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The "powerful" MEAC and OVC go 0-fer in the playoffs AGAIN while two, 10-1 PFL teams are completely screwed out of an opportunity to participate in the playoffs. I simply do not see how anyone with half a brain can take an at large team out of the MEAC over two teams in the PFL.... This kind of crap causes me to completely lose interest in the so called FCS playoffs....

DF - any follow-up on the PFL AQ?

DetroitFlyer wrote:The "powerful" MEAC and OVC go 0-fer in the playoffs AGAIN while two, 10-1 PFL teams are completely screwed out of an opportunity to participate in the playoffs. I simply do not see how anyone with half a brain can take an at large team out of the MEAC over two teams in the PFL.... This kind of crap causes me to completely lose interest in the so called FCS playoffs....

Here is an interesting stat for everyone. Since 1998 there has only been one NC from a team outside of the CAA, SoCon, or the Big Sky champ. I understand your frustration but the PFL is gonna have to beat some playoff caliber teams to get in the field unless they can get in when the field is expanded again. I'm sure they will end up with 24 teams, which really waters it down. Heck, I think 20 teams is a watered down field. I would prefer putting just 8 in to make the regular season actually mean more of being able to go on a lucky four game win stint and win the title after going 6-5 or 7-4 in the regular season.

Do you really think Dayton or Jacksonville would still be in the field at this point? Neither of them would be in the top three in the SoCon or CAA and some folks feel the CAA gets too many teams in already.

SmallCollegeFBFan wrote:

DetroitFlyer wrote:The "powerful" MEAC and OVC go 0-fer in the playoffs AGAIN while two, 10-1 PFL teams are completely screwed out of an opportunity to participate in the playoffs. I simply do not see how anyone with half a brain can take an at large team out of the MEAC over two teams in the PFL.... This kind of crap causes me to completely lose interest in the so called FCS playoffs....

Well, here is an interesting stat for everyone. Since 1998 there has only been one NC from a team outside of the CAA, SoCon, or the Big Sky. Maybe we just need to have 8 teams and invite them all from those three leagues? champ.

And that team is in FBS now...

My suggestion to the "smaller" partial or non scholarship leagues is to step up to the plate, fully fund your programs and play the big boys week in and week out- and I am referring to the 10 win Jacksonville club who pounded their chests but got absolutely destroyed in a six TD whuppin by the only real playoff team they played all year.

Riddle me this: Where would Dayton or Jacksonville finish in the SoCon or CAA as currently constituted???? Sub .500 and an also ran toting numerous ass whuppins. BIG difference in the level of commitment of the conferences and the strength of the competition every week.

blueballs wrote:

SmallCollegeFBFan wrote:
Well, here is an interesting stat for everyone. Since 1998 there has only been one NC from a team outside of the CAA, SoCon, or the Big Sky. Maybe we just need to have 8 teams and invite them all from those three leagues? champ.

And that team is in FBS now...

My suggestion to the "smaller" partial or non scholarship leagues is to step up to the plate, fully fund your programs and play the big boys week in and week out- and I am referring to the 10 win Jacksonville club who pounded their chests but got absolutely destroyed in a six TD whuppin by the only real playoff team they played all year.

Riddle me this: Where would Dayton or Jacksonville finish in the SoCon or CAA as currently constituted???? Sub .500 and an also ran toting numerous ass whuppins. BIG difference in the level of commitment of the conferences and the strength of the competition every week.

Level of commitment is the key issue here. PFL teams don't invest the same resources into their programs as do CAA, SoCon, Big Sky, MEAC etc schools do. They shouldn't expect the same rewards as those schools.

Typical BS.... So, the PFL has to buy its way to an at large bid? And what does it matter how UD or JU would finish in the SoCon or CAA? Where would either of the two MEAC teams in the playoffs finish? How about any OVC team that has been in the playoffs the last 10 years? Dayton did beat playoff team Robert Morris this year, and beat playoff team Fordham back in 2007. Yeah, that really seems to help. The NCAA and the process are corrupt! There may not be any written rule, but it is clear that you have to buy a bid to the playoffs. What a load of you know what.... As I said for years relative to the NEC, no bid until you get an autobid. Same for the PFL is seems. I have not followed up on the PFL autobid status. Frankly, I am still so honked off that the PFL got screwed again this year that I am not in the right frame of mind to discuss this with anyone in the PFL or at UD. Maybe about February 2011 or so....

From a post by a very wise man over on the AGS board:

There are folks who won't be satisfied until we have a BCS system in the FCS.

Some people just don't get the fact that the playoffs are the NCAA Division I Football Championship Playoffs. Just like the NCAA basketball tournament, ALL of the conference/league champions should have a place at the table, if they so desire. The playoffs are not the "Who-gives-the-most-scholarships-playoffs" or the "FBS-wannabe-playoffs".

The reason that the NCAA basketball tournament is such a raging success is that everyone (and I mean everyone) starts out the season with the belief that their team can make it to the Final Four, even teams from weak conferences like the SoCon or Big Sky!

The expanded NCAA basketball tourney gets more people interested and involved. Yeah, let's keep the FCS Playoffs small so that the millions of fans of Appalachian State and Montana across the country can claim some sort of exclusivity!

Rhetorical question: How many "Cinderella" teams make runs in the NCAA basketball tourney that stir interest in the tourney from people without a horse in the race?

I would argue that the FCS Playoffs are stronger and more interesting to a wider audience this year simply because of expansion. They will be even stronger and far more interesting to a much wider audience when they expand further in the near future.

Fans of teams such as Appalachian State should welcome the broader appeal and broader audience for the playoffs. Just as Butler found in the NCAA Tournament this past spring, additional exposure for your institution is absolutely priceless!

But go ahead...

Keep whining about keeping the FCS Playoffs an exclusive, widely-ignored little sandbox in the corner of the American college sports world. Then when someone mentions Appalachian State to your average American, the response will be, "You mean the hillbillies have a college?"

DetroitFlyer wrote:Typical BS.... So, the PFL has to buy its way to an at large bid? And what does it matter how UD or JU would finish in the SoCon or CAA? Where would either of the two MEAC teams in the playoffs finish? How about any OVC team that has been in the playoffs the last 10 years? Dayton did beat playoff team Robert Morris this year, and beat playoff team Fordham back in 2007. Yeah, that really seems to help. The NCAA and the process are corrupt! There may not be any written rule, but it is clear that you have to buy a bid to the playoffs. What a load of you know what.... As I said for years relative to the NEC, no bid until you get an autobid. Same for the PFL is seems. I have not followed up on the PFL autobid status. Frankly, I am still so honked off that the PFL got screwed again this year that I am not in the right frame of mind to discuss this with anyone in the PFL or at UD. Maybe about February 2011 or so....

Clearly.

Dayton's best win of the year is Robert Morris. Robert Morris barely made its way into the playoffs in the first year their conference got an auto bid.

Jacksonville's best win of the year is losing to App State by less than 50.

Reasons Dayton/Jacksonville didn't make the playoffs:


1. Bad loss (Duquesne/blowout to App)

2. Didn't play each other (cost one of them a solid win).

3. Struggled to beat horrid opponents in the final weeks.

3. The PFL was dismal aside from those two teams. It also included by far the worst team in all of DI (Valpo).


As people who've read my stuff would guess, I'm far from a power conference elitist. However, Dayton & Jacksonville still did not deserve to make the postseason even with a mediocre field of playoff contenders.

It does not matter how many facts you lay out; DetroitFlyer can't process fact or logic. We've had this discussion ad-infinity.

Dayton and Jacksonville, and the rest of their conference-mates are nothing more than DIII football teams. Just as Mt Union doesn't belong in the FCS playoffs, neither do the Flyers or the Dolphins. Accept it and go watch basketball.

DetroitFlyer wrote:Typical BS.... So, the PFL has to buy its way to an at large bid? And what does it matter how UD or JU would finish in the SoCon or CAA? Where would either of the two MEAC teams in the playoffs finish? How about any OVC team that has been in the playoffs the last 10 years? Dayton did beat playoff team Robert Morris this year, and beat playoff team Fordham back in 2007. Yeah, that really seems to help. The NCAA and the process are corrupt! There may not be any written rule, but it is clear that you have to buy a bid to the playoffs. What a load of you know what.... As I said for years relative to the NEC, no bid until you get an autobid. Same for the PFL is seems. I have not followed up on the PFL autobid status. Frankly, I am still so honked off that the PFL got screwed again this year that I am not in the right frame of mind to discuss this with anyone in the PFL or at UD. Maybe about February 2011 or so....

The playoffs should be for the best teams. Nobody in the PFL rated high enough to deserve it this year. If you want to be in the playoffs do the things that playoff teams do to be competitive, otherwise stop complaining.

CoachL wrote:From a post by a very wise man over on the AGS board:

There are folks who won't be satisfied until we have a BCS system in the FCS.

Some people just don't get the fact that the playoffs are the NCAA Division I Football Championship Playoffs. Just like the NCAA basketball tournament, ALL of the conference/league champions should have a place at the table, if they so desire. The playoffs are not the "Who-gives-the-most-scholarships-playoffs" or the "FBS-wannabe-playoffs".

The reason that the NCAA basketball tournament is such a raging success is that everyone (and I mean everyone) starts out the season with the belief that their team can make it to the Final Four, even teams from weak conferences like the SoCon or Big Sky!

The expanded NCAA basketball tourney gets more people interested and involved. Yeah, let's keep the FCS Playoffs small so that the millions of fans of Appalachian State and Montana across the country can claim some sort of exclusivity!

Rhetorical question: How many "Cinderella" teams make runs in the NCAA basketball tourney that stir interest in the tourney from people without a horse in the race?

I would argue that the FCS Playoffs are stronger and more interesting to a wider audience this year simply because of expansion. They will be even stronger and far more interesting to a much wider audience when they expand further in the near future.

Fans of teams such as Appalachian State should welcome the broader appeal and broader audience for the playoffs. Just as Butler found in the NCAA Tournament this past spring, additional exposure for your institution is absolutely priceless!

But go ahead...

Keep whining about keeping the FCS Playoffs an exclusive, widely-ignored little sandbox in the corner of the American college sports world. Then when someone mentions Appalachian State to your average American, the response will be, "You mean the hillbillies have a college?"

Not a very wise post. If the guy who wrote it is supposed to be a wise man, I hope this isn't his best work.

Neither Jacksonville nor Dayton deserved an at-large bid.

Neither did SCST. Or Liberty.

However, the PFL does deserve an AQ just like every other FCS conference with 6 teams that have played together for 2 years that wants one.

CoachL wrote:From a post by a very wise man over on the AGS board:

There are folks who won't be satisfied until we have a BCS system in the FCS.

Some people just don't get the fact that the playoffs are the NCAA Division I Football Championship Playoffs. Just like the NCAA basketball tournament, ALL of the conference/league champions should have a place at the table, if they so desire. The playoffs are not the "Who-gives-the-most-scholarships-playoffs" or the "FBS-wannabe-playoffs".

The reason that the NCAA basketball tournament is such a raging success is that everyone (and I mean everyone) starts out the season with the belief that their team can make it to the Final Four, even teams from weak conferences like the SoCon or Big Sky!

The expanded NCAA basketball tourney gets more people interested and involved. Yeah, let's keep the FCS Playoffs small so that the millions of fans of Appalachian State and Montana across the country can claim some sort of exclusivity!

Rhetorical question: How many "Cinderella" teams make runs in the NCAA basketball tourney that stir interest in the tourney from people without a horse in the race?

I would argue that the FCS Playoffs are stronger and more interesting to a wider audience this year simply because of expansion. They will be even stronger and far more interesting to a much wider audience when they expand further in the near future.

Fans of teams such as Appalachian State should welcome the broader appeal and broader audience for the playoffs. Just as Butler found in the NCAA Tournament this past spring, additional exposure for your institution is absolutely priceless!

But go ahead...

Keep whining about keeping the FCS Playoffs an exclusive, widely-ignored little sandbox in the corner of the American college sports world. Then when someone mentions Appalachian State to your average American, the response will be, "You mean the hillbillies have a college?"

Nobody wants just a two team field but it is clear many of the leagues don't have the scholarships nor put the same amount of money in football in FCS.

Another thing that is flawed in that logic is in basketball there is so much luck involved. Even the best shooter can have a bad day and their team lose if the underrated team is hitting all their shots but in football it is more of a game of strength, schemes, and skill. We already have enough blowouts in the playoffs. Why would we want more? I don't want a BCS format in the FCS but I think 16 is the most we need. I don't think anyone ever said anything about a two team field either. That is just pure exaggeration. The least there should ever be is 8 and I believe 10-12 is ideal.

Do like the NCAA b-ball tourney. The MEAC and Pioneer can faceoff in a play-in game and the winner can get the crap beat out of them the next week. Or Dayton can grow some ball, hit the road for a few years and rack up some wins against the MVC or CAA.

And don't give us that home-home crap DF unless you are willing to fork over the $400k+ gate Delaware can produce for a home game.

My suggestion for Dayton would be earn the respect of the FCS as I described above and start earning the respect in your own backyard. 3200 fans and 7800 empty seats tells me your own community does not respect you. Why then should the rest of us? Whine all you like or go earn some respect. But my guess is you'll be back in another month spouting the same pussy crap you have all year.

Jacksonville and Dayton did not deserve to be in the playoffs, end of story. If you are from a non-power FCS conference, you have to schedule multiple big time games and win. Think Gonzaga and Butler in college basketball.

Campbell was able to get a four year deal with ODU (2 for 2), which means they'd be playing a CAA team for two years, with one of 'em being at home. They might not win one, but that's scheduling up in my opinion for a Pioneer League team. Maybe Dayton can take advantage of Georgia State, or perhaps Charlotte and arrange a similar deal? There are actually decent teams that you can get H/H with...just not the Montana's and ASU's of the FCS. But ya gotta play teams from the better conferences to prove yourself.

DetroitFlyer wrote:The "powerful" MEAC and OVC go 0-fer in the playoffs AGAIN while two, 10-1 PFL teams are completely screwed out of an opportunity to participate in the playoffs. I simply do not see how anyone with half a brain can take an at large team out of the MEAC over two teams in the PFL.... This kind of crap causes me to completely lose interest in the so called FCS playoffs....

And we're all going to lose sleep knowing you are losing interest because your teams don't play anyone. For years you've been spouting the same old tired shit and you always ignore the FACT that teams without auto bids have made the playoffs quite a number of times. Go peddle your shit elsewhere.

89Hen wrote:

DetroitFlyer wrote:The "powerful" MEAC and OVC go 0-fer in the playoffs AGAIN while two, 10-1 PFL teams are completely screwed out of an opportunity to participate in the playoffs. I simply do not see how anyone with half a brain can take an at large team out of the MEAC over two teams in the PFL.... This kind of crap causes me to completely lose interest in the so called FCS playoffs....

And we're all going to lose sleep knowing you are losing interest because your teams don't play anyone.

To be fair, it's not like MEAC played anyone either. I'd argue that the PFL probably played a better OOC than the MEAC. That said, it's not excuse. Both leagues should schedule better in the future.

∞∞∞ wrote:

89Hen wrote: And we're all going to lose sleep knowing you are losing interest because your teams don't play anyone.

To be fair, it's not like MEAC played anyone either. I'd argue that the PFL probably played a better OOC than the MEAC. That said, both leagues should schedule better in the future.

The MEAC sucks, so does the OVC. That's not a case for giving yet another crappy conference an auto.

SmallCollegeFBFan wrote:Nobody wants just a two team field but it is clear many of the leagues don't have the scholarships nor put the same amount of money in football in FCS.

Another thing that is flawed in that logic is in basketball there is so much luck involved. Even the best shooter can have a bad day and their team lose if the underrated team is hitting all their shots but in football it is more of a game of strength, schemes, and skill. We already have enough blowouts in the playoffs. Why would we want more? I don't want a BCS format in the FCS but I think 16 is the most we need. I don't think anyone ever said anything about a two team field either. That is just pure exaggeration. The least there should ever be is 8 and I believe 10-12 is ideal.

1.) Who said anything about a two-team field? Except that you may have a point there! That is the logical end-game for the limited-playoff crowd.

2.) The playoffs are not about who spends the most money on football. If it were, please see point #1.

3.) "Blowouts" like last-team-in NDSU blowing out Montana State?

4.) Have you ever played, much less coached football or basketball? "...basketball there is so much luck involved... but in football it is more of a game of strength, schemes, and skill." Are you kidding me??

5.) You haven't addressed any of the points regarding about the success of the broad NCAA basketball tourney vs. the who-gives-a-rat's-furry-behind obscurity of the FCS Playoffs.

CoachL wrote:the success of the broad NCAA basketball tourney vs. the who-gives-rat's-furry-behind obscurity of the FCS Playoffs.

I'll address it. This year the Big South and NEC were given bids and the field was expanded to 20... is the tourney meeting new found success?

D2 and D3 have more teams... are they more successful?

89Hen wrote:

CoachL wrote:the success of the broad NCAA basketball tourney vs. the who-gives-rat's-furry-behind obscurity of the FCS Playoffs.

I'll address it. This year the Big South and NEC were given bids and the field was expanded to 20... is the tourney meeting new found success?

D2 and D3 have more teams... are they more successful?

Now that you mention it...

Yes.

danefan wrote:Neither Jacksonville nor Dayton deserved an at-large bid.

Neither did SCST. Or Liberty.

However, the PFL does deserve an AQ just like every other FCS conference with 6 teams that have played together for 2 years that wants one.

Yup