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Gil Dobie wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 3:34 am What is the Hall of Fame member line-up you saw play live or on TV, prior to your graduation from High School. Must be Hall of Famers

CF Willie Mays
RF Roberto Clemente
LF Hank Aaron
1B Mickey Mantle
2B Rod Carew
3B Brooks Robinson
SS Luis Aparicio
C Johnny Bench
RHP Bob Gibson
LHP Steve Carlton
R Hoyt Wilhelm

AZGrizFan wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 8:04 am

Gil Dobie wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 3:34 am What is the Hall of Fame member line-up you saw play live or on TV, prior to your graduation from High School. Must be Hall of Famers

CF Willie Mays
RF Roberto Clemente
LF Hank Aaron
1B Mickey Mantle
2B Rod Carew
3B Brooks Robinson
SS Luis Aparicio
C Johnny Bench
RHP Bob Gibson
LHP Steve Carlton
R Hoyt Wilhelm

Well mine would look a lot like yours, but I’d make a few changes:

I’d swap out Sandy Koufax for Steve Carlton
I’d swap out Ernie Banks for Luis Aparicio
Probably take Carlton Fisk over Johnny Bench
Fan Favorite: I’d take Willy McCovey over Mantle
Tough call at 3rd between Robinson and Mike Schmidt for me
And I’d go with Goose Gossage over Wilhelm as a reliever

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 11:21 am

AZGrizFan wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 8:04 am

Well mine would look a lot like yours, but I’d make a few changes:

I’d swap out Sandy Koufax for Steve Carlton
I’d swap out Ernie Banks for Luis Aparicio
Probably take Carlton Fisk over Johnny Bench
Fan Favorite: I’d take Willy McCovey over Mantle
Tough call at 3rd between Robinson and Mike Schmidt for me
And I’d go with Goose Gossage over Wilhelm as a reliever

I never really understand that. Both are obviously great ballplayers (think both have one WS MVP to their credit as well, although Schmidt had more league MVP's), no doubt, but the slight edge in fielding that Brooks has (and it's slight - remember, Schmidt had 10 gold gloves of his own in a shorter career at 3rd) is trumped by Schmidt's far better numbers at the plate (think they ended up with the same average, but Schmidt is something like 200 points better in OPS thanks to more than 2x the number of HR's).

JALMOND wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 9:08 am CF Kirby Puckett (started when I was in jr high school so he counts)
RF Reggie Jackson
LF Hank Aaron
1B Tony Perez
2B Rod Carew
SS Alan Trammell
3B Pete Rose (not in the Hall of Fame on a technicality, The best baseball player I've seen, period).
RHP Nolan Ryan
LHP Tommy John
R Rollie Fingers
C Johnny Bench

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 11:56 am

JALMOND wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 9:08 am CF Kirby Puckett (started when I was in jr high school so he counts)
RF Reggie Jackson
LF Hank Aaron
1B Tony Perez
2B Rod Carew
SS Alan Trammell
3B Pete Rose (not in the Hall of Fame on a technicality, The best baseball player I've seen, period).
RHP Nolan Ryan
LHP Tommy John
R Rollie Fingers
C Johnny Bench

I thought about putting Pete Rose in too, even with the HOF criteria. But 3B? He played full time 3B for like 4 years in his 24 season career. When he won his GG he was in the outfield. I know he moved around a ton (to his credit to be capable of playing at a high level at lots of spots) but 3B was probably his shortest tenure at any one position.

SuperHornet wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 10:48 pm OK, so I'm kinda stretching the rules here a bit since while I know you MEANT Cooperstown, you didn't exactly specify that. But how my favorite modern pitcher isn't in the Hall after being a 3x All-Star, winning the World Series, the Cy Young, the Gold Glove and World Series MVP in the same year, a Silver Slugger award, throwing a record 59 straight scoreless innings, AND throwing a complete game victory one night and getting the save on another night in the World Series. How is that not enough?!? SMH....

LF Rickey Henderson
RF Tony Gwynn
1B Pete Rose*
C Johnny Bench
3B Mike Schmidt
2B Joe Morgan
SS Ozzie Smith
RHP Nolan Ryan
LHP Fernando Valenzuela**
Closer Bruce Sutter

*WWE HoF
**Mexican Baseball HoF

AZGrizFan wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 8:04 am

Gil Dobie wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 3:34 am What is the Hall of Fame member line-up you saw play live or on TV, prior to your graduation from High School. Must be Hall of Famers

CF Willie Mays
RF Roberto Clemente
LF Hank Aaron
1B Mickey Mantle
2B Rod Carew
3B Brooks Robinson
SS Luis Aparicio
C Johnny Bench
RHP Bob Gibson
LHP Steve Carlton
R Hoyt Wilhelm

Well mine would look a lot like yours, but I’d make a few changes:

I’d swap out Sandy Koufax for Steve Carlton
I’d swap out Ernie Banks for Luis Aparicio
Probably take Carlton Fisk over Johnny Bench
Fan Favorite: I’d take Willy McCovey over Mantle
Tough call at 3rd between Robinson and Mike Schmidt for me
And I’d go with Goose Gossage over Wilhelm as a reliever

Gil Dobie wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 4:40 pm

AZGrizFan wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 8:04 am

Well mine would look a lot like yours, but I’d make a few changes:

I’d swap out Sandy Koufax for Steve Carlton
I’d swap out Ernie Banks for Luis Aparicio
Probably take Carlton Fisk over Johnny Bench
Fan Favorite: I’d take Willy McCovey over Mantle
Tough call at 3rd between Robinson and Mike Schmidt for me
And I’d go with Goose Gossage over Wilhelm as a reliever

I never say Koufax play, and Ernie was playing 1b when I watched him, but both are great choices. Schmidt and Goose were still young punks back then too, so I picked who was better at the time. McCovey was probably better than Mantle at the time, but Mantle was a legend. One player that was tough to leave off the list was Frank Robinson. Nolan Ryan not so much, at that time, Seaver was better. In 1972, Steve Carlton won 27 games out of the 59 the Phillies won, with a 1.97 ERA and 310 k's.

GannonFan wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 6:48 am

SuperHornet wrote: ↑Fri Aug 19, 2022 10:48 pm OK, so I'm kinda stretching the rules here a bit since while I know you MEANT Cooperstown, you didn't exactly specify that. But how my favorite modern pitcher isn't in the Hall after being a 3x All-Star, winning the World Series, the Cy Young, the Gold Glove and World Series MVP in the same year, a Silver Slugger award, throwing a record 59 straight scoreless innings, AND throwing a complete game victory one night and getting the save on another night in the World Series. How is that not enough?!? SMH....

LF Rickey Henderson
RF Tony Gwynn
1B Pete Rose*
C Johnny Bench
3B Mike Schmidt
2B Joe Morgan
SS Ozzie Smith
RHP Nolan Ryan
LHP Fernando Valenzuela**
Closer Bruce Sutter

*WWE HoF
**Mexican Baseball HoF

Fernando didn't win the GG in his rookie year, that came several years later.

He had a great rookie year, then pretty good the next 4-5 years, and then just cratered from there for his remaining 12 years of baseball. He got fat, which didn't help either. After the mid-1980's, he was just a pitcher who used to be good.

AZGrizFan wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 5:58 pm

Gil Dobie wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 4:40 pm

I never say Koufax play, and Ernie was playing 1b when I watched him, but both are great choices. Schmidt and Goose were still young punks back then too, so I picked who was better at the time. McCovey was probably better than Mantle at the time, but Mantle was a legend. One player that was tough to leave off the list was Frank Robinson. Nolan Ryan not so much, at that time, Seaver was better. In 1972, Steve Carlton won 27 games out of the 59 the Phillies won, with a 1.97 ERA and 310 k's.

I took your instructions a bit differently, but it’s all for discussion purposes.

Look up Nolan Ryan’s stats with the hapless Angels. NINE times on 1974 gave up 3 runs or less and lost. Holds 51 MLB records. Most no hitters. Most one hitters. Most two hitters. Most strikeouts. He NEVER played on a good/great team, and it cost him a number of Cy Youngs.

Gil Dobie wrote: ↑Tue Aug 23, 2022 5:07 am

AZGrizFan wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 5:58 pm

I took your instructions a bit differently, but it’s all for discussion purposes.

Look up Nolan Ryan’s stats with the hapless Angels. NINE times on 1974 gave up 3 runs or less and lost. Holds 51 MLB records. Most no hitters. Most one hitters. Most two hitters. Most strikeouts. He NEVER played on a good/great team, and it cost him a number of Cy Youngs.

Saw Gibson strikeout 17 of my Tigers in a World Series game, and his 1968 season. Gibson finished with more complete games than Ryan, having played 10 less seasons. Even Willie Mays would not dig in at homepage against Gibson. That being said, Ryan would be on my 5 man pitching rotation. Add Seaver, Marichal and Kaat for a 2nd lefty.

AZGrizFan wrote: ↑Tue Aug 23, 2022 7:03 am

Gil Dobie wrote: ↑Tue Aug 23, 2022 5:07 am

Saw Gibson strikeout 17 of my Tigers in a World Series game, and his 1968 season. Gibson finished with more complete games than Ryan, having played 10 less seasons. Even Willie Mays would not dig in at homepage against Gibson. That being said, Ryan would be on my 5 man pitching rotation. Add Seaver, Marichal and Kaat for a 2nd lefty.

If Sandy Koufax isn't on your 5-man rotation you're gonna lose.