ISIS

[kalm]

Somewhat agreed with him until he brought up the christian propaganda. Christians, historically, have been worse and preach intolerance just as vile, just read the bible or listen to a republican politician.

This is what I'm talking about:

Yes, Christians have done violent things. But the point is that if you actually follow the Bible literally according to how the structure of Christianity is designed you're not going to be violent. The structure is such that there are Old and New Testaments. And the New Testament rules are defined by what the Jesus character said i the Gospels and what his disciples said in the other books of the New Testament.

It's pacifist. In fact, my big concern about what would happen if people really followed the instructions of the Jesus character we would not defend ourselves at all. We wouldn't even have a military.

Islam is different. There may be contradictory messages in the Koran but there is NO doubt that that there are instructions to be violent. Just do a Google search on "violent quotes in the Koran."

You could legitimately say that what Christians were doing during the Inquisition was a perversion of Christianity. But what ISIS is doing now is NOT a perversion of Islam. THEY are not the ones "incorrectly" following the instructions. The ones who are trying to fit in by trying to distance themselves form them are.

So 90% of the the Islamic world are shitty Muslims?

[JohnStOnge]

So 90% of the the Islamic world are shitty Muslims?

I think that the fundamental nature of the faith is aggressively violent. Mohammed was a war lord. A military leader. Though a situation eventually developed in which Christianity was essentially spread by force that's not how it started. It started by people going out and converting by persuasion; being willing to be stoned to death, crucified, etc. A very pacifist approach was associated with it gaining its initial foothold.

Not Islam. Islam was, from the beginning, spread by force and conquest. Very direct. It's a different thing.

And my view in that regard has been bolstered by watching/hearing historians in media saying that what we're seeing now from ISIS is basically the way Islam started its spread in the beginning. They're not perverting the religion. They're returning to its origins. Its roots.

[houndawg]

Somewhat agreed with him until he brought up the christian propaganda. Christians, historically, have been worse and preach intolerance just as vile, just read the bible or listen to a republican politician.

This is what I'm talking about:

Yes, Christians have done violent things. But the point is that if you actually follow the Bible literally according to how the structure of Christianity is designed you're not going to be violent. The structure is such that there are Old and New Testaments. And the New Testament rules are defined by what the Jesus character said i the Gospels and what his disciples said in the other books of the New Testament.

It's pacifist. In fact, my big concern about what would happen if people really followed the instructions of the Jesus character we would not defend ourselves at all. We wouldn't even have a military.

Islam is different. There may be contradictory messages in the Koran but there is NO doubt that that there are instructions to be violent. Just do a Google search on "violent quotes in the Koran."

You could legitimately say that what Christians were doing during the Inquisition was a perversion of Christianity. But what ISIS is doing now is NOT a perversion of Islam. THEY are not the ones "incorrectly" following the instructions. The ones who are trying to fit in by trying to distance themselves form them are.

You're such a drama queen, but then most fundamentalists are.


And its funny as hell to listen to you try to push one bunch of superstitious nonsense over equally nonsensical competing superstitions when you spend so much time here trying to present yourself as an evidence-driven realist who simply followed the numbers to his narrow and racist world view.....

[JohnStOnge]

ou're such a drama queen, but then most fundamentalists are.


And its funny as hell to listen to you try to push one bunch of superstitious nonsense over equally nonsensical competing superstitions when you spend so much time here trying to present yourself as an evidence-driven realist who simply followed the numbers to his narrow and racist world view.....

As I"ve told you guys many times before, I am an agnostic. You need to stand back and look at what the two books state. Unless you disagree that it's pretty clear that in Christian theology there is a distinct separation between Old and New Testaments you need to look at what the New Testament in the Bible says and compare the level of violence promoted there to the level of violence promoted in the Koran.

Quran (2:216) – “Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not.”

Find something like that in the New Testament of the Bible and quote if for me. Find the Jesus character of the Bible saying something like that.

[D1B]

Somewhat agreed with him until he brought up the christian propaganda. Christians, historically, have been worse and preach intolerance just as vile, just read the bible or listen to a republican politician.

This is what I'm talking about:

Yes, Christians have done violent things. But the point is that if you actually follow the Bible literally according to how the structure of Christianity is designed you're not going to be violent. The structure is such that there are Old and New Testaments. And the New Testament rules are defined by what the Jesus character said i the Gospels and what his disciples said in the other books of the New Testament.

It's pacifist. In fact, my big concern about what would happen if people really followed the instructions of the Jesus character we would not defend ourselves at all. We wouldn't even have a military.

Islam is different. There may be contradictory messages in the Koran but there is NO doubt that that there are instructions to be violent. Just do a Google search on "violent quotes in the Koran."

You could legitimately say that what Christians were doing during the Inquisition was a perversion of Christianity. But what ISIS is doing now is NOT a perversion of Islam. THEY are not the ones "incorrectly" following the instructions. The ones who are trying to fit in by trying to distance themselves form them are.

1. As a Christian, you cannot disregard the Old Testament.

2. Salvation only through Jesus is as violent of a directive as anything in the Koran.

3. The only reason Christians and catholics are not acting like modern day Muslims anymore is due to the fact people like me keep them in check.

[CID1990]

I totally agree with the board Donks on this.

Christians have done totally heinous things in the name of Jesus, so who are we to judge?

Let ISIS have their fun.

[D1B]

I totally agree with the board Donks on this.

Christians have done totally heinous things in the name of Jesus, so who are we to judge?

Let ISIS have their fun.

Christians are still doing horrible - Iraq, Afghanistan, Ukraine, Vietnam, Cambodia, altar boys, bigotry against gays and non believers....

[DSUrocks07]

I totally agree with the board Donks on this.

Christians have done totally heinous things in the name of Jesus, so who are we to judge?

Let ISIS have their fun.

The muslim world need to keep their own house in order, Egypt and Jordan have already begun this.

We have zero reason to be involved outside of providing support to the sovereign nations who are opposing them directly.

There's a story that Fox is parading about a Army vet who has gone full merc and is fighting in Syria, which i believe is a violation of the Geneva Conventions, against ISIS. And they are playing up the Christians vs Muslims angle big time, because thats whave Ultraconservative News Network does.

Christianity is a peaceful religion, but its followers are some violent motherfuckers.

[CID1990]

I totally agree with the board Donks on this.

Christians have done totally heinous things in the name of Jesus, so who are we to judge?

Let ISIS have their fun.

Christians are still doing horrible - Iraq, Afghanistan, Ukraine, Vietnam, Cambodia, altar boys, bigotry against gays and non believers....

Yep, crucifying kids, burning people alive, beheading

like I said

If our own house isn't in perfect order, then who are we to demand that crucifying children, burning and beheading people should be stopped, much less do anything about it?

So let ISIS have their fun

[D1B]

Christians are still doing horrible - Iraq, Afghanistan, Ukraine, Vietnam, Cambodia, altar boys, bigotry against gays and non believers....

Yep, crucifying kids, burning people alive, beheading

like I said

If our own house isn't in perfect order, then who are we to demand that crucifying children, burning and beheading people should be stopped, much less do anything about it?

So let ISIS have their fun

Yep, invading a country for no reason and killing a few hundred thousand people is in no way as heinous as beheading a few dipshits.

[CID1990]

Yep, crucifying kids, burning people alive, beheading

like I said

If our own house isn't in perfect order, then who are we to demand that crucifying children, burning and beheading people should be stopped, much less do anything about it?

So let ISIS have their fun

Yep, invading a country for no reason and killing a few hundred thousand people is in no way as heinous as beheading a few dipshits.

Especially while carrying a cross in front of your army while yelling "In the name of Jesus" like we did... er nevermind

I thought you were trying to suggest that we invaded Iraq in order to force our version Christianity on them

[Pwns]

And here I thought foreign policy was about the petrodollar and rare Earth elements and Satanburton.

[houndawg]

ISIS is nothing more than the enemy du jour, just like Ebola was before election day.

Now that we're the world's largest producer of oil we don't need to be in the mid-east protecting "our" oil anymore. Bye bye Saudi Arabia, bye bye Israel, bye bye a quarter trillion in defense spending. Wherever are our "lets cut guvmint spending" friends...?

[Skjellyfetti]

As I"ve told you guys many times before, I am an agnostic. You need to stand back and look at what the two books state. Unless you disagree that it's pretty clear that in Christian theology there is a distinct separation between Old and New Testaments you need to look at what the New Testament in the Bible says and compare the level of violence promoted there to the level of violence promoted in the Koran.

Quran (2:216) – “Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not.”

Find something like that in the New Testament of the Bible and quote if for me. Find the Jesus character of the Bible saying something like that.

You're cherry picking. Just like the crazy Islamists cherry pick.

I certainly agree with you that Jesus preached nonviolence. But, you can cherry pick passages from the Bible that paint a different story - just like you do with the Koran.

Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.

Read this. What you really want to criticize is Wahhabism...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabism" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[houndawg]

ou're such a drama queen, but then most fundamentalists are.


And its funny as hell to listen to you try to push one bunch of superstitious nonsense over equally nonsensical competing superstitions when you spend so much time here trying to present yourself as an evidence-driven realist who simply followed the numbers to his narrow and racist world view.....

As I"ve told you guys many times before, I am an agnostic. You need to stand back and look at what the two books state. Unless you disagree that it's pretty clear that in Christian theology there is a distinct separation between Old and New Testaments you need to look at what the New Testament in the Bible says and compare the level of violence promoted there to the level of violence promoted in the Koran.

Quran (2:216) – “Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not.”

Find something like that in the New Testament of the Bible and quote if for me. Find the Jesus character of the Bible saying something like that.

C'mon John, we've all been here a while now, you don't need to lie about your religion.

[Skjellyfetti]

Seriously, I remember him arguing many times that without a God or something equivalent there would be no basis for morality.

[kalm]

So 90% of the the Islamic world are shitty Muslims?

I think that the fundamental nature of the faith is aggressively violent. Mohammed was a war lord. A military leader. Though a situation eventually developed in which Christianity was essentially spread by force that's not how it started. It started by people going out and converting by persuasion; being willing to be stoned to death, crucified, etc. A very pacifist approach was associated with it gaining its initial foothold.

Not Islam. Islam was, from the beginning, spread by force and conquest. Very direct. It's a different thing.

And my view in that regard has been bolstered by watching/hearing historians in media saying that what we're seeing now from ISIS is basically the way Islam started its spread in the beginning. They're not perverting the religion. They're returning to its origins. Its roots.

Are there any muslims worth saving or should we kill all 1.7 billion just to be safe? C'mon, man it's easy to suggest turning the middle east into a parking lot, but I want to see some actual strategy!

[andy7171]

And here I thought foreign policy was about the petrodollar and rare Earth elements and Satanburton.

That is so pre-Obama. It's 2015 already.

[Baldy]

And here I thought foreign policy was about the petrodollar and rare Earth elements and Satanburton.

That is so pre-Obama. It's 2015 already.

Besides, Satanburton is sooooo Bush era. The new boogeyman is The Koch Bros.

[YoUDeeMan]

I totally agree with the board Donks on this.

Christians have done totally heinous things in the name of Jesus, so who are we to judge?

Let ISIS have their fun.

The muslim world need to keep their own house in order, Egypt and Jordan have already begun this.

We have zero reason to be involved outside of providing support to the sovereign nations who are opposing them directly.

There's a story that Fox is parading about a Army vet who has gone full merc and is fighting in Syria, which i believe is a violation of the Geneva Conventions, against ISIS. And they are playing up the Christians vs Muslims angle big time, because thats whave Ultraconservative News Network does.

Christianity is a peaceful religion, but its followers are some violent motherfuckers.

Huh?

"Playing up" the Christians versus Muslins?

The radical Muslins just killed 21 Christians Egyptians in Libya. There is no, "playing up" about it. They specifically targeted them and killed them.

I'm not use if you understand...under Muslinity, Christians can only live in a Muslin world if they pay a special tax and openly accept their subservient position. There really is no way to get around that fact.

[D1B]

Yep, invading a country for no reason and killing a few hundred thousand people is in no way as heinous as beheading a few dipshits.

Especially while carrying a cross in front of your army while yelling "In the name of Jesus" like we did... er nevermind

Bet close to 100% of the people responsible were wearing crosses and were told or brainwashed by a Christian leader - priest, preacher or chaplain that they are doing what God and Jesus want them to do.

[houndawg]

The muslim world need to keep their own house in order, Egypt and Jordan have already begun this.

We have zero reason to be involved outside of providing support to the sovereign nations who are opposing them directly.

There's a story that Fox is parading about a Army vet who has gone full merc and is fighting in Syria, which i believe is a violation of the Geneva Conventions, against ISIS. And they are playing up the Christians vs Muslims angle big time, because thats whave Ultraconservative News Network does.

Christianity is a peaceful religion, but its followers are some violent motherfuckers.

Huh?

"Playing up" the Christians versus Muslins?

The radical Muslins just killed 21 Christians Egyptians in Libya. There is no, "playing up" about it. They specifically targeted them and killed them.

I'm not use if you understand...under Muslinity, Christians can only live in a Muslin world if they pay a special tax and openly accept their subservient position. There really is no way to get around that fact.

Haven't got a bill yet..

[houndawg]

Yep, invading a country for no reason and killing a few hundred thousand people is in no way as heinous as beheading a few dipshits.

Especially while carrying a cross in front of your army while yelling "In the name of Jesus" like we did... er nevermind

I thought you were trying to suggest that we invaded Iraq in order to force our version Christianity on them

wrong crowd...those people stay at home and maintain a vigilant watch for those of insufficient patriotism.

[CAA Flagship]

This is what I'm talking about:

Yes, Christians have done violent things. But the point is that if you actually follow the Bible literally according to how the structure of Christianity is designed you're not going to be violent. The structure is such that there are Old and New Testaments. And the New Testament rules are defined by what the Jesus character said i the Gospels and what his disciples said in the other books of the New Testament.

It's pacifist. In fact, my big concern about what would happen if people really followed the instructions of the Jesus character we would not defend ourselves at all. We wouldn't even have a military.

Islam is different. There may be contradictory messages in the Koran but there is NO doubt that that there are instructions to be violent. Just do a Google search on "violent quotes in the Koran."

You could legitimately say that what Christians were doing during the Inquisition was a perversion of Christianity. But what ISIS is doing now is NOT a perversion of Islam. THEY are not the ones "incorrectly" following the instructions. The ones who are trying to fit in by trying to distance themselves form them are.

1. As a Christian, you cannot disregard the Old Testament.

2. Salvation only through Jesus is as violent of a directive as anything in the Koran.

3. The only reason Christians and catholics are not acting like modern day Muslims anymore is due to the fact people like me keep them in check.

[D1B]

1. As a Christian, you cannot disregard the Old Testament.

2. Salvation only through Jesus is as violent of a directive as anything in the Koran.

3. The only reason Christians and catholics are not acting like modern day Muslims anymore is due to the fact people like me keep them in check.