Here we go again- Atlanta

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by SDHornet »

CAA Flagship wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:47 am
SeattleGriz wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 11:44 am
Second question about the Wendy's burning down. Who carries shit with them that could burn down a Wendy's?

If I was there, I could produce my phone, wallet, half gallon wiper fluid and an old produce box from Costco for keeping groceries from rolling around. Hardly a recipe to burn down a Wendy's.

I can understand if you were more rural.
There was a gas station next door.
Finish your 40 and fill it up with gas for about 20 cents.
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by CitadelGrad »

kalm wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 6:01 am
CitadelGrad wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 10:38 pm


fbi.gov
Linky no worky
It's the FBI. Do I really have to tell you how to get there?
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by UNI88 »

CitadelGrad wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:20 am
kalm wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 6:01 am

Linky no worky
It's the FBI. Do I really have to tell you how to get there?
One Twitter video and a broken link to the FBI proves what?

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by kalm »

CitadelGrad wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:20 am
kalm wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 6:01 am


Linky no worky
It's the FBI. Do I really have to tell you how to get there?
It was your assertion. A working link would be nice...if you actually had anything....thanks for trying tho.
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by BDKJMU »

This officer getting railroaded. The 2 cops were having a professional encounter with the guy until the guy resisted arrest and got in a fight with the 2 cops, took one of their tasers, started to run, then turned back and pointed the taser at the officer. WTF was the officer suppose to do? If the officer goes hands on with the guy and gets tasered & incapacitaed, then the suspect could grab his gun & shoot him with it.

The dipstick mayor chimed in right off the bat that the shooting was unjustified and DA says contemplating murder charges. Talk about a rush to judgement.

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by CID1990 »

BDKJMU wrote:This officer getting railroaded. The 2 cops were having a professional encounter with the guy until the guy resisted arrest and got in a fight with the 2 cops, took one of their tasers, started to run, then turned back and pointed the taser at the officer. WTF was the officer suppose to do? If the officer goes hands on with the guy and gets tasered & incapacitaed, then the suspect could grab his gun & shoot him with it.

The dipstick mayor chimed in right off the bat that the shooting was unjustified and DA says contemplating murder charges. Talk about a rush to judgement.
I think there’s an element of reasonableness that needs to be applied here.

I know of a number of cases where officers have been killed after being incapacitated with a taser

In fact, there’s an active lawsuit against APD where someone died after being tased, and the lawsuit refers to a taser as a deadly weapon. So there’s that. Lots of case law supports this as a justified shooting. So there isn’t going to be civil or criminal liability here.

However, I would not have fired in this situation. I know this because I have been in a very similar one. I think the officer exhibited less than good judgment in this situation, and there’s no Monday morning quarterbacking needed to see it.

1) the guy is trying to escape. Anyone who has been in one of these encounters knows that dude is going to run until his feet fall off. Let him run! You have his car and his info. Pick him up on a warrant later.

2) there are two officers. If one is incapacitated with the taser, and then the perp advances on him, then you are in a deadly force situation. If I were alone, then I probably would have fired, even though the guy is running away because once Im down he can double back. Not going to happen if I have a partner with me.

So I’d call this a strictly legal shooting with poor judgment. If I’m a cop, I don’t want to work with this guy because one day he’s going to do it again and he might take me down with him. So I’m not bothered with the firing. Let the dude go sell insurance or something if he isn’t married to a RN


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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by CAA Flagship »

CID1990 wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:18 pm
BDKJMU wrote:This officer getting railroaded. The 2 cops were having a professional encounter with the guy until the guy resisted arrest and got in a fight with the 2 cops, took one of their tasers, started to run, then turned back and pointed the taser at the officer. WTF was the officer suppose to do? If the officer goes hands on with the guy and gets tasered & incapacitaed, then the suspect could grab his gun & shoot him with it.

The dipstick mayor chimed in right off the bat that the shooting was unjustified and DA says contemplating murder charges. Talk about a rush to judgement.
I think there’s an element of reasonableness that needs to be applied here.

I know of a number of cases where officers have been killed after being incapacitated with a taser

In fact, there’s an active lawsuit against APD where someone died after being tased, and the lawsuit refers to a taser as a deadly weapon. So there’s that. Lots of case law supports this as a justified shooting. So there isn’t going to be civil or criminal liability here.

However, I would not have fired in this situation. I know this because I have been in a very similar one. I think the officer exhibited less than good judgment in this situation, and there’s no Monday morning quarterbacking needed to see it.

1) the guy is trying to escape. Anyone who has been in one of these encounters knows that dude is going to run until his feet fall off. Let him run! You have his car and his info. Pick him up on a warrant later.

2) there are two officers. If one is incapacitated with the taser, and then the perp advances on him, then you are in a deadly force situation. If I were alone, then I probably would have fired, even though the guy is running away because once Im down he can double back. Not going to happen if I have a partner with me.

So I’d call this a strictly legal shooting with poor judgment. If I’m a cop, I don’t want to work with this guy because one day he’s going to do it again and he might take me down with him. So I’m not bothered with the firing. Let the dude go sell insurance or something if he isn’t married to a RN


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Damn, your 2 points are exactly what I have been saying from the start.
Yes, you have his car. You can probably figure out where he lives and arrest him there. Although, that puts more officers in danger of unknown threats such as barricading or support from neighbors. And yes, the second officer makes the taser less lethal in that he probably won't get to your gun.

Bottom line, Brooks did two things wrong before the cop made a poor judgement. He was drunk driving and fell asleep, and he resisted arrest. The poor judgement doesn't ever happen without the first two things.

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by GannonFan »

CAA Flagship wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:34 am
CID1990 wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:18 pm

I think there’s an element of reasonableness that needs to be applied here.

I know of a number of cases where officers have been killed after being incapacitated with a taser

In fact, there’s an active lawsuit against APD where someone died after being tased, and the lawsuit refers to a taser as a deadly weapon. So there’s that. Lots of case law supports this as a justified shooting. So there isn’t going to be civil or criminal liability here.

However, I would not have fired in this situation. I know this because I have been in a very similar one. I think the officer exhibited less than good judgment in this situation, and there’s no Monday morning quarterbacking needed to see it.

1) the guy is trying to escape. Anyone who has been in one of these encounters knows that dude is going to run until his feet fall off. Let him run! You have his car and his info. Pick him up on a warrant later.

2) there are two officers. If one is incapacitated with the taser, and then the perp advances on him, then you are in a deadly force situation. If I were alone, then I probably would have fired, even though the guy is running away because once Im down he can double back. Not going to happen if I have a partner with me.

So I’d call this a strictly legal shooting with poor judgment. If I’m a cop, I don’t want to work with this guy because one day he’s going to do it again and he might take me down with him. So I’m not bothered with the firing. Let the dude go sell insurance or something if he isn’t married to a RN


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Damn, your 2 points are exactly what I have been saying from the start.
Yes, you have his car. You can probably figure out where he lives and arrest him there. Although, that puts more officers in danger of unknown threats such as barricading or support from neighbors. And yes, the second officer makes the taser less lethal in that he probably won't get to your gun.

Bottom line, Brooks did two things wrong before the cop made a poor judgement. He was drunk driving and fell asleep, and he resisted arrest. The poor judgement doesn't ever happen without the first two things.
Agreed, but those bad judgements of drunk driving and resisting arrest don't warrant death. Sure, the cop was put into a bad situation, but there were better outcomes (as CID points out) and he didn't take those. This isn't murder, but it's an example of a cop letting a situation get out of control and making a bad decision that leads to a death that shouldn't have happened. Gotta be better.
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by AZGrizFan »

How does the cop know (at that point) that it's HIS TAZER that's being pointed back at him? Perhaps the dude had his own gun that he pulled given the chance and was pointing THAT back at the officers?

As a police officer, are you willing to put YOUR life on the line betting 100% that it's your tazer being pointed back at you?

Not me.
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by GannonFan »

AZGrizFan wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:17 am
How does the cop know (at that point) that it's HIS TAZER that's being pointed back at him? Perhaps the dude had his own gun that he pulled given the chance and was pointing THAT back at the officers?

As a police officer, are you willing to put YOUR life on the line betting 100% that it's your tazer being pointed back at you?

Not me.
Didn't they pretty much frisk this guy before any of that happened? Where would the guy have been hiding a gun that they wouldn't have found it?
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by CAA Flagship »

GannonFan wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:39 am
AZGrizFan wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:17 am
How does the cop know (at that point) that it's HIS TAZER that's being pointed back at him? Perhaps the dude had his own gun that he pulled given the chance and was pointing THAT back at the officers?

As a police officer, are you willing to put YOUR life on the line betting 100% that it's your tazer being pointed back at you?

Not me.
Didn't they pretty much frisk this guy before any of that happened? Where would the guy have been hiding a gun that they wouldn't have found it?
I don't know for sure. Don't they frisk after you cuff them sometimes? I see a lot of that on Live PD.

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by Gil Dobie »

CitadelGrad wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 7:54 am
SeattleGriz wrote:
Sun Jun 14, 2020 7:40 am


I want to know why the Wendy's had to be burned down? WTF did the burger joint have to do with it? Do they think Wendy's ratted the guy out for falling asleep in the drive thru lane?
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by Baldy »

CAA Flagship wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:47 am
GannonFan wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:39 am


Didn't they pretty much frisk this guy before any of that happened? Where would the guy have been hiding a gun that they wouldn't have found it?
I don't know for sure. Don't they frisk after you cuff them sometimes? I see a lot of that on Live PD.
He had already failed a field sobriety test, so I'm pretty sure he would have been frisked by then.

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by CAA Flagship »

Baldy wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:58 am
CAA Flagship wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:47 am

I don't know for sure. Don't they frisk after you cuff them sometimes? I see a lot of that on Live PD.
He had already failed a field sobriety test, so I'm pretty sure he would have been frisked by then.
Can you frisk someone that hasn't been charged yet? I don't know the protocol. Not sure of the proper sequence, especially in this case.

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by BDKJMU »

CAA Flagship wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:34 am
CID1990 wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:18 pm

I think there’s an element of reasonableness that needs to be applied here.

I know of a number of cases where officers have been killed after being incapacitated with a taser

In fact, there’s an active lawsuit against APD where someone died after being tased, and the lawsuit refers to a taser as a deadly weapon. So there’s that. Lots of case law supports this as a justified shooting. So there isn’t going to be civil or criminal liability here.

However, I would not have fired in this situation. I know this because I have been in a very similar one. I think the officer exhibited less than good judgment in this situation, and there’s no Monday morning quarterbacking needed to see it.

1) the guy is trying to escape. Anyone who has been in one of these encounters knows that dude is going to run until his feet fall off. Let him run! You have his car and his info. Pick him up on a warrant later.

2) there are two officers. If one is incapacitated with the taser, and then the perp advances on him, then you are in a deadly force situation. If I were alone, then I probably would have fired, even though the guy is running away because once Im down he can double back. Not going to happen if I have a partner with me.

So I’d call this a strictly legal shooting with poor judgment. If I’m a cop, I don’t want to work with this guy because one day he’s going to do it again and he might take me down with him. So I’m not bothered with the firing. Let the dude go sell insurance or something if he isn’t married to a RN


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Damn, your 2 points are exactly what I have been saying from the start.
Yes, you have his car. You can probably figure out where he lives and arrest him there. Although, that puts more officers in danger of unknown threats such as barricading or support from neighbors. And yes, the second officer makes the taser less lethal in that he probably won't get to your gun.

Bottom line, Brooks did two things wrong before the cop made a poor judgement. He was drunk driving and fell asleep, and he resisted arrest. The poor judgement doesn't ever happen without the first two things.
And assaulted law enforcement officers in the struggle.
And stole a taser.
And pointed the taser at the officer.
And deployed the taser at the officer? (one article I read claimed Brooks shot the taser at the officer)..

Brooks did about 5 things wrong, with multiple felonies, before the cop made poor judgement...
Last edited by BDKJMU on Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by GannonFan »

BDKJMU wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:07 am
CAA Flagship wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:34 am

Damn, your 2 points are exactly what I have been saying from the start.
Yes, you have his car. You can probably figure out where he lives and arrest him there. Although, that puts more officers in danger of unknown threats such as barricading or support from neighbors. And yes, the second officer makes the taser less lethal in that he probably won't get to your gun.

Bottom line, Brooks did two things wrong before the cop made a poor judgement. He was drunk driving and fell asleep, and he resisted arrest. The poor judgement doesn't ever happen without the first two things.
And assaulted law enforcement officers in the struggle.
And stole a taser.
And pointed and deployed the taser at the officer? (one article I read claimed Brooks shot the taser at the officer)..

Brooks did about 5 things wrong before the cop made poor judgement..
And yet, still, none of those things warrant a death sentence.
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by BDKJMU »

AZGrizFan wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:17 am
How does the cop know (at that point) that it's HIS TAZER that's being pointed back at him? Perhaps the dude had his own gun that he pulled given the chance and was pointing THAT back at the officers?

As a police officer, are you willing to put YOUR life on the line betting 100% that it's your tazer being pointed back at you?

Not me.
I ASSumed it was HIS (the officer who fired his firearm) taser. But one article I read said it was the other officer's taser, which would change a lot I think.

Why would a prosecutor the next day, on something that's clearly not cut and dry like the Floyd case, say that murder charges were being contemplated before an investigation had been done? Seems completely premature and irresponsible.

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by BDKJMU »

CAA Flagship wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:04 am
Baldy wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:58 am

He had already failed a field sobriety test, so I'm pretty sure he would have been frisked by then.
Can you frisk someone that hasn't been charged yet? I don't know the protocol. Not sure of the proper sequence, especially in this case.
Think they could have done a Terry frisk.

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by BDKJMU »

Black Georgia sheriff says shooting of Rayshard Brooks by Atlanta police was 'completely justified'
https://www.foxnews.com/media/sheriff-a ... -justified

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by CID1990 »

Again, the shooting was legal that isn’t being debated here But it was the culmination of a couple errors of judgment. There are all kinds of justified police shootings that are preventable - independent of anything the suspect does.
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by dbackjon »

CID1990 wrote:
Mon Jun 15, 2020 11:18 pm
BDKJMU wrote:This officer getting railroaded. The 2 cops were having a professional encounter with the guy until the guy resisted arrest and got in a fight with the 2 cops, took one of their tasers, started to run, then turned back and pointed the taser at the officer. WTF was the officer suppose to do? If the officer goes hands on with the guy and gets tasered & incapacitaed, then the suspect could grab his gun & shoot him with it.

The dipstick mayor chimed in right off the bat that the shooting was unjustified and DA says contemplating murder charges. Talk about a rush to judgement.
I think there’s an element of reasonableness that needs to be applied here.

I know of a number of cases where officers have been killed after being incapacitated with a taser

In fact, there’s an active lawsuit against APD where someone died after being tased, and the lawsuit refers to a taser as a deadly weapon. So there’s that. Lots of case law supports this as a justified shooting. So there isn’t going to be civil or criminal liability here.

However, I would not have fired in this situation. I know this because I have been in a very similar one. I think the officer exhibited less than good judgment in this situation, and there’s no Monday morning quarterbacking needed to see it.

1) the guy is trying to escape. Anyone who has been in one of these encounters knows that dude is going to run until his feet fall off. Let him run! You have his car and his info. Pick him up on a warrant later.

2) there are two officers. If one is incapacitated with the taser, and then the perp advances on him, then you are in a deadly force situation. If I were alone, then I probably would have fired, even though the guy is running away because once Im down he can double back. Not going to happen if I have a partner with me.

So I’d call this a strictly legal shooting with poor judgment. If I’m a cop, I don’t want to work with this guy because one day he’s going to do it again and he might take me down with him. So I’m not bothered with the firing. Let the dude go sell insurance or something if he isn’t married to a RN


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A good friend that just retired (December) after 20 years on LV Metro Police highlighted the two cop scenario as one of the key problems in the shooting. If the officer was alone, the shooting was likely justified, for the reason you mentioned. But with back-up, hard to claim the cop feared for his life.
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by BDKJMU »

CID1990 wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 5:27 pm
Again, the shooting was legal that isn’t being debated here. But it was the culmination of a couple errors of judgment. There are all kinds of justified police shootings that are preventable - independent of anything the suspect does.
Well, the mayor didn't get that message. Happened Fri night, and Sat (before she could have known all the facts) she was commenting that it wasn't justified use of deadly force, and called for his firing.
The Fulton County DA didn't get that message, and goes on CNN and other media on Sunday and said several charges being considered, including murder, felony murder, and involuntary manslaughter.

Completely irresponsible on both their parts. They should have just said something along the lines of tragic situation, we don't know all the facts, it will be investigated thoroughly expeditiously, etc, etc..

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by SeattleGriz »

CAA Flagship wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:47 am
GannonFan wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:39 am


Didn't they pretty much frisk this guy before any of that happened? Where would the guy have been hiding a gun that they wouldn't have found it?
I don't know for sure. Don't they frisk after you cuff them sometimes? I see a lot of that on Live PD.
Live PD. Didn't that shit get cancelled due to racism?
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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by BDKJMU »

SeattleGriz wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 8:28 pm
CAA Flagship wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:47 am

I don't know for sure. Don't they frisk after you cuff them sometimes? I see a lot of that on Live PD.
Live PD. Didn't that shit get cancelled due to racism?
Got cancelled last week, as did COPS, because apparently we can't have police shows any more..

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Re: Here we go again- Atlanta

Post by ALPHAGRIZ1 »

BDKJMU wrote:
SeattleGriz wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 8:28 pm
Live PD. Didn't that shit get cancelled due to racism?
Got cancelled last week, as did COPS, because apparently we can't have police shows any more..
Thank God now get rid of all the shit cop programs on TV like NCIS, Chicago whatever and Blue Bloods.

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