Obama's "Iran-Contra" Mexican Arms Smuggling Cover-Up

[houndawg]

It's legal citizens that that just got busted running guns from NM to Mexico.

I was going to add a disclaimer that 98% of it was illegals crossing the border because they will be very isolated incidents of legals doing this too.


Funny how the only time your side wants to get uptight about criminal activity is when legal Americans are targeted.

Very telling.

You're going to catch the vapors, Alice, calm down. If you watched the news last night you saw the article about the town in NM.

[travelinman67]

If a legal citizen wants to purchase guns at gun shows thats fine, when THEY try to cross the border with them to sell to cartels then execute them or throw them in prison for life.

But we both know thats not whats happening, the illegals are taking them back across the border we still for some reason have not sealed the fu*k off.

...focus, y'all.

This isn't about "illegal aliens". It's about:

1) Ill-conceived, ill-motivated "Big Brother", machiavellian law enforcement scheme gone awry.

2) Executive Branch's ill-conceived, ill-motivated attempt to deny their responsibility.

But as with most Donk-deeds, the pols will squirm and swap their way out of purgatory...

...and the Conks won't hold them accountable...again.

[houndawg]

If a legal citizen wants to purchase guns at gun shows thats fine, when THEY try to cross the border with them to sell to cartels then execute them or throw them in prison for life.

But we both know thats not whats happening, the illegals are taking them back across the border we still for some reason have not sealed the fu*k off.

...focus, y'all.

This isn't about "illegal aliens". It's about:

1) Ill-conceived, ill-motivated "Big Brother", machiavellian law enforcement scheme gone awry.

2) Executive Branch's ill-conceived, ill-motivated attempt to deny their responsibility.

But as with most Donk-deeds, the pols will squirm and swap their way out of purgatory...

...and the Conks won't hold them accountable...again.

Hard to get worked up about a little gun running after Iran-Contra. Hell we made a national hero out some peckerwood colonel over that little escapade.

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

YEah, I bet you didnt get worked up when all that Iran Contra was going on...........paaalleeeeeezzzzzzzzz.

[houndawg]

YEah, I bet you didnt get worked up when all that Iran Contra was going on...........paaalleeeeeezzzzzzzzz.

I did indeed get worked up. And I don't like this situation either, I'm taking issue with your statement that the smuggling is all done by illegals.

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

YEah, I bet you didnt get worked up when all that Iran Contra was going on...........paaalleeeeeezzzzzzzzz.

I did indeed get worked up. And I don't like this situation either, I'm taking issue with your statement that the smuggling is all done by illegals.

The majority of it is done by illegals. That is directly from the people dealing with this problem. Sure there are legal citizens buying the guns but 9of10 people taking them over the border are not legal citizens. Its basic knowledge if your involved with the Border Patrol and ATF.

[Wedgebuster]

In today's Billings Gazette-
http://billingsgazette.com/news/state-a ... a9bfc.html

Undoubtedly headed for the BC Bud fields of western Canada, and as stated above, involves illegals..

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

In today's Billings Gazette-
http://billingsgazette.com/news/state-a ... a9bfc.html

Undoubtedly headed for the BC Bud fields of western Canada, and as stated above, involves illegals..

WOW!

An illegal alien doing this in our country! This cant happen!!


BTW, I swear that guy was at the gun show in Butte last month he looks way familiar.

[Skjellyfetti]

The majority of it is done by illegals. That is directly from the people dealing with this problem. Sure there are legal citizens buying the guns but 9of10 people taking them over the border are not legal citizens. Its basic knowledge if your involved with the Border Patrol and ATF.

So, sounds to me like the gun shops/gun shows aren't doing their required background checks. Sounds like they need the government help in running their checks.




Also sounds like it's time to erect a multibillion dollar fence between the US and Canada.

[Wedgebuster]

In today's Billings Gazette-
http://billingsgazette.com/news/state-a ... a9bfc.html

Undoubtedly headed for the BC Bud fields of western Canada, and as stated above, involves illegals..

WOW!

An illegal alien doing this in our country! This cant happen!!


BTW, I swear that guy was at the gun show in Butte last month he looks way familiar.

Better than 50-50 you are right. What a way to make a living huh.

And this is the Bonny of this Bonny and Clyde-

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

Can you say HEP C?

[BDKJMU]

Report: ATF guns killed Arizona border agent

PHOENIX - An investigative report will be released at a Congressional Hearing on Wednesday criticizing a federal government program that let thousands of U.S. guns cross into Mexico.

The House Oversight and Government Reform Committee began looking at "Operation Fast and Furious" after a border patrol agent was gunned down by weapons tied to the program......

http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/region_ph ... rder-agent" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[BDKJMU]

Two AK-47s Used to Murder Mexican Lawyer Were 'Fast and Furious' Guns From U.S., Sources Say

EXCLUSIVE: Two guns sold to a Mexican cartel and used in the high-profile kidnapping and murder of a Mexican lawyer last year were purchased under the U.S. Justice Department's failed anti-gun trafficking program Operation Fast and Furious, sources tell Fox News.
U.S. law enforcement sources and officials in Washington told Fox News that two AK-47s were purchased in Arizona by a straw buyer — someone who legally buys guns, then illegal sells them to a third party – and were allowed to “walk” into Mexico. Police recovered the guns in the course of their investigation of the kidnapping of Mario Gonzalez Rodriguez.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/06 ... z1PaLS32Ft" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

All this blood from the people already killed and the dozens if not hundreds more that will surely follow, in some cases on both sides of the border, from the thousands of guns that were allowed by the ATF to be taken into Mexico to be sold to the cartels is on your hands Obama..

[Cap'n Cat]

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/obama-d ... to-mexico/

What started as an ATF leaked CBS story about a Fed investigation into arms smuggling into Mexico, dubbed "Project Gunrunner", has now blown up in AG Holder, Big Sis Napolitano and POTUS Obama's faces. The operation involved ATF covertly tracking illegal assault/tactical weapons sales (coordinated by the ATF) for the purpose of smuggling the arms into Mexico for criminal use. At least two of those weapons are now connected to the murder of a U.S. Border Patrol Agent. Holder, Napolitano and Obama are now denying knowledge of the operation's existence (now renamed, "Fast and Furious").
As with many of Obama's scandals, as you read through this, ask yourself, "If this had happened during Bush or Reagan's presidencies, how much attention would the media and congress have directed towards the Executive Branch's involvement in this debacle?

When Iran-Contra broke, Congress impaneled an Independent Counsel; created the Tower Commission to investigate; tried and convicted several participants; and dogged Reagan into the afterlife.

Yet, Obama and Holder set up an arms smuggling operation to "track" the flow of weapons into Mexico...

...without Mexican President Calderon's knowledge...

...for the specific reason to generate support for gun control initiatives...

...allowing sniper and assault weapons to be purchased by "known" arms smugglers...

...who then sell the weapons to be used against Mexican and American law enforcement...

...ultimately resulting in a confirmed murder of a U.S. federal agent!!!!!!

Where in the fuck is Congress?

Why hasn't a Special Counsel been created to investigate their knowledge of this catastrophe?

Only one Congressman, Chuck Grassley, has written a letter requesting an investigation.

Donk or Conk...

...this is bullshit!

(...brace for Jellyklownjeffbfdawg cockmouthedcoverup crap...)

Tsk, tsk, tsk, T.

[CID1990]

Pistols, assault weapons, legal, illegal. None of that is pertinent to the fact that this DoJ engaged in malfeasance and they intentionally did it under the radar without Congressional oversight. Ultimately if there are consequences for this, the head that will roll will be a middle echelon Oliver North-esque figure. That is, if the DoJ was astute enough to delegate executive authority for Gunrunner to someone like that.

[houndawg]

Pistols, assault weapons, legal, illegal. None of that is pertinent to the fact that this DoJ engaged in malfeasance and they intentionally did it under the radar without Congressional oversight. Ultimately if there are consequences for this, the head that will roll will be a middle echelon Oliver North-esque figure. That is, if the DoJ was astute enough to delegate executive authority for Gunrunner to someone like that.

But Ollie North was a patriot and hero and got to run for Senator instead of going to Ft. Leavenworth where his sorry ass should be rotting to this day.... .



Big tempest in a teapot here, folks. The US guvmint has been the planet's biggest weapons supplier for a long time to anybody who can move enough heroin to pay the bill. It isn't our fault that the scum we sell weapons to uses them for evil purpose.

[CID1990]

Pistols, assault weapons, legal, illegal. None of that is pertinent to the fact that this DoJ engaged in malfeasance and they intentionally did it under the radar without Congressional oversight. Ultimately if there are consequences for this, the head that will roll will be a middle echelon Oliver North-esque figure. That is, if the DoJ was astute enough to delegate executive authority for Gunrunner to someone like that.

But Ollie North was a patriot and hero and got to run for Senator instead of going to Ft. Leavenworth where his sorry ass should be rotting to this day.... .



Big tempest in a teapot here, folks. The US guvmint has been the planet's biggest weapons supplier for a long time to anybody who can move enough heroin to pay the bill. It isn't our fault that the scum we sell weapons to uses them for evil purpose.

Oh ok. I see now.

That makes what DoJ did with Gunrunner perfectly ok.

We might be a net exporter of weapons, but the flap over Gunrunner has little to do with arms dealing or anything having to do with illegal or legal weapons. It has to do with government agencies doing things under the radar because they would not be tolerated if they were ON the radar.

No amount of moral equivalency makes it right.

[houndawg]

But Ollie North was a patriot and hero and got to run for Senator instead of going to Ft. Leavenworth where his sorry ass should be rotting to this day.... .



Big tempest in a teapot here, folks. The US guvmint has been the planet's biggest weapons supplier for a long time to anybody who can move enough heroin to pay the bill. It isn't our fault that the scum we sell weapons to uses them for evil purpose.

Oh ok. I see now.

That makes what DoJ did with Gunrunner perfectly ok.

We might be a net exporter of weapons, but the flap over Gunrunner has little to do with arms dealing or anything having to do with illegal or legal weapons. It has to do with government agencies doing things under the radar because they would not be tolerated if they were ON the radar.

No amount of moral equivalency makes it right.

The government does as it pleases, regardless of radar.

I didn't say gunrunner was "perfectly OK", I said it isn't easy to get upset about the government selling weapons to gangsters in Mexico when they've had colonels selling them to worse than that out of the basement of the White House, with a little drug dealing on the side.

[FormerPokeCenter]

The Hubbub is about operation "Fast and Furious" where the ATF let "Straw Men" buy arms at US gun shops, who were going to be followed. The ATF had men on the "Straw men" buyers, but were waived off at the point of resale to an intermediary.and told NOT to follow the guns to the next higher ups.

The thing is, the Gun Shops were doing their jobs correctly, ergo the fraudulent buyers were identified as "straw men" manufactured for the purposes of the buy. The system works as intended. The only reason the sales went through is because the Obama administration said it was okay to mount Operation Fast and Furious. That operation, too, worked as intended until the Obama administration made the call to waive off surveillance and apprehension.

Making those calls more problematic is the fact that the Assistant AG responsible for the operation got access to the live feeds for the hidden cameras that were installed in the gun shops and watched the buys. He ultimately was one of the folks in the loop, if I understand the story right, who told the ATF to stand down and not pursue the buyers any further....

Holder and the President, who are staunch gun control advocates, were briefed on this operation before, during and after.

If you're a fan of False Flag conspiracy theories, I'd say this was probably the opening round of a conspiracy designed to attack assault rifle sales, by pointing to straw men buyers and lax security at gun shops. Fortunately for the 2nd Amendment, this adminnstration is relatively inept, their plan went wrong and the admininstration's fingerprints are all over it.

Congress has taken note and there are now some inquiries. Look for congressional hearings. My cousin, US Rep Blake Farenthold, from the 27th Congressional District in South Texas is all over this. It ain't goin' away

[BDKJMU]

Oh ok. I see now.

That makes what DoJ did with Gunrunner perfectly ok.

We might be a net exporter of weapons, but the flap over Gunrunner has little to do with arms dealing or anything having to do with illegal or legal weapons. It has to do with government agencies doing things under the radar because they would not be tolerated if they were ON the radar.

No amount of moral equivalency makes it right.

The government does as it pleases, regardless of radar.

I didn't say gunrunner was "perfectly OK", I said it isn't easy to get upset about the government selling weapons to gangsters in Mexico when they've had colonels selling them to worse than that out of the basement of the White House, with a little drug dealing on the side.

I know you're dumba** is slow sometimes, but the govt isn't selling the weapons to gangsters in Mexico. To try to compare Fast and Furious to Iran-Contra is pretty weak.

[Bronco]

==

They're just starting to grill this gang.

Holder looks a little uncomfortable and is almost as big a liar as his boss

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[youtube][/youtube]

[BDKJMU]

"Head of ATF Is Likely to Go

The Justice Department is expected to oust the head of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, according to people familiar with the matter, amid a troubled federal antitrafficking operation that has grown into the agency's biggest scandal in nearly two decades......
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... _US_News_5" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thing is, it shouldn't just be him.

"The Fast and Furious operation caused dissent in the ATF Phoenix office, according to three ATF agents who testified at a House hearing Wednesday. The agents said they battled supervisors who insisted on doing surveillance instead of arresting suspected straw buyers."

"................In one email to field staff printed in the report, ATF supervisor David Voth suggested that staff who objected to his orders would be fired.

"I will be damned if this case is going to suffer due to petty arguing, rumours, or other adolescent behavior," he wrote. "We are all adults, we are all professionals, and we have an exciting opportunity to use the biggest tool in our law-enforcement tool box. If you don't think this is fun, you are in the wrong line of work, period!"

John Dodson, a special agent from Phoenix who eventually blew the whistle on the "flawed" operation, told congressmen his superiors would be "giddy" with delight when "their" guns were found at a crime scene in Mexico, because they believed it "validated" their tactic. With regard to potential loss of life, an ATF boss told him: "if you are going to make an omelette, you need to scramble some eggs."

On 14 December, disaster struck when the US border patrol guard, Brian Terry, was killed during a shootout with suspected illegal aliens on the Arizona border. His killers dropped their rifles to flee faster. Two of the weapons were AK-47s which had been intentionally allowed to walk during Fast and Furious.

Rather than admit to any mistake, the ATF embarked on a cover-up. William Newell, the special agent in charge of the operation, ordered the arrest of 20 of the people agents had been watching buy weapons for months. Then, although not one senior cartel member was arrested, he held a press conference declaring the operation a success.

Newell was then asked if any weapons had been deliberately allowed to end up in the hands of criminals. He replied, "Hell no!" The report describes that statement as untrue and "shocking." It alleges that the Department of Justice continued to attempt a cover-up for several months...."
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 97924.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Voth, Newell sound have their asses hauled before Congress too. This cluster f*** ought to end a lot of careers....

[BDKJMU]

==

They're just starting to grill this gang.

Holder looks a little uncomfortable and is almost as big a liar as his boss

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[youtube][/youtube]

Starting at about the 40 second mark, Holder, "I probably heard about Fast and Furious for the 1st time over the last few weeks" What a lying sack of s*it. Heck this thread was started over 2 1/2 months ago. So we knew about it on this message board for over 2 1/2 months, but the ATTY Gen of the US claims he only knew about it for a few weeks?

About the 3:50 mark, Issa, "Did he (Holder) know about it earlier than he testified? Absolutely."

[native]

Regardless of where you stand politically, it is pretty hard to find a valid rationale for this one. I know the big O is extremely intelligent, but this is just plain wrong headed. Hard to believe it is due to his clueless naivety this time.

Easier to believe it was calculated, to lay the foundation for his relentless blame of the gun industry and the 2nd Amendment?

[native]

The Hubbub is about operation "Fast and Furious" where the ATF let "Straw Men" buy arms at US gun shops, who were going to be followed. The ATF had men on the "Straw men" buyers, but were waived off at the point of resale to an intermediary.and told NOT to follow the guns to the next higher ups.

The thing is, the Gun Shops were doing their jobs correctly, ergo the fraudulent buyers were identified as "straw men" manufactured for the purposes of the buy. The system works as intended. The only reason the sales went through is because the Obama administration said it was okay to mount Operation Fast and Furious. That operation, too, worked as intended until the Obama administration made the call to waive off surveillance and apprehension.

Making those calls more problematic is the fact that the Assistant AG responsible for the operation got access to the live feeds for the hidden cameras that were installed in the gun shops and watched the buys. He ultimately was one of the folks in the loop, if I understand the story right, who told the ATF to stand down and not pursue the buyers any further....

Holder and the President, who are staunch gun control advocates, were briefed on this operation before, during and after.

If you're a fan of False Flag conspiracy theories, I'd say this was probably the opening round of a conspiracy designed to attack assault rifle sales, by pointing to straw men buyers and lax security at gun shops. Fortunately for the 2nd Amendment, this adminnstration is relatively inept, their plan went wrong and the admininstration's fingerprints are all over it.

Congress has taken note and there are now some inquiries. Look for congressional hearings. My cousin, US Rep Blake Farenthold, from the 27th Congressional District in South Texas is all over this. It ain't goin' away

Not a conspiracy buff, but your false flag theory is the only one that makes sense.