ASU continues study of possible move to FBS

[Appaholic]

I will say what I said before, I believe it's CUSA or bust. I could be wrong, but it would certainly be counter to everything that has been said thus far. We'll see.

I hope you're right for your sake. SB would be a badddd option.

Agree. I could understand & even support a move to C-USA, but not the SunBelt. Although, if we move to C-USA, i don't harbor the same delusions other App fans are suffering by thinking we'll somehow get a chance to "play against the big boys". We might, but not by a much larger chance than we currently have (see VaTech, LSU, Michigan, et al). We'll be in the football equivalent of a mid-major conference with the biggest difference being in all other D1 sports, there is an opportunity to play for the trophy (see Butler, Goerge Mason, VCU, Northern Iowa) but in football, we'll never get the chance no matter how undefeated we go (see Boise St, TCU, Utah). Let's just hold no grand illusions like we've suddenly "arrived" on the national football scene if invited to the C-USA....we still won't be sitting at the cool kid's table, but we'll be in the same room at least (maybe they'll wave to us)...

[Pwns]

No offense, Appies, but if it's "CUSA or bust" I don't think you guys are going anywhere for a while.

[collegesportsinfo]

Eventually, there is a reality check for all schools and fans. We all know what we want: UMass wants the Big East. So do other eastern schools like App St., Charlotte, even JMU. But the big east isn't a real option for any of us, so we look down the next tier. Charlotte, App St, GA State...all would love a CUSA spot. But it really is a stretch to think that CUSA would open up a coveted FBS spot for an unproven FBS school when they have some decent FBS schools in good markets to look at. This is why UMass and the MAC have had discussions. UMass doesn't WANT to join the MAC, but the reality is that with the FBS conference invite mandate, the MAC is the only option. And that holds true for other schools considering upgrades: in the perfect world, Charlotte, App St or GA St would get CUSa invites. But the odds are very much against that happening. It's not a reflection on those schools, just on the system that exists. So as pwns said, if App st, GA St or Charlotte are holding out for a CUSa invite, it might be a LONG time. And that's why if any of those schools are LUCKY enough to even get a Sun Belt invite, one of the few FBS conference spots even available, then there are only 2 choices: accept it and upgrade and hope to one day get into CUSA/Big East, or pass on it and remain in FCS for what will likely be forever. For UMass, it's the MAC or nothing...we're not expecting CUSA to knock on our doors and say "hey, you guys haven't even played in FBS yet, but here's an invite for you because we're willing to take a chance with our millions of dollars".

[Appaholic]

Eventually, there is a reality check for all schools and fans. We all know what we want: UMass wants the Big East. So do other eastern schools like App St., Charlotte, even JMU. But the big east isn't a real option for any of us, so we look down the next tier. Charlotte, App St, GA State...all would love a CUSA spot. But it really is a stretch to think that CUSA would open up a coveted FBS spot for an unproven FBS school when they have some decent FBS schools in good markets to look at. This is why UMass and the MAC have had discussions. UMass doesn't WANT to join the MAC, but the reality is that with the FBS conference invite mandate, the MAC is the only option. And that holds true for other schools considering upgrades: in the perfect world, Charlotte, App St or GA St would get CUSa invites. But the odds are very much against that happening. It's not a reflection on those schools, just on the system that exists. So as pwns said, if App st, GA St or Charlotte are holding out for a CUSa invite, it might be a LONG time. And that's why if any of those schools are LUCKY enough to even get a Sun Belt invite, one of the few FBS conference spots even available, then there are only 2 choices: accept it and upgrade and hope to one day get into CUSA/Big East, or pass on it and remain in FCS for what will likely be forever. For UMass, it's the MAC or nothing...we're not expecting CUSA to knock on our doors and say "hey, you guys haven't even played in FBS yet, but here's an invite for you because we're willing to take a chance with our millions of dollars".

I agree with your analysis. All the more reason I would understand and support a move to C-USA. I'd even support a move to the MAC as an acknowledgement of the inevitability of moving to FBS. But I draw the line on supporting a move to the Sunbelt. I'm not willing to wallow in the dregs of the Sunbelt (even for the wonderful possibility of going to a BOWL GAME!) and watch App play the same level of football competition they currently have against non-traditional and geogrphically-distant opponents. Just for the "hope" of getting an invite to C-USA in the future in which I may or may not be alive to witness given the decison-making ability of those in the Bowl Chartel / NCAA. Is that selfish? You bet it is....but I see no "shame" in remaining FCS, but I would be ashamed of my alma mater if we went to Sunbelt....

[ASUMountaineer]

Eventually, there is a reality check for all schools and fans. We all know what we want: UMass wants the Big East. So do other eastern schools like App St., Charlotte, even JMU. But the big east isn't a real option for any of us, so we look down the next tier. Charlotte, App St, GA State...all would love a CUSA spot. But it really is a stretch to think that CUSA would open up a coveted FBS spot for an unproven FBS school when they have some decent FBS schools in good markets to look at. This is why UMass and the MAC have had discussions. UMass doesn't WANT to join the MAC, but the reality is that with the FBS conference invite mandate, the MAC is the only option. And that holds true for other schools considering upgrades: in the perfect world, Charlotte, App St or GA St would get CUSa invites. But the odds are very much against that happening. It's not a reflection on those schools, just on the system that exists. So as pwns said, if App st, GA St or Charlotte are holding out for a CUSa invite, it might be a LONG time. And that's why if any of those schools are LUCKY enough to even get a Sun Belt invite, one of the few FBS conference spots even available, then there are only 2 choices: accept it and upgrade and hope to one day get into CUSA/Big East, or pass on it and remain in FCS for what will likely be forever. For UMass, it's the MAC or nothing...we're not expecting CUSA to knock on our doors and say "hey, you guys haven't even played in FBS yet, but here's an invite for you because we're willing to take a chance with our millions of dollars".

Hmm, I hadn't heard that the SunBelt was opening spots. Last I had heard they weren't expanding. I'll defer to your work--it's just news to me.

[Fresno St. Alum]

Eventually, there is a reality check for all schools and fans. We all know what we want: UMass wants the Big East. So do other eastern schools like App St., Charlotte, even JMU. But the big east isn't a real option for any of us, so we look down the next tier. Charlotte, App St, GA State...all would love a CUSA spot. But it really is a stretch to think that CUSA would open up a coveted FBS spot for an unproven FBS school when they have some decent FBS schools in good markets to look at. This is why UMass and the MAC have had discussions. UMass doesn't WANT to join the MAC, but the reality is that with the FBS conference invite mandate, the MAC is the only option. And that holds true for other schools considering upgrades: in the perfect world, Charlotte, App St or GA St would get CUSa invites. But the odds are very much against that happening. It's not a reflection on those schools, just on the system that exists. So as pwns said, if App st, GA St or Charlotte are holding out for a CUSa invite, it might be a LONG time. And that's why if any of those schools are LUCKY enough to even get a Sun Belt invite, one of the few FBS conference spots even available, then there are only 2 choices: accept it and upgrade and hope to one day get into CUSA/Big East, or pass on it and remain in FCS for what will likely be forever. For UMass, it's the MAC or nothing...we're not expecting CUSA to knock on our doors and say "hey, you guys haven't even played in FBS yet, but here's an invite for you because we're willing to take a chance with our millions of dollars".

Hmm, I hadn't heard that the SunBelt was opening spots. Last I had heard they weren't expanding. I'll defer to your work--it's just news to me.

Well they said they are fine with their current membership, but things can always change, they'd be stupid to not accept App St. in the SBC. SBC has 10/11. They may eventually go to a 12/13 if they don't get raided by CUSA, if, if , if anyone joins the BE from CUSA.

[collegesportsinfo]

Eventually, there is a reality check for all schools and fans. We all know what we want: UMass wants the Big East. So do other eastern schools like App St., Charlotte, even JMU. But the big east isn't a real option for any of us, so we look down the next tier. Charlotte, App St, GA State...all would love a CUSA spot. But it really is a stretch to think that CUSA would open up a coveted FBS spot for an unproven FBS school when they have some decent FBS schools in good markets to look at. This is why UMass and the MAC have had discussions. UMass doesn't WANT to join the MAC, but the reality is that with the FBS conference invite mandate, the MAC is the only option. And that holds true for other schools considering upgrades: in the perfect world, Charlotte, App St or GA St would get CUSa invites. But the odds are very much against that happening. It's not a reflection on those schools, just on the system that exists. So as pwns said, if App st, GA St or Charlotte are holding out for a CUSa invite, it might be a LONG time. And that's why if any of those schools are LUCKY enough to even get a Sun Belt invite, one of the few FBS conference spots even available, then there are only 2 choices: accept it and upgrade and hope to one day get into CUSA/Big East, or pass on it and remain in FCS for what will likely be forever. For UMass, it's the MAC or nothing...we're not expecting CUSA to knock on our doors and say "hey, you guys haven't even played in FBS yet, but here's an invite for you because we're willing to take a chance with our millions of dollars".

Hmm, I hadn't heard that the SunBelt was opening spots. Last I had heard they weren't expanding. I'll defer to your work--it's just news to me.

No conference other than the Big East adding 1 more school and the WAC "ARE" expanding. But the established logic right now is that the Big East will expand to 10, the MAC to 14 and that 12 is the understanding for other conferences.

So with the Sunbelt at 10 members, it's the only conference that even has any wiggle room (other than the WAC). So if UMass does join the MAC, then FCS schools like GA State, App St, Charlotte, etc, would have only the WAC and Sunbelt as even potential FBS football options. Because at least the Sunbelt could be approached about expanding by 2 to 12 total members.

But remember, as sad as it might be, the Sunbelt holds the cards...not App St, Charlotte, of GA St. Any FCS school would need to convince the Sunbelt to even invite them. So if any of those school's fans are thinking about FBS, they better get used to the idea of the Sunbelt being a very real option...as it's likely the only FBS option.

[ASUMountaineer]

Hmm, I hadn't heard that the SunBelt was opening spots. Last I had heard they weren't expanding. I'll defer to your work--it's just news to me.

No conference other than the Big East adding 1 more school and the WAC "ARE" expanding. But the established logic right now is that the Big East will expand to 10, the MAC to 14 and that 12 is the understanding for other conferences.

So with the Sunbelt at 10 members, it's the only conference that even has any wiggle room (other than the WAC). So if UMass does join the MAC, then FCS schools like GA State, App St, Charlotte, etc, would have only the WAC and Sunbelt as even potential FBS football options. Because at least the Sunbelt could be approached about expanding by 2 to 12 total members.

But remember, as sad as it might be, the Sunbelt holds the cards...not App St, Charlotte, of GA St. Any FCS school would need to convince the Sunbelt to even invite them. So if any of those school's fans are thinking about FBS, they better get used to the idea of the Sunbelt being a very real option...as it's likely the only FBS option.

Of course the SB holds the cards. Logically, it makes sense that the SB may be ASU's only option. Of course, I haven't seen logic be used in FBS football in a long time. I can only go by what our AD says, and so far he has only indicated that the SB is not an option. We'll see what happens.

Who knows what will happen? How shocked would you be if ASU did, somehow, possibly, maybe get an invite to CUSA? I would be, but I'm holding out hope that if a move is made we're all shocked.

[Appaholic]

No conference other than the Big East adding 1 more school and the WAC "ARE" expanding. But the established logic right now is that the Big East will expand to 10, the MAC to 14 and that 12 is the understanding for other conferences.

So with the Sunbelt at 10 members, it's the only conference that even has any wiggle room (other than the WAC). So if UMass does join the MAC, then FCS schools like GA State, App St, Charlotte, etc, would have only the WAC and Sunbelt as even potential FBS football options. Because at least the Sunbelt could be approached about expanding by 2 to 12 total members.

But remember, as sad as it might be, the Sunbelt holds the cards...not App St, Charlotte, of GA St. Any FCS school would need to convince the Sunbelt to even invite them. So if any of those school's fans are thinking about FBS, they better get used to the idea of the Sunbelt being a very real option...as it's likely the only FBS option.

Of course the SB holds the cards. Logically, it makes sense that the SB may be ASU's only option. Of course, I haven't seen logic be used in FBS football in a long time. I can only go by what our AD says, and so far he has only indicated that the SB is not an option. We'll see what happens.

Who knows what will happen? How shocked would you be if ASU did, somehow, possibly, maybe get an invite to CUSA? I would be, but I'm holding out hope that if a move is made we're all shocked.

Let's hope we are only "shocked" (C-USA invite) and not "shocked & disappointed" (Sunbelt invite & acceptance)...

[ASUMountaineer]

Of course the SB holds the cards. Logically, it makes sense that the SB may be ASU's only option. Of course, I haven't seen logic be used in FBS football in a long time. I can only go by what our AD says, and so far he has only indicated that the SB is not an option. We'll see what happens.

Who knows what will happen? How shocked would you be if ASU did, somehow, possibly, maybe get an invite to CUSA? I would be, but I'm holding out hope that if a move is made we're all shocked.

Let's hope we are only "shocked" (C-USA invite) and not "shocked & disappointed" (Sunbelt invite & acceptance)...

[ASUG8]

Of course the SB holds the cards. Logically, it makes sense that the SB may be ASU's only option. Of course, I haven't seen logic be used in FBS football in a long time. I can only go by what our AD says, and so far he has only indicated that the SB is not an option. We'll see what happens.

Who knows what will happen? How shocked would you be if ASU did, somehow, possibly, maybe get an invite to CUSA? I would be, but I'm holding out hope that if a move is made we're all shocked.

Let's hope we are only "shocked" (C-USA invite) and not "shocked & disappointed" (Sunbelt invite & acceptance)...

If it's a Sunbelt invite and acceptance it will be "shock and awe", as in "I'm shocked! Aw F*&^!!!!!!"

[collegesportsinfo]

As posted in another thread, Sunbelt is looking to add an 11th football team.

http://collegesportsinfo.com/2011/04/07 ... ll-school/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But they are only considering established FBS schools at this time. All signs point to LA Tech as the target. Could also be NMSU. Can't see a CUSa school downgrading and MAC schools also a stretch (leaving tight knit conference for same tier conference with triple the travel costs).

But it excludes any FCs upgrade, so the AppSt/GA St SB haters need not fret. The bad news is if a WAC school goes to the SB, then it's 1 less option for an FCS school in the east to upgrade. WAC could become the Great West of FBs football with schools in the east and west...if the wAC were the only FBs option. Pretty sure that would keep schools in FCS from upgrading

[T-Dog]

I've also heard UAB joining the Sun Belt isn't out the realm of possibility.

[JSU02]

I've also heard UAB joining the Sun Belt isn't out the realm of possibility.

As a UAB alum, the only way that will happen is if the C-USA falls apart. But yes, Wright Waters would love to have them (along with Jax State after we finish our facility upgrades).

[Pigskin Steve]

It seems apparent that someone or a group of schools may need to take on the NCAA head to head.
A best option for App State, JMU, Delaware, UMass, GaSo and some other schools would be to form an FBS conference and play that way. Who were the "FCS administrators" that had that phrase put into the NCAA rules about needing an existing FBS conference invitation? Does anyone know?

[collegesportsinfo]

It seems apparent that someone or a group of schools may need to take on the NCAA head to head.
A best option for App State, JMU, Delaware, UMass, GaSo and some other schools would be to form an FBS conference and play that way. Who were the "FCS administrators" that had that phrase put into the NCAA rules about needing an existing FBS conference invitation? Does anyone know?

I've been banging that drum too. The rules are in place for a reason. But they are not in place to stop an active and organized group from creating something. Big difference between the NCAA stopping D2 schools from upgrading to D1 independence or FCs schools to FBS independence and a united group moving up together.

And that's the first step: communication and organization. The group of schools considering upgrades or capable of upgrades (if it meant being left behind) really need to sit down and talk. Then share their discussions and have a public conversation with the NCAA. And then if the NCAA resists, the group will be able to gain the public support needed to change the NCAA's mind.

You've got a good enough group with UMass, Delaware, JMU, ODU, App St., Charlotte, GA St and GA Southern. That's 8 schools and enough to do it on their own. Temple would likely trade the A10/MAC combo as well for 9 schools. In time, you hope it's strong enough and there's TV revenue to get ECU and MArshall in as well.

[Appaholic]

It seems apparent that someone or a group of schools may need to take on the NCAA head to head.
A best option for App State, JMU, Delaware, UMass, GaSo and some other schools would be to form an FBS conference and play that way. Who were the "FCS administrators" that had that phrase put into the NCAA rules about needing an existing FBS conference invitation? Does anyone know?

I've been banging that drum too. The rules are in place for a reason. But they are not in place to stop an active and organized group from creating something. Big difference between the NCAA stopping D2 schools from upgrading to D1 independence or FCs schools to FBS independence and a united group moving up together.

And that's the first step: communication and organization. The group of schools considering upgrades or capable of upgrades (if it meant being left behind) really need to sit down and talk. Then share their discussions and have a public conversation with the NCAA. And then if the NCAA resists, the group will be able to gain the public support needed to change the NCAA's mind.

You've got a good enough group with UMass, Delaware, JMU, ODU, App St., Charlotte, GA St and GA Southern. That's 8 schools and enough to do it on their own. Temple would likely trade the A10/MAC combo as well for 9 schools. In time, you hope it's strong enough and there's TV revenue to get ECU and MArshall in as well.

I'd rather go that way as well. Outside of C-USA invite (& only because of the ECU/Marshall angle and being an established conf), I coould support a move up with a new conference of traditional FCS rival schools...still hate bowls, but at least the competition as well as the geographical rivalries would be maintained...