So Let's Hear Some Ideas From The Center

[death dealer]

We've heard the proposals from the two distant camps. This is a call out to the truly centrist crowd. Lets talk about a reasonable response to what from my perceptive, is a disturbing escalation in the number and severity of these attacks. Lets leave out emotion. Let's check our fear and loathing at the door and see if we can't come up with some ideas.

[Gil Dobie]

People with diagnosed dis-functional adults/kids in their home, should not have guns in their home, or at least put them in a safe that cannot be open by such people.

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

There isnt room for compromise on this issue.

The 2nd amendment guarantees my RIGHT to keep and bear arms.

They are wrong.

Game over end of story.

[death dealer]

There is no silver bullet cure for an issue this complicated. Banning the manufacture and sale of guns is going to have limited effect if any. Arming teachers is fraught with complications and potential pitfalls. Armed guards will be costly and a hard sell in some areas. Requiring background checks at gun shows might not be convenient, but could be done with a central clearing house. We do it that way when we auction off guns at charity events. We contract out with a third party to do the background checks. We use a local gun dealer who has the system in place. Why couldn't you do something similar at gun swaps and shows? It could be the responsibility of the organizers as part of the set up. That seems like a reasonable concession on gun rights side. It gives a way to close this so called gun show loophole without the burden being placed on the individual vendors. Sort of like when you go to a concert and you get the little bracelet that authorizes you to buy beer. If you intend on buying a gun at the show, you have to submit to a background check that would cover you for the duration of the show. Seems so simple, I can't be the first person to come up with this.

[death dealer]

There isnt room for compromise on this issue.

The 2nd amendment guarantees my RIGHT to keep and bear arms.

They are wrong.

Game over end of story.

I'm not looking for compromise from you alpha. You've said your piece, and you've made some good points.

[death dealer]

And what about the mental illness side of this problem? Let's get going on better handling these patients. We need better treatment, improvement in the system we have now to address these patients before they become a statistic. The layers go so much deeper than which guns should be available to own. Seems we are getting distracted from clearing the forest by staring at the trees.

[Gil Dobie]

And what about the mental illness side of this problem? Let's get going on better handling these patients. We need better treatment, improvement in the system we have now to address these patients before they become a statistic. The layers go so much deeper than which guns should be available to own. Seems we are getting distracted from clearing the forest by staring at the trees.

Exactly, it's like trying to outlaw automobiles because there are some that break the law with them, drive drunk and create statistics.

[mrklean]

If a person in America wants to go to any mall food court and kill a bunch of people, he can. This is the price of living in a free country. Now if you are willing to give up some of your rights to feel safer. But that was tried in 1936 Germany, and we all know how that turned out

[93henfan]

I have no issue with background checks at gun shows. Every weapon I ever purchased required a background check. Other than the rifle I picked up Saturday, the check has never taken more than 10 minutes. Gil's proposal about homes with mental illness would be impossible to enforce, short of some sort of Orwellian monitoring. Diagnosing mental illness is not a gun issue.

[Col Hogan]

The alleged gun show loophole is a red herring...any reputable dealer selling at gun shows does background checks...

Its the average citizen who comes to a show with a weapon to sell face to face with another citizen at the gun show who avoids the checks...

So, for a moment, let us agree to pass a law that says anybody who attends a gun show and makes a purchase must go through a background check...even private sales...

Now, all you'll have is people going outside to their car to make the sale, instead of inside where there is almost always a police presence...

And what about the sale you decide to make to a friend...which is exactly how I got my first gun...I stopped by his house with the cash, signed a bill of sale, and walked out because he knew I could legally possess the weapon...

So, like the AWB which is cosmetic in nature and did not prevent mass shootings during its ten year existence, closing a non-loophole is a feel-good action that will have little to no impact on face to face gun sales...

And just to repeat what 93 said, diagnosing mental illness is not a gun issue...

[kalm]

And just to repeat what 93 said, diagnosing mental illness is not a gun issue...

By that logic, neither are mass killings. I see the point here, but I'm something tells me that it's not exactly realisitic.

[SDHornet]

First time chiming in on this issue. I don't own a gun, but I will whenever I purchase a home (probably sooner than that actually). The bottom line is gun ownership boils down to personal responsibility, which is pretty much what anything in life boils down to. Asking the gov to somehow account for irresponsible people is not the way to go, and that is not its job anyways. Sadly I don't think there is a solution to this problem and I do not want to see my rights taken away because people can't handle their business and I do not want my rights taken away for "the greater good" (that Patriot Act BS is going oh so well).

About the only thing I think should be done is ensuring guns don't get into the hands of people who are looking to do harm via background checks and other similar measures. However that does not include a ban on guns or types of guns people feel aren't needed. Criminals will get their hands on guns one way or another (see Mexico, guns are illegal down there) so the only thing laws will do is punish the law abiding and responsible people. It's a shitty situation and there is no magic bullet (pun intended) solution.

[DSUrocks07]

Possession of a firearm during the committing of a crime/misdemeanor? 5-10 automatic.

Use of a firearm during the committing of a felony? 15 years minimum.

Strengthen the punishment to deterr those type of crimes.

Do away with these "gun free" zones. Allow those employees who have CC permits to carry if they desire. But enforce or make a national law that you must be at least 21 years old to CC.

Any student in possession of a firearm on school property, automatic expulsion.

Have a law that to carry in public, you must have a CC permit.

Sent from my VM670 using Tapatalk 2

[93henfan]

Criminals will get their hands on guns one way or another (see Mexico, guns are illegal down there) so the only thing laws will do is punish the law abiding and responsible people. It's a shitty situation and there is no magic bullet (pun intended) solution.

And while I'm sneaking in another post here on Christmas Eve...

I know that Col and I are not NRA loyalists, even though we are considered "gun nuts" by some here. I can't speak for the Col, but there was one thing about the NRA statements of the last few days that I completely disagree with: some sort of quick national appropriation to place a cop in every school. Screw that. Let each state/municipality handle how they will protect their schools. We don't need another federally mandated increase in the police state.

[93henfan]

Any student in possession of a firearm on school property, automatic expulsion.

I disagree. I think students who are CCW should be able to carry. A 21 year old (VA's age req) student with CCW might have stopped the VA Tech slayer sooner.

[Ibanez]

There isnt room for compromise on this issue.

The 2nd amendment guarantees my RIGHT to keep and bear arms.

They are wrong.

Game over end of story.

Quit being self centered. Nobody wants to take your guns away.

[DSUrocks07]

Any student in possession of a firearm on school property, automatic expulsion.

I disagree. I think students who are CCW should be able to carry. A 21 year old (VA's age req) student with CCW might have stopped the VA Tech slayer sooner.

I was thinking that that would be more along the lines of high school students and below. But I agree with that. Colleges are a different ballgame.

Sent from my VM670 using Tapatalk 2

[BlueHen86]

I would start by trying to educate people. Remind people that owning a gun requires responsibility. Suggest proper ways to store your guns so that they don't into the wrong hands. Educate parents of socially inept children so that they take extra precautions to keep guns way from their kids.

Also, consider having armed staffers in school. Maybe start by polling teachers and administrators to see if any already own a gun and see if any would be willing to carry in school if the proper gun safety training were provided.

Won't solve all of the problems., but might help - and even the NRA would likely be on board.

[ALPHAGRIZ1]

I would start by trying to educate people. Remind people that owning a gun requires responsibility. Suggest proper ways to store your guns so that they don't into the wrong hands. Educate parents of socially inept children so that they take extra precautions to keep guns way from their kids.

Also, consider having armed staffers in school. Maybe start by polling teachers and administrators to see if any already own a gun and see if any would be willing to carry in school if the proper gun safety training were provided.

Won't solve all of the problems., but might help - and even the NRA would likely be on board.

I agree education is the key.

We need gun safety classes in schools starting in 6th grade. Teacher need to be educated so they cant lie to classes like they are right now. Even if it is ignorance its no reason for them to be uninformed.