Big Sky Expansion

[JBB]

It looks like Montana and Montana State may be gone. The WAC does not allow FCS games. The BSC will need two all-sports members. UND brings nothing to the Summit except their baggage. They have one of the worst basketball teams in Division 1. They represent a travel burden to the rest of the Summit with only the Dakota Schools benefiting. Membership in the Summit would have to include some provisions by UND to subsidized travel to the far reaching schools. In addition, the benefits to UND would be huge and the Summit must consider that when placing a price on membership. I would say a structured payout of $1 million to the league, penalty clause for early departure (UND fans want to move directly to the WAC) and travel allowances to the original core members.

On the other hand the BSC is going to be coming to the door with hat-in-hand. I sure hope the knock on UNDs door. Let the BSC get the table scrapes.

[weberwildcat]

It looks like Montana and Montana State may be gone. The WAC does not allow FCS games. The BSC will need two all-sports members. UND brings nothing to the Summit except their baggage. They have one of the worst basketball teams in Division 1. They represent a travel burden to the rest of the Summit with only the Dakota Schools benefiting. Membership in the Summit would have to include some provisions by UND to subsidized travel to the far reaching schools. In addition, the benefits to UND would be huge and the Summit must consider that when placing a price on membership. I would say a structured payout of $1 million to the league, penalty clause for early departure (UND fans want to move directly to the WAC) and travel allowances to the original core members.

On the other hand the BSC is going to be coming to the door with hat-in-hand. I sure hope the knock on UNDs door. Let the BSC get the table scrapes.

The WAC had FCS games this yr and same with next year.

[weberwildcat]

If we replace the montanas with the dakotas will this be football only or full members? Could we lose our auto bid to the NCAA Tourney with this move?

[EWURanger]

I find it funny that people keep bringing up this "the WAC doesn't play FCS games" nonsense........

Get a clue, people - they don't allow road games against FCS schools. No FBS conferences does, it's in the NCAA by-laws.

EWU plays a Pac-10 school every year though 2015, so for anyone to suggest that the WAC or MWC are too good to play FCS is laughable.

[EWURanger]

It looks like Montana and Montana State may be gone.

Montana most likely is a done deal with the WAC, but I have yet to see anything credible regarding MSU leaving anytime in the near future. Source?

The WAC does not allow FCS games.

2010 WAC teams against FCS

EWU @ Nevada
UC Davis @ SJSU
Cal-Poly @ Fresno State
Charleston Southern @ Hawaii
North Dakota @ Idaho
Idaho State @ Utah State
Grambling @ La Tech

On the other hand the BSC is going to be coming to the door with hat-in-hand. I sure hope the knock on UNDs door. Let the BSC get the table scrapes.

This whole passage doesn't even make sense.

[GeauxSioux]

If we replace the montanas with the dakotas will this be football only or full members? Could we lose our auto bid to the NCAA Tourney with this move?

North Dakota would be full members if asked to join according to Sioux AD Brian Faison. http://gfsports.areavoices.com/2010/10/ ... -comments/

[JBB]

Thanks for the clarification on the FCS/WAC ban. I guess what I heard was that Fargo might lose their Montana game because of the WAC Rule. I guess we would get the buyout?

I sure hope there is an invite forthcoming from the BSC for UND. That would leave the BIG 3 in-tack to continue what is now becoming a great football tradition in the Dakotas.

If UND goes to the Big Sky USD is right there for the MVFC if YSU has opportunity to move to a more geographically friendly conference. On the other hand USD could go to the Big Sky too in one capacity or another. Either way I dont see a threat to the Summit, in fact, The Summit might be strengthened if SUU were to go to the BSC as well.

If the WAC comes calling they would come to Fargo first. No matter which university they went to stadium commitments would have to be made. NDSU is certainly adequate right now and their average attendance is respectable for the WAC. Besides they have a lot of doors to knock on before they get down to the Dakotas.

If the BSC invites UND "reuniting with NDSU, SDSU and USD" becomes unlikely and that dream of the UND crowd loses any relevance. I would have to say evidence of the BSC and UND is mounting. Its starting to seem more likely all the time.

[SloStang]

I guess you are just happy that UND will not be in the same conference so that they can not continue their dominance over NDSU in football. What is their record against NDSU? Looked it up, it is 62-45-3. They also won 9 of the last 11 games played. Hey if you never play them you can never catch them. If you hate them so much and think you are so much better than them I would think you would want to play them so you could prove it. Right now I say UND 62, NDSU 45. I think what is really going on is you have such a inferiority complex that you have to continuely try to degrade them and prop up NDSU all the time. It is really sad that you are so insecure and filled with hate, but seeing that you are it makes perfect sense that you want no part of UND.

[JBB]

This thread is about Big Sky Expansion isnt it? I dont know why you are always turning threads into UND is better than NDSU and then take a shot at me. You have a posting history. I suggest you look at it and learn.

[SloStang]

This thread is about Big Sky Expansion isnt it? I dont know why you are always turning threads into UND is better than NDSU and then take a shot at me. You have a posting history. I suggest you look at it and learn.

You are right it is about Big Sky Expansion not about you taking shots at UND. Let's look at your posting history in this thread to find out how many shots you have taken at them.

1) Of course many fans want UND to go directly to the WAC. Good idea. I say go.

2) These people from UND are detached from reality and certainly will add little to the Summit except discord and contempt.

3) This is a comment from one of their more level headed morons. This guy was in the front when UND quit playing NDSU and SDSU and was also one of the big mouthpieces running down NDSU and its move to D1 (its very likely this person will post here soon calling for the mods to ban me. He does that all the time):

4) Please BSC come through and take this school off of our hands. We want our conference to be tight knit. loyal competititve group. UND and its past history make that very unlikely if they are admitted.

5) Just for fun here is a look at Tom Millers main theme which further displays UNDs institution lack of character:

6) Tom, UND quit playing NDSU and SDSU 7 years ago and the UND base was as ugly and as mean spirited as could be while doing it! That's not the kind of associations we want in the Summit.

7) UND brings nothing to the Summit except their baggage. They have one of the worst basketball teams in Division 1. They represent a travel burden to the rest of the Summit with only the Dakota Schools benefiting (couldn't the same be said about NDSU?).

You are a one trick pony JBB and your act is getting old.

[SDHornet]

If UND or any school from the Dakota's is brought on as a full member, I sure as hell hope to see Sac move everything but football to the Big West. I can't imagine what sending all the non-revenue sports to the Dakota's will cost.

[EWURanger]

If UND or any school from the Dakota's is brought on as a full member, I sure as hell hope to see Sac move everything but football to the Big West. I can't imagine what sending all the non-revenue sports to the Dakota's will cost.

Adding UND as an all sports member just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. While I am sure they have a lot to offer the conference in terms of them being a flagship university, one can't ignore the geography factor. Without a travel partner, I think it's going to be a really hard sell for them, and if I'm Sac, PSU, NAU I'd be blocking them in favor of SUU as an all-sports, and adding UND as football-only.

I think something like the below might makes sense. Does not include UM, they're most likely WAC'd out after 2011. Also eliminated Sac as an all-sports. Big West makes sense for them for everything but football.

All-Sports members (8):

EWU
ISU
MSU
UNC
PSU
NAU
WEB
SUU

Football (12):

Pacific Division:
Eastern Washington
Portland State
Sac State
Northern Arizona
CPSLO
UC-Davis

Mountain Division:
Weber State
Idaho State
Montana State
Northern Colorado
North Dakota
Southern Utah

[EWURanger]

.

[GeauxSioux]

If UND or any school from the Dakota's is brought on as a full member, I sure as hell hope to see Sac move everything but football to the Big West. I can't imagine what sending all the non-revenue sports to the Dakota's will cost.

Just for fun I picked an arbitrary weekend in February and checked air fares from Sacramento to Missoula ($383) and Sacramento to Grand Forks ($398). Not a huge difference. Of course cost would be a consideration for teams that normally would bus to their games.

Wider exposure would be something that North Dakota does bring to the table. UND has their own cable channel FSSN http://www.ndtc.tv/fssn.htm, which is picked up all over North Dakota, most of South Dakota and Northern Minnesota. FSSN is in the second year of a three year contract with Fox College Sports (FCS) to broadcasts UND home games.

For example the hockey team had an exhibition game last weekend that was broadcast nationwide on FCS. " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
[youtube][/youtube]

[freebird]

Or maybe the BSC is set. Montana leaves to become a small fish in a medium size pond, and we have a 10 team conference.

[weberwildcat]

If UM only leaves then only SUU will be added.

[JBB]

Slostang, please. Everyone of those comments was made in connection with the BSC expansion and everyone was an expression of my opinion about it, the schools involved and how movement would affect NDSU and the Summit.

I am against UND in the Summit and Summit football. Of course with your intolerant attitude no opinion other than own is valid. You are intolerant of opposing viewpoints. That a psychological problem, I hope its not chemically induced.

Your comments are personal attacks on me combined with your ball washing of UND football while running down NDSU. You have a problem and I suggest you fix it or simply change your name to "UND Ball Washer". There I made a comment not connected with BSC expansion.

Grow up Slostang. Even hippies have to face reality some time: THERE IS MORE THAN ONE POINT OF VIEW.

[JBB]

Im pretty sure Montana will leave and Montana State has requested funds to expand their stadium beyond 15,000. Both ADs are also speaking out in favor of the FBS move. Montana because it makes sense, UM because of Montana. I think SUU is a lock, UND second. After that probably USD could be considered football only but that now seems unlikely considering Fullerton's comments.

[kalm]

Slostang, please. Everyone of those comments was made in connection with the BSC expansion and everyone was an expression of my opinion about it, the schools involved and how movement would affect NDSU and the Summit.

I am against UND in the Summit and Summit football. Of course with your intolerant attitude no opinion other than own is valid. You are intolerant of opposing viewpoints. That a psychological problem, I hope its not chemically induced.

Your comments are personal attacks on me combined with your ball washing of UND football while running down NDSU. You have a problem and I suggest you fix it or simply change your name to "UND Ball Washer". There I made a comment not connected with BSC expansion.

Grow up Slostang. Even hippies have to face reality some time: THERE IS MORE THAN ONE POINT OF VIEW.

Wow, you really need to go back and read the thread again.

[JBB]

m pretty sure Montana will leave and Montana State has requested funds to expand their stadium beyond 15,000. Both ADs are also speaking out in favor of the FBS move. Montana because it makes sense, UM because of Montana. I think SUU is a lock, UND second. After that probably USD could be considered football only but that now seems unlikely considering Fullerton's comments.

[weberwildcat]

I don't know anything about the Dakotas since they were all DII very recently. Is it safe to say if we are adding any dakotas that it is because the big sky will be fearing it could die like what could still happen to the wac?

Im neutral on the Dakotas but more against it right now I guess due to location being so damn far away. I haven't been to EWU yet cuz its too far and thats 700 miles. UND, on the Minnesota border is 1,200 miles from where I live.

From the Pacific ocean to Minnesota will suck. Again I'm not trying to dis UND but you have to see my point. I know the Great West was basically that big too but no one ever thought that conf would last very long, just a temp thing,3 of the 5 teams were DII within the past, what 5 yrs?

[JBB]

I dont think USD is in play beyond the outside chance of a football only. The big question: Where would the BSC turn if they need 1 or 2 new all-sports members to replace the Montana(s)? It might be a matter of survival rather than "best choice"? In fact there are only 2 choices that I see beyond a total remodel of the landscape.

[weberwildcat]

UND Info

The University of North Dakota (UND) is a public university in Grand Forks, North Dakota, USA. Established by the Dakota Territorial Assembly in 1883, six years before the establishment of the state of North Dakota, UND is the oldest university in the state and enrolls over 13,100 students.

UND's athletic teams bear the name of the Fighting Sioux.[49] The official school colors of UND are green and pink. The colors are supposed to be representative of North Dakota's state flower, the Wild Prairie Rose. [3] However, the official athetic teams colors of UND are Green and White adapted in the 1920's.

UND is currently in Division I. The hockey teams play in the Western Collegiate Hockey Association and all other teams currently play in the Great West Conference. The cycling team is part of USA Cycling's North Central Collegiate Cycling Conference.

The men's ice hockey team has won seven national championships and has been runner-up five times. Both the men's and women's ice hockey teams play home games at Ralph Engelstad Arena. The Ralph, as it is commonly known, has been called one of the finest hockey arenas in the world.[50] The football team, which plays home games in the Alerus Center, won the Division II national championship in 2001 and was the runner-up in 2003. The basketball teams play in the Betty Engelstad Sioux Center. The women's team has won three national championships in 1997, 1998, and 1999 and was runner-up in 2001. One notable UND athletic alumnus is NBA coach and former player Phil Jackson. Many UND alumni have played in the NHL as well, including: New Jersey Devils Left Wing Zach Parise and Center Travis Zajac, Carolina Hurricanes Defenseman Mike Commodore, Chicago Blackhawks Forward and captain Jonathan Toews, former NHL goalie Ed Belfour, and St. Louis Blues center TJ Oshie.

[cats2506]

m pretty sure Montana will leave and Montana State has requested funds to expand their stadium beyond 15,000. Both ADs are also speaking out in favor of the FBS move. Montana because it makes sense, UM because of Montana. I think SUU is a lock, UND second. After that probably USD could be considered football only but that now seems unlikely considering Fullerton's comments.

I think this is mixed up a little but MSU's AD has never spoken out positively about a move to the WAC. MSU's AD only speaks in gibberish so that nobody know what he is saying.

Yes MSU got approval to hire an architect for a stadium upgrade, but moving to that WAC right now is not a reality. the Money is simply not there. I am still hoping that logic will prevail and that UM will stay in BSC

[bincitysioux]

I don't know anything about the Dakotas since they were all DII very recently. Is it safe to say if we are adding any dakotas that it is because the big sky will be fearing it could die like what could still happen to the wac?

Im neutral on the Dakotas but more against it right now I guess due to location being so damn far away. I haven't been to EWU yet cuz its too far and thats 700 miles. UND, on the Minnesota border is 1,200 miles from where I live.

From the Pacific ocean to Minnesota will suck. Again I'm not trying to dis UND but you have to see my point. I know the Great West was basically that big too but no one ever thought that conf would last very long, just a temp thing,3 of the 5 teams were DII within the past, what 5 yrs?

The travel is what sucks from North Dakota's perspective as well, but we just need a league for all of our sports, especially football. Unless the Summit comes with some sort of football attachment, I'm strongly in favor of the Big Sky, whether it includes any Montana schools or not. And theoretically if both Montana schools end up leaving, the Big Sky could go into WAC mode, and need to add schools just to remain viable, regardless of factors like travel.

To answer your question, UC Davis joined DI in 2002, the same year the Northern Colorado did, while North Dakota and South Dakota moved up in 2008.