Trump Impeachment Part Duex

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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by AZGrizFan »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:24 am
SDHornet wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:08 am

My question was more to the general audience and not you specifically. I haven't tuned into any of the impeachment nonsense, but from the headlines I see it's all the typical gaslighting "Orange Man Bad" stuff without acknowledging the violence that was encouraged this past summer by the other side. And no, they are not the same but we didn't get to the Jan 6th Riot in a vacuum.
We certainly didn't get here in a vaccum. Agreed.

It seems i'm one of the few people here that has no problem saying any politician that did what Trump is accused of should be punished.
And yet you seem to have conveniently forgotten shit the left has been saying for four years, and more precisely all summer and winter since Floyd.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by HI54UNI »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 10:51 am Also - is it normal for impartial jurors to give advice to the defendants lawyers?
About as normal as it is for one of the jurors to also be the presiding judge.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by SDHornet »

HI54UNI wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:34 am
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 10:51 am Also - is it normal for impartial jurors to give advice to the defendants lawyers?
About as normal as it is for one of the jurors to also be the presiding judge.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

SDHornet wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:29 am
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:24 am We certainly didn't get here in a vaccum. Agreed.

It seems i'm one of the few people here that has no problem saying any politician that did what Trump is accused of should be punished.
Eh, what he said leading up to the event deserve scrutiny. I don't buy into the idea that he was directly behind/incited the actions of individuals. There would be other legal ramifications if so. His speech on Jan 6th indicated a peaceful tact and not a violent one. Also if it was cut an dry, you'd see more than the spurned anti-Trump Senators jumping on the vote for impeachment.

All in all a complete waste of time that will only embolden Trump and the "Trumpist" movement further.
That's not the issue. I don't think he was directing the riot. His words and actions, however, helped fuel the fire.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by SDHornet »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:46 am
SDHornet wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:29 am

Eh, what he said leading up to the event deserve scrutiny. I don't buy into the idea that he was directly behind/incited the actions of individuals. There would be other legal ramifications if so. His speech on Jan 6th indicated a peaceful tact and not a violent one. Also if it was cut an dry, you'd see more than the spurned anti-Trump Senators jumping on the vote for impeachment.

All in all a complete waste of time that will only embolden Trump and the "Trumpist" movement further.
That's not the issue. I don't think he was directing the riot. His words and actions, however, helped fuel the fire.
Sure, as did many others on pretty much every side of the spectrum. Ergo he'll be acquitted. :coffee:
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

AZGrizFan wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:30 am
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:24 am We certainly didn't get here in a vaccum. Agreed.

It seems i'm one of the few people here that has no problem saying any politician that did what Trump is accused of should be punished.
And yet you seem to have conveniently forgotten shit the left has been saying for four years, and more precisely all summer and winter since Floyd.
I haven't. But show me a candidate spend months before an election telling their supporters that any loss means there's fraud..and then spend months after the loss telling everyone it's rigged and there's fraud...and then call states demanding they overturn the results...and then demand that the VP ignore the votes in Congress. When did a Democrat do anything like that?

I must've missed Hilary's "Stop the Steal" rallies and her spending almost half a year telling Democrats that the election will be rigged, was rigged and that the Antifa should Stand By.

Yep, I must've missed all of that.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

SDHornet wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:47 am
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:46 am

That's not the issue. I don't think he was directing the riot. His words and actions, however, helped fuel the fire.
Sure, as did many others on pretty much every side of the spectrum. Ergo he'll be acquitted. :coffee:
But that argument, " Democrats did it" is BS. Because someone else did something stupid isn't an excuse for your bad behavior.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

HI54UNI wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:34 am
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 10:51 am Also - is it normal for impartial jurors to give advice to the defendants lawyers?
About as normal as it is for one of the jurors to also be the presiding judge.
Yeah, that's a weird one. Robert's should be there.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by SDHornet »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:53 am
SDHornet wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:47 am

Sure, as did many others on pretty much every side of the spectrum. Ergo he'll be acquitted. :coffee:
But that argument, " Democrats did it" is BS. Because someone else did something stupid isn't an excuse for your bad behavior.
Agreed, but again this didn't happen in a vacuum. If Trump directly called for his supporters to storm the "gates" at the Capitol then we'd be having a different conversation. He didn't, he called for a peaceful tact in his speech.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by AZGrizFan »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:51 am
AZGrizFan wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:30 am

And yet you seem to have conveniently forgotten shit the left has been saying for four years, and more precisely all summer and winter since Floyd.
I haven't. But show me a candidate spend months before an election telling their supporters that any loss means there's fraud..and then spend months after the loss telling everyone it's rigged and there's fraud...and then call states demanding they overturn the results...and then demand that the VP ignore the votes in Congress. When did a Democrat do anything like that?

I must've missed Hilary's "Stop the Steal" rallies and her spending almost half a year telling Democrats that the election will be rigged, was rigged and that the Antifa should Stand By.

Yep, I must've missed all of that.
Well you will never find ALL that in one candidate on the left because there was only ONE guy who was president doing that. But almost all those things were done by multiple candidates on the left over the past four years.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

SDHornet wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:58 am
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:53 am
But that argument, " Democrats did it" is BS. Because someone else did something stupid isn't an excuse for your bad behavior.
Agreed, but again this didn't happen in a vacuum. If Trump directly called for his supporters to storm the "gates" at the Capitol then we'd be having a different conversation. He didn't, he called for a peaceful tact in his speech.
You're talking about 1 speech and are ignoring the totality of what led up to that speech. He told a militia group to stand by and stand ready. He and his surrogates told them their country was in danger, to fight like hell, trial by combat, go to the Capitol and support he Republicans. He did a lot more than say be peaceful, one time in one speech.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

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AZGrizFan wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:02 pm
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 11:51 am
I haven't. But show me a candidate spend months before an election telling their supporters that any loss means there's fraud..and then spend months after the loss telling everyone it's rigged and there's fraud...and then call states demanding they overturn the results...and then demand that the VP ignore the votes in Congress. When did a Democrat do anything like that?

I must've missed Hilary's "Stop the Steal" rallies and her spending almost half a year telling Democrats that the election will be rigged, was rigged and that the Antifa should Stand By.

Yep, I must've missed all of that.
Well you will never find ALL that in one candidate on the left because there was only ONE guy who was president doing that. But almost all those things were done by multiple candidates on the left over the past four years.
I don't disagree...but when did it end up with our seat of gov't being attacked?
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by AZGrizFan »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:04 pm
AZGrizFan wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:02 pm

Well you will never find ALL that in one candidate on the left because there was only ONE guy who was president doing that. But almost all those things were done by multiple candidates on the left over the past four years.
I don't disagree...but when did it end up with our seat of gov't being attacked?
Again, none of the others are voted on in THAT building, so you’re probably not going to get that. If that’s your “qualifier”, then the only person who’s probably going to meet your standards IS the president, or a presidential candidate. But that’s not the only position that lemmings take their marching orders from, when parsing violent rhetoric.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

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AZGrizFan wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:27 pm
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:04 pm

I don't disagree...but when did it end up with our seat of gov't being attacked?
Again, none of the others are voted on in THAT building, so you’re probably not going to get that. If that’s your “qualifier”, then the only person who’s probably going to meet your standards IS the president, or a presidential candidate. But that’s not the only position that lemmings take their marching orders from, when parsing violent rhetoric.
Lemmings will take their orders from their leader. Pelosi, Trump, Mickey Mouse....they're called lemmings for a reason.

But you do raise a good point. And to your argument, and I said it last summer, and Democrat that was egging on the rioters deserved to be punished. ESPECIALLY if lives were lost because of it all.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by AZGrizFan »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:33 pm
AZGrizFan wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:27 pm

Again, none of the others are voted on in THAT building, so you’re probably not going to get that. If that’s your “qualifier”, then the only person who’s probably going to meet your standards IS the president, or a presidential candidate. But that’s not the only position that lemmings take their marching orders from, when parsing violent rhetoric.
Lemmings will take their orders from their leader. Pelosi, Trump, Mickey Mouse....they're called lemmings for a reason.

But you do raise a good point. And to your argument, and I said it last summer, and Democrat that was egging on the rioters deserved to be punished. ESPECIALLY if lives were lost because of it all.
Well then every life lost during all the riots, that blood is on the hands of the AOChe’s, Pelosis, Waters’, etc of the world.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

AZGrizFan wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:42 pm
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:33 pm Lemmings will take their orders from their leader. Pelosi, Trump, Mickey Mouse....they're called lemmings for a reason.

But you do raise a good point. And to your argument, and I said it last summer, and Democrat that was egging on the rioters deserved to be punished. ESPECIALLY if lives were lost because of it all.
Well then every life lost during all the riots, that blood is on the hands of the AOChe’s, Pelosis, Waters’, etc of the world.
They certainly share the blame for fanning the flames. :nod:
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by BDKJMU »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:04 pm
AZGrizFan wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:02 pm

Well you will never find ALL that in one candidate on the left because there was only ONE guy who was president doing that. But almost all those things were done by multiple candidates on the left over the past four years.
I don't disagree...but when did it end up with our seat of gov't being attacked?
Do you not remember in 2018, after being whipped up by the left, including by donks in Congress, you had a mob of lefties storm the Capitol trying to prevent the confirmation of a SCOTUS justice, and 300 were arrested?
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

BDKJMU wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:59 pm
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:04 pm

I don't disagree...but when did it end up with our seat of gov't being attacked?
Do you not remember in 2018, and being whipped up by the left, including in Congress, you had a mob of lefties storm the Capitol trying to prevent the confirmation of a SCOTUS justice, and 300 were arrested?
I do. Remind me please, did they break into area's they weren't allowed? Did they vandalize the building? Remind me - did they erect a gallows and threaten to murder any politicians? Did they attack and beat the shit out any police? Did they ransack and rob any offices? Regardless, if Congress had tried to censure or punish any elected official which took part, I would have supported it. That's the difference between you and I - I have no loyalty to any party or ideology and am free to criticize and praise them.
Spoiler: show
That wasn't the respond you were looking for was it? I'm consistent in this - you break the law you go to jail. You encourage others to break the law, you go to jail.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by kalm »

Haven’t caught up on this thread but some dude on MSNBC said the defense’s closing arguments and use of video is like watching a Hannity episode. :lol:
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

BDKJMU wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:59 pm
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:04 pm

I don't disagree...but when did it end up with our seat of gov't being attacked?
Do you not remember in 2018, after being whipped up by the left, including by donks in Congress, you had a mob of lefties storm the Capitol trying to prevent the confirmation of a SCOTUS justice, and 300 were arrested?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/de ... story.html

Here's an article. Where did they destroy property, threaten to murder people, and rob congressional offices?
Then dozens of protesters pushed past the police line and occupied the Supreme Court steps, chanting, pumping fists, one doing yoga poses. The steps were quickly filled.
Chanting and yoga poses!?!! :lol: That's what I expect from lefties.

To my earlier point - the bad behavior of one group doesn't give you an excuse to do the same. :coffee: You seem to disagree.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by BDKJMU »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:02 pm
BDKJMU wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:59 pm
Do you not remember in 2018, and being whipped up by the left, including in Congress, you had a mob of lefties storm the Capitol trying to prevent the confirmation of a SCOTUS justice, and 300 were arrested?
I do. Remind me please, did they break into area's they weren't allowed? Did they vandalize the building? Remind me - did they erect a gallows and threaten to murder any politicians? Did they attack and beat the shit out any police? Did they ransack and rob any offices? Regardless, if Congress had tried to censure or punish any elected official which took part, I would have supported it. That's the difference between you and I - I have no loyalty to any party or ideology and am free to criticize and praise them.
Spoiler: show
That wasn't the respond you were looking for was it? I'm consistent in this - you break the law you go to jail. You encourage others to break the law, you go to jail.
Doesn't matter- you're rationalizing breaking the law. Breaking the law is breaking the law, amirite?

Regardless, Trump didn't encourage others to break the law.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

BDKJMU wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:21 pm
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:02 pm

I do. Remind me please, did they break into area's they weren't allowed? Did they vandalize the building? Remind me - did they erect a gallows and threaten to murder any politicians? Did they attack and beat the shit out any police? Did they ransack and rob any offices? Regardless, if Congress had tried to censure or punish any elected official which took part, I would have supported it. That's the difference between you and I - I have no loyalty to any party or ideology and am free to criticize and praise them.
Spoiler: show
That wasn't the respond you were looking for was it? I'm consistent in this - you break the law you go to jail. You encourage others to break the law, you go to jail.
Doesn't matter- you're rationalizing breaking the law. Breaking the law is breaking the law, amirite?

Regardless, Trump didn't encourage others to break the law.
In all seriousness, are you brain dead? You have to be. How do you read "You break the law, you go to jail," and think that I'm rationalizing breaking the law? :dunce: Go read my posts on here, I am consistent. You break the law, you should be punished. You're either retarded or you're just making assumptions and hoping to get away with it.


In either case, you are 100% wrong.

What an ignorant post...and that's saying alot for CS.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by BDKJMU »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:28 pm
BDKJMU wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:21 pm
Doesn't matter- you're rationalizing breaking the law. Breaking the law is breaking the law, amirite?

Regardless, Trump didn't encourage others to break the law.
In all seriousness, are you brain dead? You have to be. How do you read "You break the law, you go to jail," and think that I'm rationalizing breaking the law? :dunce: Go read my posts on here, I am consistent. You break the law, you should be punished. You're either retarded or you're just making assumptions and hoping to get away with it.


In either case, you are 100% wrong.

What an ignorant post...and that's saying alot for CS.
You were comparing the 2 sets of rioters 2018 and 1/6, saying the 2018 were lesser.

And you're 100% wrong on Trump. Trump didn't break any law.
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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by Ibanez »

BDKJMU wrote:
Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:28 pm In all seriousness, are you brain dead? You have to be. How do you read "You break the law, you go to jail," and think that I'm rationalizing breaking the law? :dunce: Go read my posts on here, I am consistent. You break the law, you should be punished. You're either retarded or you're just making assumptions and hoping to get away with it.


In either case, you are 100% wrong.

What an ignorant post...and that's saying alot for CS.
You were comparing the 2 sets of rioters 2018 and 1/6, saying the 2018 were lesser.

And you're 100% wrong on Trump. Trump didn't break any law.
I’m going to respond in a way Trump would - listen, loser. I said the two were different and in either case anyone encouraging violence or illegal acts should be punished. You’re the worst. You’re dense.

It’s amazing. You’ve gone full retard. Are you even reading the posts? You can’t be.


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Re: Trump Impeachment Part Duex

Post by BDKJMU »

Ibanez wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:53 pm
BDKJMU wrote: You were comparing the 2 sets of rioters 2018 and 1/6, saying the 2018 were lesser.

And you're 100% wrong on Trump. Trump didn't break any law.
I’m going to respond in a way Trump would - listen, loser. I said the two were different and in either case anyone encouraging violence or illegal acts should be punished. You’re the worst. You’re dense.

It’s amazing. You’ve gone full retard. Are you even reading the posts? You can’t be.


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I never said that rioters shouldn't be punished you fucking retard.
And no, I'm not reading all your TDS drivel...
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