So, the abortion issue is now back in the limelight...

[89Hen]

Trip you're making this harder than it has to be. A simple "I don't care" after people point out that abortion is murder is all it takes to end the debate.

I'm pro-abortion, and I don't care that it is murder.

See, easy. You're welcome.

Perhaps the best argument I've ever seen for pro-choice. Sick and disturbed, but effective in a way.

[93henfan]

Killing babies is just a start. If we can so easily get our heads around that then it should only be a few small steps further to justifying the things we need to do to get the world population back down to around 5 billion.


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Amen.

Any way we can find to snuff people shouldn't be discouraged.

We are way overdue for a nice world war, pandemic, etc. The herd needs culling.

Won't be good for property values, but will be a terrific buying opportunity.

[CID1990]

Killing babies is just a start. If we can so easily get our heads around that then it should only be a few small steps further to justifying the things we need to do to get the world population back down to around 5 billion.


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Amen.

Any way we can find to snuff people shouldn't be discouraged.

We are way overdue for a nice world war, pandemic, etc. The herd needs culling.

Won't be good for property values, but will be a terrific buying opportunity.

Ya think?

I mean, why stop with fetuses?

Let’s keep going. Because the logic works for anybody... not just the unborn

Start with newborns, then toddlers, retards, Gypsies, Joos, and any other invalids or undesirables.

Then we can move on to the unemployed (you get a 1 year grace period), the elderly, vegans, transtesticles, divorce attorneys, Baptists, and child molesters.

I think I’ve eliminated about 1 billion right there!

Next up: telemarketers (and other poor people), congresscritters, 7th Day Adventists, HSN presenters, and all Olympic curlers


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[Ibanez]

Amen.

Any way we can find to snuff people shouldn't be discouraged.

We are way overdue for a nice world war, pandemic, etc. The herd needs culling.

Won't be good for property values, but will be a terrific buying opportunity.

Ya think?

I mean, why stop with fetuses?

Let’s keep going. Because the logic works for anybody... not just the unborn

Start with newborns, then toddlers, retards, Gypsies, Joos, and any other invalids or undesirables.

Then we can move on to the unemployed (you get a 1 year grace period), the elderly, vegans, transtesticles, divorce attorneys, Baptists, and child molesters.

I think I’ve eliminated about 1 billion right there!

Next up: telemarketers (and other poor people), congresscritters, 7th Day Adventists, HSN presenters, and all Olympic curlers


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So you're just going to give Crossfitters a free pass?

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

Amen.

Any way we can find to snuff people shouldn't be discouraged.

We are way overdue for a nice world war, pandemic, etc. The herd needs culling.

Won't be good for property values, but will be a terrific buying opportunity.

Ya think?

I mean, why stop with fetuses?

Let’s keep going. Because the logic works for anybody... not just the unborn

Start with newborns, then toddlers, retards, Gypsies, Joos, and any other invalids or undesirables.

Then we can move on to the unemployed (you get a 1 year grace period), the elderly, vegans, transtesticles, divorce attorneys, Baptists, and child molesters.

I think I’ve eliminated about 1 billion right there!

Next up: telemarketers (and other poor people), congresscritters, 7th Day Adventists, HSN presenters, and all Olympic curlers


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What about the Irish?

[89Hen]

and all Olympic curlers

Now you've gone too far.

[93henfan]

How about non-essential federal employees? Time off and a raise I say!

[Gil Dobie]

Just figured they would jump to anyone older than 80, or 70, or 60, or 50.............till we get to a Logan's Run scenario.

[GannonFan]

Just figured they would jump to anyone older than 80, or 70, or 60, or 50.............till we get to a Logan's Run scenario.

I was just thinking that - great movie. I'm sure Trip would be all in favor of a Logan's Run society, although probably have a lower age for political opponents for when their crystals start to flash.

[∞∞∞]

No, I don't believe in culling the herd; hell I don't even believe in the death-penalty.

All born should have the right to life.

[89Hen]

All born should have the right to life.

You're not going to find too many people agree with you on late term abortion Trip. Wait until you have a child of your own and maybe you'll get it.

[SDHornet]

Trip you're making this harder than it has to be. A simple "I don't care" after people point out that abortion is murder is all it takes to end the debate.

I'm pro-abortion, and I don't care that it is murder.

See, easy. You're welcome.

Perhaps the best argument I've ever seen for pro-choice. Sick and disturbed, but effective in a way.

I take the nihilistic approach for this issue and others like drone fucking islamist habib in the ME, lazy fuck on the streets that won't get a job to take care of him/herself, and anyone that is dependent on the gubmint for subsistence. There might be some exceptions, but they are rare and few.

The abortionists/leftists lose me when they take a pro murder stance with the abortion issue, but then claim to be for the benefit humanity on issues like welfare/universal healthcare/universal basic income/anti-death sentence/open borders for illegals because otherwise they have to live in shitholes. Probably a few other issues I missed but you get the point.

[SDHornet]

Killing babies is just a start. If we can so easily get our heads around that then it should only be a few small steps further to justifying the things we need to do to get the world population back down to around 5 billion.


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Amen.

Any way we can find to snuff people shouldn't be discouraged.

We are way overdue for a nice world war, pandemic, etc. The herd needs culling.

Won't be good for property values, but will be a terrific buying opportunity.

[93henfan]

and anyone that is dependent on the gubmint for subsistence

Careful, Eugene.

[AZGrizFan]

I’m a fan of an annual purge. The movie has it exactly right.

[SDHornet]

and anyone that is dependent on the gubmint for subsistence

Careful, Eugene.

You're one of the rare and few exceptions (only because I don't want to hear/read you go full meltdown again) but your non-essential coworkers can all go pound sand.

[JohnStOnge]

Well the pro life side might have over reached on that "Unplanned" movie. Yesterday, for the first time, I saw the first indication that the "true story" might not be true. It came during what I think was a fair interview of "Uplanned" producer Joe Knopp. You can see the interview at https://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2019/04/1 ... -movie.cnn. At about 2:08 in Smerconish put up the text of a Facebook post by Abby Johnson on the day she quit planned parenthood. I put a screen snip of it below the text of this post. That, to me, calls her claim that she quit because she was disturbed over what she saw during an abortion into serious question. I looked up what I think is the Texas Monthly article Smierconish referenced at https://www.texasmonthly.com/politics/the-convert/. It's got this in it:

Johnson’s account is so plausible and rich in detail that even Planned Parenthood seems not to have investigated whether this event ever took place. At my request, the staff at the Bryan clinic examined patient records from September 26, the day Johnson claims to have had her conversion experience, and spoke with the physician who performed abortions on that date. According to Planned Parenthood, there is no record of an ultrasound-guided abortion performed on September 26. The physician on duty told the organization that he did not use an ultrasound that day, nor did Johnson assist on any abortion procedure.

If it turns out that Johnson's story is false that would have no bearing on the substance of the abortion debate. But it sure as heck won't help the pro life cause to have a big deal made out of a "true story" that's a lie.

[Pwns]

Well, it's not like she was a receptionist double agent out to try and make a name for herself. She was one of PP's rising stars that gave up a cushy job at a non-profit.

I think she could've easily not known the correct date, or PP couldn't have record, or PP is lying (don't trust them one bit, honestly).

[JohnStOnge]

Well, it's not like she was a receptionist double agent out to try and make a name for herself. She was one of PP's rising stars that gave up a cushy job at a non-profit.

I think she could've easily not known the correct date, or PP couldn't have record, or PP is lying (don't trust them one bit, honestly).

There is a quote shortly following the language I quoted above from the Texas Monthly piece about the likelihood that she just got the date wrong:

It’s difficult to imagine that Johnson simply got the date wrong; September 12 was the only other day that month that the clinic performed surgical abortions.

Here "I quit" date was September 26. And, again, all this is in the context of what she said in that Facebook post. There's more context on the Facebook thing in the Texas Monthly article too:

Johnson received condolences and encouragement from a number of Facebook friends, most of whom were shocked by her announcement. She never mentioned being pressured to increase abortions, having witnessed the ultrasound-guided procedure, or having suffered a moral crisis.

As I said, none of this has bearing on the substance of the issue. But I think that any reasonable person who is totally objective had to bet they'd bet the story is not true.

[JoltinJoe]

None of us has any way of knowing how true the details of Johnson's conversion account are true.

Johnson says one thing; PP's records don't support her timeline; and, of course PP really can't be trusted at face value any more than Johnson can.

Here's what we do know. Johnson was a fast-rising PP clinic director at the young age of 29, and a vocal pro-abortion advocate. She left that position. She converted and became a vocal pro-life advocate.

I think the biggest truth in the story that conversions of this nature happen only in one direction. Metaphorically, PP is East Berlin.

[CID1990]

Well the pro life side might have over reached on that "Unplanned" movie. Yesterday, for the first time, I saw the first indication that the "true story" might not be true. It came during what I think was a fair interview of "Uplanned" producer Joe Knopp. You can see the interview at https://www.cnn.com/videos/tv/2019/04/1 ... -movie.cnn. At about 2:08 in Smerconish put up the text of a Facebook post by Abby Johnson on the day she quit planned parenthood. I put a screen snip of it below the text of this post. That, to me, calls her claim that she quit because she was disturbed over what she saw during an abortion into serious question. I looked up what I think is the Texas Monthly article Smierconish referenced at https://www.texasmonthly.com/politics/the-convert/. It's got this in it:

Johnson’s account is so plausible and rich in detail that even Planned Parenthood seems not to have investigated whether this event ever took place. At my request, the staff at the Bryan clinic examined patient records from September 26, the day Johnson claims to have had her conversion experience, and spoke with the physician who performed abortions on that date. According to Planned Parenthood, there is no record of an ultrasound-guided abortion performed on September 26. The physician on duty told the organization that he did not use an ultrasound that day, nor did Johnson assist on any abortion procedure.

If it turns out that Johnson's story is false that would have no bearing on the substance of the abortion debate. But it sure as heck won't help the pro life cause to have a big deal made out of a "true story" that's a lie.

Whoa

So... do you mean to say that abortion isnt killing?


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[JohnStOnge]

None of us has any way of knowing how true the details of Johnson's conversion account are true.

Johnson says one thing; PP's records don't support her timeline; and, of course PP really can't be trusted at face value any more than Johnson can.

Here's what we do know. Johnson was a fast-rising PP clinic director at the young age of 29, and a vocal pro-abortion advocate. She left that position. She converted and became a vocal pro-life advocate.

I think the biggest truth in the story that conversions of this nature happen only in one direction. Metaphorically, PP is East Berlin.

The Texas Monthly article has this in it:

Could clinic staff and the physician be mistaken? The Texas Department of State Health Services requires abortion providers to fill out a form documenting basic information about each procedure performed at a clinic. This document is known as the Induced Abortion Report Form. The Bryan clinic reported performing fifteen surgical abortions on September 26. Johnson has consistently said that the patient in question was thirteen weeks pregnant, which is plausible, since thirteen weeks is right at the cusp of when physicians will consider using an ultrasound to assist with the procedure. Yet none of the patients listed on the report for that day were thirteen weeks pregnant; in fact, none were beyond ten weeks.

Just to be sure I looked up the Texas Administrative Law on reporting requirements. It's at https://hhs.texas.gov/sites/default/fil ... n-code.pdf. It requires this:

(a) The purpose of this section is to implement the monthly abortion
reporting requirements for physicians who perform one or more abortions during
the preceding calendar month. A report must be submitted for each abortion
performed.
(b) The report may not identify by any means the patient.
(c) The report must include:
(1) whether the abortion facility at which the abortion is performed is
licensed under this chapter;
(2) the patient's year of birth, race, marital status, and state and
county of residence;
(3) the type of abortion procedure;
(4) the date the abortion was performed;

So the procedures are reported to the State. It looks to me like, if the Clininc wanted to cover up this particular procedure on this one date, it would have had to know it wanted to cover it up before it reported to the State. This is not a situation in which the clinic could say, "Oh Abby Johnson has become an issue so lets destroy records to cover it up." The State has the records.

Remember, Planned Parenthood didn't volunteer information on its records. It isn't a situation where this woman made her claim and Planned Parenthood took the initiative to say "Hey we didn't have that procedure on that date!" A reporter looked for the records and there is a system where the records are filed with the State.

And, again: All that is in the context of a situation in which the woman contemporaneously posted on Facebook that she quit because she got a bad peformance appraisal and wasn't appreciated.

I am pro life. When I first saw the trailers for the movie my eyes got moist. I agree that there were efforts to suppress the movie. I would love it if, instead of seeing the language of that Facebook post as it is, the woman had said she quit because of what she witnessed. I would love for the story to be true.

But one has to be intellectually honest with oneself and if one is intellectually honest with oneself the woman's credibility with respect to the story does not look real good. I mean really. You take one look at the language of that Facebook post and you have to conclude that if the people who made that movie knew about that they should NEVER have made that movie. That Facebook post alone raises too much doubt to stick that out there as a true story.

Now if it turns out she didn't really write that in a Facebook post it'll be different. But Smerconish asked the movie's producer about it and he did not argue that the Facebook post didn't happen. He instead tried to explain it and I don't think he did a very good job of it.

[JohnStOnge]

Whoa

So... do you mean to say that abortion isnt killing?


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No. An abortion procedure kills a living member of our species. As I said, whether the story is true or not has no impact on the substance of the debate about abortion. But if it looks likely that it's not true after all the buzz surrounding it, the emotional presentation, the stories of refusal to air the trailer, etc., it hurts the credibility of the pro life side. It's a very emotional presentation of what's supposed to be a true story and if it turns out to be a false story that's going to hurt.

And, frankly, at this point I think it's a false story. That Facebook post alone was close to enough for me to think the woman didn't quit because of an abortion procedure she saw then I read about that reporter looking for records and the State reporting requirements. I can never be 100% sure but I feel pretty confident that the woman didn't quit her job because of a procedure she saw and that incident she described never happened.

You're a law enforcement guy. What do YOU think?

[Chizzang]

Whoa

So... do you mean to say that abortion isnt killing?


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No. An abortion procedure kills a living member of our species. As I said, whether the story is true or not has no impact on the substance of the debate about abortion. But if it looks likely that it's not true after all the buzz surrounding it, the emotional presentation, the stories of refusal to air the trailer, etc., it hurts the credibility of the pro life side. It's a very emotional presentation of what's supposed to be a true story and if it turns out to be a false story that's going to hurt.

And, frankly, at this point I think it's a false story. That Facebook post alone was close to enough for me to think the woman didn't quit because of an abortion procedure she saw then I read about that reporter looking for records and the State reporting requirements. I can never be 100% sure but I feel pretty confident that the woman didn't quit her job because of a procedure she saw and that incident she described never happened.

You're a law enforcement guy. What do YOU think?

John,
A person can become president of the united states and hardly even grasp the concept of truth
why is the truth so important here..?

Fundamentalist Christian America ignores the truth every week these past 2 years
I wouldn't worry too much about this group of people and "The Truth"

[JohnStOnge]

I will backtrack some on the State reporting requirement because when they report to the State those records can't be released. So it's possible the clinic could have submitted records to the State showing that kind of procedure on that day and there is no way the news media could verify that.

Still, though, all this is in the context of that Facebook post. That Facebook posts is her basically saying she gave her all to that clinic and didn't get appreciated for it. Also there's the fact that Planned Parenthood in general and that clinic in particular didn't say anything about what the records indicated. Nobody said anything about the records until that Texas Monthly reporter asked about them.

It's still the case that, if the people who produced that movie really care about the pro life cause, they should NEVER had made a movie about THAT story when Abby Johnson made that Facebook post saying she quit because of complaints about her job perfromance and not being appreciated. A post including the quote "Anyone that knows me knows how committed I was to that job." I mean come on. On the day she quits she makes that statement about how committed she was to her Planned Parenthood job and complains about not being appreciated and now she's saying she quit because of an abortion procedure she witnessed? If they were going to make a movie about some "true story" to make a point they should've looked for something else.