Minnesota Self Defense Shooting and/or Murder

[YoUDeeMan]

That may be how most people view the law, but I agree with the sane people here...

This wasn't some off the cuff decision to steal a wallet they saw lying on the ground. Break-ins are serious violations that require planning and a decision that they were going to enter someone else's house regardless of how the victim feels about the intrusion and loss of property.

That is a pretty big step outside of what passes for living peacefully among others. Once that decision is made, the perps usually continue to make bad decisions that negatively impact other individuals for the rest of their lives.

The recivitism rate for burglers is well over 70%...and that's only measuring those that return to crime within 3 years. And that doesn't include stats from people who did it again and didn't get caught.

"Released prisoners with the highest rearrest rates were robbers (70.2%), burglars (74.0%), larcenists (74.6%), motor vehicle thieves (78.8%), those in prison for possessing or selling stolen property (77.4%), and those in prison for possessing, using, or selling illegal weapons (70.2%)."

http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/index.cfm?ty=tp&tid=17" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So, in review...when people break into your home, there is always a chance that someone wil get hurt...incuding the homeowner's famliy. Most likely (in approximately 3 out of 4 cases), the clowns that break into your home will do it again to you or someone else soon. In addition to the actual cost of replacing the stolen items (not even counting the family heirloooms which can't be replaced), crime victims, including children, often have psychological issues they must deal with...sometimes for the rest of their lives.

So yes, if some dirtbag decides that he doesn't care about the potential lifetime of problems he is about to foist upon some innocent homeowner and his family, then I say getting rid of the leech is the best thing a person can do for society.

[grizzaholic]

I will always, ALWAYS, err on the side of caution for me and my family and friends.

But who will take care of them while you rot in jail?

Don't be an idiot.

[Gil Dobie]

There must be more to this.

Homeowner hears intruders, gets rifle and pistol and retreats to basement.

Intruder #1 comes down the basement stairs and is killed by several gunshots from homeowner.

Intruder #2 then comes down the same stairs.......


I don't think so.

I thought the same thing at first....if the second perp hears gunshots why move toward them? Unless her boyfriend was packing and she thought he shot first?

I haven't been able to find any reports on whether the perps were carrying or not.

[89Hen]

But who will take care of them while you rot in jail?

Don't be an idiot.

Interesting. That's the same advice I'd give you.

[grizzaholic]

Don't be an idiot.

Interesting. That's the same advice I'd give you.

I won't be moving the damn body, for starters.

[YoUDeeMan]

Interesting. That's the same advice I'd give you.

I won't be moving the damn body, for starters.

Or babbling to the police that you put a bullet through the girl's chin at point blank range while she was almost dead but still breathing.

That's why this is sucjh a win-win. You have two home invading people who's lives ending are a blessing to the rest of society, and then you have this random, not-so-smart-dude who owns (and is willing to use) guns who will probably be removed from society before he shoots the mailman.

We are witness to Nature (or God) using two different dangerous mutant viruses to eliminate each other.

[89Hen]

So yes, if some dirtbag decides that he doesn't care about the potential lifetime of problems he is about to foist upon some innocent homeowner and his family, then I say getting rid of the leech is the best thing a person can do for society.

Good to know that this homeowner knew the history of these two kids and their intent.

I do not think your position is the "sane" one.

[89Hen]

Front Row (L-R): Cluck, Grizza, JSO

[YoUDeeMan]

Front Row (L-R): Cluck, Grizza, JSO

Nah, I'm the guy in the back that watches the riff-raff get all riled up while they run into the line of fire.

I'll simply laugh and go home at the absurdity of it all.

If they come for me, I'll defend myself and my family to the death...but screw dying for someone else's cause.

[89Hen]

If they come for me

Sane

[YoUDeeMan]

So yes, if some dirtbag decides that he doesn't care about the potential lifetime of problems he is about to foist upon some innocent homeowner and his family, then I say getting rid of the leech is the best thing a person can do for society.

Good to know that this homeowner knew the history of these two kids and their intent.

I do not think your position is the "sane" one.

How do you know he didn't know their intent?

If a person breaks into someone's home, then I don't give a rats azz about their history. I also don't give a rats azz about their future.

[YoUDeeMan]

If they come for me

Sane

You are the one who posted the picture of a mob.

Are you disappointed that you reaped what you sowed?

[Chizzang]

Or babbling to the police that you put a bullet through the girl's chin at point blank range while she was almost dead but still breathing.

That's why this is sucjh a win-win. You have two home invading people who's lives ending are a blessing to the rest of society, and then you have this random, not-so-smart-dude who owns (and is willing to use) guns who will probably be removed from society before he shoots the mailman.

We are witness to Nature (or God) using two different dangerous mutant viruses to eliminate each other.

This ^
I (heart) Cluck
a pair of common criminals and a lunatic all in one sweet package

[89Hen]

Sane

You are the one who posted the picture of a mob.

Are you disappointed that you reaped what you sowed?

I thought you were referring to the home invaders. The mob is you: vigilante justice.

[YoUDeeMan]

You are the one who posted the picture of a mob.

Are you disappointed that you reaped what you sowed?

I thought you were referring to the home invaders. The mob is you: vigilante justice.

So you use a picture of a mob to represent an individual defending his home? That's on par with D1B posting a picture of some individual preists with a bunch of Nazis.

[Chizzang]

So you use a picture of a mob to represent an individual defending his home? That's on par with D1B posting a picture of some individual preists with a bunch of Nazis.

[Ibanez]

I thought you were referring to the home invaders. The mob is you: vigilante justice.

So you use a picture of a mob to represent an individual defending his home? That's on par with D1B posting a picture of some individual preists with a bunch of Nazis.

Defending your home is one thing. Going beyond that and executing the people after they have been disabled is murder(manslaughter). IF he was so innocent, why not call the police right then? There is more to the story.

[ASUG8]

So you use a picture of a mob to represent an individual defending his home? That's on par with D1B posting a picture of some individual preists with a bunch of Nazis.

Defending your home is one thing. Going beyond that and executing the people after they have been disabled is murder(manslaughter). IF he was so innocent, why not call the police right then? There is more to the story.

I get what you're saying, but who knows what happens when the adrenaline is pumping. If I had a Maglight, baseball bat, etc. * I'm not sure I would have stopped any sooner than this guy did. I'd like to believe I'd slow down once they were incapacitated, but who knows.......

* didn't mention a 3 iron because I can't hit mine for anything.

[Ibanez]

Defending your home is one thing. Going beyond that and executing the people after they have been disabled is murder(manslaughter). IF he was so innocent, why not call the police right then? There is more to the story.

I get what you're saying, but who knows what happens when the adrenaline is pumping. If I had a Maglight, baseball bat, etc. * I'm not sure I would have stopped any sooner than this guy did. I'd like to believe I'd slow down once they were incapacitated, but who knows.......

* didn't mention a 3 iron because I can't hit mine for anything.

I understand the heat of the moment. But he shot her once, walked to her and shot again, deliberately dragged her body, put a gun under her chin and pulled the trigger? That's a lot action.

[89Hen]

I thought you were referring to the home invaders. The mob is you: vigilante justice.

So you use a picture of a mob to represent an individual defending his home? That's on par with D1B posting a picture of some individual preists with a bunch of Nazis.

Stop being so obtuse. You complete understand the correlation.

To blanket this situation with statements of anyone entering your house could and should be shot on sight, no questions asked, is folly. It is mob mentality.

[Chizzang]

To blanket this situation with statements of anyone entering your house could and should be shot on sight, no questions asked, is folly. It is mob mentality.

Yeah but... I've always wanted to shoot a teenager
You know, just to see what it was like

See this is why I live where I do
All the Redmond teenagers work at Starbucks or the Grocery stores
and if they want drugs they get their parents shrink to write them a scrip
it's so much easier than all those guns and messy break ins

[Ibanez]

So you use a picture of a mob to represent an individual defending his home? That's on par with D1B posting a picture of some individual preists with a bunch of Nazis.

Stop being so obtuse. You complete understand the correlation.

To blanket this situation with statements of anyone entering your house could and should be shot on sight, no questions asked, is folly. It is mob mentality.

Obtuse. Good word. +2000 points.

[houndawg]

I get what you're saying, but who knows what happens when the adrenaline is pumping. If I had a Maglight, baseball bat, etc. * I'm not sure I would have stopped any sooner than this guy did. I'd like to believe I'd slow down once they were incapacitated, but who knows.......

* didn't mention a 3 iron because I can't hit mine for anything.

I understand the heat of the moment. But he shot her once, walked to her and shot again, deliberately dragged her body, put a gun under her chin and pulled the trigger? That's a lot action.

His word against nobody's.....

[ASUG8]

I understand the heat of the moment. But he shot her once, walked to her and shot again, deliberately dragged her body, put a gun under her chin and pulled the trigger? That's a lot action.

His word against nobody's.....

I think it's more like his word against his word in this case....he's the prosecution's best witness.

[Gil Dobie]

Latest update I could find on the home owner.

Byron Smith was a security engineer for the U.S. Department of State. He retired six years ago.

Retired State Department political officer William Davnie tells Minnesota Public Radio News that security engineers oversee construction and repair work for U.S. embassy buildings and consulates. They do not patrol grounds like security officers, but instead focus on technical issues such as building layout and alarms.