Immigration "reform"

[Ibanez]

Swing and a miss.

Not at all. Profiling works. And it's done all the time. It's just that there are some "forbidden" areas with respect to its application.

I'm good with profiling. If I'm looking for a person who commits insurance fraud, I'm looking for a white man before anything else. Enforce our laws, untie the hands of Border Control, register those that are here, get them on the path and garnish wages. During this process we can deport criminals and what not.


It's just an idea, but not a complete solution.

[houndawg]

More liberal/progressive speak. Immigration "reform" means "reward people and/or their children who came into the country illegally by allowing them to stay here and eventually become citizens."

It's crap. Nobody who came here illegally should EVER be allowed to stay here. And their children should NOT be allowed either. If anything, if we want to talk about reform, we should be talking about Amending the Constitution so that it's clear that your kid doesn't become a US citizen because you sneak across the border and drop a rug rat here.

What we should be talking about is how we're going to make life as unpleasant as possible for people who are hear illegally so that they don't want to be here. And, yes, we should be talking about every effort to deport however many million there are. This thing about "We can't deport X million people" is nonsense. We don't talk about that with other laws. Like we don't say "We can't arrest X million people who smoke marijuana."

What we CAN do is deport people who are here illegally consistently when we find them. And we can make things unpleasant for those that are here. We can change things so that people who are illegal cannot receive any kinds of benefits, etc. I'm talking about if we had the will and the consensus.

But we don't because we're idiots. Not counting the disgusting Hispanics who are already here who are pushing to have their buddies in as well. I'm talking about the rest of us who are not Hispanic and put up with this crap.

You spend so much time bloviating that you could put to better use if you could just process one simple fact that everybody but the pig-ignurnt wing of the republican party seems to get: Illegals are here to keep wages down for Americans. That's all John. If the guvmint didn't want them here they would lock up a few employers and overnight there would be no jobs for them. Really, you seem ignore the simplest stuff just so you can hear yourself jabber half-wittedly. You really do.

[kalm]

Not at all. Profiling works. And it's done all the time. It's just that there are some "forbidden" areas with respect to its application.

I'm good with profiling. If I'm looking for a person who commits insurance fraud, I'm looking for a white man before anything else. Enforce our laws, untie the hands of Border Control, register those that are here, get them on the path and garnish wages. During this process we can deport criminals and what not.


It's just an idea, but not a complete solution.

How much would it cost to deport them all? How long would it take? Would JSO be willing to raise taxes to do so?

With amnesty you're at least increasing the tax base which would help pay for the education of their disgusting little children.

[CID1990]

So DHS estimates that about half of the 12 million illegal immigrants were orginally here legally. Regardless. Which is wiser: foolishly try to arrest and deport theses people OR have an enrollment period where we advertise: If you are here illegally, go to a certain office, get a from in the mail, etc... to become a citizen. You will become a legal citizen (which means you can now get paid minimum wage and benefits. No more under the table) which also means you'll be a taxpayer. Which means that the IRS will garnish your wages until your immigration fee is paid off (make it reasonable). Which means no more hiding in the shadows.


It may not be a perfect idea, but it's better than rounding them up and sending them off to some country, many of them have never been to b/c they were born here.

I agree, but I don't like the idea of not attaching some kind of stipulations. What kind of message does that send to people who came to America legally?

Precisely. We have 12 million people (which actually translates to at least 24 million) whose defining act leading to their citizenship was to break our laws.

[JohnStOnge]

How much would it cost to deport them all? How long would it take? Would JSO be willing to raise taxes to do so?

With amnesty you're at least increasing the tax base which would help pay for the education of their disgusting little children.

I think if we adopted a comprehensive strategy such as I described, which includes both deportation of illegal aliens when found as well as taking steps to make it as unpleasant as possible for illegals to live here, we would enjoy a net savings. Remember, I said we would not be providing them with any benefits or any access to public support.

Also, I do not think amnesty would result in a net positive as compared to what I propose. I think that If you randomly select a member of the US population, it is more likely than not that the person you select will be one who is a net drain on the system. In other words: What the system spends to support them exceeds what they contribute to the system in taxes. That is the sad reality brought into being by our entitlement State approach.

And I think that is even more the case if you were to grant amnesty then one year later randomly select an individual who was granted that.

[Ivytalk]

Braceros, we hardly knew ye.

And Operation Wetback was a failure.

[JohnStOnge]

You spend so much time bloviating that you could put to better use if you could just process one simple fact that everybody but the pig-ignurnt wing of the republican party seems to get: Illegals are here to keep wages down for Americans. That's all John. If the guvmint didn't want them here they would lock up a few employers and overnight there would be no jobs for them. Really, you seem ignore the simplest stuff just so you can hear yourself jabber half-wittedly. You really do.

Illegals are not here for the purpose of keeping wages down for Americans. Yes, people hire them because they can get them for cheap. But they're not thinking, "Let's keep wages down for Americans." They're just thinking, "I can get this labor for cheap."

I have no objection to going after employers for knowingly hiring illegal aliens. And there are laws in place for doing that. But do remember that illegal aliens frequently obtain false paperwork. Employers should not be burdened with having to do Federal law enforcement's job in identifying people who are here illegally.

Focusing on employers is basically trying to change the subject. The primary violation is on the part of people coming into the country illegally. The "go after the employers" thing is classic populism. But it's diverting attention from the real "villains;" which are the people coming into the country illegally.

[BDKJMU]

I think it's great that we have a country that people want to move to and live in. I also don't care how they get here, if they want to become citizens and have no hidden agenda's, welcome to America. If immigrants fail to obey the law after becoming citizens, they will be treated like citizens and required to take responsibility for their actions. Stories that lump a certain group into a category, smells very much like racism or bigotry.

So you're for open borders then? Any of the the other close to 7 billion people who want to come here can?

[houndawg]

I'm good with profiling. If I'm looking for a person who commits insurance fraud, I'm looking for a white man before anything else. Enforce our laws, untie the hands of Border Control, register those that are here, get them on the path and garnish wages. During this process we can deport criminals and what not.


It's just an idea, but not a complete solution.

How much would it cost to deport them all? How long would it take? Would JSO be willing to raise taxes to do so?

With amnesty you're at least increasing the tax base which would help pay for the education of their disgusting little children.

And when they get older they can go to college in Germany for free!

[houndawg]

You spend so much time bloviating that you could put to better use if you could just process one simple fact that everybody but the pig-ignurnt wing of the republican party seems to get: Illegals are here to keep wages down for Americans. That's all John. If the guvmint didn't want them here they would lock up a few employers and overnight there would be no jobs for them. Really, you seem ignore the simplest stuff just so you can hear yourself jabber half-wittedly. You really do.

Illegals are not here for the purpose of keeping wages down for Americans. Yes, people hire them because they can get them for cheap. But they're not thinking, "Let's keep wages down for Americans." They're just thinking, "I can get this labor for cheap."

I have no objection to going after employers for knowingly hiring illegal aliens. And there are laws in place for doing that. But do remember that illegal aliens frequently obtain false paperwork. Employers should not be burdened with having to do Federal law enforcement's job in identifying people who are here illegally.

Focusing on employers is basically trying to change the subject. The primary violation is on the part of people coming into the country illegally. The "go after the employers" thing is classic populism. But it's diverting attention from the real "villains;" which are the people coming into the country illegally.

Wrong.

Focusing on employers is focusing on the reason illegals are coming here.

Lock up the criminals that are paying the illegals. They won't come if there aren't any jobs.

[JohnStOnge]

Focusing on employers is focusing on the reason illegals are coming here.

Lock up the criminals that are paying the illegals. They won't come if there aren't any jobs.

As I said, if employers knowingly hire illegals hold them accountable. But don't expect potential employers to do the Federal government's job by holding them responsible for determining whether or not potential employees are here illegally or not. And especially don't do it while holding a hammer over their head to make sure they don't discriminate based on ethnicity.

Meanwhile, when someone is identified as here illegally they should be immediately deported. Actually if I had my way they'd be executed as that would provide a deterrent to people trying to do it. You know: If you're caught being in the United States illegally you're dead. That would have an effect. But I know that won't happen.

[Ibanez]

Focusing on employers is focusing on the reason illegals are coming here.

Lock up the criminals that are paying the illegals. They won't come if there aren't any jobs.

As I said, if employers knowingly hire illegals hold them accountable. But don't expect potential employers to do the Federal government's job by holding them responsible for determining whether or not potential employees are here illegally or not. And especially don't do it while holding a hammer over their head to make sure they don't discriminate based on ethnicity.

Meanwhile, when someone is identified as here illegally they should be immediately deported. Actually if I had my way they'd be executed as that would provide a deterrent to people trying to do it. You know: If you're caught being in the United States illegally you're dead. That would have an effect. But I know that won't happen.

Every job i've ever had, I had to provide proof of citizenship. I've had to fill out tax forms for payroll. Something tells me, that employers are either being duped AND/OR hiring illegal immigrants and paying them under the table. Immigrants are the same way, work visas, green cards, etc.. must be produced. Employers aren't dumb. They know.

[kalm]

As I said, if employers knowingly hire illegals hold them accountable. But don't expect potential employers to do the Federal government's job by holding them responsible for determining whether or not potential employees are here illegally or not. And especially don't do it while holding a hammer over their head to make sure they don't discriminate based on ethnicity.

Meanwhile, when someone is identified as here illegally they should be immediately deported. Actually if I had my way they'd be executed as that would provide a deterrent to people trying to do it. You know: If you're caught being in the United States illegally you're dead. That would have an effect. But I know that won't happen.

Every job i've ever had, I had to provide proof of citizenship. I've had to fill out tax forms for payroll. Something tells me, that employers are either being duped AND/OR hiring illegal immigrants and paying them under the table. Immigrants are the same way, work visas, green cards, etc.. must be produced. Employers aren't dumb. They know.

In Washington State, kids have to have their parents and a school official sign a minor work permit.