Israeli Terrorists?

[kalm]

Blowing up UN schools after being warned 17 times of GPS coordinates, killing kids playing soccer on the beach…sure you can blame the bad guys for hiding among innocents, and palestinians for not evacuating but where are they supposed to go? The israeli's apparently say ahh fuck it, we'll just shell them all.

Yes, the Palestinians are terrorists, but are the Israeli's too?

In American media discourse, when Palestinians overwhelmingly kill soldiers (95% of the Israeli death toll) who are part of an army that is blockading, occupying, invading, and indiscriminately bombing them and killing their children by the hundreds, that is “terrorism”; when Israelis use massive, brutal force against a trapped civilian population, overwhelmingly killing innocent men, women and children (at least 75% of the Palestinian death toll), with clear intentions to kill civilians (see point 3), that is noble “self-defense.” That demonstrates how skewed U.S. discourse is in favor of Israel, as well as the purely manipulative, propagandistic nature of the term “terrorists.”

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014 ... a-context/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[DSUrocks07]

I thought that 'Murica was the ultimate arbiter on who is a terrorist or not?

[DSUrocks07]

Irony, Jews openly talking about a "final solution" to their "Palestinian problem"

http://www.juancole.com/2014/08/zionist ... inian.html

The Times of Israel published and then removed from its site an essay by Yochanan Gordon that openly called for genocide against the Palestinians of Gaza. A cached version is still on the internet as of this writing.
Gordon’s logic, if one wants to dignify it with that term, is that Hamas calls for the destruction of Israel, and therefore the only way to deal with them is to obliterate them entirely. He used the words “obliterate entirely.”
Hamas is a party-militia of the religious right. It does say it wants to see the Israeli government overthrown. Its leaders don’t, however, speak of committing genocide against Israelis. They say they want to recover their country, which was stolen from them by the Israelis in 1948. Colonial regimes always produce resistance movements.
The fact is that Hamas was supported by Israeli intelligence in the 1980s as a foil to the PLO, so Shin Bet and Mossad don’t seem to have been worried by the party charter.
Moreover, half the population of Gaza is children, who, how shall we put this, did not vote for Hamas in 2006. Even many Palestinians who did vote for it did so for internal reasons– they were protesting the corruption and authoritarianism of Fateh and the PLO. You can’t assume that they voted for it because they wanted to see it destroy the Israeli state.
Where Israel has worked out a truce with Hamas, Hamas has typically honored it. The truces have usually been broken by Israel. It isn’t true that it is impossible to deal with the organization. As recently as last month, the party had agreed to join Fateh in a national unity government, taking subordinate positions in a government that recognizes Israel.
Gordon has a backwards understanding of who is threatening to whom. Gaza politicians just have the opportunity to make some incendiary and boastful speeches. The Israeli military is rather more effective, and has the people of Gaza under siege, having just killed one in every thousand Palestinians in Gaza.
Israel destroyed Gaza’s only airport in 2002, and put its harbor off limits for free imports, as well. From 2007 it has prevented people in Gaza from exporting most of what they make, or from importing enough rough materials. For a while Israel even limited the amount to food coming into the Strip, declaring the Palestinians to be “on a diet.” This is a large concentration camp, and any human being cooped up in it would try to find a way of fighting this occupation.
Not to mention that Hamas doesn’t have the ability to destroy Israel. Israel has a massive military establishment and arsenal and several hundred nuclear weapons. Hamas has a few machine guns. No Israelis were killed by Hamas rockets in 2013 or the opening months of 2014. It was only after Israeli Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu incorrectly blamed Hamas for the kidnapping of three Israeli teenagers this summer, and began intensively bombing Gaza, that Hamas began replying with its rockets. 99% of Hamas rockets land harmlessly in the desert. Most of the rockets are tiny and little more than 8th grade chemistry experiments. A few are larger, imported from Iran, but there weren’t many of those and Hamas could not use them to do much real damage. A proportionate response to the rockets wouldn’t involved killing 1500 people.
The Israeli army has the right to defend Israel from Hamas attacks, but not an absolute right. It must abide by the principle of proportionality. It can’t commit war crimes or genocide.
If in the US a dangerous terrorist holed up in a mall, the government couldn’t scramble F-18s and bomb the mall to smithereens, killing hundreds os shoppers. That is what Israel did to Khuzaa.
Gordon’s premise, that Hamas wants to or can commit a genocide against Jews, is wrong. His premise that all the residents of Gaza are Hamas is wrong and wrong-headed. Gordon’s leading question is whether genocide against the Palestinians of Gaza would be justified if it eliminated (and he does mean eliminated) the threat to Israel.
That Gordon’s piece initially appeared at one of Israel’s largest-circulation newspapers is extremely worrying. Democracies don’t advocate murder or genocide. Did the editor not read it? Or did he read it and agree with it?
In any case, one thing is clear. Too many Israelis have justifications in their minds for genocide. This includes alleging that children are not innocent non-combatants. And the Genocide Convention makes another thing clear: Advocating genocide is a crime for which one can be tried at the Hague.

[DSUrocks07]

Preserving the article in question for posterity since it is cached for now.

https://archive.today/RPf3M#selection-1071.0-1095.36

When Genocide is Permissible
AUGUST 1, 2014, 5:36 PM
Yochanan Gordon

Judging by the numbers of casualties on both sides in this almost one-month old war one would be led to the conclusion that Israel has resorted to disproportionate means in fighting a far less- capable enemy. That is as far as what meets the eye. But, it’s now obvious that the US and the UN are completely out of touch with the nature of this foe and are therefore not qualified to dictate or enforce the rules of this war – because when it comes to terror there is much more than meets the eye.
I wasn’t aware of this, but it seems that the nature of warfare has undergone a major shift over the years. Where wars were usually waged to defeat the opposing side, today it seems – and judging by the number of foul calls it would indicate – that today’s wars are fought to a draw. I mean, whoever heard of a timeout in war? An NBA Basketball game allows six timeouts for each team during the course of a game, but last I checked this is a war! We are at war with an enemy whose charter calls for the annihilation of our people. Nothing, then, can be considered disproportionate when we are fighting for our very right to live.
The sad reality is that Israel gets it, but its hands are being tied by world leaders who over the past six years have insisted they are such good friends with the Jewish state, that they know more regarding its interests than even they do. But there’s going to have to come a time where Israel feels threatened enough where it has no other choice but to defy international warnings – because this is life or death.
Most of the reports coming from Gazan officials and leaders since the start of this operation have been either largely exaggerated or patently false. The truth is, it’s not their fault, falsehood and deceit is part of the very fabric of who they are and that will never change. Still however, despite their propensity to lie, when your enemy tells you that they are bent on your destruction you believe them. Similarly, when Khaled Meshal declares that no physical damage to Gaza will dampen their morale or weaken their resolve – they have to be believed. Our sage Gedalia the son of Achikam was given intelligence that Yishmael Ben Nesanyah was plotting to kill him. However, in his piety or rather naiveté Gedalia dismissed the report as a random act of gossip and paid no attention to it. To this day, the day following Rosh Hashana is commemorated as a fast day in the memory of Gedalia who was killed in cold blood on the second day of Rosh Hashana during the meal. They say the definition of insanity is repeating the same mistakes over and over. History is there to teach us lessons and the lesson here is that when your enemy swears to destroy you – you take him seriously.
Hamas has stated forthrightly that it idealizes death as much as Israel celebrates life. What other way then is there to deal with an enemy of this nature other than obliterate them completely?
News anchors such as those from CNN, BBC and Al-Jazeera have not missed an opportunity to point out the majority of innocent civilians who have lost their lives as a result of this war. But anyone who lives with rocket launchers installed or terror tunnels burrowed in or around the vicinity of their home cannot be considered an innocent civilian. If you’ll counter, that Hamas has been seen abusing civilians who have attempted to leave their homes in response to Israeli warnings to leave – well then, your beginning to come to terms with the nature of this enemy which should automatically cause the rules of standard warfare to be suspended.
Everyone agrees that Israel has the right to defend itself as well as the right to exercise that right. Secretary General Ban Ki Moon has declared it, Obama and Kerry have clearly stated that no one could be expected to sit idle as thousands of rockets rain down on the heads of its citizens, placing them in clear and present danger. It seems then that the only point of contention is regarding the measure of punishment meted out in this situation.
I will conclude with a question for all the humanitarians out there. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu clearly stated at the outset of this incursion that his objective is to restore a sustainable quiet for the citizens of Israel. We have already established that it is the responsibility of every government to ensure the safety and security of its people. If political leaders and military experts determine that the only way to achieve its goal of sustaining quiet is through genocide is it then permissible to achieve those responsible goals?

[Bronco]

Support the folks that hide behind children

[Bronco]

-
The left is on the wrong side again...following the lead of our Muzzie raised failed president

Israeli Soldier Helps Mentally Ill Palestinian Man Chained To Building By Hamas…

[93henfan]

We already covered this. Yes, they are terrorists. Yes, they would like to commit genocide on their neighbors.

Yes, both sides are heartless pieces of shit.

Yes, we should allow them both to significantly reduce each side's population. Just sit back and enjoy the show!

The earth is past due for a housekeeping of humans. Load up on guns and bring your friends.

[kalm]

Support the folks that hide behind children

If we gave them an iron dome they wouldn't have to.

[CID1990]

Blowing up UN schools after being warned 17 times of GPS coordinates, killing kids playing soccer on the beach…sure you can blame the bad guys for hiding among innocents, and palestinians for not evacuating but where are they supposed to go? The israeli's apparently say ahh **** it, we'll just shell them all.

Yes, the Palestinians are terrorists, but are the Israeli's too?

In American media discourse, when Palestinians overwhelmingly kill soldiers (95% of the Israeli death toll) who are part of an army that is blockading, occupying, invading, and indiscriminately bombing them and killing their children by the hundreds, that is “terrorism”; when Israelis use massive, brutal force against a trapped civilian population, overwhelmingly killing innocent men, women and children (at least 75% of the Palestinian death toll), with clear intentions to kill civilians (see point 3), that is noble “self-defense.” That demonstrates how skewed U.S. discourse is in favor of Israel, as well as the purely manipulative, propagandistic nature of the term “terrorists.”

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014 ... a-context/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

maybe if Hamas would stop launching rockets and building infiltration tunnels we could test your theory.... you know.... see if the Israelis would shell Gaza unprovoked

dunce

[kalm]

Blowing up UN schools after being warned 17 times of GPS coordinates, killing kids playing soccer on the beach…sure you can blame the bad guys for hiding among innocents, and palestinians for not evacuating but where are they supposed to go? The israeli's apparently say ahh **** it, we'll just shell them all.

Yes, the Palestinians are terrorists, but are the Israeli's too?

maybe if Hamas would stop launching rockets and building infiltration tunnels we could test your theory.... you know.... see if the Israelis would shell Gaza unprovoked

dunce

True. And maybe if the israeli's relaxed their occupation and embargo, maybe the Palestinians would stop too.

Dope.

[DSUrocks07]

Support the folks that hide behind children

If we gave them an iron dome they wouldn't have to.

We're give the Israelis another $225 million to upgrade their Iron Dome. The same one that already does well enough to protect Israel.

Fiscal responsibility FTW!!!

http://online.wsj.com/articles/senate-a ... 1406913423

Interesting quote from Lindsey Graham in the article:

"We will stand with you on the battlefield; we will stand with you in the court of public opinion, and we're going to push back against the United Nations," Sen. Lindsey Graham (R., S.C.) said on the Senate floor.

[BDKJMU]

Blowing up UN schools after being warned 17 times of GPS coordinates, killing kids playing soccer on the beach…sure you can blame the bad guys for hiding among innocents, and palestinians for not evacuating but where are they supposed to go? The israeli's apparently say ahh **** it, we'll just shell them all.

Yes, the Palestinians are terrorists, but are the Israeli's too?

In American media discourse, when Palestinians overwhelmingly kill soldiers (95% of the Israeli death toll) who are part of an army that is blockading, occupying, invading, and indiscriminately bombing them and killing their children by the hundreds, that is “terrorism”; when Israelis use massive, brutal force against a trapped civilian population, overwhelmingly killing innocent men, women and children (at least 75% of the Palestinian death toll), with clear intentions to kill civilians (see point 3), that is noble “self-defense.” That demonstrates how skewed U.S. discourse is in favor of Israel, as well as the purely manipulative, propagandistic nature of the term “terrorists.”

https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014 ... a-context/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Israeli terrorists my arse..
Hamas stores rocket caches in UN schools.
Hamas fires rockets from right outside those schools.
The UN is failing to tell Hamas, "No, you can't store your rockets here."

"Hamas Rockets Found in UN School Again 7/23

Hamas' attempts to minimize attention on its strategy of using civilian areas as a base of operations for rocket fire and other terrorism took a hit Tuesday when a United Nations relief organization found rockets stored in one of their schools for the second time in a week.

UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon issued a statement saying he was "alarmed and outraged" by the discovery of rockets in a vacant United Nations Relief Works Agency (UNRWA) school. He "calls on all of those who have any influence over militant groups to send an unmistakable message that this is unacceptable."

The UNRWA said it found the rockets "in the course of the regular inspection of its premises" Tuesday. Placing rockets in a UN building is a "flagrant violation of the inviolability of its premises under international law."

UNRWA condemnation of Palestinian groups' actions is extremely rare, emphasizing the severity of the recent incidents.

Speaking with the Times of Israel, Foreign Ministry spokesperson Yigal Palmor reacted intensely: "How many more schools will have to be abused by Hamas missile squads before the international community will intervene?"

"How many times can it turn its head the other way and pretend that it just doesn't see?"

Last week, the UNRWA discovered about 20 rockets in one of its schools during an inspection. A spokesperson for the agency said that the rockets were then transferred to "local authorities," which take orders from the ruling Hamas regime.

Israel is infuriated by the fact that a UN agency purportedly dedicated to humanitarian issues in Gaza transferred to a terrorist organization rockets which would likely be used to fire on Israeli civilians.

The UNRWA has a history of allowing Hamas use its facilities for its terrorist activities. "Time and again, over the years, UNRWA has been abused by gunmen from different terrorist factions who are using UN facilities to stockpile weapons, to fire rockets from, to steal UNRWA humanitarian equipment and to cause damage and fire in UNRWA's hangars," an unnamed senior foreign ministry official told the Times of Israel. "Against all evidence, UNRWA refuses to acknowledge reality and pathetically attempts to ingratiate itself with Hamas, pretending that nothing serious has happened.""
http://www.investigativeproject.org/447 ... hool-again" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hamas also has rockets fired from Gaza that fall short and land in Gaza, killing their own people.
Bombing, Deaths at Gaza UN School Appear to Be from Hamas Rockets

http://beforeitsnews.com/opinion-conser ... 84676.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yet silly liberals like Kalm are calling Israel as big of terrorists as Hamas. There is a HUGE difference between intentionally targeting civilains like Hamas, with suicide bombers and spray and pray rockets, and targeting military assets amongst a dense civilian population, killing a shitload of civilians in the process. What the Israelis doing is TAME and much more targeted than what we did during WW II. If the Israelis are terrorists, so were the RAF and US 8th Air Force for leveling German cities while going after the German military industrial complex in WWII, killing hundreds of thousands of civilians in the process, and the US 20th Air Force for leveling Japanese cities for the same reason.

[kalm]

Blowing up UN schools after being warned 17 times of GPS coordinates, killing kids playing soccer on the beach…sure you can blame the bad guys for hiding among innocents, and palestinians for not evacuating but where are they supposed to go? The israeli's apparently say ahh **** it, we'll just shell them all.

Yes, the Palestinians are terrorists, but are the Israeli's too?

Israeli terrorists my arse..
Hamas stores rocket caches in UN schools.
Hamas fires rockets from right outside those schools.
The UN is failing to tell Hamas, "No, you can't store your rockets here."

"Hamas Rockets Found in UN School Again 7/23

Hamas' attempts to minimize attention on its strategy of using civilian areas as a base of operations for rocket fire and other terrorism took a hit Tuesday when a United Nations relief organization found rockets stored in one of their schools for the second time in a week.

UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon issued a statement saying he was "alarmed and outraged" by the discovery of rockets in a vacant United Nations Relief Works Agency (UNRWA) school. He "calls on all of those who have any influence over militant groups to send an unmistakable message that this is unacceptable."

The UNRWA said it found the rockets "in the course of the regular inspection of its premises" Tuesday. Placing rockets in a UN building is a "flagrant violation of the inviolability of its premises under international law."

UNRWA condemnation of Palestinian groups' actions is extremely rare, emphasizing the severity of the recent incidents.

Speaking with the Times of Israel, Foreign Ministry spokesperson Yigal Palmor reacted intensely: "How many more schools will have to be abused by Hamas missile squads before the international community will intervene?"

"How many times can it turn its head the other way and pretend that it just doesn't see?"

Last week, the UNRWA discovered about 20 rockets in one of its schools during an inspection. A spokesperson for the agency said that the rockets were then transferred to "local authorities," which take orders from the ruling Hamas regime.

Israel is infuriated by the fact that a UN agency purportedly dedicated to humanitarian issues in Gaza transferred to a terrorist organization rockets which would likely be used to fire on Israeli civilians.

The UNRWA has a history of allowing Hamas use its facilities for its terrorist activities. "Time and again, over the years, UNRWA has been abused by gunmen from different terrorist factions who are using UN facilities to stockpile weapons, to fire rockets from, to steal UNRWA humanitarian equipment and to cause damage and fire in UNRWA's hangars," an unnamed senior foreign ministry official told the Times of Israel. "Against all evidence, UNRWA refuses to acknowledge reality and pathetically attempts to ingratiate itself with Hamas, pretending that nothing serious has happened.""
http://www.investigativeproject.org/447 ... hool-again" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hamas also has rockets fired from Gaza that fall short and land in Gaza, killing their own people.
Bombing, Deaths at Gaza UN School Appear to Be from Hamas Rockets

http://beforeitsnews.com/opinion-conser ... 84676.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yet silly liberals like Kalm are calling Israel as big of terrorists as Hamas. There is a HUGE difference between intentionally targeting civilains like Hamas, with suicide bombers and spray and pray rockets, and targeting military assets amongst a dense civilian population, killing a shitload of civilians in the process. What the Israelis doing is TAME and much more targeted than what we did during WW II. If the Israelis are terrorists, so were the RAF and US 8th Air Force for leveling German cities while going after the German military industrial complex in WWII, killing hundreds of thousands of civilians in the process, and the US 20th Air Force for leveling Japanese cities for the same reason.

Yep, Hamas is culpable too. But to not see the immorality on both sides is willfully ignorant while the comparison to WWII is just downright

Israel is losing the moral high ground in this and hurting themselves (and us) in the long run.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5629548" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[CID1990]

maybe if Hamas would stop launching rockets and building infiltration tunnels we could test your theory.... you know.... see if the Israelis would shell Gaza unprovoked

dunce

True. And maybe if the israeli's relaxed their occupation and embargo, maybe the Palestinians would stop too.

Dope.

Heres where the typical anti Israel ignorance comes into play

Israel gave Gaza back - there is no occupation there

and of course Hamas immediately began launching rockets at Israel from this newly minted safe haven that Israel gave them (remember the screaming and hair pulling as Israel uprooted Jewish settlers from Gaza to do this)

so Israel has an embargo to limit the influx of weapons and rockets

and then the idiots like you say Israel needs to end a nonexistent occupation and stop an embargo so Hamas wont launch rockets

seriously you and the rest are in Spandos territory on this issue

[CID1990]

Israeli terrorists my arse..
Hamas stores rocket caches in UN schools.
Hamas fires rockets from right outside those schools.
The UN is failing to tell Hamas, "No, you can't store your rockets here."

"Hamas Rockets Found in UN School Again 7/23

Hamas' attempts to minimize attention on its strategy of using civilian areas as a base of operations for rocket fire and other terrorism took a hit Tuesday when a United Nations relief organization found rockets stored in one of their schools for the second time in a week.

UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon issued a statement saying he was "alarmed and outraged" by the discovery of rockets in a vacant United Nations Relief Works Agency (UNRWA) school. He "calls on all of those who have any influence over militant groups to send an unmistakable message that this is unacceptable."

The UNRWA said it found the rockets "in the course of the regular inspection of its premises" Tuesday. Placing rockets in a UN building is a "flagrant violation of the inviolability of its premises under international law."

UNRWA condemnation of Palestinian groups' actions is extremely rare, emphasizing the severity of the recent incidents.

Speaking with the Times of Israel, Foreign Ministry spokesperson Yigal Palmor reacted intensely: "How many more schools will have to be abused by Hamas missile squads before the international community will intervene?"

"How many times can it turn its head the other way and pretend that it just doesn't see?"

Last week, the UNRWA discovered about 20 rockets in one of its schools during an inspection. A spokesperson for the agency said that the rockets were then transferred to "local authorities," which take orders from the ruling Hamas regime.

Israel is infuriated by the fact that a UN agency purportedly dedicated to humanitarian issues in Gaza transferred to a terrorist organization rockets which would likely be used to fire on Israeli civilians.

The UNRWA has a history of allowing Hamas use its facilities for its terrorist activities. "Time and again, over the years, UNRWA has been abused by gunmen from different terrorist factions who are using UN facilities to stockpile weapons, to fire rockets from, to steal UNRWA humanitarian equipment and to cause damage and fire in UNRWA's hangars," an unnamed senior foreign ministry official told the Times of Israel. "Against all evidence, UNRWA refuses to acknowledge reality and pathetically attempts to ingratiate itself with Hamas, pretending that nothing serious has happened.""
http://www.investigativeproject.org/447 ... hool-again" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hamas also has rockets fired from Gaza that fall short and land in Gaza, killing their own people.
Bombing, Deaths at Gaza UN School Appear to Be from Hamas Rockets

http://beforeitsnews.com/opinion-conser ... 84676.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Yet silly liberals like Kalm are calling Israel as big of terrorists as Hamas. There is a HUGE difference between intentionally targeting civilains like Hamas, with suicide bombers and spray and pray rockets, and targeting military assets amongst a dense civilian population, killing a shitload of civilians in the process. What the Israelis doing is TAME and much more targeted than what we did during WW II. If the Israelis are terrorists, so were the RAF and US 8th Air Force for leveling German cities while going after the German military industrial complex in WWII, killing hundreds of thousands of civilians in the process, and the US 20th Air Force for leveling Japanese cities for the same reason.

Yep, Hamas is culpable too. But to not see the immorality on both sides is willfully ignorant while the comparison to WWII is just downright

Israel is losing the moral high ground in this and hurting themselves (and us) in the long run.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5629548" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

actually, no they aren't.

most of the world is pretty silent on it this time around because this was 100% precipitated by Hamas

all Hamas has left is the usual suspects like Tayyip Erdogan, Iran and those who need Huffpo and Kos to tell them how they should feel

[kalm]

True. And maybe if the israeli's relaxed their occupation and embargo, maybe the Palestinians would stop too.

Dope.

Heres where the typical anti Israel ignorance comes into play

Israel gave Gaza back - there is no occupation there

and of course Hamas immediately began launching rockets at Israel from this newly minted safe haven that Israel gave them (remember the screaming and hair pulling as Israel uprooted Jewish settlers from Gaza to do this)

so Israel has an embargo to limit the influx of weapons and rockets

and then the idiots like you say Israel needs to end a nonexistent occupation and stop an embargo so Hamas wont launch rockets

seriously you and the rest are in Spandos territory on this issue

Just because Hamas fucked up doesn't mean it's not an occupation. If you don't like the word, how would you describe it?

[kalm]

Yep, Hamas is culpable too. But to not see the immorality on both sides is willfully ignorant while the comparison to WWII is just downright

Israel is losing the moral high ground in this and hurting themselves (and us) in the long run.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5629548" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

actually, no they aren't.

most of the world is pretty silent on it this time around because this was 100% precipitated by Hamas

all Hamas has left is the usual suspects like Tayyip Erdogan, Iran and those who need Huffpo and Kos to tell them how they should feel

There's strongly growing resentment world wide. You need to pay attention more.

[BDKJMU]

Heres where the typical anti Israel ignorance comes into play

Israel gave Gaza back - there is no occupation there

and of course Hamas immediately began launching rockets at Israel from this newly minted safe haven that Israel gave them (remember the screaming and hair pulling as Israel uprooted Jewish settlers from Gaza to do this)

so Israel has an embargo to limit the influx of weapons and rockets

and then the idiots like you say Israel needs to end a nonexistent occupation and stop an embargo so Hamas wont launch rockets

seriously you and the rest are in Spandos territory on this issue

Just because Hamas **** up doesn't mean it's not an occupation. If you don't like the word, how would you describe it?

How is it an occupation when Israel gave up the land? Why are you so dense?

[Ivytalk]

actually, no they aren't.

most of the world is pretty silent on it this time around because this was 100% precipitated by Hamas

all Hamas has left is the usual suspects like Tayyip Erdogan, Iran and those who need Huffpo and Kos to

tell them how they should feel

There's strongly growing resentment world wide. You need to pay attention more.

The "world" refuses to acknowledge that Hamas has no redeeming qualities -- none-- and that,while Israel has no desire to exterminate Palestinian civilians, the reverse is not true, at the highest level at least. Hamas and what passes for Arab "leadership" these days (and many of the others as well) want to wipe Israel off the map, and always have. Israel has made its share of mistakes over the years, but it has the
moral high ground in this dispute. And the latent anti-Semites are crawling out of the woodwork: in France, in Germany, in the USA, and right here on this board.

[kalm]

There's strongly growing resentment world wide. You need to pay attention more.

The "world" refuses to acknowledge that Hamas has no redeeming qualities -- none-- and that,while Israel has no desire to exterminate Palestinian civilians, the reverse is not true, at the highest level at least. Hamas and what passes for Arab "leadership" these days (and many of the others as well) want to wipe Israel off the map, and always have. Israel has made its share of mistakes over the years, but it has the
moral high ground in this dispute. And the latent anti-Semites are crawling out of the woodwork: in France, in Germany, in the USA, and right here on this board.

So question Israel's involvement and you're an anti-semite? I have no dog in this fight IT, just asking questions and that's one of the dumbest statements I've seen you make.

You, BDK, and CID might not like the word occupation but:

The U.S. position

The CIA World Factbook says: "West Bank and Gaza Strip are Israeli-occupied with current status subject to the Israeli-Palestinian Interim Agreement -- permanent status to be determined through further negotiation; Israel removed settlers and military personnel from the Gaza Strip in August 2005."

The U.S. State Department Web site also includes Gaza when it discusses the "occupied" territories. State Department spokeswoman Amanda Harper referred CNN Monday to the department's Web site for any questions about the status of Gaza, and she noted that the Web site referred to the 2005 disengagement. When asked the department's position on whether Gaza is still occupied, Harper said she would look into it. She has not yet contacted CNN with any more information.

Israel's supreme court

Israel's court system has dealt with legal questions involving Israel's responsibility for Gaza after the withdrawal in 2005.

In January 2008, the supreme court ruled in a case involving the shipping of fuel into Gaza. "The Israeli Supreme Court determined that since Israel had disengaged from the Gaza Strip it had no effective control over what occurred there," Israel's ministry of foreign affairs says on its Web site. "The judges also determined that Israel had no commitment 'to deal with the welfare of the residents of the Gaza Strip or to allow unlimited amounts of goods and merchandise' to pass through, but only vital and humanitarian goods."

http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/meast ... .question/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Israel still exercises control over the area including for the most part what goes, what goes out, what flies over, etc. If it walks like a duck….

[kalm]

Just because Hamas **** up doesn't mean it's not an occupation. If you don't like the word, how would you describe it?

How is it an occupation when Israel gave up the land? Why are you so dense?

Jesus tap dancing christ in a yamaka, you need to be the last person to ever reach for the dunce smiley.

[kalm]

Joe Scarborough on Thursday had harsh words for Israel’s actions in Gaza, saying the country was engaging in “indiscriminate” killing.
“This is asinine,” said the MSNBC host and former Republican congressman. “This continued killing of women and children in a way that appears to be indiscriminate is asinine.”

Scarborough described himself as having a record as one of Israel’s biggest supporters, saying, “I’ve always been a 100 percent supporter of Israel. The joke in Congress was anytime I wanted a key to the city of Tel Aviv, I could, you know, get a gold-plated one.”
But on Thursday he warned that the mounting civilian death toll was not just tragic for the Palestinians, but harmful both to Israel and the U.S.

“The United States of America — we cannot be associated with this if this continues. This is so bad, not only for the Israeli people, but for us,” Scarborough said.

“The United States of America — we cannot be associated with this if this continues. This is so bad, not only for the Israeli people, but for us,” Scarborough said.

“[A]s much as we all hate Hamas, what is going to replace Hamas is going to be much worse,” he said. “It is going to be a radical Islamist group instead of just power-hungry, corrupt people that despise Israel. This is such a nightmare that is unfolding.”


Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2014/07/j ... z39HMuOrBL" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

What an anti-Semitic lib...eh CID and IT?

[CID1990]

Heres where the typical anti Israel ignorance comes into play

Israel gave Gaza back - there is no occupation there

and of course Hamas immediately began launching rockets at Israel from this newly minted safe haven that Israel gave them (remember the screaming and hair pulling as Israel uprooted Jewish settlers from Gaza to do this)

so Israel has an embargo to limit the influx of weapons and rockets

and then the idiots like you say Israel needs to end a nonexistent occupation and stop an embargo so Hamas wont launch rockets

seriously you and the rest are in Spandos territory on this issue

Just because Hamas **** up doesn't mean it's not an occupation. If you don't like the word, how would you describe it?

there isnt an occupation- Gaza is owned and operated by Hamas- there are ZERO Israelis there until a couple weeks ago when they went in to stop the rocket launches and destroy tunnels that BEGIN IN GAZA AND END IN ISRAEL

why would you just make things up and/or lie?

i am as critical as the next person about Israel but on this issue you arent just wrong, you are intentionally so

[CID1990]

Joe Scarborough on Thursday had harsh words for Israel’s actions in Gaza, saying the country was engaging in “indiscriminate” killing.
“This is asinine,” said the MSNBC host and former Republican congressman. “This continued killing of women and children in a way that appears to be indiscriminate is asinine.”

Scarborough described himself as having a record as one of Israel’s biggest supporters, saying, “I’ve always been a 100 percent supporter of Israel. The joke in Congress was anytime I wanted a key to the city of Tel Aviv, I could, you know, get a gold-plated one.”
But on Thursday he warned that the mounting civilian death toll was not just tragic for the Palestinians, but harmful both to Israel and the U.S.

“The United States of America — we cannot be associated with this if this continues. This is so bad, not only for the Israeli people, but for us,” Scarborough said.

“The United States of America — we cannot be associated with this if this continues. This is so bad, not only for the Israeli people, but for us,” Scarborough said.

“[A]s much as we all hate Hamas, what is going to replace Hamas is going to be much worse,” he said. “It is going to be a radical Islamist group instead of just power-hungry, corrupt people that despise Israel. This is such a nightmare that is unfolding.”


Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2014/07/j ... z39HMuOrBL" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

What an anti-Semitic lib...eh CID and IT?

unlike you, i dont toe ideological lines and am capable of differing with people like Scarborough

you are wrong on this conflict just like he is

[JohnStOnge]

The only solution is the final solution. And that's not just with respect to the Palestinians. It's with respect to all Muslims.

The solution will not be implemented. But it IS the only solution.

And hundreds of years from now it'll be clear that it was a mistake for the Western World, which does have the power to implement it at this time, not to implement it when it had the chance.