28 Years Later

[Chizzang]

Help me out here...if you go into a hospital, people can take parts of you home without your knowledge or permission?

No different than my annual visit to my CPA. Obama takes a chunk of me every year.

So did Reagan and Bush (using that logic) which one felt better..? Or did it feel the same..?

[CAA Flagship]

No different than my annual visit to my CPA. Obama takes a chunk of me every year.

So did Reagan and Bush (using that logic) which one felt better..? Or did it feel the same..?

But my salary increased back then.

[kalm]

Yes, you can make that claim of most if not all "ism's". Still, you think Obama is a progressive. But it's progressives that are the part of the left that take issue with Obama almost as much as conservatives. That's why you see a Ron Paul and Bernie Sanders occasionally joining forces.

What's funny is you think Obama isn't a "progressive".

Ideologically, Obama is a dyed in the wool "progressive" whackjob. If you don't think so, just listen to any of his interviews before he ran for president or US Senator, read what limited writings are out there he has penned. Look who he has associated himself with over the last 35 years. His mother was also a whackjob "progressive" and was described by her associates as a "fellow traveler" (Communist sympathizer), his grandfather was a Communist, the only black father figure he had in his life growing up, Frank Marshall Davis, was a Communist. He claimed in one of the books he wrote which nobody read that he gravitated towards the Marxist professors and radical students in college. He is various parts of Upton Sinclair, Woodrow Wilson, LBJ, and Emma Goldman all rolled into one. Truly one of the worst of the worst.

The problem he faces is that the US is a center-right country and as much as he would like to, he isn't able to govern as a "progressive". He tries to push the envelope with horrible policies like Obamacare (he truly wants a socialized single payer system, and Obamacare is the first step in that direction), looting the US Treasury of billions of dollars for failed so-called "Green" stimulus packages to firms like Solyndra, EnerDel, Evergreen Solar, SunPower, etc. etc. etc., thousands of pages of new regulations coming out of Washington on a weekly basis, the militant EPA, and on and on and on...

Ivy is right. When you're as much of a wackjob as Sanders and Paul, there will be a few issues where those two will align themselves.

Boy I guess we dodged a giant socioliberalprogressive bullet when he had both houses of congress then, huh?

But I appreciate you're knowledge of Obama's seedy upbringings, influences, and alliances. You certainly know more about him than me or the msm. It was bad enough I had to learn who Saul Alinsky and Bill Ayers were. But evidently it goes much deeper and more evil!

[kalm]

Spoken like a true sycophant! You, Rahm, and David Axelrod need to get off Obama's dick for awhile.

This might be your strangest post ever, and that's saying something. Do you even know what a sycophant is? That hardly describes my attitude toward Obama.

Turn up your sarcasm detector Ive, I know you're not an Obama sycophant. I was having a little fun because the Obamabots share the same feelings toward progressives and libertarians as you. They are bad for business, they're not the corporate status quo, they refuse to play the game. But rest assured, they're also easily marginalized.

[Baldy]

Boy I guess we dodged a giant socioliberalprogressive bullet when he had both houses of congress then, huh?

What part of my statement saying the US is a center-right country did you not understand? Were you unconscious during the Donk bloodbath of the midterm elections of 2010 or something?

But I appreciate you're knowledge of Obama's seedy upbringings, influences, and alliances. You certainly know more about him than me or the msm. It was bad enough I had to learn who Saul Alinsky and Bill Ayers were. But evidently it goes much deeper and more evil!

We all suffer when voters don't educate themselves about the politicians we elect to office. Props to you for admitting being one of those people.

[ODUsmitty]

The average voter is an IDIOT, and does zero due diligence in researching the drivel that the MSM feeds them.

I'd rather be considered outside of the mainstream than to lumped into this mouth-breathing herd of idiots that are swayed by pathetic public-interest stories of the woes of those too f'ing lazy to improve their lot in life.

[kalm]

Boy I guess we dodged a giant socioliberalprogressive bullet when he had both houses of congress then, huh?

What part of my statement saying the US is a center-right country did you not understand? Were you unconscious during the Donk bloodbath of the midterm elections of 2010 or something?

But I appreciate you're knowledge of Obama's seedy upbringings, influences, and alliances. You certainly know more about him than me or the msm. It was bad enough I had to learn who Saul Alinsky and Bill Ayers were. But evidently it goes much deeper and more evil!

We all suffer when voters don't educate themselves about the politicians we elect to office. Props to you for admitting being one of those people.

America is rhetorically center-right until you threaten to take away their entitlements, ask them about pot legalization, staying in Afghanistan until 2024, or their views on Wall Street monopolies.

But if your point is that Obama is a pussy, I totally agree.

Now if you could just admit that he's the identical twin brother of Bush and Romney and that the real problem lies with entrenched power and how we elect people, we might just get somewhere.

[Ivytalk]

The average voter is an IDIOT, and does zero due diligence in researching the drivel that the MSM feeds them.

I'd rather be considered outside of the mainstream than to lumped into this mouth-breathing herd of idiots that are swayed by pathetic public-interest stories of the woes of those too f'ing lazy to improve their lot in life.

Voting rights in America should be determined by some algorithm combining intelligence and property ownership.

[Baldy]

America is rhetorically center-right until you threaten to take away their entitlements, ask them about pot legalization, staying in Afghanistan until 2024, or their views on Wall Street monopolies.

But if your point is that Obama is a pussy, I totally agree.

Now if you could just admit that he's the identical twin brother of Bush and Romney and that the real problem lies with entrenched power and how we elect people, we might just get somewhere.

That's how entitlements are intended to work. Create the entitlement, foster dependence, and use it against your opponent during election time...."Those evil Republicans are gonna take away your Medicare if you vote for them." It's how the Donks tied up the black vote through welfare dependency and with the above example for the gimme generation.

We do agree about Obama. "progressives" are pussies anyway so that goes without saying.

I would say that Obama was more of a twin for McCain than Bush or Romney. McCain and Obama's trains were headed to the same place. The only difference is that Obama's train traveled 10X faster.
The problem is with entrenched power. The founders were for a citizen legislature, not the full time politicians we have now. The founders and the Constitution called for Senators to be appointed by the state legislatures for each state. Thanks to the "progressives" that was changed by the 17th amendment.
It's good to see you learning a few things.

[Baldy]

The average voter is an IDIOT, and does zero due diligence in researching the drivel that the MSM feeds them.

I'd rather be considered outside of the mainstream than to lumped into this mouth-breathing herd of idiots that are swayed by pathetic public-interest stories of the woes of those too f'ing lazy to improve their lot in life.

Voting rights in America should be determined by some algorithm combining intelligence, TAX BURDEN, and property ownership.

FIFY

[kalm]

America is rhetorically center-right until you threaten to take away their entitlements, ask them about pot legalization, staying in Afghanistan until 2024, or their views on Wall Street monopolies.

But if your point is that Obama is a pussy, I totally agree.

Now if you could just admit that he's the identical twin brother of Bush and Romney and that the real problem lies with entrenched power and how we elect people, we might just get somewhere.

That's how entitlements are intended to work. Create the entitlement, foster dependence, and use it against your opponent during election time...."Those evil Republicans are gonna take away your Medicare if you vote for them." It's how the Donks tied up the black vote through welfare dependency and with the above example for the gimme generation.

We do agree about Obama. "progressives" are pussies anyway so that goes without saying.

I would say that Obama was more of a twin for McCain than Bush or Romney. McCain and Obama's trains were headed to the same place. The only difference is that Obama's train traveled 10X faster.
The problem is with entrenched power. The founders were for a citizen legislature, not the full time politicians we have now. The founders and the Constitution called for Senators to be appointed by the state legislatures for each state. Thanks to the "progressives" that was changed by the 17th amendment.
It's good to see you learning a few things.

Entitlement culture exists for the wealthy and corporations too. That was the whole point of the original progressive movement. "Pussies" who slogged away in the factories, railroads, and fields got a little tired of the "real men" who could afford to rest on their laurels and purchase favorable legislation.

Modern DEMOCRATIC politicians are pussies. But you are clearly confused by your own labels and stereotypes. The country is way more progressive on the big issues like war, civil liberties, and financial reform than either Romney or Obama. Poll after poll illustrates this. So Dems rhetorically swing left to get elected and in practice swing back right to fill their campaign coffers. They are whores. At least the Republicans make no bones about their fealty to the powerful.

And btw entrenched power existed when state legislatures selected senators too.

[Baldy]

Entitlement culture exists for the wealthy and corporations too. That was the whole point of the original progressive movement. "Pussies" who slogged away in the factories, railroads, and fields got a little tired of the "real men" who could afford to rest on their laurels and purchase favorable legislation.

Modern DEMOCRATIC politicians are pussies. But you are clearly confused by your own labels and stereotypes. The country is way more progressive on the big issues like war, civil liberties, and financial reform than either Romney or Obama. Poll after poll illustrates this. So Dems rhetorically swing left to get elected and in practice swing back right to fill their campaign coffers. They are whores. At least the Republicans make no bones about their fealty to the powerful.

And btw entrenched power existed when state legislatures selected senators too.

I seem to have hit a little "progressive" nerve there.

You certainly have seemed to master the talking points well. Truth of the matter is, just like prohibition, the income tax and the "corporate entitlement culture" you love to complain about is a by product of the so-called "progressive" era. Congratulations!

The pussies slogging away in the factories, fields, and the railroads finally got smart, formed unions, and purchased legislation all their own. What's the difference?

You make the hideously idiotic claim that the country is progressive on the "big issues" like war, civil liberties, financial reform, and I'm the one who is confused?
You do realize that the three costliest, bloodiest, and most destructive wars of the 20th century rest at the feet of three of your "progressive" hero presidents, don't you?
Civil liberties?
Have you learned anything about the "progressive" temperance movement and prohibition? What about the civil liberties of Japanese, Italian, and German AMERICANS held against their will in internment camps during WWI and WWII by the "progressive" gods like Woodrow Wilson and FDR? What about the "progressives" in New York and California banning plastic fucking bags, and trans fatty acids, salt, sugar, etc.
Yeah boy, them there "progressives" are some civil liberty freedom luvin' people.

What a kalamity...one step forward and two steps back.

[kalm]

Entitlement culture exists for the wealthy and corporations too. That was the whole point of the original progressive movement. "Pussies" who slogged away in the factories, railroads, and fields got a little tired of the "real men" who could afford to rest on their laurels and purchase favorable legislation.

Modern DEMOCRATIC politicians are pussies. But you are clearly confused by your own labels and stereotypes. The country is way more progressive on the big issues like war, civil liberties, and financial reform than either Romney or Obama. Poll after poll illustrates this. So Dems rhetorically swing left to get elected and in practice swing back right to fill their campaign coffers. They are whores. At least the Republicans make no bones about their fealty to the powerful.

And btw entrenched power existed when state legislatures selected senators too.

I seem to have hit a little "progressive" nerve there.

You certainly have seemed to master the talking points well. Truth of the matter is, just like prohibition, the income tax and the "corporate entitlement culture" you love to complain about is a by product of the so-called "progressive" era. Congratulations!

The pussies slogging away in the factories, fields, and the railroads finally got smart, formed unions, and purchased legislation all their own. What's the difference?

You make the hideously idiotic claim that the country is progressive on the "big issues" like war, civil liberties, financial reform, and I'm the one who is confused?
You do realize that the three costliest, bloodiest, and most destructive wars of the 20th century rest at the feet of three of your "progressive" hero presidents, don't you?
Civil liberties?
Have you learned anything about the "progressive" temperance movement and prohibition? What about the civil liberties of Japanese, Italian, and German AMERICANS held against their will in internment camps during WWI and WWII by the "progressive" gods like Woodrow Wilson and FDR? What about the "progressives" in New York and California banning plastic fucking bags, and trans fatty acids, salt, sugar, etc.
Yeah boy, them there "progressives" are some civil liberty freedom luvin' people.

What a kalamity...one step forward and two steps back.

Warrantless wire tapping, due process, and the patriot act > then plastic bags and transfatty acids. And please, continue to dig up more evidence from 80 years ago when Southern Democrats were anti-civil rights and evidently conks were anti-war.

Neither side is perfect Baldy and labels are pretty useless. Some of us realize this.

[Baldy]

Warrantless wire tapping, due process, and the patriot act > then plastic bags and transfatty acids. And please, continue to dig up more evidence from 80 years ago when Southern Democrats were anti-civil rights and evidently conks were anti-war.

Neither side is perfect Baldy and labels are pretty useless. Some of us realize this.

So, some civil liberties are more important than others...nice.
Do us a favor and make us a list from most important to least important, OK?

For someone who thinks labels are pretty useless, you sure are defending "progressivism" like a mother bear protecting her cubs.

[kalm]

Warrantless wire tapping, due process, and the patriot act > then plastic bags and transfatty acids. And please, continue to dig up more evidence from 80 years ago when Southern Democrats were anti-civil rights and evidently conks were anti-war.

Neither side is perfect Baldy and labels are pretty useless. Some of us realize this.

So, some civil liberties are more important than others...nice.
Do us a favor and make us a list from most important to least important, OK?

For someone who thinks labels are pretty useless, you sure are defending "progressivism" like a mother bear protecting her cubs.

Nah, it's just fun watching you dig a deeper hole.

Did you know that progressives invented eugenics and abortion> And Obama is a progressive, so...

[Baldy]

Nah, it's just fun watching you dig a deeper hole.

Did you know that progressives invented eugenics and abortion> And Obama is a progressive, so...

kalm, you are fast replacing Anal Lube as the Glass Joe of cs.com. If I'm digging a hole, it's because you have buried yourself in so much of your bullshit that I'm trying to help dig yourself out.

[kalm]

Nah, it's just fun watching you dig a deeper hole.

Did you know that progressives invented eugenics and abortion> And Obama is a progressive, so...

kalm, you are fast replacing Anal Lube as the Glass Joe of cs.com. If I'm digging a hole, it's because you have buried yourself in so much of your bullshit that I'm trying to help dig yourself out. :kiss wink:

Well thank you then, because I am often times, completely full of shit.

Obama is a Rohrschach Test. You see in him your worst fears of his 2008 campaign rhetoric and "progressive" alliances coming to fruition. I see in him another politician, wasting a golden opportunity to affect real change in the financial services industry, healthcare, transparent government, war, etc.

But to be fair and for consistency's sake I don't think George W. Bush was much of a conservative either.

[Baldy]

Well thank you then, because I am often times, completely full of shit.

Obama is a Rohrschach Test. You see in him your worst fears of his 2008 campaign rhetoric and "progressive" alliances coming to fruition. I see in him another politician, wasting a golden opportunity to affect real change in the financial services industry, healthcare, transparent government, war, etc.

But to be fair and for consistency's sake I don't think George W. Bush was much of a conservative either.

In other words, you see him through the filter of the political games he currently plays. I see him for what he really is and what he would like for the US to be if there wasn't so much backlash.

As I said, the US is a center-right country, we don't want to pay 45-55% personal income tax rates, we don't want socialized single payer health care, and since we want to have the most powerful economy in the world, we need to be to dominant military power in the world, also.

[kalm]

Well thank you then, because I am often times, completely full of shit.

Obama is a Rohrschach Test. You see in him your worst fears of his 2008 campaign rhetoric and "progressive" alliances coming to fruition. I see in him another politician, wasting a golden opportunity to affect real change in the financial services industry, healthcare, transparent government, war, etc.

But to be fair and for consistency's sake I don't think George W. Bush was much of a conservative either.

In other words, you see him through the filter of the political games he currently plays. I see him for what he really is and what he would like for the US to be if there wasn't so much backlash.

As I said, the US is a center-right country, we don't want to pay 45-55% personal income tax rates, we don't want socialized single payer health care, and since we want to have the most powerful economy in the world, we need to be to dominant military power in the world, also.

Well now we're going in circles. Like I said before, America is rhetorically a center-right country at most. We are conditioned to low tax rates so of course we don't want them to go up. Single payer polled near 70% before the status quo got their hands on the debate. Nobody likes the current healthcare, it's over-priced with worse outcomes than other OECD countries.

Porn is another good example where a majority of conservatives are against it and a majority of conservatives use it. Most conservatives at least on this board support gay rights. Most conservatives think we should get out of Afghanistan. Most conservatives think taxes shouldn't be cut during times of war. The list goes on and on.

[Baldy]

Well now we're going in circles. Like I said before, America is rhetorically a center-right country at most. We are conditioned to low tax rates so of course we don't want them to go up. Single payer polled near 70% before the status quo got their hands on the debate. Nobody likes the current healthcare, it's over-priced with worse outcomes than other OECD countries.

Porn is another good example where a majority of conservatives are against it and a majority of conservatives use it. Most conservatives at least on this board support gay rights. Most conservatives think we should get out of Afghanistan. Most conservatives think taxes shouldn't be cut during times of war. The list goes on and on.

There's nothing rhetorical about it. If the US wasn't a center-right country, we would be Denmark, or France, or Germany right now. Of course we're conditioned to low tax rates. Freedom is engrained in our DNA, and being able to keep more of YOUR money is the essence of being free. I have no doubt that single payer polled 70% on thinkprogress.org, but thank GOD that the majority of the people are smarter than the average thinkprogress.org reader. I can't speak for everyone, but my wife and I are extremely happy with our health care, so to say that nobody likes their healthcare is factually incorrect. However, I will agree with you and say that it is over priced (thanks to Medicare and Medicaid), but the US health care system is the best in the world...by far.

kalm, a lot of people are against a lot of things, but that doesn't mean the majority of conservatives want the nanny state to step in take control and ban everything we don't like....another area where "progressives" could learn a thing or two from the Conks. For example, I think Roe v. Wade is one of the most egregious decisions every made by the SCOTUS. Not because I'm attempting to stand on some moral high ground or because I am anti-abortion. It was an egregious decision because I believe it was a blatant violation of the 10th amendment.

[youngterrier]

lol at anyone equivocating Obama/progressivism with socialism/marxism/communism. The socialists/marxists/communists laugh at such comparisons (or they are brutally offended)

[kalm]

lol at anyone equivocating Obama/progressivism with socialism/marxism/communism. The socialists/marxists/communists laugh at such comparisons (or they are brutally offended)

Indeed. And they number in the 100's! At least.

[Cap'n Cat]

Same as the belief that Reagan was good for America.

No shit. One major reason we're in the predicament we are is because of that douchebag. Conks don't think, so they can't realize.

[Cap'n Cat]

Well now we're going in circles. Like I said before, America is rhetorically a center-right country at most. We are conditioned to low tax rates so of course we don't want them to go up. Single payer polled near 70% before the status quo got their hands on the debate. Nobody likes the current healthcare, it's over-priced with worse outcomes than other OECD countries.

Porn is another good example where a majority of conservatives are against it and a majority of conservatives use it. Most conservatives at least on this board support gay rights. Most conservatives think we should get out of Afghanistan. Most conservatives think taxes shouldn't be cut during times of war. The list goes on and on.

There's nothing rhetorical about it. If the US wasn't a center-right country, we would be Denmark, or France, or Germany right now. Of course we're conditioned to low tax rates. Freedom is engrained in our DNA, and being able to keep more of YOUR money is the essence of being free. I have no doubt that single payer polled 70% on thinkprogress.org, but thank GOD that the majority of the people are smarter than the average thinkprogress.org reader. I can't speak for everyone, but my wife and I are extremely happy with our health care, so to say that nobody likes their healthcare is factually incorrect. However, I will agree with you and say that it is over priced (thanks to Medicare and Medicaid), but the US health care system is the best in the world...by far.

kalm, a lot of people are against a lot of things, but that doesn't mean the majority of conservatives want the nanny state to step in take control and ban everything we don't like....another area where "progressives" could learn a thing or two from the Conks. For example, I think Roe v. Wade is one of the most egregious decisions every made by the SCOTUS. Not because I'm attempting to stand on some moral high ground or because I am anti-abortion. It was an egregious decision because I believe it was a blatant violation of the 10th amendment.

Baldy, like many of your Conks friends, you are a gross exaggerater.


Shame.

[youngterrier]

lol at anyone equivocating Obama/progressivism with socialism/marxism/communism. The socialists/marxists/communists laugh at such comparisons (or they are brutally offended)

Indeed. And they number in the 100's! At least.

you'd be surprised.....