OK, who ordered the double dip??

[93henfan]

Don't you just love how the oil companies adjust gas prices instantly on bad news (for us) and verrrrrrry sloooooowwllllyyyy on good news?

Gee, one would get the idea that they are in business to make money. Those bastards.

And how: http://money.cnn.com/2011/07/28/news/co ... _earnings/

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Exxon Mobil on Thursday reported a profit of $10.7 billion in the second quarter, up 41% from the prior year, driven in part by higher gas prices.

[OSBF]

no, just a time proven sound investment strategy

and how i'm going to be able to retire at 54 with 500K in a 401 while never making more than 50K/yr

Is $500k in a 401k at retirement really something to trumpet? Even by your earning history, that's like 10 years worth of salary. Are you planning on a short retirement??

Prob "short" by your defination, but I'm not looking to go out and travel around the world, buy 100K cars, or live in a million dollar beach house. When most people my age have saved almost nothing, yeah, I'm damn proud and fortunate to have my half mil. I'll do just fine with that.

If I buy an annuity with an inflation escalator, it pays 4K/month. I can live on that and be happy.

My parents retired with nothing. Never had anything to save. They've been just fine in retirement. I'll be waaaay better off than they were.

[93henfan]

OSBF, you'll be fine with your retirement fund, plus a pension, and SS. Your situation sounds almost identical to my mother, except she never paid into social security under CSRS and therefore doesn't get an SS check. But, my dad does, and they also have his 401K. They're going to be fine.

[OSBF]

OSBF, you'll be fine with your retirement fund, plus a pension, and SS. Your situation sounds almost identical to my mother, except she never paid into social security under CSRS and therefore doesn't get an SS check. But, my dad does, and they also have his 401K. They're going to be fine.

CSRS was a real gravy train. FERS while still pretty good if you were smart about it, isn't nearly as retiree "friendly" as CSRS.

The think most folks don't understand is that FERS employees are entirely responsible for their own retirement. My "pension" isn't going to cover health insurance premiums. My retirement is based on my TSP(401) that I paid into with my own earnings.

My parents retired with nothing but SS, of course they had paid in their whole lives, essentially since the inception of the program. And both worked until they were physically unable to do so(out of necessity). So their checks are pretty good, but that's all they got.

[GannonFan]

Gee, one would get the idea that they are in business to make money. Those bastards.

And how: http://money.cnn.com/2011/07/28/news/co ... _earnings/

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- Exxon Mobil on Thursday reported a profit of $10.7 billion in the second quarter, up 41% from the prior year, driven in part by higher gas prices.

That's $10.7B of profit on $121B of revenue. Sure, $10B in a quarter is really, really nice, but still, that's only an 8%-9% profit margin. It's a volume business. My company makes air filters for pretty much anything that needs an air filter (more like engines, disk drives, and the like - we even make the ePTFE membrane in house) - anything under a 30% profit margin and we quit that business. Granted, we're not making a profit of $10B a quarter, but we don't have those kinds of expenses.

[93henfan]

OSBF, you'll be fine with your retirement fund, plus a pension, and SS. Your situation sounds almost identical to my mother, except she never paid into social security under CSRS and therefore doesn't get an SS check. But, my dad does, and they also have his 401K. They're going to be fine.

CSRS was a real gravy train. FERS while still pretty good if you were smart about it, isn't nearly as retiree "friendly" as CSRS.

The think most folks don't understand is that FERS employees are entirely responsible for their own retirement. My "pension" isn't going to cover health insurance premiums. My retirement is based on my TSP(401) that I paid into with my own earnings.

My parents retired with nothing but SS, of course they had paid in their whole lives, essentially since the inception of the program. And both worked until they were physically unable to do so(out of necessity). So their checks are pretty good, but that's all they got.

Don't knock FERS too badly. I expect a pension somewhere between 30 and 40% of my high three, plus TSP of course. SS - maybe?

[89Hen]

it pays 4K/month. I can live on that and be happy.

Shit, that's my monthly beer budget.

[Ivytalk]

Buy on the dips, baby! That's what my papa said!

[93henfan]

Buy on the dips, baby! That's what my papa said!

But, but, but... how far will it dip?

[danefan]

Buy on the dips, baby! That's what my papa said!

But, but, but... how far will it dip?

Dollar Cost Average.

Its the only way to make money in the market unless you have 15 hrs a day to do research into companies.

[93henfan]

But, but, but... how far will it dip?

Dollar Cost Average.

Its the only way to make money in the market unless you have 15 hrs a day to do research into companies.

Yeah, I mean, I have a regular biweekly contribution set up to my TSP, but I will also do an interfund transfer time and again when I have a hunch about a wild swing in the market. Luckily, I've been right twice, avoiding the major dips in 2008 and also this one by moving out of a stock heavy fund to the federal G fund. I'd just like an opinion on whether not this particular dip is over, as I've avoided the loss, but I'd also like to realize the gain o the tail end.

[danefan]

Dollar Cost Average.

Its the only way to make money in the market unless you have 15 hrs a day to do research into companies.

Yeah, I mean, I have a regular biweekly contribution set up to my TSP, but I will also do an interfund transfer time and again when I have a hunch about a wild swing in the market. Luckily, I've been right twice, avoiding the major dips in 2008 and also this one by moving out of a stock heavy fund to the federal G fund. I'd just like an opinion on whether not this particular dip is over, as I've avoided the loss, but I'd also like to realize the gain o the tail end.

Even e pros don't know. The fundamentals are so f'ed up right now.

[BDKJMU]

A direct and proximate result of those minuscule growth numbers.

Now down 358, over 3% just today. My Roth and brokerage fund taking a beating....

And make that down over 512 points, 4.31 % for the day to 11,383....

[OSBF]

Dollar Cost Average.

Its the only way to make money in the market unless you have 15 hrs a day to do research into companies.

Yeah, I mean, I have a regular biweekly contribution set up to my TSP, but I will also do an interfund transfer time and again when I have a hunch about a wild swing in the market. Luckily, I've been right twice, avoiding the major dips in 2008 and also this one by moving out of a stock heavy fund to the federal G fund. I'd just like an opinion on whether not this particular dip is over, as I've avoided the loss, but I'd also like to realize the gain o the tail end.

I don't mess with doing a bunch of interfund transfers as a general rule. The number I usually jack around with is my contribution amount. When the market is in the shitter I'll ramp up my contribution all i'm possibly able to, and pull back when things start going good again. That way I'm buying shares on the cheap, and am not buying them when they're possibly too high or over-valued.

[blueballs]

And how: http://money.cnn.com/2011/07/28/news/co ... _earnings/

That's $10.7B of profit on $121B of revenue. Sure, $10B in a quarter is really, really nice, but still, that's only an 8%-9% profit margin. It's a volume business. My company makes air filters for pretty much anything that needs an air filter (more like engines, disk drives, and the like - we even make the ePTFE membrane in house) - anything under a 30% profit margin and we quit that business. Granted, we're not making a profit of $10B a quarter, but we don't have those kinds of expenses.

THIS a thousand times over!!!!!!!!

The media and liberal politicians use the "obscene profits" of the oil companies to impugn them in an attempt to a) create even more wealth envy that can be used to drive a overbearing job killing regulatory agenda, and b) further the class warfare theme to create an excuse to raise taxes on corporations and higher income earners.

The average asshole who falls for this rhetoric was never educated on the difference between "profit," "profit margin," and "per share earnings," which is just how the liberals want it and they and their lapdog media expolit it for all it is worth.

[ASUG8]

But, but, but... how far will it dip?

Dollar Cost Average.

Its the only way to make money in the market unless you have 15 hrs a day to do research into companies.

This.

When things tanked in '08, I bumped my 401k up from 10% to 12%. I've been at 15% since May and finally got the wife to bump hers too. I don't mess around with individual stocks, just a number of mutuals. I had our financial advisor (who's managing my rollovers from prior employers) review our 401K choices and recommend an allocation. So far it's working out pretty well.

[ASUG8]

That's $10.7B of profit on $121B of revenue. Sure, $10B in a quarter is really, really nice, but still, that's only an 8%-9% profit margin. It's a volume business. My company makes air filters for pretty much anything that needs an air filter (more like engines, disk drives, and the like - we even make the ePTFE membrane in house) - anything under a 30% profit margin and we quit that business. Granted, we're not making a profit of $10B a quarter, but we don't have those kinds of expenses.

THIS a thousand times over!!!!!!!!

The media and liberal politicians use the "obscene profits" of the oil companies to impugn them in an attempt to a) create even more wealth envy that can be used to drive a overbearing job killing regulatory agenda, and b) further the class warfare theme to create an excuse to raise taxes on corporations and higher income earners.

The average asshole who falls for this rhetoric was never educated on the difference between "profit," "profit margin," and "per share earnings," which is just how the liberals want it and they and their lapdog media expolit it for all it is worth.

Yup, percentages are the great equalizer and the only way to compare between companies. Ten billion is a huge number, but not so much as a percentage of net sales.

[kalm]

That's $10.7B of profit on $121B of revenue. Sure, $10B in a quarter is really, really nice, but still, that's only an 8%-9% profit margin. It's a volume business. My company makes air filters for pretty much anything that needs an air filter (more like engines, disk drives, and the like - we even make the ePTFE membrane in house) - anything under a 30% profit margin and we quit that business. Granted, we're not making a profit of $10B a quarter, but we don't have those kinds of expenses.

THIS a thousand times over!!!!!!!!

The media and liberal politicians use the "obscene profits" of the oil companies to impugn them in an attempt to a) create even more wealth envy that can be used to drive a overbearing job killing regulatory agenda, and b) further the class warfare theme to create an excuse to raise taxes on corporations and higher income earners.

The average asshole who falls for this rhetoric was never educated on the difference between "profit," "profit margin," and "per share earnings," which is just how the liberals want it and they and their lapdog media expolit it for all it is worth.

And they still made $10B in a quarter after externalizing a bunch of the risk. They extract off of public lands, they benefit from subsidized roads and infrastructure, the US Navy protects the shipping lanes...Cry me a socialist river.

[GannonFan]

THIS a thousand times over!!!!!!!!

The media and liberal politicians use the "obscene profits" of the oil companies to impugn them in an attempt to a) create even more wealth envy that can be used to drive a overbearing job killing regulatory agenda, and b) further the class warfare theme to create an excuse to raise taxes on corporations and higher income earners.

The average ******* who falls for this rhetoric was never educated on the difference between "profit," "profit margin," and "per share earnings," which is just how the liberals want it and they and their lapdog media expolit it for all it is worth.

And they still made $10B in a quarter after externalizing a bunch of the risk. They extract off of public lands, they benefit from subsidized roads and infrastructure, the US Navy protects the shipping lanes...Cry me a socialist river.

Everybody externalizes a bunch of risks. I just drove to work today and I benefited from subsidized roads and infrastructure. And the US armed forces are making sure no one is dropping a bomb on me on the way to work. But how does that change the argument? Why is Exxon's 8% profit margin bad while my company's 30%-40% profit margin good? What's an acceptable amount of profit to you?

[BDKJMU]

THIS a thousand times over!!!!!!!!

The media and liberal politicians use the "obscene profits" of the oil companies to impugn them in an attempt to a) create even more wealth envy that can be used to drive a overbearing job killing regulatory agenda, and b) further the class warfare theme to create an excuse to raise taxes on corporations and higher income earners.

The average ******* who falls for this rhetoric was never educated on the difference between "profit," "profit margin," and "per share earnings," which is just how the liberals want it and they and their lapdog media expolit it for all it is worth.

And they still made $10B in a quarter after externalizing a bunch of the risk. They extract off of public lands, they benefit from subsidized roads and infrastructure, the US Navy protects the shipping lanes...Cry me a socialist river.

They benefit from roads and infrastructure, but that is FAR outweighed by the massive profit the govt makes from the massive amounts of royalties and taxes the oil companies pay. They (oil & nat gas industry) provide hundreds of thousands of mostly well paying jobs, which is good for the govt (more tax revenue) & economy, provide a product that is used for cars, planes, tractors, combines, trucks, and literally hundreds of everyday products, again more benefit to our economy. And if the govt got the fuck out of the way and let the oil companies explore off both coasts, in ANWR, and all the other NON National Park public lands, the govt would reap a hell of a lot more in tax revenue and royalties, hundreds of thousands of more jobs would be provided, our economy would reap massive benefits, and we wouldn't have to import as much from a bunch of ragheads over in the Middle East.

[kalm]

And they still made $10B in a quarter after externalizing a bunch of the risk. They extract off of public lands, they benefit from subsidized roads and infrastructure, the US Navy protects the shipping lanes...Cry me a socialist river.

Everybody externalizes a bunch of risks. I just drove to work today and I benefited from subsidized roads and infrastructure. And the US armed forces are making sure no one is dropping a bomb on me on the way to work. But how does that change the argument? Why is Exxon's 8% profit margin bad while my company's 30%-40% profit margin good? What's an acceptable amount of profit to you?

One that doesnt require $billions in subsidies.

I get what your saying but lets all quit pretending for a second that a) big oil is the victim sufferring under the yoke of oppressive government and b) we'd all somehow be better off if government got out of the way. Is all government favorable? No. But as you suggest, everyone including big oil benefits from big government.

[LeadBolt]

Everybody externalizes a bunch of risks. I just drove to work today and I benefited from subsidized roads and infrastructure. And the US armed forces are making sure no one is dropping a bomb on me on the way to work. But how does that change the argument? Why is Exxon's 8% profit margin bad while my company's 30%-40% profit margin good? What's an acceptable amount of profit to you?

One that doesnt require $billions in subsidies.

I get what your saying but lets all quit pretending for a second that a) big oil is the victim sufferring under the yoke of oppressive government and b) we'd all somehow be better off if government got out of the way. Is all government favorable? No. But as you suggest, everyone including big oil benefits from big government.

I'm not sure that building roads and having a military is big government. He didn't claim that big oil was a victim, he responded to your implication that big oil is a victimizer.

[Ivytalk]

I've had the same two stockbrokers for years, and we rely on them to do the research and make the recommendations. We've done just fine by them over the years, so we don't panic.

That said, the macro fundamentals don't look great right now. Lots of individually profitable and well-managed companies, but not many are hiring in the US.

[kalm]

One that doesnt require $billions in subsidies.

I get what your saying but lets all quit pretending for a second that a) big oil is the victim sufferring under the yoke of oppressive government and b) we'd all somehow be better off if government got out of the way. Is all government favorable? No. But as you suggest, everyone including big oil benefits from big government.

I'm not sure that building roads and having a military is big government. He didn't claim that big oil was a victim, he responded to your implication that big oil is a victimizer.

I was only partly speaking to Gannon there. If you were a fisherman in Alaska, Exxon is most certainly a victimizer. And considering the size of our military and infrastructure, a big government cannot be helped.

[GannonFan]

I'm not sure that building roads and having a military is big government. He didn't claim that big oil was a victim, he responded to your implication that big oil is a victimizer.

I was only partly speaking to Gannon there. If you were a fisherman in Alaska, Exxon is most certainly a victimizer. And considering the size of our military and infrastructure, a big government cannot be helped.

But he's right though, I never said that Exxon was suffering under the yoke of an oppressive government. I was only responding to the idea in the thread, and even from you, that Exxon makes too much money. I don't have any problem with the amount of money they make - their profit margins are pretty slim compared to almost any industry out there. Problem is, you can't set up a worldwide business extracting oil from so many different areas and managing that supply chain withouth also putting up massive amounts of money - and really, they get pretty much the same kinds of subsidies that other businesses get - again, it just looks like they get more if you ignore the scale of operation. So the only "yoke" that Big Oil could be suffering under, if you want to use that phrase, could be the threat for government and other interest groups that decide that $10B is too much profit, regardless of what profit margin that represents, and that they should share that wealth.