave because nobody respects the Big South and we can't be better when play against CSU, Presby and VMI. Our baseball and basketball programs are usually in the top 25. Heck, CCU Baseball is normally in the top 3 with Clemson and USC.

[CID1990]

Sounds a lot like the Big South with CCU.

If the SoCon added nobody they would still be a 2 bid conference. The 2013 champs might even be someone other than ASU or GSU.

Some folks are starting to sound like the ASU - GSU crowd on the SunBelt BBS- "you need to invite us or your conference will die"

Folks need to give it up. CCU is not going to the SoCon. Look on the bright side. Being in the Bug South gives CCU a much better yearly chance id getting to go to the playoffs.


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CCU gets into the playoffs even when we aren't #1. We'd like to leave because nobody respects the Big South and we can't be better when play against CSU, Presby and VMI. Our baseball and basketball programs are usually in the top 25. Heck, CCU Baseball is normally in the top 3 with Clemson and USC.

CCU got into the playoffs when Stony Brook choked this year.

Basketball top 25 in what? SC?



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[Ibanez]

CCU gets into the playoffs even when we aren't #1. We'd like to leave because nobody respects the Big South and we can't be better when play against CSU, Presby and VMI. Our baseball and basketball programs are usually in the top 25. Heck, CCU Baseball is normally in the top 3 with Clemson and USC.

CCU got into the playoffs when Stony Brook choked this year.

Basketball top 25 in what? SC?



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Maybe I exaggerated but they surpass The Citadel.

[Ibanez]

CCU gets into the playoffs even when we aren't #1. We'd like to leave because nobody respects the Big South and we can't be better when play against CSU, Presby and VMI. Our baseball and basketball programs are usually in the top 25. Heck, CCU Baseball is normally in the top 3 with Clemson and USC.

CCU got into the playoffs when Stony Brook choked this year.

Basketball top 25 in what? SC?



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Liberty and SB had better records yet they didn't get in.

[CID1990]

CCU got into the playoffs when Stony Brook choked this year.

Basketball top 25 in what? SC?



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Liberty and SB had better records yet they didn't get in.

Stony Brook didn't get in? You sure about that?

CCU barely squeaked by an awful Furman team that The Citadel whipped off the field. That's the only reference anyone has, so your claim is questionable at best.


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[Ibanez]

Liberty and SB had better records yet they didn't get in.

Stony Brook didn't get in? You sure about that?

CCU barely squeaked by an awful Furman team that The Citadel whipped off the field. That's the only reference anyone has, so your claim is questionable at best.


Sent from the center of the universe.

Last year they did, but the other time a Big South school has gone to the playoffs, it wasn't LU or SBU. Those two years were 3 ways ties with CCU getting the auto bid even though our overall record wasn't #1 (we were tied one year w/ SBU and 2nd place the other). In the past 10 years, LU and CCU each have 5 conference championships (including the 2 shared with each other and SBU and CCU's shared with CSU). Stony Brook was a Co-Champion 4 years. Both Coastal Carolina and Liberty won Co-Champion 3 times and held it alone the other 2. Since 2004 the champions (with exception of the 2005 Co-champion CSU) the winners are always Coastal, Liberty and Stony Brook. The teams were great for one another. With SBU gone to the CAA, LU and Coastal will be duking it out. We can either hope that Gardner-Webb comes back as a good team, CSU gets built up to be a real team or some one comes in that can help elevate the Big South from being the butt of everyone's joke. SCSU in the mid 2000's would've been good but that school is spiraling out of control.

Listen, I know you Citadel guys hate CCU for some odd reason and I get that CCU in the SoCon is just another Carolina team. I'd like CCU to move out of the Big South.

[Ibanez]

Coastal Carolina has won a total of 93 Big South Conference Championships. 58 acquired within the last 13 years. (48 since football began).

Football (5) -- 2004, 2005, 2006, 2010, 2012
Men's Soccer (9) -- 1986, 1987, 1989, 1990, 1995, 2001, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2010
Volleyball (3) -- 1996, 1998, 2009
Men's Cross Country (3) -- 1993, 1995, 1996
Women's Cross Country (12) -- 1988, 1989, 1993, 1995, 1996, 1997, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2008
Men's Basketball (3) -- 1990, 1991, 1993
Women's Indoor Track & Field (6) -- 2004, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2013
Men's Golf (13) -- 1988, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2002, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010
Women's Golf (4) -- 1992, 1998, 2005, 2009
Men's Tennis (4) -- 1988, 1989, 1993, 1994
Women's Tennis (2) -- 2001, 2007
Men's Outdoor Track & Field (2) -- 2003, 2006
Women's Outdoor Track & Field (5) -- 2004, 2005, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2012
Baseball (12) -- 1986, 1989, 1991, 1992, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012
Softball (5) -- 1992, 1998, 2000, 2001, 2006, 2012


Coastal has won the Sasser Cup 7 times to Liberty's 6. The conference needs new blood or for the other teams to become truly competitive in football.

[ASUMountaineer]

Yet you fail to give a reasonable explanation.

Well, leaving aside (for SoCon purposes) that CCU is in SC, and that the conference needs to glue down UTC, CCU loses in a head to head with ETSU on those reasons alone.

VMI beats out CCU for a couple reasons. They fit in terms of size and academics. They are also in Virginia, where the SoCon would benefit from having a footprint. If the CAA loses a couple football members, W&M could possibly be coaxed into the SoCon, and already having VMI could help with that.

Mercer is the Atlanta market, and they are good in baseball and better in basketball, and likely will commit to scholly football. The Atlanta market alone makes them more attractive than CCU.

I cannot speak to the CAA's priorities, but for sure Richmond and W&M would not go for CCU for the same reasons they left the SoCon when ASU came on board.

You love saying that, don't you.

[ASUMountaineer]

OK. Wofford and who?

UTC is going to be the strongest team in the conference, and will probably beat ASU as well. Wofford will not be the champs. That will be Samford or The Citadel this year.

The game is at KBS...that would be quite the achievement for the biggest chokers in the SoCon. You never hear "Touchdown Mocs," like you do "Touchdown Citadel." Amirite?

[kdinva]

. Our baseball and basketball programs are usually in the top 25..

yeah, how did hosting the basketball tourney this season turn out for you all?

[Ibanez]

. Our baseball and basketball programs are usually in the top 25..

yeah, how did hosting the basketball tourney this season turn out for you all?

Baseball:
Ok. Let's talk about 1 season. How'd you do last year? I don't recall seeing your Knobs play in the NCAA championship like Stony Brook or in the Super Regional's like we were. But that's just one season. How about this, we've #1 regional seeds on four occasions (2005, 2007, 2008, 2010) and won 50+ games in 2005, 2007, 2008, and 2010. Shit, we even put 2 away against the Texas Rangers. We beat you 2-3 games this year, so far. We're 29-18. You guys are 19-30. We lead our division. You're at the bottom with UNC-Asheville.

Basketball: Again, one season. I may have exagerrated, but CCU basketball went 14-15 in 2012-13. 9-6 on conference which includes a win over the VMI Knobs. Albiet, the last time I truly paid attention to basketball was when we didn't have football and our homecoming was focused around it, circa 2001 .How'd you do last season? 14-17?

I admit my mistake, but don't be sounding so superior when the record is so close.

How about Golf? CCU just won the conference

Soccer? We lead the conference at 20-3-2. You guys are second to last 2-14-1. You're 1-7 at home.

Tennis? We won the conference. We're going against Duke in the tourney. You guys don't play.

[dbackjon]

Jacksonville State would be at the head of my list. They should have been added ahead of Samford last time around.

If getting into VA is that important I would have looked at Liberty well before VMI. FWIW I would have approached some of the VA DII and DIII schools before I would have approached VMI. VMI is a lost cause in FCS football at this point, and the rest of their athletic programs don't move the needle enough to over come that.

Thus is what I mean when I say people can't offer realistic alternatives.

BOTH teams you named have well known FBS aspirations. JSU won't make a lateral move to another FCS conference. You might as well say the SoCon should be going after JMU.


Sent from the center of the universe.

yup - why add two teams that will take the first FBS ticket out? Both would accept a SoCon invite one minute, then if the SunBelt called, would walk out of the SoCon Press Conference mid-introduction.

[kdinva]

Basketball: Again, one season. I may have exagerrated, but CCU basketball went 14-15 in 2012-13. 9-6 on conference which includes a win over the VMI Knobs. Albiet, the last time I truly paid attention to basketball was when we didn't have football and our homecoming was focused around it, circa 2001 .How'd you do last season? 14-17?

I admit my mistake, but don't be sounding so superior when the record is so close.

How about Golf? CCU just won the conference

Soccer? We lead the conference at 20-3-2. You guys are second to last 2-14-1. You're 1-7 at home.

Tennis? We won the conference. We're going against Duke in the tourney. You guys don't play.

baseball: we stink this year. We choose to have wrestling and lacrosse (stunk again), vs. golf and tennis. soccer: bad (we probably give out less than 1/2 the allowable grant monies than CCU does). Basketball underachieved this past season, looking forward to this winter. Our men's track program will be around this whole century.

[Ibanez]

Basketball: Again, one season. I may have exagerrated, but CCU basketball went 14-15 in 2012-13. 9-6 on conference which includes a win over the VMI Knobs. Albiet, the last time I truly paid attention to basketball was when we didn't have football and our homecoming was focused around it, circa 2001 .How'd you do last season? 14-17?

I admit my mistake, but don't be sounding so superior when the record is so close.

How about Golf? CCU just won the conference

Soccer? We lead the conference at 20-3-2. You guys are second to last 2-14-1. You're 1-7 at home.

Tennis? We won the conference. We're going against Duke in the tourney. You guys don't play.

baseball: we stink this year. We choose to have wrestling and lacrosse (stunk again), vs. golf and tennis. soccer: bad (we probably give out less than 1/2 the allowable grant monies than CCU does). Basketball underachieved this past season, looking forward to this winter. Our men's track program will be around this whole century.

I thought you guys didn't have wrestling, or is that Liberty? Anyway, VMI isn't consistent as a top performing school in athletics. You're a military school and you won't be that way ever. How many times do you see West Point or the Air Force Academy win a national championship or multiple conference championships. And i'm not suggesting that CCU is far superior, i'm just stating that the case isn't purely athletics.

Adam Smith of the Burlington Times-News

When the SoCon added Samford in 2008, Coastal Carolina had been under consideration. But Coastal Carolina’s academic profile was a drawback, especially in the collective mind of the league’s private schools (Davidson, Furman, Wofford, Elon).

So Mercer, which starts playing football this fall, would be a basketball-based addition, at least in the short term. Meanwhile, Coastal Carolina, for example, has made multiple appearances in the FCS playoffs recently. The Chanticleers would be a ready-to-roll choice for football.

Jeff Hartsell of the Charleston Post and Courier

Who else? ETSU and VMI would be eager to come back, I think, but ETSU is another start-up program and VMI might as well be. I’d call Richmond, William & Mary and UNC Wilmington of the Colonial. Might be a long shot, but you never know until you try. Fall-back schools? Coastal Carolina, Gardner-Webb, High Point, I guess

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[kdinva]

Jeff Hartsell of the Charleston Post and Courier

Who else? ETSU and VMI would be eager to come back, I think, but ETSU is another start-up program and VMI might as well be.

sad, 90% of the articles Mr. Hartsell writes about the Keydets are positive........VMI was three or four plays away from winning last season's game in Lex.......

[Ibanez]

Jeff Hartsell of the Charleston Post and Courier

sad, 90% of the articles Mr. Hartsell writes about the Keydets are positive........VMI was three or four plays away from winning last season's game in Lex.......

He is The Citadel beat writer...

[CID1990]

UTC is going to be the strongest team in the conference, and will probably beat ASU as well. Wofford will not be the champs. That will be Samford or The Citadel this year.

The game is at KBS...that would be quite the achievement for the biggest chokers in the SoCon. You never hear "Touchdown Mocs," like you do "Touchdown Citadel." Amirite?

Well, yes.

But I feel sorry for them. All that talent and they just continue to underachieve. I do think they could have a bear of a team this year, if they can just get out if their own way.


Sent from the center of the universe.

[catdaddy2402]

Jacksonville State would be at the head of my list. They should have been added ahead of Samford last time around.

If getting into VA is that important I would have looked at Liberty well before VMI. FWIW I would have approached some of the VA DII and DIII schools before I would have approached VMI. VMI is a lost cause in FCS football at this point, and the rest of their athletic programs don't move the needle enough to over come that.

Thus is what I mean when I say people can't offer realistic alternatives.

BOTH teams you named have well known FBS aspirations. JSU won't make a lateral move to another FCS conference. You might as well say the SoCon should be going after JMU.


Sent from the center of the universe.

Both may have FBS aspirations but neither has a conference that is going to add them anytime in the near future. The only conference that Jax St has any chance of joining is the Sun Belt and there is no way they are going to add a 3rd school in Alabama. Liberty has even less of a chance than Jax St.

[CID1990]

Thus is what I mean when I say people can't offer realistic alternatives.

BOTH teams you named have well known FBS aspirations. JSU won't make a lateral move to another FCS conference. You might as well say the SoCon should be going after JMU.


Sent from the center of the universe.

Both may have FBS aspirations but neither has a conference that is going to add them anytime in the near future. The only conference that Jax St has any chance of joining is the Sun Belt and there is no way they are going to add a 3rd school in Alabama. Liberty has even less of a chance than Jax St.

Nobody has any way of knowing that. The SoCon needs to be looking 10 or more years into the future, and any team that has even sniffed a possible move is going to lessen its chances.


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[GoApps70]

SoCon should also go after JMU.

[ASUMountaineer]

SoCon should also go after JMU.

Oh, you were serious.