2020 General Election

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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Ibanez »

Winterborn wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:23 am
GannonFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:18 am

Of course. The Resistance and #notmypresident and the '08 #endofanerror were all great examples of handling losses with grace and dignity. :coffee:
Not liking to lose is a universal human condition. :)
True. And there are going to be pouters and people that throw out stupid things like " Impeach 45' or "#ErrorInChief". But to actively engage and demand that votes just be found, materialized out of thin air is next level craziness.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by UNI88 »

Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:31 am
Winterborn wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:23 am
Not liking to lose is a universal human condition. :)
True. And there are going to be pouters and people that throw out stupid things like " Impeach 45' or "#ErrorInChief". But to actively engage and demand that votes just be found, materialized out of thin air is next level craziness.
Everything Trump does, including whining and throwing tantrums, is Bigly YUGE!
Last edited by UNI88 on Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:27 am
GannonFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:18 am

Of course. The Resistance and #notmypresident and the '08 #endofanerror were all great examples of handling losses with grace and dignity. :coffee:
They aren't...but then again they weren't actively seeking to overthrow the election, beg states to find votes and flip the state, ask the VP to not certify the results. There's always going to be sore losers, that's expected. But I think Trump and MAGA world have gone beyond the normal whining and pouting.
No they tried to impeach on manufactured evidence instead. :lol: :dunce:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:28 am
SDHornet wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:13 am

Depends on how that loss comes about. Another night of shenanigans and you have the trend. I think the DNC has wised up to have even more ballots stuffed and it won't have to come to that.
So, the Republicans in Georgia's government are too stupid to secure their own elections?

Well, they were in November but if they Republicans get the outcome they desire tonight, then it's back to being a fair election, right?


And what about those Republican's that won in October? Are their victories not suspect? If Trump lost, then how'd all those down ballot tickets win?
Everything about the GA vote is suspect. It's not that hard to understand.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

UNI88 wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:32 am
Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:31 am

True. And there are going to be pouters and people that throw out stupid things like " Impeach 45' or "#ErrorInChief". But to actively engage and demand that votes just be found, materialized out of thin air is next level craziness.
Everything Trump does, including whining and throwing tantrums, is YUGE!
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by GannonFan »

Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:28 am
SDHornet wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:13 am

Depends on how that loss comes about. Another night of shenanigans and you have the trend. I think the DNC has wised up to have even more ballots stuffed and it won't have to come to that.
So, the Republicans in Georgia's government are too stupid to secure their own elections?

Well, they were in November but if they Republicans get the outcome they desire tonight, then it's back to being a fair election, right?


And what about those Republican's that won in October? Are their victories not suspect? If Trump lost, then how'd all those down ballot tickets win?
I for one don't think the election was stolen. I think there are irregularities in every election, I think our election laws and procedures are pretty inefficient and potentially problematic, but I don't see any evidence that it was widespread enough to really impact the Presidential election. But when people bring up that "how come those down ballot tickets" didn't win too, I think that's a red herring. Down ballot elections are local, so you would need to be pretty widespread geographically, and even in districts that you don't have control of, to change those elections. For President, you can tip the scales in one big location, say a major city (and most major cities are already predominately one-party control anyway) and impact the Presidential election without getting the coattails of elections away from that major city. I don't think that happened, but to say it didn't happen because the down ballot tickets didn't win isn't being honest either.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by GannonFan »

SDHornet wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:33 am
Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:27 am

They aren't...but then again they weren't actively seeking to overthrow the election, beg states to find votes and flip the state, ask the VP to not certify the results. There's always going to be sore losers, that's expected. But I think Trump and MAGA world have gone beyond the normal whining and pouting.
No they tried to impeach on manufactured evidence instead. :lol: :dunce:
I even forgot about that farce of an impeachment. And I don't even like Trump, but that was next level political temper tantrum for sure.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by SDHornet »

GannonFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:38 am
SDHornet wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:33 am

No they tried to impeach on manufactured evidence instead. :lol: :dunce:
I even forgot about that farce of an impeachment. And I don't even like Trump, but that was next level political temper tantrum for sure.
Hey but unity or something. :rofl:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Ibanez »

SDHornet wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:34 am
Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:28 am

So, the Republicans in Georgia's government are too stupid to secure their own elections?

Well, they were in November but if they Republicans get the outcome they desire tonight, then it's back to being a fair election, right?


And what about those Republican's that won in October? Are their victories not suspect? If Trump lost, then how'd all those down ballot tickets win?
Everything about the GA vote is suspect. It's not that hard to understand.
We can easily resolve this - Trump submits all the evidence he and his campaign claim to have.

It's very interesting that in the weeks since the election, with the 50+ lawsuits, no evidence has been submitted.

If you think you've been wronged, supply proof. That's not hard to understand, either.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Ibanez »

SDHornet wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:33 am
Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:27 am

They aren't...but then again they weren't actively seeking to overthrow the election, beg states to find votes and flip the state, ask the VP to not certify the results. There's always going to be sore losers, that's expected. But I think Trump and MAGA world have gone beyond the normal whining and pouting.
No they tried to impeach on manufactured evidence instead. :lol: :dunce:
Manufactured? I don't know about that. But they were certainly grasping at anything. I think the impeachment was a huge mistake. Talking about impeachment from day 1 was a huge mistake. The Dems never turn down a moment to screw themselves.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Ibanez »

GannonFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:36 am
Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:28 am

So, the Republicans in Georgia's government are too stupid to secure their own elections?

Well, they were in November but if they Republicans get the outcome they desire tonight, then it's back to being a fair election, right?


And what about those Republican's that won in October? Are their victories not suspect? If Trump lost, then how'd all those down ballot tickets win?
I for one don't think the election was stolen. I think there are irregularities in every election, I think our election laws and procedures are pretty inefficient and potentially problematic, but I don't see any evidence that it was widespread enough to really impact the Presidential election. But when people bring up that "how come those down ballot tickets" didn't win too, I think that's a red herring. Down ballot elections are local, so you would need to be pretty widespread geographically, and even in districts that you don't have control of, to change those elections. For President, you can tip the scales in one big location, say a major city (and most major cities are already predominately one-party control anyway) and impact the Presidential election without getting the coattails of elections away from that major city. I don't think that happened, but to say it didn't happen because the down ballot tickets didn't win isn't being honest either.
Right - but if you have 100 Republicans voting in a local race for Congressman X, you would expect to have 100 Republican votes for the top of the ticket. There's something there and i'm assuming it's Republicans who were tired of Trump (not to mention indy's like me who vote a mix of D/R).
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Re: 2020 General Election

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Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:14 am
GannonFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:36 am

I for one don't think the election was stolen. I think there are irregularities in every election, I think our election laws and procedures are pretty inefficient and potentially problematic, but I don't see any evidence that it was widespread enough to really impact the Presidential election. But when people bring up that "how come those down ballot tickets" didn't win too, I think that's a red herring. Down ballot elections are local, so you would need to be pretty widespread geographically, and even in districts that you don't have control of, to change those elections. For President, you can tip the scales in one big location, say a major city (and most major cities are already predominately one-party control anyway) and impact the Presidential election without getting the coattails of elections away from that major city. I don't think that happened, but to say it didn't happen because the down ballot tickets didn't win isn't being honest either.
Right - but if you have 100 Republicans voting in a local race for Congressman X, you would expect to have 100 Republican votes for the top of the ticket. There's something there and i'm assuming it's Republicans who were tired of Trump (not to mention indy's like me who vote a mix of D/R).
Like I said, it's district by district. Did Trump lose districts where Republicans running for Congress won? Or did Biden just do well in larger, Democratic-dominated districts? I don't know the answer but I doubt that there are many instances of the former and probably a lot of instances of the latter.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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GannonFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:23 am
Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:14 am

Right - but if you have 100 Republicans voting in a local race for Congressman X, you would expect to have 100 Republican votes for the top of the ticket. There's something there and i'm assuming it's Republicans who were tired of Trump (not to mention indy's like me who vote a mix of D/R).
Like I said, it's district by district. Did Trump lose districts where Republicans running for Congress won? Or did Biden just do well in larger, Democratic-dominated districts? I don't know the answer but I doubt that there are many instances of the former and probably a lot of instances of the latter.
So I brought that up b/c I've heard the argument that there's no way Trump could've lost and down ticket Republicans won. I spent 2 weeks around my MAGA family and a few friends and that's one of the many arguments they throw out (along side other Gateway Pundit and Fox News conspiracies.)
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Pwns »

Some notes about the Georgia runoff.

I think Purdue will beat Ossoff by at least a point but the Loeffler-Warnock race is more unclear.

Loeffler was appointed by the governor and has never really had a to fight for a seat in congress, and it shows. She's just too robotic and from what I've seen people don't really like her that much.

If nothing else I won't have 15 unread campaign spam texts if I go a few hours without looking at my phone.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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AZGrizFan wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 5:26 pm
AshevilleApp wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 2:56 pm


When exactly did both parties approve building a wall? You may be right, I'm just curious . And how much wall? A quick search shows somewhere between 15 and 30 miles of new wall where no barriers had been before. Something like 425 miles of replacement barriers as well. Out of a 2000 mile border with Mexico. He sho' got that wall built! He said he did though, so it must be true.

I am glad about the troops coming home , they never should have been there to begin with. Although I don't recall Republicans saying they would do that for years.
If you don’t think there’s a gigantic difference between the wall being built and the “barriers” (and i use that word VERY loosely) being replaced, you haven’t been paying attention. all those “barriers” did was mark the actual border. They didn’t stop shit.

Fair enough. So we now have secured around 25% of the border, which still won't stop shit. If someone wants in, they'll get in. Great political drama though.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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AshevilleApp wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:00 pm
AZGrizFan wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 5:26 pm

If you don’t think there’s a gigantic difference between the wall being built and the “barriers” (and i use that word VERY loosely) being replaced, you haven’t been paying attention. all those “barriers” did was mark the actual border. They didn’t stop shit.

Fair enough. So we now have secured around 25% of the border, which still won't stop shit. If someone wants in, they'll get in. Great political drama though.
Not true. There are parts of the border that are impassable. there are parts of the border that are already effectively walled (or patrolled). We don’t need 2500 miles of fence to make it secure. And it’s not just political drama if you live down here, trust me.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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Pwns wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:46 am Some notes about the Georgia runoff.

I think Purdue will beat Ossoff by at least a point but the Loeffler-Warnock race is more unclear.

Loeffler was appointed by the governor and has never really had a to fight for a seat in congress, and it shows. She's just too robotic and from what I've seen people don't really like her that much.

If nothing else I won't have 15 unread campaign spam texts if I go a few hours without looking at my phone.
So you’ve got “robotic” Loeffler vs psychotic wife-beater Warnock.

I’ll take robotic for $1,000, Alex.....
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Ibanez »

AZGrizFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:37 pm
Pwns wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:46 am Some notes about the Georgia runoff.

I think Purdue will beat Ossoff by at least a point but the Loeffler-Warnock race is more unclear.

Loeffler was appointed by the governor and has never really had a to fight for a seat in congress, and it shows. She's just too robotic and from what I've seen people don't really like her that much.

If nothing else I won't have 15 unread campaign spam texts if I go a few hours without looking at my phone.
So you’ve got “robotic” Loeffler vs psychotic wife-beater Warnock.

I’ll take robotic for $1,000, Alex.....
Honest question - and I don't know much about Warnock, but why is he psychotic?


We all support a candidate that has done something wrong - stealing campaign money, adultery, sexual assault, banging interns/pages, running over your ex's foot...we tend to ignore those failures when the person has an R or D behind their name.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by AZGrizFan »

Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:44 pm
AZGrizFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:37 pm

So you’ve got “robotic” Loeffler vs psychotic wife-beater Warnock.

I’ll take robotic for $1,000, Alex.....
Honest question - and I don't know much about Warnock, but why is he psychotic?


We all support a candidate that has done something wrong - stealing campaign money, adultery, sexual assault, banging interns/pages, running over your ex's foot...we tend to ignore those failures when the person has an R or D behind their name.

Have you not seen the video with his wife? :ohno: :ohno: :ohno:
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Ibanez »

AZGrizFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:45 pm
Ibanez wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:44 pm
Honest question - and I don't know much about Warnock, but why is he psychotic?


We all support a candidate that has done something wrong - stealing campaign money, adultery, sexual assault, banging interns/pages, running over your ex's foot...we tend to ignore those failures when the person has an R or D behind their name.

Have you not seen the video with his wife? :ohno: :ohno: :ohno:
I've heard about it. is that he one where he ran over her foot? I also don't really care - I've got enough to worry about with Ms. G in representing this insane asylum.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by Pwns »

AZGrizFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:37 pm
Pwns wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:46 am Some notes about the Georgia runoff.

I think Purdue will beat Ossoff by at least a point but the Loeffler-Warnock race is more unclear.

Loeffler was appointed by the governor and has never really had a to fight for a seat in congress, and it shows. She's just too robotic and from what I've seen people don't really like her that much.

If nothing else I won't have 15 unread campaign spam texts if I go a few hours without looking at my phone.
So you’ve got “robotic” Loeffler vs psychotic wife-beater Warnock.

I’ll take robotic for $1,000, Alex.....
Yeah, but what about easing the white guilt of Atlanta suburbanites who take long commutes through a poorly-planned monstrosity of a city to ensure their kids go to lily-white schools. That's important.
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Re: 2020 General Election

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SDHornet wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:10 pm
SeattleGriz wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 11:49 am

What's different is he accomplished what Republicans have been saying they would do for years.

He simply did what he said he was going to do. It wasn't just lip service.

For a quick example, look at the wall. How long ago did both parties approve to build the wall but didn't do anything? How about trying to get our troops home? Those are just two of the multiple things he said he would do. All this while having to deal with the Dems and the NeverTrumpers.

Don't forget I didn't vote for him back in 2016, but he earned my vote this year. I also have said he is the perfect asshole to deal with our elected assholes.
This. The Trump appeal is that he got shit done that congress critters have been talking about for decades. Add in how the economy boomed/rebounded under his policies, specifically for the middle class and minorities, and I'm not surprised to see his popularity soar even with the msm that set out to tear him down before he even took office. Like him or not what he has accomplished has been impressive.
Yep. Esp when you consider that his 1st yr he didn’t get much help from conks in Congress because:
-none of them expected him to win, so they were totally unprepared to work with a conk White House..Ex they had no plan to repeal & replace Obamacare. After all, why woukd they need a plan with Clinton in the WH?
-After Trump won most conks in DC didn’t expect him to surivive the Russian Collusion Delusional Fake News scandal.
Then his 4th year had the China Virus on top of the election. So Trump basically had 2 normal years to get stuff done. The fact that he got everything done he did is pretty incredible considering the circumstances.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by BDKJMU »

AshevilleApp wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 2:56 pm
SeattleGriz wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 11:49 am

What's different is he accomplished what Republicans have been saying they would do for years.

He simply did what he said he was going to do. It wasn't just lip service.

For a quick example, look at the wall. How long ago did both parties approve to build the wall but didn't do anything? How about trying to get our troops home? Those are just two of the multiple things he said he would do. All this while having to deal with the Dems and the NeverTrumpers.

Don't forget I didn't vote for him back in 2016, but he earned my vote this year. I also have said he is the perfect asshole to deal with our elected assholes.
When exactly did both parties approve building a wall? You may be right, I'm just curious . And how much wall? A quick search shows somewhere between 15 and 30 miles of new wall where no barriers had been before. Something like 425 miles of replacement barriers as well. Out of a 2000 mile border with Mexico. He sho' got that wall built! He said he did though, so it must be true.

I am glad about the troops coming home , they never should have been there to begin with. Although I don't recall Republicans saying they would do that for years.
Most of those prior ‘barrier’ were nothing more than rickity speed bumps that could easily be tunneled under, cut through, climbed over. And funding has been approved with contracts awarded for 800 miles, so won’t be easy for Biden to undo that.
While much of the wall has been replacement for existing structures, officials have repeatedly noted that the enormous 30-foot structures – complete with anti-climb technology and cameras – are radically different from the old landing mat that it replaced.
Morgan has said that the 450 miles does not mark an end to the project, and pointed to $1.375 billion that was included in the recent omnibus spending bill passed by Congress and signed by President Trump.

That money completes a total of about $16 billion for the wall system, Morgan said, which will fund a total of almost 800 miles of new wall.

"So in addition to the 450 that we’ve already got on the ground, we’ve got funded 350 miles of wall system to go in the ground," he said. "The overwhelming amount of those miles, that funding, the contracts have already been awarded."

The future of construction at the border is unclear. President-elect Joe Biden opposed wall construction and has promised that "there will not be another foot of wall constructed on my administration."

However, it might not be that simple. Morgan warned that with those contracts already awarded, it would cost the U.S. "billions" to suddenly walk away from those contracts and could cost thousands of jobs.

The challenge marks one of a number that the Biden administration will have to navigate if it wants to dramatically change track on immigration. Biden has promised to end a number of key Trump policies on illegal immigration and asylum – leading to fears that such changes could lead to a border surge and a new migration crisis.

Top Biden officials recently warned that changes may take longer than some had expected...
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trumps ... 0-mile.amp
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by BDKJMU »

SeattleGriz wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 5:47 pm
AZGrizFan wrote: Mon Jan 04, 2021 5:26 pm

If you don’t think there’s a gigantic difference between the wall being built and the “barriers” (and i use that word VERY loosely) being replaced, you haven’t been paying attention. all those “barriers” did was mark the actual border. They didn’t stop shit.
Exactly. Don't hear much from the communities whose crime/drug rates have dropped since the replacement fencing. They're pretty happy with the new fence.
Bingo.
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Re: 2020 General Election

Post by BDKJMU »

GannonFan wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 8:29 am
bluehenbillk wrote: Tue Jan 05, 2021 8:09 am I didn't see a separate Georgia thread here so excuse me for working in today's Senate runoff but here's my question:

The way the Senate works, with the exception of judicial appointments, don't you need 60 votes to pass legislature, etc from the Senate? Maybe Cabinet appointments just need a majority too but if legislation, taxes, etc needs to go through don't you still need 60? Trump's first two years in office a lot got stuck in the Senate b/c they never had 60 votes.

Anyone?
Yes, currently you don't need 60 votes for judicial appointments (the Dems hit the nuclear button on all appointments other than SCOTUS back in 2013, and then the GOP pressed the button again in 2017 to include SCOTUS picks), and you don't need 60 votes for the budget reconciliation process when dealing with taxes or spending (it is somewhat narrow, but what falls under that could be expanded as needed by the party in power).

With that said, the Dems have been very clear for the past election cycle that nothing is off the table to pass what they want to pass and if that means dumping the filibuster rule to get it then that is certainly an option. Schumer has been saying that for at least the past year. Biden is supposed to be the calming influence in that regard, but he supported the nuclear option as VP when Reid did it in 2013 (and he opposed it when the GOP did it in 2017 - apparently it just matters if it benefits you or not). There will be a lot of pressure to dump the filibuster to pass as much as possible over the next two years as a 50/50 split in the Senate means Harris can break the tie everytime. I imagine much of the climate change legislation will go that route.
Joe Manchin came out on record in Nov and said if the donks took control of the Senate he wouldn’t support emding the fillibuster, court packing, Green New Deal, etc..
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