2020 General Election

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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

kalm wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 6:37 am
SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 6:24 am Interesting. Seems the MCBOS wants to replace voting machines inspected by the current audit, because they are not certified by the EAC.

None of the firms MCBOS chose for their audits were certified at the time they were chosen for their audit, and only became certified AFTER it was pointed out they weren't current. Both firms had let their certifications expire.

Well, now it seems they have evidence the MCBOS used one of these firms (Pro V&V) in 2019, while it's certification was expired.

You know what that means don't you? The machines the uncertified firm touched, were tarnished back in 2019.

Can't make this shit up. This whole fiasco is going pretty much how I expected and have stated. Our elections are run by bureaucratic boobs.
Trump’s victory in 2016 is clearly now in question. As are the Republican gains in the house last year.
Tell you what. When Trump won due to 88k in votes over three states, I thought that was great, since I disliked The Hildabeast. Then when Joe won by 42k in votes over three states, that really piqued my interest. I now find both scenarios sketchy.

While I understand the electoral college, I'm having a tough time reconciling two elections in which 130 k in votes out of 300 million have chosen our last two Presidents. Foil hat moment here, but it makes me think "powers that be" are choosing our Presidents.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

kalm wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:12 am
SDHornet wrote: Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:47 pm

Time for a forensic audit in Georgia. Maybe Biden* can travel there and make more Jim Crow/Civil War speeches. :lol: :popcorn:

Holy shit! Well if Tucker says it... :lol:

They should rush this to the courts!
He didn't, the ALC and vids of shady stuff going on in Fulton County said it. :coffee:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

kalm wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 6:37 am
SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 6:24 am Interesting. Seems the MCBOS wants to replace voting machines inspected by the current audit, because they are not certified by the EAC.

None of the firms MCBOS chose for their audits were certified at the time they were chosen for their audit, and only became certified AFTER it was pointed out they weren't current. Both firms had let their certifications expire.

Well, now it seems they have evidence the MCBOS used one of these firms (Pro V&V) in 2019, while it's certification was expired.

You know what that means don't you? The machines the uncertified firm touched, were tarnished back in 2019.

Can't make this shit up. This whole fiasco is going pretty much how I expected and have stated. Our elections are run by bureaucratic boobs.
Trump’s victory in 2016 is clearly now in question. As are the Republican gains in the house last year.
Uh, yeah. That's kinda what the Left parroted on about non-stop from '16-'20. Were you in a cave or something? :lol:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

Well well. This was the guy who leaked his phone call with Trump to the media and stated uncategorically that the Georgia election was safe, secure and certainly had zero shenanigans.

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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

Maricopa election was a mess. I thought these guys were professionals? Must've been trained by the NY crew that left the test ballots in their recent ranked choice election.

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Re: 2020 General Election

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AZ SOS on why they have to throw away the machines that were audited. :rofl:

Katie Hobbs: I already tested the voting machines and I'm certain that they were 100% accurate.

Also Katie Hobbs: It's impossible to test if the voting machines are 100% accurate so I have to throw away all of the voting machines.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 1:10 pm AZ SOS on why they have to throw away the machines that were audited. :rofl:

Katie Hobbs: I already tested the voting machines and I'm certain that they were 100% accurate.

Also Katie Hobbs: It's impossible to test if the voting machines are 100% accurate so I have to throw away all of the voting machines.
Weren't these machines supposed to be impervious to hacking? :lol:

This whole saga is just :popcorn:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

SDHornet wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 3:01 pm
SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 1:10 pm AZ SOS on why they have to throw away the machines that were audited. :rofl:

Katie Hobbs: I already tested the voting machines and I'm certain that they were 100% accurate.

Also Katie Hobbs: It's impossible to test if the voting machines are 100% accurate so I have to throw away all of the voting machines.
Weren't these machines supposed to be impervious to hacking? :lol:

This whole saga is just :popcorn:
Yes, plus she is saying that previously, the process of certifying the machines made them 100% accurate, but now that Cyber Ninjas has examined them, that same process apparently isn't robust enough to make them 100% accurate after their examination.

The AZ SOS is a doofus.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

Highlights from AZ Audit Senate Hearing 7/15

Hand Count

• Ballot duplication nightmare. Serial numbers are required to match the original and duplicated ballot. “Thousands” of ballots are either missing serial numbers or have unreadable serial numbers printed over a dark black ballot identification box. Ken Bennett stated that it’s impossible to determine whether a ballot was duplicated more than once.

Machine Analysis

• Inferior equipment verification process. Senator Peterson noted that if the EAC equipment verification process cannot handle evaluation by an audit, then we need a new certification procedure.

• Cyber security vulnerabilities, missing security event data, and suspicious logins. Ben Cotton of CyFIR emphasized the critical need for router and Splunk log data. He gave 4 reasons:

a) The November election system breach reported by Maricopa County and the SoS.

b) Extreme cyber security vulnerabilities: the last malware and operating system/ security patch update was in August 2019 when the Dominion software was originally installed. “It would take less than 10 min to gain system-level access.”

c) Security event data only goes back to 2/5/21. By design, the security log only holds 20 MB of data. Strangely, on 3/11/21, there were 37,646 queries for a blank password that had had the effect of overwriting the data prior to 2/5/21.

d) Suspicious anonymous logons. CyFIR has found anonymous logons at the system level that do not follow the pattern of normal Windows behavior.

• Maricopa County is unable to validate the security of the election system. The evidence provided suggests that only Dominion is able to verify the ICP configuration. Cotton explains that it’s impossible to validate the security of an election system if you cannot independently validate the configuration. CyFIR needs the authentication fobs held by Dominion to check ICP configuration.

Paper Analysis

• Ballot calibration was off by an average of 1000% in some batches leading to bleed-through, which can cause over-votes or inaccurate vote attribution. The County has stated that they use thick VoteSecure paper, which should limit bleed-through in the event of mis-calibration. However, the Cyber Ninjas team found a large number of ballots on very thin paper stock. The ballots printed on-demand at the voting centers on Election Day have the worst calibration issues. More than 168K ballots were affected.

Voter Rolls

• Voter roll anomalies affect more than 107K ballots. Doug Logan “highly recommends canvassing” based on the data his team has reviewed. For example:

a) There are 74,243 mail-in ballots with no clear record of being sent out

b) 11,326 people who voted do not show up on the 11/7 voter rolls, but are listed in the 12/4 database

c) 3,981 people who voted on Election Day were registered after 10/15, which is a violation of state law

d) Approximately 18k people voted on Election Day but were subsequently removed from the rolls

Envelopes

• Maricopa County did not turn over images of the envelopes as requested in the January subpoena

Closing Remarks

The hearing concluded with a review of the 17 missing items needed to complete the audit, many of them already subpoenaed, including router data, Splunk logs, hardware tokens, envelope images, chain of custody documentation, and all portable media. Senator Fann stated that the Senate will likely have to go back to court to enforce the subpoena and retrieve the remaining items.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:05 pm Highlights from AZ Audit Senate Hearing 7/15

Hand Count

• Ballot duplication nightmare. Serial numbers are required to match the original and duplicated ballot. “Thousands” of ballots are either missing serial numbers or have unreadable serial numbers printed over a dark black ballot identification box. Ken Bennett stated that it’s impossible to determine whether a ballot was duplicated more than once.

Machine Analysis

• Inferior equipment verification process. Senator Peterson noted that if the EAC equipment verification process cannot handle evaluation by an audit, then we need a new certification procedure.

• Cyber security vulnerabilities, missing security event data, and suspicious logins. Ben Cotton of CyFIR emphasized the critical need for router and Splunk log data. He gave 4 reasons:

a) The November election system breach reported by Maricopa County and the SoS.

b) Extreme cyber security vulnerabilities: the last malware and operating system/ security patch update was in August 2019 when the Dominion software was originally installed. “It would take less than 10 min to gain system-level access.”

c) Security event data only goes back to 2/5/21. By design, the security log only holds 20 MB of data. Strangely, on 3/11/21, there were 37,646 queries for a blank password that had had the effect of overwriting the data prior to 2/5/21.

d) Suspicious anonymous logons. CyFIR has found anonymous logons at the system level that do not follow the pattern of normal Windows behavior.

• Maricopa County is unable to validate the security of the election system. The evidence provided suggests that only Dominion is able to verify the ICP configuration. Cotton explains that it’s impossible to validate the security of an election system if you cannot independently validate the configuration. CyFIR needs the authentication fobs held by Dominion to check ICP configuration.

Paper Analysis

• Ballot calibration was off by an average of 1000% in some batches leading to bleed-through, which can cause over-votes or inaccurate vote attribution. The County has stated that they use thick VoteSecure paper, which should limit bleed-through in the event of mis-calibration. However, the Cyber Ninjas team found a large number of ballots on very thin paper stock. The ballots printed on-demand at the voting centers on Election Day have the worst calibration issues. More than 168K ballots were affected.

Voter Rolls

• Voter roll anomalies affect more than 107K ballots. Doug Logan “highly recommends canvassing” based on the data his team has reviewed. For example:

a) There are 74,243 mail-in ballots with no clear record of being sent out

b) 11,326 people who voted do not show up on the 11/7 voter rolls, but are listed in the 12/4 database

c) 3,981 people who voted on Election Day were registered after 10/15, which is a violation of state law

d) Approximately 18k people voted on Election Day but were subsequently removed from the rolls

Envelopes

• Maricopa County did not turn over images of the envelopes as requested in the January subpoena

Closing Remarks

The hearing concluded with a review of the 17 missing items needed to complete the audit, many of them already subpoenaed, including router data, Splunk logs, hardware tokens, envelope images, chain of custody documentation, and all portable media. Senator Fann stated that the Senate will likely have to go back to court to enforce the subpoena and retrieve the remaining items.
All based on conclusions rendered by people who had no idea as to what they were doing and are also credibility criticized because everybody knows it was a partisan effort rather than a serious review.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

SDHornet wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 10:02 am
kalm wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:12 am

Holy shit! Well if Tucker says it... :lol:

They should rush this to the courts!
He didn't, the ALC and vids of shady stuff going on in Fulton County said it. :coffee:
Ok I watched the whole thing to make sure he didn't provide key information that he left out when he referenced the Atlanta Journal Constitution. What he left out is that the Atlanta Journal Constitution said that the double counting of ballots documented by the images had no impact on the final certified results. That's a pretty important piece of information to leave out.

I'm waiting to see what happens with the tally sheet thing but if I had to bet I'd bet there is nothing to it. I say that for a couple of reasons. One is that I've seen this kind of "Oh we've got the smoking gun" stuff before from the "election was stolen crowd" and it always ends up being a situation in which, once we get the full story, nothing nefarious happened. Many times it turns out to be a situation in which the people who made the allegation didn't understand what they were looking at. The other is that I think it extremely unlikely that someone would fill out a tally sheet that is going to be counted and deliberately falsify it by writing "100 to 0" when the actually votes distributed between 3 candidates then sign their name to the tally sheet. We'll see what happens with that. If something really made an official record claiming that there were 100 percent of votes for Biden when the truth is that there were something like 60 for Biden, 35 for Trump, and 5 for Jorgenson we will indeed hear about people being criminally prosecuted. I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for that. We''ll see.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:13 pm
SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:05 pm Highlights from AZ Audit Senate Hearing 7/15

Hand Count

• Ballot duplication nightmare. Serial numbers are required to match the original and duplicated ballot. “Thousands” of ballots are either missing serial numbers or have unreadable serial numbers printed over a dark black ballot identification box. Ken Bennett stated that it’s impossible to determine whether a ballot was duplicated more than once.

Machine Analysis

• Inferior equipment verification process. Senator Peterson noted that if the EAC equipment verification process cannot handle evaluation by an audit, then we need a new certification procedure.

• Cyber security vulnerabilities, missing security event data, and suspicious logins. Ben Cotton of CyFIR emphasized the critical need for router and Splunk log data. He gave 4 reasons:

a) The November election system breach reported by Maricopa County and the SoS.

b) Extreme cyber security vulnerabilities: the last malware and operating system/ security patch update was in August 2019 when the Dominion software was originally installed. “It would take less than 10 min to gain system-level access.”

c) Security event data only goes back to 2/5/21. By design, the security log only holds 20 MB of data. Strangely, on 3/11/21, there were 37,646 queries for a blank password that had had the effect of overwriting the data prior to 2/5/21.

d) Suspicious anonymous logons. CyFIR has found anonymous logons at the system level that do not follow the pattern of normal Windows behavior.

• Maricopa County is unable to validate the security of the election system. The evidence provided suggests that only Dominion is able to verify the ICP configuration. Cotton explains that it’s impossible to validate the security of an election system if you cannot independently validate the configuration. CyFIR needs the authentication fobs held by Dominion to check ICP configuration.

Paper Analysis

• Ballot calibration was off by an average of 1000% in some batches leading to bleed-through, which can cause over-votes or inaccurate vote attribution. The County has stated that they use thick VoteSecure paper, which should limit bleed-through in the event of mis-calibration. However, the Cyber Ninjas team found a large number of ballots on very thin paper stock. The ballots printed on-demand at the voting centers on Election Day have the worst calibration issues. More than 168K ballots were affected.

Voter Rolls

• Voter roll anomalies affect more than 107K ballots. Doug Logan “highly recommends canvassing” based on the data his team has reviewed. For example:

a) There are 74,243 mail-in ballots with no clear record of being sent out

b) 11,326 people who voted do not show up on the 11/7 voter rolls, but are listed in the 12/4 database

c) 3,981 people who voted on Election Day were registered after 10/15, which is a violation of state law

d) Approximately 18k people voted on Election Day but were subsequently removed from the rolls

Envelopes

• Maricopa County did not turn over images of the envelopes as requested in the January subpoena

Closing Remarks

The hearing concluded with a review of the 17 missing items needed to complete the audit, many of them already subpoenaed, including router data, Splunk logs, hardware tokens, envelope images, chain of custody documentation, and all portable media. Senator Fann stated that the Senate will likely have to go back to court to enforce the subpoena and retrieve the remaining items.
All based on conclusions rendered by people who had no idea as to what they were doing and are also credibility criticized because everybody knows it was a partisan effort rather than a serious review.
:rofl: You're a misinformed broken record dude. If you listened to the report, they never once said anything was untoward and actually offered fair reasons as to why some of the issues could have happened.

If they don't know what they are doing, where have the reports been from the auditors of the audit that are there on behalf of the AZ Secretary of State?

You know, from Ryan Macias, who was caught lying to gain entry and then wouldn't explain why he lied and said he was a reporter? He was then chosen by the AZ SOS as her choice as an audit auditor. Where are his reports?
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by CID1990 »

Well, at least the AZ audit actually presents some data, instead of "Trump was ahead and then suddenly he wasn't!!" as evidence of election fraud.

If the AZ findings are bogus, then it should be fairly easy to prove.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Skjellyfetti »

Doesn't sound great for SCOTUS naming Trump the rightful President by August. Oh well. Seems like the focus had begun shifting to Jawjuh anyway. That'll do it for sure.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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Skjellyfetti wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:55 pm Doesn't sound great for SCOTUS naming Trump the rightful President by August. Oh well. Seems like the focus had begun shifting to Jawjuh anyway. That'll do it for sure.
Who other than the fringe believes they are going to kick Biden to the street and install Trump? I keep reading there is no precedent or pathway for this to happen.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:27 pm
Skjellyfetti wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:55 pm Doesn't sound great for SCOTUS naming Trump the rightful President by August. Oh well. Seems like the focus had begun shifting to Jawjuh anyway. That'll do it for sure.
Who other than the fringe believes they are going to kick Biden to the street and install Trump? I keep reading there is no precedent or pathway for this to happen.
only the fringe of the fringe, and then the fringe of the fringe on the left (like analjelly) who believe the conspiracy theories from the boogeyman right.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

JohnStOnge wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:31 pm
SDHornet wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 10:02 am
He didn't, the ALC and vids of shady stuff going on in Fulton County said it. :coffee:
Ok I watched the whole thing to make sure he didn't provide key information that he left out when he referenced the Atlanta Journal Constitution. What he left out is that the Atlanta Journal Constitution said that the double counting of ballots documented by the images had no impact on the final certified results. That's a pretty important piece of information to leave out.

I'm waiting to see what happens with the tally sheet thing but if I had to bet I'd bet there is nothing to it. I say that for a couple of reasons. One is that I've seen this kind of "Oh we've got the smoking gun" stuff before from the "election was stolen crowd" and it always ends up being a situation in which, once we get the full story, nothing nefarious happened. Many times it turns out to be a situation in which the people who made the allegation didn't understand what they were looking at. The other is that I think it extremely unlikely that someone would fill out a tally sheet that is going to be counted and deliberately falsify it by writing "100 to 0" when the actually votes distributed between 3 candidates then sign their name to the tally sheet. We'll see what happens with that. If something really made an official record claiming that there were 100 percent of votes for Biden when the truth is that there were something like 60 for Biden, 35 for Trump, and 5 for Jorgenson we will indeed hear about people being criminally prosecuted. I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for that. We''ll see.
No one knows that until a forensic audit is complete. Nice spin though. :thumb:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:05 pm Highlights from AZ Audit Senate Hearing 7/15

Voter Rolls

• Voter roll anomalies affect more than 107K ballots. Doug Logan “highly recommends canvassing” based on the data his team has reviewed. For example:

a) There are 74,243 mail-in ballots with no clear record of being sent out

b) 11,326 people who voted do not show up on the 11/7 voter rolls, but are listed in the 12/4 database

c) 3,981 people who voted on Election Day were registered after 10/15, which is a violation of state law

d) Approximately 18k people voted on Election Day but were subsequently removed from the rolls

Closing Remarks

The hearing concluded with a review of the 17 missing items needed to complete the audit, many of them already subpoenaed, including router data, Splunk logs, hardware tokens, envelope images, chain of custody documentation, and all portable media. Senator Fann stated that the Senate will likely have to go back to court to enforce the subpoena and retrieve the remaining items.
So basically they got the ballots in and back-tracked on the "registration" to make them look legit. No way this can be just some "oopsies we have inexperienced people handling the ballots" mistake. :coffee:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:27 pm
Skjellyfetti wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:55 pm Doesn't sound great for SCOTUS naming Trump the rightful President by August. Oh well. Seems like the focus had begun shifting to Jawjuh anyway. That'll do it for sure.
Who other than the fringe believes they are going to kick Biden to the street and install Trump? I keep reading there is no precedent or pathway for this to happen.
It's the new narrative the Left is pimping. No one in their right mind thinks Trump will be declared POTUS. But that GA Senate seat is another matter. Was there enough illegal votes to force the 2nd runoff vote?
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SeattleGriz »

SDHornet wrote: Fri Jul 16, 2021 10:24 am
SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:05 pm Highlights from AZ Audit Senate Hearing 7/15

Voter Rolls

• Voter roll anomalies affect more than 107K ballots. Doug Logan “highly recommends canvassing” based on the data his team has reviewed. For example:

a) There are 74,243 mail-in ballots with no clear record of being sent out

b) 11,326 people who voted do not show up on the 11/7 voter rolls, but are listed in the 12/4 database

c) 3,981 people who voted on Election Day were registered after 10/15, which is a violation of state law

d) Approximately 18k people voted on Election Day but were subsequently removed from the rolls

Closing Remarks

The hearing concluded with a review of the 17 missing items needed to complete the audit, many of them already subpoenaed, including router data, Splunk logs, hardware tokens, envelope images, chain of custody documentation, and all portable media. Senator Fann stated that the Senate will likely have to go back to court to enforce the subpoena and retrieve the remaining items.
So basically they got the ballots in and back-tracked on the "registration" to make them look legit. No way this can be just some "oopsies we have inexperienced people handling the ballots" mistake. :coffee:
Yes.

On the 75k ballots, there is discussion ballots were printed and submitted. A few affidavits that say the paper stock was really thin and marks bled through if you used a sharpie. That would explain how a ballot was submitted, but didn't have a record of being sent.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

CID1990 wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 6:41 pm Well, at least the AZ audit actually presents some data, instead of "Trump was ahead and then suddenly he wasn't!!" as evidence of election fraud.

If the AZ findings are bogus, then it should be fairly easy to prove.
i see two reasons for not be reassured by that. The first one is that the ballots and the equipment have been compromised. I'm sure you've heard/read plenty about all of the chain of custody issues. Everything has been being handled and manipulated by an overtly partisan group.

The second is that the Airzona Republican legislators are not objective. i think there could be proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the findings are bogus and it would be very possible that the Arizona Republican legislators would refuse to accept it.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 4:56 pm If they don't know what they are doing, where have the reports been from the auditors of the audit that are there on behalf of the AZ Secretary of State?
I don't know about reports from auditors, but she maintains a web page to report some problems. It's at https://azsos.gov/about-office/media-ce ... notes-2021 . Here is one observation of interest:
Observation: On May 26, 2021, observers noted that quality control practices to ensure data is entered correctly are still not in place rendering all of the data and findings unreliable.
I think she probably has a lot more. I think you will see a robust response if and when, as expected, this clown show partisan audit produces a report purporting to cast doubt upon the legitimacy of the certified results.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

SDHornet wrote: Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:47 pm
SeattleGriz wrote: Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:30 am

Oh I read that, but this was a small batch. Remember, we were told that double/triple scanning did NOT happen. Funny how the goalposts are moved by the AJC.

Okay, double/triple scanning did happen, but not much. :lol:
Time for a forensic audit in Georgia. Maybe Biden* can travel there and make more Jim Crow/Civil War speeches. :lol: :popcorn:

Ok. Here is the first thing I was able to find rebutting Carlson's claims:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/tucke ... ter-fraud/

And yes I know conservatives have attempted to discredit Snopes just like they've attempted to discredit other fact-checkers because fact checking has not worked out well for conservatives in recent years. But I predict that Snopes will be shown to be correct over time. Everything Carlson talked about has a reasonable explanation. There was no fraud. There were errors. And the errors had no impact on the final certified results. That includes the tally sheets.

The worst thing is, I think, that Carlson knew he was being misleading. That's the sad thing about the conservative media and Republican politicians at this time in history. They know they are misleading people. But they are doing it anyway because it benefits them.
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JohnStOnge
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by JohnStOnge »

SeattleGriz wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 6:56 am
kalm wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 6:37 am

Trump’s victory in 2016 is clearly now in question. As are the Republican gains in the house last year.
Tell you what. When Trump won due to 88k in votes over three states, I thought that was great, since I disliked The Hildabeast. Then when Joe won by 42k in votes over three states, that really piqued my interest. I now find both scenarios sketchy.

While I understand the electoral college, I'm having a tough time reconciling two elections in which 130 k in votes out of 300 million have chosen our last two Presidents. Foil hat moment here, but it makes me think "powers that be" are choosing our Presidents.
The reason for getting rid of the Electoral College system is that the President is the ONE government official who represents ALL of the people in the United States. The winner of the vote among ALL of the people in the United States should be President.

If we did it that way, there would be no issue. Trump lost by 2.9 million votes cast by ALL of the people in 2016 and lost by 7.1 million in 2020. If we didn't have the Electoral College system we would not be going through all this crap with Republicans lying about State by State election results right now. There would be no point in it. Plus, again: It is just morally right to say that the person who gets the most votes wins in the Presidential election.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by CID1990 »

JohnStOnge wrote: Fri Jul 16, 2021 2:59 pm
CID1990 wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 6:41 pm Well, at least the AZ audit actually presents some data, instead of "Trump was ahead and then suddenly he wasn't!!" as evidence of election fraud.

If the AZ findings are bogus, then it should be fairly easy to prove.
i see two reasons for not be reassured by that. The first one is that the ballots and the equipment have been compromised. I'm sure you've heard/read plenty about all of the chain of custody issues. Everything has been being handled and manipulated by an overtly partisan group.

The second is that the Airzona Republican legislators are not objective. i think there could be proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the findings are bogus and it would be very possible that the Arizona Republican legislators would refuse to accept it.
Both of those points are immaterial.

First, there's plenty in that report that can still be chased down or verified.

Certain sections of the GOP have rejected the fact that several courts have either thrown out or rejected to examine the early wild claims about election fraud back around the turn of the year, so I'm not sure why "the right would reject it" is some kind of bugaboo for you. It just sounds like you have a peculiar lack of curiosity.
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