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But you know who else noticed what Delany and Slive had to say last week? Guys like Charlie Cobb.

Cobb is the athletic director at Appalachian State University, one of the very best programs in Division I-AA (due to public confusion over the labels, we don't use the official NCAA designations FBS and FCS). The Mountaineers of Jerry Moore won three straight national championships from 2005-2007 and have led the nation in Division I-AA attendance (at 28,000-plus) three times in the last four years.

In case you are wondering, in 2010 a total of 32 of the 120 Division I-A teams averaged less in home attendance than Appalachian State. In fact, 23 Division I-A schools averaged less than 20,000 in attendance last season.

"When we look at the WAC, the MAC, the Sun Belt and the others we compare very favorably to what they are doing," Cobb said. "So we decided that if things change dramatically we need to be prepared."

So when all the smoke clears your divisions in college football for the 2014 regular season would be:

The College Football Association (CFA): ACC, SEC, Big Ten, Big 12, Big East, Pac-12, Army, Navy, Notre Dame, and BYU.

Division I-A: Mountain West, WAC, Mid-American, Conference USA, Sun Belt, Big Sky, CAA, Missouri Valley, Ohio Valley, Southern, Southland, Charlotte (Independent)

Division I-AA: Big South, Ivy, MEAC, Northeast, Patriot, Pioneer, SWAC, Fordham (Independent)

Division II

Division III

I think this guy may be onto something....as I posted on egriz, as a Griz fan I like the concept. We move up a level as a conference (much less disruptive), gain significantly more Western U.S. opponents (Idaho, BSU, Utah State, Wyoming, Colorado State, SJS, Fresno State, Nevada, Air Force, San Diego State, UNLV) and still have a playoff to determine the eventual champion.

Your thread title is better, though.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=23911" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

HA HA, what a dumbfuck....

Skjellyfetti wrote:

Your thread title is better, though.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=23911" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That thread looked so boring I never even opened it up to see what it was about...so fuckin' sue me.

And JBB can suck your little smokies dick while you're suing me.

I could handle this.

This may be reasonable on premise, but probably not in practice.

How would the new I-A schools integrate the differences in scholarships? What about Title IX concerns (which are the biggest impedement to "moving up." Football pays the bills, but other programs spend all the money)? What happens to schools from present FCS conferences that would move to I-A that couldn't afford the difference (and I'd be willing to bet it would be a LOT)?

Stupid Title IX.

LDopaPDX wrote:This may be reasonable on premise, but probably not in practice.

How would the new I-A schools integrate the differences in scholarships? What about Title IX concerns (which are the biggest impedement to "moving up." Football pays the bills, but other programs spend all the money)? What happens to schools from present FCS conferences that would move to I-A that couldn't afford the difference (and I'd be willing to bet it would be a LOT)?

I would say the SunBelts of the world would trim schollies to go to the FCS full schollie model, if it is clear they will be shut out of the bowls/money games. They are bleeding money as it is.


BTW, there is no way in h*** Boise State moves down at this point. Someone like the Big 12 would dump Iowa State for BSU if this scenario played out

Vidav wrote:Stupid Title IX.

Do you have something against women's pole vaulting? I think Andy might want a word with you.

Trapped in CA wrote:

LDopaPDX wrote:This may be reasonable on premise, but probably not in practice.

How would the new I-A schools integrate the differences in scholarships? What about Title IX concerns (which are the biggest impedement to "moving up." Football pays the bills, but other programs spend all the money)? What happens to schools from present FCS conferences that would move to I-A that couldn't afford the difference (and I'd be willing to bet it would be a LOT)?

I would say the SunBelts of the world would trim schollies to go to the FCS full schollie model, if it is clear they will be shut out of the bowls/money games. They are bleeding money as it is.


BTW, there is no way in h*** Boise State moves down at this point. Someone like the Big 12 would dump Iowa State for BSU if this scenario played out

I would agree with that statement. Or the Pac-12 dropping Wazzu and picking them up ( ).

And the same is true for some of the schools at the I-AA level...while it's convenient to think conferences would "move up" as a whole, it depends on the financial implications and how it's structured...because if all of the BSC were required to go to 85 schollies, there's about 8 teams that would say thanks but no thanks.

AZGrizFan wrote:

Trapped in CA wrote:
I would say the SunBelts of the world would trim schollies to go to the FCS full schollie model, if it is clear they will be shut out of the bowls/money games. They are bleeding money as it is.


BTW, there is no way in h*** Boise State moves down at this point. Someone like the Big 12 would dump Iowa State for BSU if this scenario played out

I would agree with that statement. Or the Pac-12 dropping Wazzu and picking them up ( ).

And the same is true for some of the schools at the I-AA level...while it's convenient to think conferences would "move up" as a whole, it depends on the financial implications and how it's structured...because if all of the BSC were required to go to 85 schollies, there's about 8 teams that would say thanks but no thanks.

I would imagine the I-A would be less than 85 schollies.

Under this scenario, there would be huge pressure on the CFA to include the MWC.
MWC is closer to the Big 6 (and better than the Big East) than the other conferences.

dbackjon wrote:

AZGrizFan wrote:
I would agree with that statement. Or the Pac-12 dropping Wazzu and picking them up ( ).

And the same is true for some of the schools at the I-AA level...while it's convenient to think conferences would "move up" as a whole, it depends on the financial implications and how it's structured...because if all of the BSC were required to go to 85 schollies, there's about 8 teams that would say thanks but no thanks.

I would imagine the I-A would be less than 85 schollies.

Under this scenario, there would be huge pressure on the CFA to include the MWC.
MWC is closer to the Big 6 (and better than the Big East) than the other conferences.

Once the BCS contract runs out, is there any requirement for the "Big 6" to remain the same? Why couldn't they just kick out the Big East and add the MWC?

Oh....wait. Maybe it's because 80% of the people live in Big East markets?

college football needs relegation like professional soccer leagues.

There's a ton going on with this, it's been talked about a lot elsewhere and there is a lot of ground to cover!

for one thing, why is Iowa State more deserving than Houston? Vandy more so than Central Florida? Washington State anywhere as worthy of belonging as Fresno State? Has absolutely any member of the Big East done anything to earn it that Boise State hasn't? The lines of demarcation are so horrifically arbitrary and comically infuriating as to defy belief.

for another, Title IX obviously is an issue, since they're going to have to pay everybody to be fair, and the whole market issue with this is the sense that QB1 at Ohio State is worth more than SJSU's 2nd string linebacker is worth more than California (Pa)'s softball player and so on...

which leads to the real unethicality of the whole thing summarized by Pete Fiutak adroitly by saying, LET THE PLAYERS BE ABLE TO TAKE WHATEVER ANYONE WANTS TO GIVE THEM.. The libertarian stance would kill all death penalties and institute an anarchy of fairness that would simultaneously ensure that the most powerful schools remained such, since nobody is going to pay a kid at Akron what they'd pay him at UT Austin...

Sigh

Skjellyfetti wrote:college football needs relegation like professional soccer leagues.

...and it always has needed it!

The nations universities are are unable to control costs at any level despite taking advantage of their non taxable status. They are incapable of proper management because they are driven by liberal, left wing philosophies. The rules, regulations and laws bankrupting universities extend to athletics. The money is seen by the left leadership as another taxable source to fund their follies. Now you have the capitalist sports entrepreneurs trying to co-exist with the left wing dogma controlling the universities.

The money pouring into college athletics, especially at that level, is huge and its all based on the work of the athletes. They get tuition and book money and the institutions rake in billions. Its the same formula that is causing all of our jobs to be exported. Cheap labor abroad and less regulation. In college athletics you have the athletes playing the role of cheap labor. This split is an effort to avoid regulation from the progressive left wing folks in control of the universities by getting out of the NCAA. Then they will have hit the jackpot: low wages and less regulation.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/ ... ortCat=ncf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

JBB wrote:The nations universities are are unable to control costs at any level despite taking advantage of their non taxable status. They are incapable of proper management because they are driven by liberal, left wing philosophies. The rules, regulations and laws bankrupting universities extend to athletics. The money is seen by the left leadership as another taxable source to fund their follies. Now you have the capitalist sports entrepreneurs trying to co-exist with the left wing dogma controlling the universities.

The money pouring into college athletics, especially at that level, is huge and its all based on the work of the athletes. They get tuition and book money and the institutions rake in billions. Its the same formula that is causing all of our jobs to be exported. Cheap labor abroad and less regulation. In college athletics you have the athletes playing the role of cheap labor. This split is an effort to avoid regulation from the progressive left wing folks in control of the universities by getting out of the NCAA. Then they will have hit the jackpot: low wages and less regulation.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/ ... ortCat=ncf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Just looking at EWU's Board of Trustees alone you'll find a President of a corporate governance consulting firm who worked in republican Gov. Dan Evans administration, an executive with Lockheed Martin, the owner of an investment firm, and an executive with Inland Power and Light. I'm sure they're all liberals and that's why they've instituted a comprehensive budget cutting plan or why the state placed a hiring freeze on all state schools at the start of the recession.

Oh, and you might wanna inform the 10's of thousands of conservative alumni who make annual donations to these hotbeds of Stalinism. Or the adjunct business prof's who take time out of the business's they own and run to teach classes in administrative wealth redistribution. And whatever you do, please don't clue in all of those conservative controlled private Industries who get workers highly trained and educated at the expense of the government.

Bill Fette was a liberal.

Skjellyfetti wrote:college football needs relegation like professional soccer leagues.

In theory, this would be nice.

But we'd have to be careful about how relegation would be defined. Are we dropping whole leagues (i.e. Sun Belt/MAC)? Are we talking about individual schools (Wazzu)? Do they just swap places with schools/leagues coming up? That might work on a league-by-league basis. But if, say, Wazzu qualifies to be dropped to FCS and App qualifies to move up, how does that work with leagues? App in the Pac-12 and Wazzu in the SoCon would look pretty ugly.

kalm wrote:

JBB wrote:The nations universities are are unable to control costs at any level despite taking advantage of their non taxable status. They are incapable of proper management because they are driven by liberal, left wing philosophies. The rules, regulations and laws bankrupting universities extend to athletics. The money is seen by the left leadership as another taxable source to fund their follies. Now you have the capitalist sports entrepreneurs trying to co-exist with the left wing dogma controlling the universities.

The money pouring into college athletics, especially at that level, is huge and its all based on the work of the athletes. They get tuition and book money and the institutions rake in billions. Its the same formula that is causing all of our jobs to be exported. Cheap labor abroad and less regulation. In college athletics you have the athletes playing the role of cheap labor. This split is an effort to avoid regulation from the progressive left wing folks in control of the universities by getting out of the NCAA. Then they will have hit the jackpot: low wages and less regulation.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/ ... ortCat=ncf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Just looking at EWU's Board of Trustees alone you'll find a President of a corporate governance consulting firm who worked in republican Gov. Dan Evans administration, an executive with Lockheed Martin, the owner of an investment firm, and an executive with Inland Power and Light. I'm sure they're all liberals and that's why they've instituted a comprehensive budget cutting plan or why the state placed a hiring freeze on all state schools at the start of the recession.

Oh, and you might wanna inform the 10's of thousands of conservative alumni who make annual donations to these hotbeds of Stalinism. Or the adjunct business prof's who take time out of the business's they own and run to teach classes in administrative wealth redistribution. And whatever you do, please don't clue in all of those conservative controlled private Industries who get workers highly trained and educated at the expense of the government.

Bill Fette was a liberal.

Sadly, this pwning of epic proportions will fall on deaf and/or retarded ears.

Grizalltheway wrote:

kalm wrote:

Just looking at EWU's Board of Trustees alone you'll find a President of a corporate governance consulting firm who worked in republican Gov. Dan Evans administration, an executive with Lockheed Martin, the owner of an investment firm, and an executive with Inland Power and Light. I'm sure they're all liberals and that's why they've instituted a comprehensive budget cutting plan or why the state placed a hiring freeze on all state schools at the start of the recession.

Oh, and you might wanna inform the 10's of thousands of conservative alumni who make annual donations to these hotbeds of Stalinism. Or the adjunct business prof's who take time out of the business's they own and run to teach classes in administrative wealth redistribution. And whatever you do, please don't clue in all of those conservative controlled private Industries who get workers highly trained and educated at the expense of the government.

Bill Fette was a liberal.

Sadly, this pwning of epic proportions will fall on deaf and/or retarded ears.

I approve.











Of GATW's new sig.

Wouldnt mind the split except that no way would the MWC be left out of the CFA in this scenario. The Mountain West which/will includes Boise State, Air Force, Nevada, Fresno State for the most part are pretty good and constant and programs like Hawaii, San Diego State, and Wyoming who are improving or able to be reasonably competitive. Also there is the chance that TCU may cancel the idea from the Big East if this were to play out as it seems all the conferences in the CFA (including the Mountain West) would have a chance to compete in a big bowl game.

You make a good point. There is no way Army and Navy would move up and Air Force would not.

And it is very hard to forget about Boise State.

My own version of the split in FBS would be the formation of 4 give or take 30-team conferences, each with a 16-team first division and a give or take 14-team second division. The top two teams in the second division would play the bottom two teams of the first division each year, perhaps in bowl games, winner is in the first division, loser is in the second division for the next year.

The first division championship game would in effect be the first round of a playoff.

Screamin_Eagle174 wrote:I approve.











Of GATW's new sig.

This. Also Vidav's siggy is pretty delicious too.

kalm wrote:

JBB wrote:The nations universities are are unable to control costs at any level despite taking advantage of their non taxable status. They are incapable of proper management because they are driven by liberal, left wing philosophies. The rules, regulations and laws bankrupting universities extend to athletics. The money is seen by the left leadership as another taxable source to fund their follies. Now you have the capitalist sports entrepreneurs trying to co-exist with the left wing dogma controlling the universities.

The money pouring into college athletics, especially at that level, is huge and its all based on the work of the athletes. They get tuition and book money and the institutions rake in billions. Its the same formula that is causing all of our jobs to be exported. Cheap labor abroad and less regulation. In college athletics you have the athletes playing the role of cheap labor. This split is an effort to avoid regulation from the progressive left wing folks in control of the universities by getting out of the NCAA. Then they will have hit the jackpot: low wages and less regulation.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/ ... ortCat=ncf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Just looking at EWU's Board of Trustees alone you'll find a President of a corporate governance consulting firm who worked in republican Gov. Dan Evans administration, an executive with Lockheed Martin, the owner of an investment firm, and an executive with Inland Power and Light. I'm sure they're all liberals and that's why they've instituted a comprehensive budget cutting plan or why the state placed a hiring freeze on all state schools at the start of the recession.

Oh, and you might wanna inform the 10's of thousands of conservative alumni who make annual donations to these hotbeds of Stalinism. Or the adjunct business prof's who take time out of the business's they own and run to teach classes in administrative wealth redistribution. And whatever you do, please don't clue in all of those conservative controlled private Industries who get workers highly trained and educated at the expense of the government.

Bill Fette was a liberal.

Well, thats one conservative you mention. Arent you going to mention all the other left wing nuts?

Its the huge amount of money pouring in that is causing the hypocrisy. The left wing liberals need the money. They cant run the universities profitably with their outlandish and impractical philosophies, even with a conservative helping out here or there. They are tapping out the tuition payers and the "guaranteed" federally controlled student loan program is maxed out to the the sub prime level, They cant control costs at all.

Maybe they could free football from some of the more liberal and binding regulations like title 9 and produce more bottom line cash? It might pay for their absurd "left wing" folly for another decade?

SuperHornet wrote:

Skjellyfetti wrote:college football needs relegation like professional soccer leagues.

In theory, this would be nice.

But we'd have to be careful about how relegation would be defined. Are we dropping whole leagues (i.e. Sun Belt/MAC)? Are we talking about individual schools (Wazzu)? Do they just swap places with schools/leagues coming up? That might work on a league-by-league basis. But if, say, Wazzu qualifies to be dropped to FCS and App qualifies to move up, how does that work with leagues? App in the Pac-12 and Wazzu in the SoCon would look pretty ugly.

Worst CFA team in each West, Midwest, and East being replaced by best 3 1-A teams from West/Midwest/East? Or something like that.