Breaking: Active Shooter HS Broward Co, FL

[kalm]

But the Carl Sagan's and Mr Rogers types make good teachers.

Might listen to Sagen, but not Rogers.

Judging by how your class treated teachers, you might need Rogers more than Sagen....

[houndawg]

There were already armed personnel at the scene when it went down. Armed teachers won't contribute anything but a cross-fire. Plus teachers are union thug lefties, haven't you heard?

Some of you people just don't get that packing heat is not something to do at the hobby/enthusiast level and that there are not enough hours available to a teacher outside of work to achieve and maintain the proficiency levels I would want people to have that are armed in a crowded area. At this rate it will be necessary to include semi-autos in the same classification as machine guns.

I'm not talking hobby enthusiast, I'm talking legit trained by the police that would come to the school. My mom was a teacher and basketball coach. I know how much time a teacher has to train. Many have 2nd jobs.

I would not include semi-automatic rifles, only hand-guns. Again, legit, trained by police, 1-3 depending on size of school. And again, not the only option. Add metal detection at doors.

Police-trained my ass. How many times have you read something similar to: "Police officers fired 85 rounds at Mr. Dialou, 14 of which struck him.."? Proficiency with firearms is not something that is granted after a few hours training by police. It's really very much like playing the Banjo - if you want to be good at it you have to do it all the time. They don't have time, Gil. They have families and kids too and I doubt they want to spend their family time trying to maintain proficiency with a pistol. Not to mention the cost, which I'd happily pay more taxes for if your hair-brained scheme had any real chance of working.

[Gil Dobie]

Maybe the cops know them personally from training, and maybe just 2-3 teachers carry in a school. Would you rather wait for gun laws to change or be pro-active in protecting kids in schools. You shoot down everything I've suggested, metal detectors, having a few well trained teachers/school marshals in a school. Some school already have these and they work if applied properly.

What is your idea for a solution?

I had to add the 2-3 because I'm thinking you guys are assuming 20-30 teachers carry, which is dumb.

Gil, I don't remember shooting down everything you've suggested but if I have I apologize.

I'm not dead against arming select teachers, just asking questions. Like I said, it would just seem that the chaos created in the situation might add to the problem hence the idea of some sort of identifying clothing they could quick throw on might help. I'm also curious what the plan is once **** goes down. Does the armed teacher stay in the classroom, barricade the door, and take up a defensive position, or do they go out into the battle and try to take out the shooter(s)?

I think increasing police presence and eventually secured entrances and checkpoints with metal detectors and such will probably happen.

Teacher does whatever their training suggest with options to ad lib. I don't have a detailed outline of the training, just don't see what is so bad about having a couple teachers armed and trained with the local policia, in addition to other steps. Along with other security measures, like metal detection, etc. My thoughts change as we type these responses, maybe the armed teachers are deputized once they have passed training.

[Gil Dobie]

I'm not talking hobby enthusiast, I'm talking legit trained by the police that would come to the school. My mom was a teacher and basketball coach. I know how much time a teacher has to train. Many have 2nd jobs.

I would not include semi-automatic rifles, only hand-guns. Again, legit, trained by police, 1-3 depending on size of school. And again, not the only option. Add metal detection at doors.

Police-trained my ass. How many times have you read something similar to: "Police officers fired 85 rounds at Mr. Dialou, 14 of which struck him.."? Proficiency with firearms is not something that is granted after a few hours training by police. It's really very much like playing the Banjo - if you want to be good at it you have to do it all the time. They don't have time, Gil. They have families and kids too and I doubt they want to spend their family time maintaining the proficiency with a pistol. Not to mention the cost, which I'd happily pay more taxes for if your hair-brained scheme had any real chance of working.

Have you been following what I'm getting at. Trying to come up with ideas that protect our schools. So you would like to wait until all guns are taken away and let school go on asis? I've just throwing out ideas like having a couple teachers carry, metal detection, etc. There are teachers that have time and if you are doing extra school related duties, you get paid for those extra school related duties. Do you have teachers in your family? I grew up around them, vacationed with teaching families, hunted, fished with them. If a teacher has time to coach a sport or activity, another teacher might have time to train. Heck, schools in the 1960's and 70's had shooting classes.

[houndawg]

My experience with schools as a former cop who spent time at schools is that arming teachers is a bad idea

1) 3/4ths of them are not gun people

2) an overlapping 1/8th of them are morons

3) 6.93% of them would shoot themselves accidentally in homeroom

Teachers arent airline pilots (a good percentage of pilots are military)... think of the goofiest idiot you were in college with .... she's a teacher now

At the end of the day, we want our teachers to be a combination of Carl Sagan and Mr. Rogers. That guy shouldn't be carrying a heater, and he would refuse to anyway


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I know a teacher that was a military pilot and they support having a select few carry, not the Carl Sagan's or Mr Rogers types. We ran them out of the class room in High School. I don't know how many teachers we had that left the classroom crying. The other teachers, that we actually respected and feared would have been good candidates to be the 1 or 2 candidates. There are some good teachers out there.

...probably why you come up with these half-witted ideas.

[Gil Dobie]

I know a teacher that was a military pilot and they support having a select few carry, not the Carl Sagan's or Mr Rogers types. We ran them out of the class room in High School. I don't know how many teachers we had that left the classroom crying. The other teachers, that we actually respected and feared would have been good candidates to be the 1 or 2 candidates. There are some good teachers out there.

...probably why you come up with these half-witted ideas.

Lots of hot air, where are your idea's.

[Gil Dobie]

Might listen to Sagen, but not Rogers.

Judging by how your class treated teachers, you might need Rogers more than Sagen....

Maybe, but he would not have lasted the semester. I was the more of a watcher than a participant in these events.

[houndawg]

Police-trained my ass. How many times have you read something similar to: "Police officers fired 85 rounds at Mr. Dialou, 14 of which struck him.."? Proficiency with firearms is not something that is granted after a few hours training by police. It's really very much like playing the Banjo - if you want to be good at it you have to do it all the time. They don't have time, Gil. They have families and kids too and I doubt they want to spend their family time maintaining the proficiency with a pistol. Not to mention the cost, which I'd happily pay more taxes for if your hair-brained scheme had any real chance of working.

Have you been following what I'm getting at. Trying to come up with ideas that protect our schools. So you would like to wait until all guns are taken away and let school go on asis? I've just throwing out ideas like having a couple teachers carry, metal detection, etc. There are teachers that have time and if you are doing extra school related duties, you get paid for those extra school related duties. Do you have teachers in your family? I grew up around them, vacationed with teaching families, hunted, fished with them. If a teacher has time to coach a sport or activity, another teacher might have time to train. Heck, schools in the 1960's and 70's had shooting classes.

Yes I have, and you may have noticed that I disagree with arming teachers but think metal detectors are a good idea. As for teachers, my mom was a 4th grade teacher, my wife is a retired college professor, and my daughter teaches English as a Second Language to Hispanic kids in North Carolina.

[kalm]

Have you been following what I'm getting at. Trying to come up with ideas that protect our schools. So you would like to wait until all guns are taken away and let school go on asis? I've just throwing out ideas like having a couple teachers carry, metal detection, etc. There are teachers that have time and if you are doing extra school related duties, you get paid for those extra school related duties. Do you have teachers in your family? I grew up around them, vacationed with teaching families, hunted, fished with them. If a teacher has time to coach a sport or activity, another teacher might have time to train. Heck, schools in the 1960's and 70's had shooting classes.

Yes I have, and you may have noticed that I disagree with arming teachers but think metal detectors are a good idea. As for teachers, my mom was a 4th grade teacher, my wife is a retired college professor, and my daughter teaches English as a Second Language to Hispanic kids in North Carolina.

They should try teaching ESL to the white kids in NC too...

HEYO!

[Gil Dobie]

Have you been following what I'm getting at. Trying to come up with ideas that protect our schools. So you would like to wait until all guns are taken away and let school go on asis? I've just throwing out ideas like having a couple teachers carry, metal detection, etc. There are teachers that have time and if you are doing extra school related duties, you get paid for those extra school related duties. Do you have teachers in your family? I grew up around them, vacationed with teaching families, hunted, fished with them. If a teacher has time to coach a sport or activity, another teacher might have time to train. Heck, schools in the 1960's and 70's had shooting classes.

Yes I have, and you may have noticed that I disagree with arming teachers but think metal detectors are a good idea. As for teachers, my mom was a 4th grade teacher, my wife is a retired college professor, and my daughter teaches English as a Second Language to Hispanic kids in North Carolina.

There are policemen that teach computer forensics classes, for example. It's not that far fetched having the proper teacher or 2.

Most of the teachers I knew had 2nd jobs or after hours activities that paid extra.

[Ibanez]

What the hell are you talking about?

We were not a nice high school class. 22 students acting terrible, making an emotional teacher leave the classroom crying. Get it?

Your post was confusing. None of that was clear.

[Gil Dobie]

We were not a nice high school class. 22 students acting terrible, making an emotional teacher leave the classroom crying. Get it?

Your post was confusing. None of that was clear.

That's what Chizzy says.

[BDKJMU]

My experience with schools as a former cop who spent time at schools is that arming teachers is a bad idea

1) 3/4ths of them are not gun people

2) an overlapping 1/8th of them are morons

3) 6.93% of them would shoot themselves accidentally in homeroom

Teachers arent airline pilots (a good percentage of pilots are military)... think of the goofiest idiot you were in college with .... she's a teacher now

At the end of the day, we want our teachers to be a combination of Carl Sagan and Mr. Rogers. That guy shouldn't be carrying a heater, and he would refuse to anyway


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I know a teacher that was a military pilot and they support having a select few carry, not the Carl Sagan's or Mr Rogers types. We ran them out of the class room in High School. I don't know how many teachers we had that left the classroom crying. The other teachers, that we actually respected and feared would have been good candidates to be the 1 or 2 candidates. There are some good teachers out there.

I said it earlier on here my older brother said they have 2 on staff at the HS he teaches at in CT- one retired local cop and 1 retired Dept of Corrections. He said both retired from their LEO jobs in their mid-late 40s after 20+ years before getting into teaching. Seems like there wouldn't be anything wrong with guys like that carrying. Course I realize former or retired LEOS in teaching are probaly only 1-2% of school employees. Even if you included military maybe 5%?

I’ll have to ask my brother would he want to carry at school if he could (in CT will likely never be allowed). He was Army National Guard in the 90s, is a member of the local rod and gun club, has a CCW (harder to get in CT than in other states), has coached football, reffed football & lax), apparently one of the few non liberal teachers at his school, definitely not the Carl Sagen or Mr Rogers type.

[CID1990]

A thousand faces in the school and you're going to memorize who has the guns while Andy tippytoes up behind the perp and puts two in his head.

Ever heard of training with police and being friends with those police train with and continue to upgrade your training? Also with today's technology, you can easily have an app the would bring up the 1-3 people in the school that can carry on your police ipad or whatever they use in the squad car.

What's your solution?

Police have enough bullshite to deal with than trying to remember whos packing at any of the several schools in their area

If you dont work with them every day you arent going to remember them and you sure as hell arent going to run around an active shooter scene with an ipad

its too much responsibility and liability to put on two professions that are already top loaded with liability


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[Gil Dobie]

Ever heard of training with police and being friends with those police train with and continue to upgrade your training? Also with today's technology, you can easily have an app the would bring up the 1-3 people in the school that can carry on your police ipad or whatever they use in the squad car.

What's your solution?

Police have enough bullshite to deal with than trying to remember whos packing at any of the several schools in their area

If you dont work with them every day you arent going to remember them and you sure as hell arent going to run around an active shooter scene with an ipad

its too much responsibility and liability to put on two professions that are already top loaded with liability


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No shiat they aren't going to run around with a ipad. I assume they would have one in the squad car on the way to the shooting, and be aware the person they trained, is in the school. There are active police and ex-military that currently teach. I don't think it's a traditional teacher that you are thinking of, that will be carrying. Maybe it's not even a teacher, maybe a school marshal in plain clothes that works directly with the police and has a weekly in-person update with the local police. Just doesn't look that difficult to me to protect the kids.

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

I'm not talking hobby enthusiast, I'm talking legit trained by the police that would come to the school. My mom was a teacher and basketball coach. I know how much time a teacher has to train. Many have 2nd jobs.

I would not include semi-automatic rifles, only hand-guns. Again, legit, trained by police, 1-3 depending on size of school. And again, not the only option. Add metal detection at doors.

Police-trained my ass. How many times have you read something similar to: "Police officers fired 85 rounds at Mr. Dialou, 14 of which struck him.."? Proficiency with firearms is not something that is granted after a few hours training by police. It's really very much like playing the Banjo - if you want to be good at it you have to do it all the time. They don't have time, Gil. They have families and kids too and I doubt they want to spend their family time trying to maintain proficiency with a pistol. Not to mention the cost, which I'd happily pay more taxes for if your hair-brained scheme had any real chance of working.

You are a clueless hack that has no idea what you are talking about. You know shit about guns, less about training and or police. Why dont you just keep to what you know, trolling, animal husbandry and cross dressing........

[CID1990]

Police have enough bullshite to deal with than trying to remember whos packing at any of the several schools in their area

If you dont work with them every day you arent going to remember them and you sure as hell arent going to run around an active shooter scene with an ipad

its too much responsibility and liability to put on two professions that are already top loaded with liability


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No shiat they aren't going to run around with a ipad. I assume they would have one in the squad car on the way to the shooting, and be aware the person they trained, is in the school. There are active police and ex-military that currently teach. I don't think it's a traditional teacher that you are thinking of, that will be carrying. Maybe it's not even a teacher, maybe a school marshal in plain clothes that works directly with the police and has a weekly in-person update with the local police. Just doesn't look that difficult to me to protect the kids.

So instead of putting more police in schools

We want to put even lower trained people in schools

Do you know how much time you have to spend annually in training as a cop just to satisfy insurance requirements?

There's so much wrong about the idea of arming teachers or 7-11 security guards that I really can't list them all

How about we just stick with unbreakable barrier numero uno:

No school district that uses teachers or non police security guards will be able to maintain insurance..


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[Gil Dobie]

No shiat they aren't going to run around with a ipad. I assume they would have one in the squad car on the way to the shooting, and be aware the person they trained, is in the school. There are active police and ex-military that currently teach. I don't think it's a traditional teacher that you are thinking of, that will be carrying. Maybe it's not even a teacher, maybe a school marshal in plain clothes that works directly with the police and has a weekly in-person update with the local police. Just doesn't look that difficult to me to protect the kids.

So instead of putting more police in schools

We want to put even lower trained people in schools

Do you know how much time you have to spend annually in training as a cop just to satisfy insurance requirements?

There's so much wrong about the idea of arming teachers or 7-11 security guards that I really can't list them all

How about we just stick with unbreakable barrier numero uno:

No school district that uses teachers or non police security guards will be able to maintain insurance..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Putting police in schools is fine by me. I would expect if teachers/school marshals are armed, that they would be trained by police, have to pass a strict test. I'm thinking of my friend that's a war vet and teacher, that could handle a situation, and would train well for this. Now you bring insurance into the picture, that's another monster. It appears insurance would control this, and not make it possible for anyone other than official police to be brought in. Police that would actually be able to do something if there was an event.

I am familiar with police training from a family member that was a County Sheriff.

[AZGrizFan]

No shiat they aren't going to run around with a ipad. I assume they would have one in the squad car on the way to the shooting, and be aware the person they trained, is in the school. There are active police and ex-military that currently teach. I don't think it's a traditional teacher that you are thinking of, that will be carrying. Maybe it's not even a teacher, maybe a school marshal in plain clothes that works directly with the police and has a weekly in-person update with the local police. Just doesn't look that difficult to me to protect the kids.

So instead of putting more police in schools

We want to put even lower trained people in schools

Do you know how much time you have to spend annually in training as a cop just to satisfy insurance requirements?

There's so much wrong about the idea of arming teachers or 7-11 security guards that I really can't list them all

How about we just stick with unbreakable barrier numero uno:

No school district that uses teachers or non police security guards will be able to maintain insurance..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

we gonna put more police in schools who are too chicken to actually do their fucking JOB when the time arrives?

[CID1990]

So instead of putting more police in schools

We want to put even lower trained people in schools

Do you know how much time you have to spend annually in training as a cop just to satisfy insurance requirements?

There's so much wrong about the idea of arming teachers or 7-11 security guards that I really can't list them all

How about we just stick with unbreakable barrier numero uno:

No school district that uses teachers or non police security guards will be able to maintain insurance..


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I am familiar with police training from a family member that was a County Sheriff.

It sure doesn't sound like you are

If you were, you'd know that you'd be adding a significant training regime to a profession that already has its own burdensome certifications

You'd also know that active shooter training involves much more than just being trained and certified to use a gun.




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[dbackjon]

That was the first thing I thought too actually. Regardless it does beg the question when the subject is arming teachers: What happens when teacher goes postal?

The other fatal flaw is what Ibanez pointed out about the cops arriving and there are multiple armed civilians around - recipe for disaster. How would you like to be a black teacher holding a pistol when the police roll up? If you hurried you might have just enough time to kiss your ass goodbye.

Please point out a single instance of school shooting where the cops arrived before the shooter had either a) departed the premise or b) departed this earth.

Columbine.

[Ibanez]

Ever heard of training with police and being friends with those police train with and continue to upgrade your training? Also with today's technology, you can easily have an app the would bring up the 1-3 people in the school that can carry on your police ipad or whatever they use in the squad car.

What's your solution?

Police have enough bullshite to deal with than trying to remember whos packing at any of the several schools in their area

If you dont work with them every day you arent going to remember them and you sure as hell arent going to run around an active shooter scene with an ipad

its too much responsibility and liability to put on two professions that are already top loaded with liability


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Exactly. And you think they’re going to have flash cards handy at each school?


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[houndawg]

Yes I have, and you may have noticed that I disagree with arming teachers but think metal detectors are a good idea. As for teachers, my mom was a 4th grade teacher, my wife is a retired college professor, and my daughter teaches English as a Second Language to Hispanic kids in North Carolina.

They should try teaching ESL to the white kids in NC too...

HEYO!

[houndawg]

Police-trained my ass. How many times have you read something similar to: "Police officers fired 85 rounds at Mr. Dialou, 14 of which struck him.."? Proficiency with firearms is not something that is granted after a few hours training by police. It's really very much like playing the Banjo - if you want to be good at it you have to do it all the time. They don't have time, Gil. They have families and kids too and I doubt they want to spend their family time trying to maintain proficiency with a pistol. Not to mention the cost, which I'd happily pay more taxes for if your hair-brained scheme had any real chance of working.

You are a clueless hack that has no idea what you are talking about. You know **** about guns, less about training and or police. Why dont you just keep to what you know, trolling, animal husbandry and cross dressing........

Good grief, son, it wasn't me that said you had a small penis - and she actually only said that it was small compared to mine, which applies to everybody else too .....

[Gil Dobie]

I am familiar with police training from a family member that was a County Sheriff.

It sure doesn't sound like you are

If you were, you'd know that you'd be adding a significant training regime to a profession that already has its own burdensome certifications

You'd also know that active shooter training involves much more than just being trained and certified to use a gun.

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If you are thinking active shooter training and every possible cert a policeman can get,then we are not talking about the same thing. I'm talking a few very qualified individuals, 1-3 individuals, that go thru and get a police training cert for being able to carry in a school. Not go thru all the training that police go thru, otherwise just bring the police into the school. Keep in touch with police while they are certified at that school, maybe a weekly meeting with the police dept they are being advised by. These people would be on site if all else fails, metal detection, security camera's, etc. After all these conversations, I'm more leaning towards more police presence, but that's what happens when you talk stuff thru.

My family member was crazed in the head during an active shooting event, but the shooter wasn't so lucky.