"Yes" Means Prove It

[travelinman67]

Washington State Supreme Court rules burden of proof lies with accuser.

http://m.washingtonexaminer.com/due-pro ... le/2555557

[Chizzang]

Washington State Supreme Court rules burden of proof lies with accuser.

http://m.washingtonexaminer.com/due-pro ... le/2555557

What's your point..?

[CID1990]

Hasn't that always been the case?

[travelinman67]

Hasn't that always been the case?

Under the recent passage (trend) of "Yes means Yes" laws, the burden was placed upon the accused (rape/sex assault cases) to prove they had affirmatively obtained consent. The court decision effectively nullifies the "Yes means Yes" laws (as well as other laws that attempt to employ that method).

[Pwns]

Our constitution is a weapon in the War on Wimmyn™.

[Ibanez]

Hasn't that always been the case?

Yes, this is nothing new.

[Grizalltheway]

Hasn't that always been the case?

Yes, this is nothing new.

Read the damn article.

[kalm]

"If no meant no, we'd all die virgins. No doesn't mean no. No means try the neck, the nipples, and get back to me in 5 minutes"

- Tosh

[Ibanez]

Yes, this is nothing new.

Read the damn article.

I did. I interpreted CIDs post to be differently, apparently. It appears now in Washington that SE174 can accuse you of raping him, and his job is done. That sounds illogical to me. If you accuse me of wrongdoing, you should prove it. That's how things work. If we go around accusing people and not providing evidence, how can anyone truly get justice?

[Grizalltheway]

Read the damn article.

I did. I interpreted CIDs post to be differently, apparently. It appears now in Washington that SE174 can accuse you of raping him, and his job is done. That sounds illogical to me. If you accuse me of wrongdoing, you should prove it. That's how things work. If we go around accusing people and not providing evidence, how can anyone truly get justice?

Apparently you didn't, or that southern edumucation is kicking in.

The Washington Supreme Court ruled Thursday that those accused of rape are not responsible for proving they obtained consent.

"Requiring a defendant to do more than raise a reasonable doubt is inconsistent with due process principles," wrote Justice Debra Stephens. She added that doing so raised "a very real possibility of wrongful convictions.

[andy7171]

JFC Go back to bed Raul. You are getting your ass handed to you by WTAG!

[Ibanez]

I did. I interpreted CIDs post to be differently, apparently. It appears now in Washington that SE174 can accuse you of raping him, and his job is done. That sounds illogical to me. If you accuse me of wrongdoing, you should prove it. That's how things work. If we go around accusing people and not providing evidence, how can anyone truly get justice?

Apparently you didn't, or that southern edumucation is kicking in.

The Washington Supreme Court ruled Thursday that those accused of rape are not responsible for proving they obtained consent.

"Requiring a defendant to do more than raise a reasonable doubt is inconsistent with due process principles," wrote Justice Debra Stephens. She added that doing so raised "a very real possibility of wrongful convictions.

Shit. My bad. In my defense, I am running on very little sleep.

[Ibanez]

JFC Go back to bed Raul. You are getting your ass handed to you by WTAG!

Fucking embarrassing.

[Grizalltheway]

JFC Go back to bed Raul. You are getting your ass handed to you by WTAG!

Fucking embarrassing.

Don't take it too hard. It happens to everyone eventually.

[Ibanez]

Fucking embarrassing.

Don't take it too hard. It happens to everyone eventually.

I don't. I'm day dreaming about getting 4-5 continuous hours of sleep. I can't sleep through all the feedings, diaper changes and screaming. My wife should really get some help.

[YoUDeeMan]

Don't take it too hard. It happens to everyone eventually.

I don't. I'm day dreaming about getting 4-5 continuous hours of sleep. I can't sleep through all the feedings, diaper changes and screaming. My wife should really get some help.

SCBH can probably lend Dan to your wife for a couple weeks.

[Ibanez]

I don't. I'm day dreaming about getting 4-5 continuous hours of sleep. I can't sleep through all the feedings, diaper changes and screaming. My wife should really get some help.

SCBH can probably lend Dan to your wife for a couple weeks.

Haha. Dan.

[CID1990]

Yes, this is nothing new.

Read the damn article.

What, are you saying the title in the link "burden of proof lies on the accuser"

and the thread title:

"Washington State Supreme Court rules burden of proof lies with accuser"

are somehow not accurate?

and so what I said is not accurate?

[Grizalltheway]

Read the damn article.

What, are you saying the title in the link "burden of proof lies on the accuser"

and the thread title:

"Washington State Supreme Court rules burden of proof lies with accuser"

are somehow not accurate?

and so what I said is not accurate?

As it pertains to the law in Washingston state since 1975, no, your statement of "hasn't that always been the case" was not accurate.

The Washington Supreme Court ruled Thursday that those accused of rape are not responsible for proving they obtained consent. In a 6-3 ruling, the court said that requiring the accused to provide such proof to the preponderance of evidence standard violated constitutional rights.

[Chizzang]

For a little historical update gentlemen,
There have been a few Key Rape convictions that have now been shown to be false convictions
some years later - and the state has grown tired of innocents being jailed in matters such as these

Better a thousand guilty go free than one innocent be sentenced...
This has been a long time coming and a few recent cases have come to light - pushing the issue

[HI54UNI]

The disturbing thing is that 3 judges didn't agree with this decision......

[JohnStOnge]

I think that the bottom line is that it IS true that when it comes to rape the situation had evolved into one in which the accused effectively had to prove himself innocent and also was not allowed to do things like call the credibility and/or character of his accuser into question. If this means some movement in the other direction in one State that is a good thing.

Typically you hear stuff about the "victim." Well, we don't know they're the "victim." That they're a "victim" should have to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. And we've had this thing develop whereby they're considered the "victim" before the trial even starts.

[Chizzang]

I think that the bottom line is that it IS true that when it comes to rape the situation had evolved into one in which the accused effectively had to prove himself innocent and also was not allowed to do things like call the credibility and/or character of his accuser into question. If this means some movement in the other direction in one State that is a good thing.

Typically you hear stuff about the "victim." Well, we don't know they're the "victim." That they're a "victim" should have to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. And we've had this thing develop whereby they're considered the "victim" before the trial even starts.

You might actually like the local government here Johnny...
For a bunch of godless hippies and uppity women

They encourage the local police forces to "do less"
They legalized Marijuana
They have more successful small businesses than any other state in the union
Which is interesting because Washington state is ranked as B- for small business friendly - yet - the state leads the union in Small Businesses and start ups

For example:
Breweries and Distilleries
Bakeries and Coffee Shops
Etc. etc.

[travelinman67]

I think that the bottom line is that it IS true that when it comes to rape the situation had evolved into one in which the accused effectively had to prove himself innocent and also was not allowed to do things like call the credibility and/or character of his accuser into question. If this means some movement in the other direction in one State that is a good thing.

Typically you hear stuff about the "victim." Well, we don't know they're the "victim." That they're a "victim" should have to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. And we've had this thing develop whereby they're considered the "victim" before the trial even starts.

You might actually like the local government here Johnny...
For a bunch of godless hippies and uppity women

They encourage the local police forces to "do less"
They legalized Marijuana
They have more successful small businesses than any other state in the union
Which is interesting because Washington state is ranked as B- for small business friendly - yet - the state leads the union in Small Businesses and start ups

For example:
Breweries and Distilleries
Bakeries and Coffee Shops
Etc. etc.

Amazing what can happen with laissez faire govt., unlimited cheap water, cheap energy, abundant agriculture, and a strong egalitarian ethic.

[Chizzang]

You might actually like the local government here Johnny...
For a bunch of godless hippies and uppity women

They encourage the local police forces to "do less"
They legalized Marijuana
They have more successful small businesses than any other state in the union
Which is interesting because Washington state is ranked as B- for small business friendly - yet - the state leads the union in Small Businesses and start ups

For example:
Breweries and Distilleries
Bakeries and Coffee Shops
Etc. etc.

Amazing what can happen with laissez faire govt., unlimited cheap water, cheap energy, abundant agriculture, and a strong egalitarian ethic.

And Hippies... don't forget the Hippies