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GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 11:35 am Probably deserving of its own thread. What the heck is Trump doing here? We have the 8 years of Obama's undeclared, war by drone approach in Pakistan that has created a generation of folks there and around there who now completely think the West is full of crap - and how can you blame them after a decade of extrajudicial killings by remote control? Now, pretty much out of nowhere, Trump decides blowing up boats near Venezuela is worth the effort. Never mind that the Coast Guard is available and actually has intercepting boats carrying illegal goods as one of its major job descriptions. Never mind that by using big boy Navy stuff and blowing up boats we can't verify who the folks are on those boats or if they actually are carrying narcotics. And never mind the other big thing that blowing up vessels in international waters, without authority from Congress or any actual evidence that these boats are what we say they are, lacks any legality whatsoever.

The guy in command of the whole Southern Command for the Navy just retired, only 1 year into a 4 year job. Being a good military guy, he's not leaking things as to why, but it doesn't take a mind reader to know that he's getting out of the legal fire that's to come from this once people realize we have no authority to be doing what we're doing. Heck, we could even have folks in country in Venezuela for all we know, harkening back to the glory days when we set up puppet regimes in countries like this after getting wholly involved in coups and changes of power. It's like Trump's just now finished Tom Clancy's "Clear and Present Danger" and wants to play it out in real time.

So when China launches its long awaited invasion of Taiwan in the next year or two, and says they had to in order to stop the flow of drugs coming from Taiwan, and say it's like their Venezuela, will we just nod our head and say "yup"?

Another reason why the Dems need to get their heads out of their arses and open the government back up. We're going to have a "No Kings" rally this weekend, but the irony will be that by abdicating the role of the legislative branch, and closing down the government is basically that, we're closer to what we'll be protesting by our very own actions (or inaction if you will).

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:14 pm There is a lot going on in Venezuela and it’s more than Maduro being the king of a drug trafficking organization

The Chinese are in Venezuela, the Russians are in Venezuela and who knows what they are up to… they know but we don’t know everything just yet

But having nuclear warheads in Venezuela is much more of a threat than coming from Russia of China due to the range

So Trump blowing up drug smugglers coming out of Venezuela is really so much more than just a war on drugs

I could envision this turning into a “bay of pigs” scenario, all Russia has done is move their threats from Cuba to Venezuela this time, China is involved as well

The Coast Guard has been doing an outstanding job along those routes for about 40 years now, but you would need about 10 Coast Guards to shut it down. Yes the Navy has helped but they are just platforms. Also, the guys driving these go fast boats smuggling drugs are the lowest pawns in the DTO. If they get caught, tried and convicted prison sentences are light, with free healthcare and food. It’s not that great of a deterrent really as these guys live in great fear on the outside

kalm wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:14 pm

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 11:35 am Probably deserving of its own thread. What the heck is Trump doing here? We have the 8 years of Obama's undeclared, war by drone approach in Pakistan that has created a generation of folks there and around there who now completely think the West is full of crap - and how can you blame them after a decade of extrajudicial killings by remote control? Now, pretty much out of nowhere, Trump decides blowing up boats near Venezuela is worth the effort. Never mind that the Coast Guard is available and actually has intercepting boats carrying illegal goods as one of its major job descriptions. Never mind that by using big boy Navy stuff and blowing up boats we can't verify who the folks are on those boats or if they actually are carrying narcotics. And never mind the other big thing that blowing up vessels in international waters, without authority from Congress or any actual evidence that these boats are what we say they are, lacks any legality whatsoever.

The guy in command of the whole Southern Command for the Navy just retired, only 1 year into a 4 year job. Being a good military guy, he's not leaking things as to why, but it doesn't take a mind reader to know that he's getting out of the legal fire that's to come from this once people realize we have no authority to be doing what we're doing. Heck, we could even have folks in country in Venezuela for all we know, harkening back to the glory days when we set up puppet regimes in countries like this after getting wholly involved in coups and changes of power. It's like Trump's just now finished Tom Clancy's "Clear and Present Danger" and wants to play it out in real time.

So when China launches its long awaited invasion of Taiwan in the next year or two, and says they had to in order to stop the flow of drugs coming from Taiwan, and say it's like their Venezuela, will we just nod our head and say "yup"?

Another reason why the Dems need to get their heads out of their arses and open the government back up. We're going to have a "No Kings" rally this weekend, but the irony will be that by abdicating the role of the legislative branch, and closing down the government is basically that, we're closer to what we'll be protesting by our very own actions (or inaction if you will).

Agree with everything here except the last paragraph. The Dems are powerless even when in session. What resolution would compel R’s to vote for it and reassert their constitutionally mandated authority?

Trump ignores laws he disagrees with. There is no one in power to stop him save congressional R’s, and his cabinet.

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:59 pm

kalm wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:14 pm

Agree with everything here except the last paragraph. The Dems are powerless even when in session. What resolution would compel R’s to vote for it and reassert their constitutionally mandated authority?

Trump ignores laws he disagrees with. There is no one in power to stop him save congressional R’s, and his cabinet.

I agree, the only thing the Dems can do is create noise, but they limit themselves when all they've been making noise about is the shutdown. They don't have the bandwidth and volume to do multiple things, so while they demand government subsidies to continue increasing "affordable" care, Trump plays with Navy firepower in the Caribbean. And Trump can ignore laws, but he doesn't ignore lawsuits. Someone needs to get something in front of a judge to give this operation a pause.

kalm wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 1:46 pm

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:59 pm

I agree, the only thing the Dems can do is create noise, but they limit themselves when all they've been making noise about is the shutdown. They don't have the bandwidth and volume to do multiple things, so while they demand government subsidies to continue increasing "affordable" care, Trump plays with Navy firepower in the Caribbean. And Trump can ignore laws, but he doesn't ignore lawsuits. Someone needs to get something in front of a judge to give this operation a pause.

Totally agree. And the Dems clearly need new leadership and consultants.

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:56 pm

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:14 pm There is a lot going on in Venezuela and it’s more than Maduro being the king of a drug trafficking organization

The Chinese are in Venezuela, the Russians are in Venezuela and who knows what they are up to… they know but we don’t know everything just yet

But having nuclear warheads in Venezuela is much more of a threat than coming from Russia of China due to the range

So Trump blowing up drug smugglers coming out of Venezuela is really so much more than just a war on drugs

I could envision this turning into a “bay of pigs” scenario, all Russia has done is move their threats from Cuba to Venezuela this time, China is involved as well

The Coast Guard has been doing an outstanding job along those routes for about 40 years now, but you would need about 10 Coast Guards to shut it down. Yes the Navy has helped but they are just platforms. Also, the guys driving these go fast boats smuggling drugs are the lowest pawns in the DTO. If they get caught, tried and convicted prison sentences are light, with free healthcare and food. It’s not that great of a deterrent really as these guys live in great fear on the outside

We are not worried about nukes in Venezuela. This isn't Cuba all over again. And nuclear missiles in Venezuela are not any more threatening than nuclear missiles in submarines sitting not too far off the Atlantic and Pacific coasts. This isn't the movie "War Games", and if it were the only way to win would be not to play.

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 3:01 pm

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:56 pm

We are not worried about nukes in Venezuela. This isn't Cuba all over again. And nuclear missiles in Venezuela are not any more threatening than nuclear missiles in submarines sitting not too far off the Atlantic and Pacific coasts. This isn't the movie "War Games", and if it were the only way to win would be not to play.

Of course we are not at war with Venezuela about nukes, I didn’t mean to imply that

But don’t think this is not a multi level strategy because our adversaries are using Venezuela as a staging ground for activities that will not be good for the United States.

Trump strategy is fight the drug war and send a message to our enemies that we’re not playing games …. We know you’re down there and we know you’re up to no good.

Speaking of games, I have not seen movie War Games

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 5:29 pm

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 3:01 pm

Of course we are not at war with Venezuela about nukes, I didn’t mean to imply that

But don’t think this is not a multi level strategy because our adversaries are using Venezuela as a staging ground for activities that will not be good for the United States.

Trump strategy is fight the drug war and send a message to our enemies that we’re not playing games …. We know you’re down there and we know you’re up to no good.

Speaking of games, I have not seen movie War Games

Great early 80s flick. Probably watched it (parts at least) double digit times in the last 40+ years).

kalm wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:14 pm

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 11:35 am Probably deserving of its own thread. What the heck is Trump doing here? We have the 8 years of Obama's undeclared, war by drone approach in Pakistan that has created a generation of folks there and around there who now completely think the West is full of crap - and how can you blame them after a decade of extrajudicial killings by remote control? Now, pretty much out of nowhere, Trump decides blowing up boats near Venezuela is worth the effort. Never mind that the Coast Guard is available and actually has intercepting boats carrying illegal goods as one of its major job descriptions. Never mind that by using big boy Navy stuff and blowing up boats we can't verify who the folks are on those boats or if they actually are carrying narcotics. And never mind the other big thing that blowing up vessels in international waters, without authority from Congress or any actual evidence that these boats are what we say they are, lacks any legality whatsoever.

The guy in command of the whole Southern Command for the Navy just retired, only 1 year into a 4 year job. Being a good military guy, he's not leaking things as to why, but it doesn't take a mind reader to know that he's getting out of the legal fire that's to come from this once people realize we have no authority to be doing what we're doing. Heck, we could even have folks in country in Venezuela for all we know, harkening back to the glory days when we set up puppet regimes in countries like this after getting wholly involved in coups and changes of power. It's like Trump's just now finished Tom Clancy's "Clear and Present Danger" and wants to play it out in real time.

So when China launches its long awaited invasion of Taiwan in the next year or two, and says they had to in order to stop the flow of drugs coming from Taiwan, and say it's like their Venezuela, will we just nod our head and say "yup"?

Another reason why the Dems need to get their heads out of their arses and open the government back up. We're going to have a "No Kings" rally this weekend, but the irony will be that by abdicating the role of the legislative branch, and closing down the government is basically that, we're closer to what we'll be protesting by our very own actions (or inaction if you will).

Agree with everything here except the last paragraph. The Dems are powerless even when in session. What resolution would compel R’s to vote for it and reassert their constitutionally mandated authority?

Trump ignores laws he disagrees with. There is no one in power to stop him save congressional R’s, and his cabinet.

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 9:19 pm

kalm wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:14 pm
Agree with everything here except the last paragraph. The Dems are powerless even when in session. What resolution would compel R’s to vote for it and reassert their constitutionally mandated authority?

Trump ignores laws he disagrees with. There is no one in power to stop him save congressional R’s, and his cabinet.

too funny, you’re only agreeing because you don’t want to get taken to public school again

But kidding aside, you agree with everything because you are clueless on anything going on in the Caribbean, but that doesn’t make you unique.

I always said … what happens in the Caribbean stays in the Caribbean because wild stuff happens but it never makes mainstream news in the states

So being Caribbean Hen, I can tell you that Trump blowing up boats just didn’t come out of nowhere… but I understand why it might seem like that.

UNI88 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 9:12 am

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 9:19 pm

too funny, you’re only agreeing because you don’t want to get taken to public school again

But kidding aside, you agree with everything because you are clueless on anything going on in the Caribbean, but that doesn’t make you unique.

I always said … what happens in the Caribbean stays in the Caribbean because wild stuff happens but it never makes mainstream news in the states

So being Caribbean Hen, I can tell you that Trump blowing up boats just didn’t come out of nowhere… but I understand why it might seem like that.

It might not have come out of nowhere but it isn't that simple. The questions that need to be answered include:
1) is trump legally justified in blowing up those boats without providing proof of guilt? Or is murder and trump is guilty of international criminal acts?
2) when does trump need Congressional approval for these actions? To blow up the boats? To send the CIA in? Certainly before sending the military in to a foreign nation.

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 11:56 am

UNI88 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 9:12 am

It might not have come out of nowhere but it isn't that simple. The questions that need to be answered include:
1) is trump legally justified in blowing up those boats without providing proof of guilt? Or is murder and trump is guilty of international criminal acts?
2) when does trump need Congressional approval for these actions? To blow up the boats? To send the CIA in? Certainly before sending the military in to a foreign nation.

All valid questions

But remember, it’s the left that designated Trump the King

kalm wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 11:58 am

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 11:56 am

All valid questions

But remember, it’s the left that designated Trump the King

No. He did it all by his little loathsome self.

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 11:59 am

kalm wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 11:58 am

No. He did it all by his little loathsome self.

Today is No Kings day

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 11:56 am

UNI88 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 9:12 am

It might not have come out of nowhere but it isn't that simple. The questions that need to be answered include:
1) is trump legally justified in blowing up those boats without providing proof of guilt? Or is murder and trump is guilty of international criminal acts?
2) when does trump need Congressional approval for these actions? To blow up the boats? To send the CIA in? Certainly before sending the military in to a foreign nation.

All valid questions

But remember, it’s the left that designated Trump the King

UNI88 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 12:01 pm

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 18, 2025 11:56 am

All valid questions

But remember, it’s the left that designated Trump the King

I didn't realize that trump's White House was part of "the left" ...

Today, the U.S. announced its 7th strike in SOUTHCOM, destroying a boat affiliated with a Colombian cartel. The U.S. has massed 10,000+ troops in the region, with most in Puerto Rico and on 12 U.S. Navy ships. Also:

• USAF B-52H bombers + USMC F-35B fighters conducted a bomber attack demo

• Special forces spotted near Trinidad and Tobago

• AC-130J Ghostrider gunships deployed to Puerto Rico

• Additional ships arrived in theater: Military Sealift Command oilers USNS Henry J. Kaiser (T-AO 187) and USNS Kanawha (T-AO 196), U.S. Army landing craft utility USAV Wilson Wharf (LCU 2011), littoral combat ship USS Wichita (LCS 13) replaced USS Minneapolis-St. Paul (LCS 21)

• NYT: U.S. installed a new long-range radar system (AN/TPS-75) in St. Croix, USVI, and built a new bunker to store ammunition and support drone ops at Rafael Hernández Airport

• New Joint Task Force (JTF) under II Marine Expeditionary Force (II MEF) established

• SOUTHCOM Commander, Admiral Holsey, retiring

Last week, POTUS acknowledged authorization for the CIA to conduct covert ops in Venezuela and previewed: "We are looking at land now, because we've got the sea very well under control."

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 11:35 am Probably deserving of its own thread. What the heck is Trump doing here? We have the 8 years of Obama's undeclared, war by drone approach in Pakistan that has created a generation of folks there and around there who now completely think the West is full of crap - and how can you blame them after a decade of extrajudicial killings by remote control? Now, pretty much out of nowhere, Trump decides blowing up boats near Venezuela is worth the effort. Never mind that the Coast Guard is available and actually has intercepting boats carrying illegal goods as one of its major job descriptions. Never mind that by using big boy Navy stuff and blowing up boats we can't verify who the folks are on those boats or if they actually are carrying narcotics. And never mind the other big thing that blowing up vessels in international waters, without authority from Congress or any actual evidence that these boats are what we say they are, lacks any legality whatsoever.

The guy in command of the whole Southern Command for the Navy just retired, only 1 year into a 4 year job. Being a good military guy, he's not leaking things as to why, but it doesn't take a mind reader to know that he's getting out of the legal fire that's to come from this once people realize we have no authority to be doing what we're doing. Heck, we could even have folks in country in Venezuela for all we know, harkening back to the glory days when we set up puppet regimes in countries like this after getting wholly involved in coups and changes of power. It's like Trump's just now finished Tom Clancy's "Clear and Present Danger" and wants to play it out in real time.

So when China launches its long awaited invasion of Taiwan in the next year or two, and says they had to in order to stop the flow of drugs coming from Taiwan, and say it's like their Venezuela, will we just nod our head and say "yup"?

Another reason why the Dems need to get their heads out of their arses and open the government back up. We're going to have a "No Kings" rally this weekend, but the irony will be that by abdicating the role of the legislative branch, and closing down the government is basically that, we're closer to what we'll be protesting by our very own actions (or inaction if you will).

kalm wrote: ↑Sun Oct 19, 2025 9:28 pm This doesn’t look promising for the brutal and corrupt dictator in Venezuela who is the King of a Drug trafficking organization intent on poisoning Americans and lining his pockets with billions of dollars

Today, the U.S. announced its 7th strike in SOUTHCOM, destroying a boat affiliated with a Colombian cartel. The U.S. has massed 10,000+ troops in the region, with most in Puerto Rico and on 12 U.S. Navy ships. Also:

• USAF B-52H bombers + USMC F-35B fighters conducted a bomber attack demo

• Special forces spotted near Trinidad and Tobago

• AC-130J Ghostrider gunships deployed to Puerto Rico

• Additional ships arrived in theater: Military Sealift Command oilers USNS Henry J. Kaiser (T-AO 187) and USNS Kanawha (T-AO 196), U.S. Army landing craft utility USAV Wilson Wharf (LCU 2011), littoral combat ship USS Wichita (LCS 13) replaced USS Minneapolis-St. Paul (LCS 21)

• NYT: U.S. installed a new long-range radar system (AN/TPS-75) in St. Croix, USVI, and built a new bunker to store ammunition and support drone ops at Rafael Hernández Airport

• New Joint Task Force (JTF) under II Marine Expeditionary Force (II MEF) established

• SOUTHCOM Commander, Admiral Holsey, retiring

Last week, POTUS acknowledged authorization for the CIA to conduct covert ops in Venezuela and previewed: "We are looking at land now, because we've got the sea very well under control."

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Mon Oct 20, 2025 6:25 am

kalm wrote: ↑Sun Oct 19, 2025 9:28 pm This doesn’t look promising for the brutal and corrupt dictator in Venezuela who is the King of a Drug trafficking organization intent on poisoning Americans and lining his pockets with billions of dollars

Well stated

GannonFan wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:56 pm

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 12:14 pm There is a lot going on in Venezuela and it’s more than Maduro being the king of a drug trafficking organization

The Chinese are in Venezuela, the Russians are in Venezuela and who knows what they are up to… they know but we don’t know everything just yet

But having nuclear warheads in Venezuela is much more of a threat than coming from Russia of China due to the range

So Trump blowing up drug smugglers coming out of Venezuela is really so much more than just a war on drugs

I could envision this turning into a “bay of pigs” scenario, all Russia has done is move their threats from Cuba to Venezuela this time, China is involved as well

The Coast Guard has been doing an outstanding job along those routes for about 40 years now, but you would need about 10 Coast Guards to shut it down. Yes the Navy has helped but they are just platforms. Also, the guys driving these go fast boats smuggling drugs are the lowest pawns in the DTO. If they get caught, tried and convicted prison sentences are light, with free healthcare and food. It’s not that great of a deterrent really as these guys live in great fear on the outside

We are not worried about nukes in Venezuela. This isn't Cuba all over again. And nuclear missiles in Venezuela are not any more threatening than nuclear missiles in submarines sitting not too far off the Atlantic and Pacific coasts. This isn't the movie "War Games", and if it were the only way to win would be not to play.