Reasoned Answers, Please: What Happens If US Defaults?

[89Hen]

I know that's what you're hoping for. I saw the Prez giving a stump speech that wasn't even thinly veiled. He's a bigger partisan hack than Rush, Hannity or Coulter at this point.

You forgot to mention the teleprompter.

Don't need to, but nice deflection.

[GannonFan]

What a **** joke that press conference was. I've never seen a sitting President stump so hard in a non-election year. Saying W and Reagan did something so he should do the same. Nice change. Shame on Obama.

He's swinging the stick hen, repubs are about to hang themselves with their own rope, and he is going to stand by and let them.

Come on, man, even as an Obama voter in '08, last night was just a real sad descent of where the Presidency is going. Hard to take pride in any of that last night, and the entire debt ceiling drama has just been a fiasco for everyone involved. Obama's not scoring any real points even if the GOP takes more of a hit than he does in this. In the end, they all take hits.

Obama's biggest flaw since he's taken office is that he hasn't really led anything - at first I thought it was because he was out maneuvered by more entrenched Dems in the supermajority Congress and that he was just learning the job, but even with the supermajority going away and still holding one of the houses of Congress he's still been way, way too passive when it comes to direction. He can probably still win an election in '12 by not being tied too specifically to any one specific agenda, but that may be a result of the GOP not having any credible candidate to put up. Winning by default (heh, didn't even intend that pun!) isn't exactly something to be thrilled about. And if he's not been effective at leading in his first four years, it's hard to see him becoming one as his power wanes in his lame duck term. So much promise and to date, so little realized. That's what was sad about last night.

[blueballs]

On the subject of taxes, the following example sums up a lot of what is wrong:

I did a loan for a single woman who closed on her home in June. She isa hotel maid and has 3 rugrats running around with no babydaddy. Here is what her 2010 tax returns said:

Line 7- wages, tips, salaries, etc. $25,814
Line 21- AGI $25,814

Line 24, standard deduction as HOH ($ 8,350)
Line 26, exemption for dependents ($10,950)

Line 27, taxable income $ 6,514

Line 28 TAX $ 653

Line 29 credit for child expenses ($ 596)
Line 32 retirement svg contr ($ 57)

Line 37 TOTAL TAX $ 0

Line 38 Total withholding $ 2,191
Line 40 Making work pay $ 400
Line 41 EIC $ 3,047
Line 42 Add'l child credit $ 2,000

Line 44 Total "payments" $ 7,638

Line 46 REFUND $ 7,638



THIS illustrates exactly the problem with our system. Forget about low tax brackets for low income earners, this woman is in a NEGATIVE 21% bracket, which means she earned and was paid $25,814 TAX FREE and got an extra $5447 from the achievers and business owners of this country like me so she had actual cash flow of $31,261 TAX FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can you fucking believe it?????????????????????????????

Now, guess who she's going to vote for...










PS: She qualified for SHIP down payment assistance of $30,000, so she was the proud recipient of over $35k from the taxpayers- the achievers and business owners of this country- in the past year and PAID ZERO TAX. Again, guess who has her vote forever and ever...

[∞∞∞]

If they don't come up with a solution soon, I really hope President Obama just says "f it" and raises the debt ceiling, citing the 14th Amendment and his duty to protect the Constitution as his reason. Then let the Supreme Court decide if what he did was unconstitutional. But I know Obama doesn't have the balls to do that 'cause he's been weak so far with the powers afforded to the executive branch. This whole thing is pathetic. Legislative and Executive...if they don't get this done...vote them all out. Clean house and let's get people in there who care.

[Grizalltheway]

On the subject of taxes, the following example sums up a lot of what is wrong:

I did a loan for a single woman who closed on her home in June. She isa hotel maid and has 3 rugrats running around with no babydaddy. Here is what her 2010 tax returns said:

Line 7- wages, tips, salaries, etc. $25,814
Line 21- AGI $25,814

Line 24, standard deduction as HOH ($ 8,350)
Line 26, exemption for dependents ($10,950)

Line 27, taxable income $ 6,514

Line 28 TAX $ 653

Line 29 credit for child expenses ($ 596)
Line 32 retirement svg contr ($ 57)

Line 37 TOTAL TAX $ 0

Line 38 Total withholding $ 2,191
Line 40 Making work pay $ 400
Line 41 EIC $ 3,047
Line 42 Add'l child credit $ 2,000

Line 44 Total "payments" $ 7,638

Line 46 REFUND $ 7,638



THIS illustrates exactly the problem with our system. Forget about low tax brackets for low income earners, this woman is in a NEGATIVE 21% bracket, which means she earned and was paid $25,814 TAX FREE and got an extra $5447 from the achievers and business owners of this country like me so she had actual cash flow of $31,261 TAX FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can you fucking believe it?????????????????????????????

Now, guess who she's going to vote for...










PS: She qualified for SHIP down payment assistance of $30,000, so she was the proud recipient of over $35k from the taxpayers- the achievers and business owners of this country- in the past year and PAID ZERO TAX. Again, guess who has her vote forever and ever...

This would be much more compelling if there weren't plenty of achievers and business owners who benefit greatly from government spending and tax loopholes. And no, that isn't aimed at you.

[houndawg]

On the subject of taxes, the following example sums up a lot of what is wrong:

I did a loan for a single woman who closed on her home in June. She isa hotel maid and has 3 rugrats running around with no babydaddy. Here is what her 2010 tax returns said:

Line 7- wages, tips, salaries, etc. $25,814
Line 21- AGI $25,814

Line 24, standard deduction as HOH ($ 8,350)
Line 26, exemption for dependents ($10,950)

Line 27, taxable income $ 6,514

Line 28 TAX $ 653

Line 29 credit for child expenses ($ 596)
Line 32 retirement svg contr ($ 57)

Line 37 TOTAL TAX $ 0

Line 38 Total withholding $ 2,191
Line 40 Making work pay $ 400
Line 41 EIC $ 3,047
Line 42 Add'l child credit $ 2,000

Line 44 Total "payments" $ 7,638

Line 46 REFUND $ 7,638



THIS illustrates exactly the problem with our system. Forget about low tax brackets for low income earners, this woman is in a NEGATIVE 21% bracket, which means she earned and was paid $25,814 TAX FREE and got an extra $5447 from the achievers and business owners of this country like me so she had actual cash flow of $31,261 TAX FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can you **** believe it?????????????????????????????

Now, guess who she's going to vote for...










PS: She qualified for SHIP down payment assistance of $30,000, so she was the proud recipient of over $35k from the taxpayers- the achievers and business owners of this country- in the past year and PAID ZERO TAX. Again, guess who has her vote forever and ever...

Who does the bitch think she is, General Electric?

[Ivytalk]

On the subject of taxes, the following example sums up a lot of what is wrong:

I did a loan for a single woman who closed on her home in June. She isa hotel maid and has 3 rugrats running around with no babydaddy. Here is what her 2010 tax returns said:

Line 7- wages, tips, salaries, etc. $25,814
Line 21- AGI $25,814

Line 24, standard deduction as HOH ($ 8,350)
Line 26, exemption for dependents ($10,950)

Line 27, taxable income $ 6,514

Line 28 TAX $ 653

Line 29 credit for child expenses ($ 596)
Line 32 retirement svg contr ($ 57)

Line 37 TOTAL TAX $ 0

Line 38 Total withholding $ 2,191
Line 40 Making work pay $ 400
Line 41 EIC $ 3,047
Line 42 Add'l child credit $ 2,000

Line 44 Total "payments" $ 7,638

Line 46 REFUND $ 7,638



THIS illustrates exactly the problem with our system. Forget about low tax brackets for low income earners, this woman is in a NEGATIVE 21% bracket, which means she earned and was paid $25,814 TAX FREE and got an extra $5447 from the achievers and business owners of this country like me so she had actual cash flow of $31,261 TAX FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Can you **** believe it?????????????????????????????

Now, guess who she's going to vote for...










PS: She qualified for SHIP down payment assistance of $30,000, so she was the proud recipient of over $35k from the taxpayers- the achievers and business owners of this country- in the past year and PAID ZERO TAX. Again, guess who has her vote forever and ever...

Who does the bitch think she is, General Electric?

At least GE knows who its "daddy" is. And it ain't Jeff Immelt.

[Wedgebuster]

Look, balking at raising the debt ceiling for any damn reason is pure horseshit, and pure partisan. Congress already voted to spend the money.

CONGRESS ALREADY VOTED TO SPEND THE MONEY, IT IS ON OUR CREDIT CARD, AND THE PAYMENT IS NOW DUE.

Now the repubs who vote no on EVERYTHING that comes from the dems, regardless, are attaching if's and's and but's to the issue in order to CONTINUE TO VOTE NO and make a political spectacle over WHETHER OR NOT TO PAY THE BILLS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN APPROVED BY THIS CONGRESS.

You tea bagger pukes just try that out at home, run up your credit card and when it comes time to pay the bill, let your old lady tell you that you can't because she does not like what you spent it on, and she wants to debate about it for nine months.

Yeah I say vote them all the hell out of office. Now how would that affect the current GOP takeover trend?

Stupid cock suckers.

[bulldog10jw]

Now the repubs who vote no on EVERYTHING that comes from the dems, regardless, are attaching if's and's and but's to the issue in order to CONTINUE TO VOTE NO and make a political spectacle over WHETHER OR NOT TO PAY THE BILLS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN APPROVED BY THIS CONGRESS.

The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. … Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that ‘the buck stops here. Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better. Barack Obama 2006

[89Hen]

Stupid cock suckers.

You were saying.

[Wedgebuster]

Stupid cock suckers.

You were saying.

Thanks for answering.

[89Hen]

Your guy is a fraud. Shame on you for defending him.

[Grizalltheway]

Your guy is a fraud. Shame on you for defending him.

Says the guy who defends/gives 10% of his paycheck to a fraudulant group of child molestors.

[89Hen]

Your guy is a fraud. Shame on you for defending him.

Says the guy who defends/gives 10% of his paycheck to a fraudulant group of child molestors.

You must go to the same spin class as Obama.

[BDKJMU]

He's swinging the stick hen, repubs are about to hang themselves with their own rope, and he is going to stand by and let them.

Come on, man, even as an Obama voter in '08, last night was just a real sad descent of where the Presidency is going. Hard to take pride in any of that last night, and the entire debt ceiling drama has just been a fiasco for everyone involved. Obama's not scoring any real points even if the GOP takes more of a hit than he does in this. In the end, they all take hits.

Obama's biggest flaw since he's taken office is that he hasn't really led anything - at first I thought it was because he was out maneuvered by more entrenched Dems in the supermajority Congress and that he was just learning the job, but even with the supermajority going away and still holding one of the houses of Congress he's still been way, way too passive when it comes to direction. He can probably still win an election in '12 by not being tied too specifically to any one specific agenda, but that may be a result of the GOP not having any credible candidate to put up. Winning by default (heh, didn't even intend that pun!) isn't exactly something to be thrilled about. And if he's not been effective at leading in his first four years, it's hard to see him becoming one as his power wanes in his lame duck term. So much promise and to date, so little realized. That's what was sad about last night.

Oh come on, you're acting like you're surprised. "So much promise" my ass. Here was a guy coming into office who had:
-ZERO military experience
-ZERO Executive leadership experience
-ZERO experience running a business
-And who's political experience consisted of 8 years in the Illinois State Senate voting mostly "present" and 2 yrs in the US Senate before he started his campaign for President.

He managed to win because the economy tanked under Bush a month or two before the election, the RHINO MCain couldn't campaign his way out of a wet paper bag, and Obama could give a great campaign speech while reading a teleprompter giving people tingly feelings up their legs. Anyone who was politically astute 2 1/2+ years ago knew this guy was going to be in way over his head and was going to be a disaster. It wasn't a case of "so much promise". More like "so little promise".

[ASUMountaineer]

Who does the bitch think she is, General Electric?

At least GE knows who its "daddy" is. And it ain't Jeff Immelt.

True that.

[AZGrizFan]

Come on, man, even as an Obama voter in '08, last night was just a real sad descent of where the Presidency is going. Hard to take pride in any of that last night, and the entire debt ceiling drama has just been a fiasco for everyone involved. Obama's not scoring any real points even if the GOP takes more of a hit than he does in this. In the end, they all take hits.

Obama's biggest flaw since he's taken office is that he hasn't really led anything - at first I thought it was because he was out maneuvered by more entrenched Dems in the supermajority Congress and that he was just learning the job, but even with the supermajority going away and still holding one of the houses of Congress he's still been way, way too passive when it comes to direction. He can probably still win an election in '12 by not being tied too specifically to any one specific agenda, but that may be a result of the GOP not having any credible candidate to put up. Winning by default (heh, didn't even intend that pun!) isn't exactly something to be thrilled about. And if he's not been effective at leading in his first four years, it's hard to see him becoming one as his power wanes in his lame duck term. So much promise and to date, so little realized. That's what was sad about last night.

Oh come on, you're acting like you're surprised. "So much promise" my ass. Here was a guy coming into office who had:
-ZERO military experience
-ZERO Executive leadership experience
-ZERO experience running a business
-And who's political experience consisted of 8 years in the Illinois State Senate voting mostly "present" and 2 yrs in the US Senate before he started his campaign for President.

He managed to win because the economy tanked under Bush a month or two before the election, the RHINO MCain couldn't campaign his way out of a wet paper bag, and Obama could give a great campaign speech while reading a teleprompter giving people tingly feelings up their legs. Anyone who was politically astute 2 1/2+ years ago knew this guy was going to be in way over his head and was going to be a disaster. It wasn't a case of "so much promise". More like "so little promise".

BZ. Good post.

[∞∞∞]

F everyone in our government. At this point, I don't care if they come up with an agreement or not. All of them have showed how incompetent they are in their abilities to run the US. The only thing I'm gonna look forward to is doing my tiny part in trying to vote all the idiots out of office. What a ridiculous position we're in right now.

ps. also an especially big F you to the Tea Party. Cancer on this nation.

[Rob Iola]

F everyone in our government. At this point, I don't care if they come up with an agreement or not. All of them have showed how incompetent they are in their abilities to run the US. The only thing I'm gonna look forward to is doing my tiny part in trying to vote all the idiots out of office. What a ridiculous position we're in right now.

ps. also an especially big F you to the Tea Party. Cancer on this nation.

Whoa there cowboy - strip away the competing news conferences and partisan soundbites and you're seeing a great example of high-pressure negotiation. These guys are far from incompetent...

When the sun sets on 8/2 Obama will sign a debt law that basically pushes the goalposts back. The law will pretty much cast in stone our withdrawal from Iraq and Afghanistan, leave taxes and entitlements unchanged, and make a few cosmetic cuts. And of course lift the debt ceiling. The only political issue will be setting the next crisis date - whether that will be before or after the 2012 elections.

What the congressional conks are doing is simply running out the clock - since the Senate won't pass a bill of their own initiative it's fallen to the House, and by extension the House Republicans, to take the lead. If the conks pass a bill now the Senate Democrats will have ample time to reject it, rewrite it, and return it - leaving the House Republicans the unpalatable choice of either holding their noses and voting for it or being left holding the bag if/when we default. Instead they'll wait, vote for it on Monday, and skip town - leaving the Senate Democrats and Obama that same choice.

[∞∞∞]

I really hope you're right Iola. I guess it's the way the whole thing has played out which is bothersome. None of them realize it's "We the People," and not "We the Government." (except Ron Paul )

[TheDancinMonarch]

None of them realize it's "We the People," and not "We the Government." (except Ron Paul )

also an especially big F you to the Tea Party. Cancer on this nation.

So just to be clear. In your world Tea Party people are not part of the population and should have no say in the future of the country. Is that correct?

[Rob Iola]

None of them realize it's "We the People," and not "We the Government." (except Ron Paul )

also an especially big F you to the Tea Party. Cancer on this nation.

So just to be clear. In your world Tea Party people are not part of the population and should have no say in the future of the country. Is that correct?

Dude, his world is your world. With a big ol' monorail track right thru the middle of it.


(I know I know, it's always about the ODU monorail with me - I'll stop...)

[TheDancinMonarch]

So just to be clear. In your world Tea Party people are not part of the population and should have no say in the future of the country. Is that correct?

Dude, his world is your world. With a big ol' monorail track right thru the middle of it.


(I know I know, it's always about the ODU monorail with me - I'll stop...)

While your opinion is both fascinating and amusing, I was really more interested in Smudges opinion. And differences of opinion are allowed on the ODU campus, or at least occur accidentally, especially since the construction of the North American Stonehenge.

[∞∞∞]

Of course Tea Party members should have a say in the government like every other American, but they've become annoying to the point where I'm really bothered by their childish antics. I actually supported them at the start thinking they'd be a good wake up call to increased government spending and waste. But now, they've warped into something else...something that thinks "it's their way or the highway." There's absolutely no disagreeing with them and if you do, you're unAmerican. They're beginning to stand for everything that the Constitution isn't about. And let's be frank, the movement has attracted a lot of shady American subgroups which is tarnishing the Tea Party's image and their ability to negotiate (which they seemed to possess before).

See, with Democrats and Republicans...they're like herpes. Highly annoying at times, slightly threatening to your health, but it won't ultimately kill you. The Tea Party is like a tan. Really nice at the beginning and something you're kinda proud of. Everyone compliments you and you're like...I should do this more. But over time as you tanned more and more, a few dark spots showed up here and there, and then BOOM, you've got skin cancer. The rest of your body is trying to fight it off because it doesn't want it, things begin to deteriorate because cancer doesn't wanna have a symbiotic relationship with your organs, and eventually you're left with a body that's destined to fail. That's what the Tea Party has become: a cancer from a pretty tan.

[Ibanez]

Of course Tea Party members should have a say in the government like every other American, but they've become annoying to the point where I'm really bothered by their childish antics. I actually supported them at the start thinking they'd be a good wake up call to increased government spending and waste. But now, they've warped into something else...something that thinks "it's their way or the highway." There's absolutely no disagreeing with them and if you do, you're unAmerican. They're beginning to stand for everything that the Constitution isn't about. And let's be frank, the movement has attracted a lot of shady American subgroups which is tarnishing the Tea Party's image and their ability to negotiate (which they seemed to possess before).

See, with Democrats and Republicans...they're like herpes. Highly annoying at times, slightly threatening to your health, but it won't ultimately kill you. The Tea Party is like a tan. Really nice at the beginning and something you're kinda proud of. Everyone compliments you and you're like...I should do this more. But over time as you tanned more and more, a few dark spots showed up here and there, and then BOOM, you've got skin cancer. The rest of your body is trying to fight it off because it doesn't want it, things begin to deteriorate because cancer doesn't wanna have a symbiotic relationship with your body, and then you're left with a body that eventually's destined to fail. That's what the Tea Party has become: a cancer from a pretty tan.

Wow.