The growing threat from FCS

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The growing threat from FCS

Post by Blue Hen Fanatic »

Edited for maximum effect:
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The growing threat from Football Championship Subdivision teams
Associated Press
SEPTEMBER 21, 2010

From: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... 12272.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

One of the stories of this young season is the growing threat that Football Championship Subdivision teams pose to the big schools, as evidenced by North Dakota State's upset over Kansas in week one, James Madison's stunner over Virginia Tech in week two and Massachusetts's five-point loss to Michigan on Saturday. But is this threat actually growing? Are games between the FCS and the Football Bowl Subdivision getting closer? When Big State U. takes on Diminutive Directional College, is there now something for the Goliaths to fear?

Not really. FCS upsets over FBS teams aren't on the rise. They're happening at the same rate that they have for the past 15 years. The big boys' victory margin isn't narrowing either.

This, of course, is as it should be. FBS teams, by virtue of their significantly larger followings and greater visibility, hold massive advantages over FCS schools. This is reflected in their head-to-head results, which have not deviated this year from past seasons:

FBS performance vs. FCS schools

Year Win% Record Differential
1996 .851 40-7 15.1
1997 .857 30-5 20.8
1998 .872 41-6 21.8
1999 .865 45-7 22.9
2000 .709 39-16 19.7
2001 .860 49-8 21.3
2002 .877 57-8 24.8
2003 .859 61-10 23.6
2004 .893 50-6 21.5
2005 .963 52-2 25.4
2006 .910 71-7 26.7
2007 .886 70-9 25.9
2008 .977 85-2 28.9
2009 .947 89-5 29.1
2010 .913 63-6 27.4
Total .890 842-104 24.4

Source: Stats Inc.

But there are certain schools and scheduling scenarios that name teams should be wary of. Basically, if you're a fan of a major school, the biggest threats to the 40-7 breather you're expecting are the Colonial Athletic Association and your own athletic director's foolishness.

Although the 2010 FBS winning percentage is down from 2008, it's in line with the overall winning percentage since 1996 - slightly ahead, actually. By season's end, it may wind up in the same ballpark as 2009. Likewise, the average point differential in these games isn't slipping in comparison to where it typically stands. This season's 27.4-point figure is the third-highest of this 15-year time frame.

So FCS upsets aren't on the rise. What is on the rise are assumptions that they're on the rise, since writers and TV commentators often mention this season's six upsets without providing context about whether six is an abnormally high number. Plus, of course, the 2007 Appalachian State-Michigan and 2010 James Madison-Virginia Tech upsets have created the perception that even elite FBS teams have become much more vulnerable.

FBS conferences vs. FCS schools

Conf. Record Win%
SEC 78-2 .975
Big 12 87-3 .967
WAC 74-3 .961
Pac-10 37-2 .949
Mtn West 48-3 .941
Big East 64-4 .941
Conf. USA 68-5 .932
ACC 82-7 .921
Big Ten 52-5 .912
Ind. 93-16 .853
MAC 95-27 .779
Big West* 32-10 .762
Sun Belt 32-17 .653

*-no longer plays football

Source: Stats Inc.

But while those upsets were undeniably landmark victories (they represented the first two FCS wins over ranked FBS opponents), they seem to be closer in kind to the 1982 Chaminade-over-Virginia basketball shocker than the U.S.'s sixth-place showing at the 2002 world basketball championships. That is, they're more one-offs than proof that the playing field is suddenly leveling.

Indeed, for all but the weakest FBS conferences, the odds of losing to an FCS opponent remain miniscule, as the adjacent chart shows.

Note how well even the WAC has done, and how admirably few FCS games the Pac-10 has played.

:nod: But then there's the CAA - 'Colonial Athletic Association', home to seven teams in last week's FCS top-25 coaches' poll, including UMass and James Madison. Since 2006, its average point differential in games against FBS teams is minus-15 points, a relatively competitive figure when compared to the overall average. CAA teams have 10 victories over the FBS over this span (including wins over Virginia, Virginia Tech, Northwestern and Duke twice), compared to 19 for all of the rest of the FCS. :nod:

:nod: Clearly this is not a conference to be taken lightly - which is exactly what Virginia Tech did by playing James Madison after the Hokies lost to Boise State. :nod:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by AZGrizFan »

Blue Hen Fanatic wrote: FBS conferences vs. FCS schools

Conf. Record Win%
SEC 78-2 .975
Big 12 87-3 .967
WAC 74-3 .961
Pac-10 37-2 .949
Mtn West 48-3 .941
Big East 64-4 .941
Conf. USA 68-5 .932
ACC 82-7 .921
Big Ten 52-5 .912
Ind. 93-16 .853
MAC 95-27 .779
Big West* 32-10 .762
Sun Belt 32-17 .653

*-no longer plays football
What this tells me is that if Western FCS teams want to get a CAA-like reputation, we're going to have to travel East and play MAC and Sun Belt teams. :lol:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by mcveyrl »

AZGrizFan wrote:
Blue Hen Fanatic wrote: FBS conferences vs. FCS schools

Conf. Record Win%
SEC 78-2 .975
Big 12 87-3 .967
WAC 74-3 .961
Pac-10 37-2 .949
Mtn West 48-3 .941
Big East 64-4 .941
Conf. USA 68-5 .932
ACC 82-7 .921
Big Ten 52-5 .912
Ind. 93-16 .853
MAC 95-27 .779
Big West* 32-10 .762
Sun Belt 32-17 .653

*-no longer plays football
What this tells me is that if Western FCS teams want to get a CAA-like reputation, we're going to have to travel East and play MAC and Sun Belt teams. :lol:

Yea, I'm not sure you guys could beat SJSU, Idaho, NMSU, Wyoming, etc. either.
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by AZGrizFan »

mcveyrl wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:
What this tells me is that if Western FCS teams want to get a CAA-like reputation, we're going to have to travel East and play MAC and Sun Belt teams. :lol:

Yea, I'm not sure you guys could beat SJSU, Idaho, NMSU, Wyoming, etc. either.
If by "you guys" you mean Montana (and you mean RIGHT now), I'd agree. If by "you guys" you mean "western FCS teams", I give you a big hearty :roll: . I believe Cal Poly has victories over SJSU and SDSU in the past couple years, as well as a 1-point loss to Wisconsin. Montana State beat Colorado a few years ago, then played well against Oklahoma, and should have won against Washington State this year. Weber has also played their I-A games tough recently.

Much like in the FCS world, there just aren't as many patsies to choose from out here. :coffee:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by andy7171 »

The sooner you accept that we east coasters are better than you pioneers out there, the sooner we'll all get alone AZ.






:lol:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by mcveyrl »

AZGrizFan wrote:
mcveyrl wrote:

Yea, I'm not sure you guys could beat SJSU, Idaho, NMSU, Wyoming, etc. either.
If by "you guys" you mean Montana (and you mean RIGHT now), I'd agree. If by "you guys" you mean "western FCS teams", I give you a big hearty :roll: . I believe Cal Poly has victories over SJSU and SDSU in the past couple years, as well as a 1-point loss to Wisconsin. Montana State beat Colorado a few years ago, then played well against Oklahoma, and should have won against Washington State this year. Weber has also played their I-A games tough recently.

Much like in the FCS world, there just aren't as many patsies to choose from out here. :coffee:
But you're saying there's opportunities...I'm fully aware of the west coast FCS success. My beef with the comment was that the ratio of sucky FBS teams to quality FCS teams is probably about the same as it is in the east, which is what your last comment alludes to I think. Let's not act like the ratio of wins is really that high anywhere. It's rare that even crappy MAC and Sun Belt teams lose to FCS. SJSU is the west coast answer to Ball State, just play them a lot. Hell, schedule a home and home with Idaho, I'm sure they'd like to get out of there for a weekend. The point is that there's opportunity for you to play crappy WAC and MWC teams (and even Sun Belt teams as far as that conference stretches!). The fact is, many choose not to and either schedule a DII win or play a Pac 10 team because they'll get more money.

At any rate, I do take offense that the Griz are traveling out east and taking one of the sucky FBS teams that somebody out east could play!! :lol:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by AZGrizFan »

andy7171 wrote:The sooner you accept that we east coasters are better than you pioneers out there, the sooner we'll all get alone AZ.






:lol:
But you'll never be Iowa. :coffee:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by CatMom »

andy7171 wrote:The sooner you accept that we east coasters are better than you pioneers out there, the sooner we'll all get alone AZ.






:lol:
Then come play TCU or Houston (well, if they still had Keenum) or A&M or LSU or Bama or TTech and we'll see how that goes, shall we?
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by BDKJMU »

Blue Hen. There was already a thread on this started yesterday:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=18600" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

No reason to do 2 threads.

Mods: Maybe merge this one to the other one?
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by BlueHen86 »

AZGrizFan wrote:
Blue Hen Fanatic wrote: FBS conferences vs. FCS schools

Conf. Record Win%
SEC 78-2 .975
Big 12 87-3 .967
WAC 74-3 .961
Pac-10 37-2 .949
Mtn West 48-3 .941
Big East 64-4 .941
Conf. USA 68-5 .932
ACC 82-7 .921
Big Ten 52-5 .912
Ind. 93-16 .853
MAC 95-27 .779
Big West* 32-10 .762
Sun Belt 32-17 .653

*-no longer plays football
What this tells me is that if Western FCS teams want to get a CAA-like reputation, we're going to have to travel East and play MAC and Sun Belt teams. :lol:
No, not MAC or Sunbelt teams. They would have to play ACC teams. :lol:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by S F State Gaters »

this is a good thread on it's own. the perception of FCS is changing, and it is tinged with a lot of prejudice from the FBS side along with a lot of misunderstanding and misinformation. among even the lower levels of FBS, the sbc, mac, and lower level wac, cusa, and mwc teams, there is a stigma associated with FCS in a lot of circles. Data like this work in some ways to both absolve and reinforce these ways of thinking about FCS ball
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The growing threat from FCS

Post by clenz »

CatMom wrote:
andy7171 wrote:The sooner you accept that we east coasters are better than you pioneers out there, the sooner we'll all get alone AZ.






:lol:
Then come play TCU or Houston (well, if they still had Keenum) or A&M or LSU or Bama or TTech and we'll see how that goes, shall we?
Alabama, and to a slightly lesser extent LSU, aren't really considered west
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by andy7171 »

CatMom wrote:
andy7171 wrote:The sooner you accept that we east coasters are better than you pioneers out there, the sooner we'll all get alone AZ.






:lol:
Then come play TCU or Houston (well, if they still had Keenum) or A&M or LSU or Bama or TTech and we'll see how that goes, shall we?
You did see the :lol: right? :roll:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by bandl »

CatMom wrote:
andy7171 wrote:The sooner you accept that we east coasters are better than you pioneers out there, the sooner we'll all get alone AZ.






:lol:
Then come play TCU or Houston (well, if they still had Keenum) or A&M or LSU or Bama or TTech and we'll see how that goes, shall we?
How 'bout we'll just play Penn State, Florida, Virginia Tech, Ohio State (just as much part of the east as Bama is of the West), Michigan, etc and call it even, shall we?

Oh, and I also suggest you check out this website:
http://www.wikihow.com/Take-a-Joke
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by 89Hen »

CatMom wrote:
andy7171 wrote:The sooner you accept that we east coasters are better than you pioneers out there, the sooner we'll all get alone AZ.

:lol:
Then come play TCU or Houston (well, if they still had Keenum) or A&M or LSU or Bama or TTech and we'll see how that goes, shall we?
Bama is now a western team? :|
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by Theee Catrabbit »

Yeah....oh yeah? Well we'll just stick to playing Nebraska. Any takers? No? Didn't think so. :|
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by 89Hen »

Theee Catrabbit wrote:Yeah....oh yeah? Well we'll just stick to losing to Nebraska. Any takers? No? Didn't think so. :|
FIFY
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by Theee Catrabbit »

89Hen wrote:
Theee Catrabbit wrote:Yeah....oh yeah? Well we'll just stick to losing to Nebraska. Any takers? No? Didn't think so. :|
FIFY

Still a fan, gotta stay positive. :nod:
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Re: The growing threat from FCS

Post by SpeedkingATL »

If the MAC, the Big East, Sunbelt, and lower performing BCS conference schools would play more games against Top 10 programs in FCS the numbers would look a little different. Most FBS programs get their aXX handed to them by the LSUs, OSUs, SoCals, Floridas, and Penn States of the world. Check out the mighty ACCs record against the SEC over the last five years...and see what that winning percentage is.
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