Coronavirus COVID-19

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

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“Tolerance and Apathy are the last virtues of a dying society.” Aristotle

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by kalm »

BDKJMU wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:12 pm Chicago mayor: Cancel Thanksgiving
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/12/chicago ... -rise.html
Prudent based on trends. WA might be back in phase 1 by next week.

It will hopefully start plateauing again by January.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by SDHornet »

GannonFan wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:32 pm
SDHornet wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 11:52 am

The same reason why you can take your mask off to eat in a restaurant but have to wear one while waiting in line to be seated.
:? Not sure you read his question correctly.
I read it correctly, I was answering one absurd observation about China virus protocol exemption with another. :thumb:
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:14 am
BDKJMU wrote: Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:12 pm Chicago mayor: Cancel Thanksgiving
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/12/chicago ... -rise.html
Prudent based on trends. WA might be back in phase 1 by next week.

It will hopefully start plateauing again by January.
What makes January a magical date? Last time we had the good fortune to be heading into the spring and all the nice weather and getting to be outdoors. We're not even in winter yet. Last time most of the real restrictions lasted until June (couldn't get my hair cut until the end of June, I still have the photo). That was 4 months. I think we're shutting things down until at least March at this point.

County I'm in just outside of PA just closed the schools (going all virtual) for two weeks, and then they'll reassess. They actually used the term "flatten the curve" again. And I just saw that NYC is about to go all virtual in city schools. They may not call it a lockdown again this time, but it's happening again. I don't see things opening up again until the vaccine now.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by UNI88 »

GannonFan wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:22 am
kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:14 am
Prudent based on trends. WA might be back in phase 1 by next week.

It will hopefully start plateauing again by January.
What makes January a magical date? Last time we had the good fortune to be heading into the spring and all the nice weather and getting to be outdoors. We're not even in winter yet. Last time most of the real restrictions lasted until June (couldn't get my hair cut until the end of June, I still have the photo). That was 4 months. I think we're shutting things down until at least March at this point.

County I'm in just outside of PA just closed the schools (going all virtual) for two weeks, and then they'll reassess. They actually used the term "flatten the curve" again. And I just saw that NYC is about to go all virtual in city schools. They may not call it a lockdown again this time, but it's happening again. I don't see things opening up again until the vaccine now.
:nod:

Do we really know why we're having the latest surge? Is it because people aren't following protocols (masks, distancing, etc.)? Is it due to a seasonal surge like the flu? Is it some combination?

Are lockdowns the best response? If masks and physical distancing are working than why do we need to lockdown?
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by BDKJMU »

GannonFan wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:22 am
kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:14 am

Prudent based on trends. WA might be back in phase 1 by next week.

It will hopefully start plateauing again by January.
What makes January a magical date? Last time we had the good fortune to be heading into the spring and all the nice weather and getting to be outdoors. We're not even in winter yet. Last time most of the real restrictions lasted until June (couldn't get my hair cut until the end of June, I still have the photo). That was 4 months. I think we're shutting things down until at least March at this point.

County I'm in just outside of PA just closed the schools (going all virtual) for two weeks, and then they'll reassess. They actually used the term "flatten the curve" again. And I just saw that NYC is about to go all virtual in city schools. They may not call it a lockdown again this time, but it's happening again. I don't see things opening up again until the vaccine now.
Biden gets inaugurated. You know the donks have a magic wand that will make the virus go away? The last donk POTUS claimed it could slow the rise of the oceans, and heal the planet.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by UNI88 »

BDKJMU wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:39 am
GannonFan wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:22 am

What makes January a magical date? Last time we had the good fortune to be heading into the spring and all the nice weather and getting to be outdoors. We're not even in winter yet. Last time most of the real restrictions lasted until June (couldn't get my hair cut until the end of June, I still have the photo). That was 4 months. I think we're shutting things down until at least March at this point.

County I'm in just outside of PA just closed the schools (going all virtual) for two weeks, and then they'll reassess. They actually used the term "flatten the curve" again. And I just saw that NYC is about to go all virtual in city schools. They may not call it a lockdown again this time, but it's happening again. I don't see things opening up again until the vaccine now.
Biden gets inaugurated. You know the donks have a magic wand that will make the virus go away? The last donk POTUS claimed it could slow the rise of the oceans, and heal the planet.
And the current conk POTUS claimed it could make Mexico pay for a wall.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by kalm »

GannonFan wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:22 am
kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:14 am

Prudent based on trends. WA might be back in phase 1 by next week.

It will hopefully start plateauing again by January.
What makes January a magical date? Last time we had the good fortune to be heading into the spring and all the nice weather and getting to be outdoors. We're not even in winter yet. Last time most of the real restrictions lasted until June (couldn't get my hair cut until the end of June, I still have the photo). That was 4 months. I think we're shutting things down until at least March at this point.

County I'm in just outside of PA just closed the schools (going all virtual) for two weeks, and then they'll reassess. They actually used the term "flatten the curve" again. And I just saw that NYC is about to go all virtual in city schools. They may not call it a lockdown again this time, but it's happening again. I don't see things opening up again until the vaccine now.
Infections, hospitalizations, and deaths plateau. Different than lockdowns.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by kalm »

UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:32 am
GannonFan wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:22 am

What makes January a magical date? Last time we had the good fortune to be heading into the spring and all the nice weather and getting to be outdoors. We're not even in winter yet. Last time most of the real restrictions lasted until June (couldn't get my hair cut until the end of June, I still have the photo). That was 4 months. I think we're shutting things down until at least March at this point.

County I'm in just outside of PA just closed the schools (going all virtual) for two weeks, and then they'll reassess. They actually used the term "flatten the curve" again. And I just saw that NYC is about to go all virtual in city schools. They may not call it a lockdown again this time, but it's happening again. I don't see things opening up again until the vaccine now.
:nod:

Do we really know why we're having the latest surge? Is it because people aren't following protocols (masks, distancing, etc.)? Is it due to a seasonal surge like the flu? Is it some combination?

Are lockdowns the best response? If masks and physical distancing are working than why do we need to lockdown?
Yes.

The answer to one offer first questions answers the last.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

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UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:32 am
GannonFan wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:22 am

What makes January a magical date? Last time we had the good fortune to be heading into the spring and all the nice weather and getting to be outdoors. We're not even in winter yet. Last time most of the real restrictions lasted until June (couldn't get my hair cut until the end of June, I still have the photo). That was 4 months. I think we're shutting things down until at least March at this point.

County I'm in just outside of PA just closed the schools (going all virtual) for two weeks, and then they'll reassess. They actually used the term "flatten the curve" again. And I just saw that NYC is about to go all virtual in city schools. They may not call it a lockdown again this time, but it's happening again. I don't see things opening up again until the vaccine now.
:nod:

Do we really know why we're having the latest surge? Is it because people aren't following protocols (masks, distancing, etc.)? Is it due to a seasonal surge like the flu? Is it some combination?

Are lockdowns the best response? If masks and physical distancing are working than why do we need to lockdown?
:coffee:
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by SDHornet »

UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:49 am
BDKJMU wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:39 am
Biden gets inaugurated. You know the donks have a magic wand that will make the virus go away? The last donk POTUS claimed it could slow the rise of the oceans, and heal the planet.
And the current conk POTUS claimed it could make Mexico pay for a wall.
Trumps magic wand only worked on the economy. :mrgreen:
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by UNI88 »

kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:58 am
UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:32 am
:nod:

Do we really know why we're having the latest surge? Is it because people aren't following protocols (masks, distancing, etc.)? Is it due to a seasonal surge like the flu? Is it some combination?

Are lockdowns the best response? If masks and physical distancing are working than why do we need to lockdown?
Yes.

The answer to one offer first questions answers the last.
English please ...
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

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SDHornet wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:32 pm
UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:49 am

And the current conk POTUS claimed it could make Mexico pay for a wall.
Trumps magic wand only worked on the economy. :mrgreen:
That's because it's a very small wand ... :lol:
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by kalm »

UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:48 pm
kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:58 am

Yes.

The answer to one offer first questions answers the last.
English please ...
That was pretty bad.

:lol:

Lockdowns are necessary when social distancing and mask wearing aren’t being followed enough. We only have ourselves to blame.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:56 am
GannonFan wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:22 am

What makes January a magical date? Last time we had the good fortune to be heading into the spring and all the nice weather and getting to be outdoors. We're not even in winter yet. Last time most of the real restrictions lasted until June (couldn't get my hair cut until the end of June, I still have the photo). That was 4 months. I think we're shutting things down until at least March at this point.

County I'm in just outside of PA just closed the schools (going all virtual) for two weeks, and then they'll reassess. They actually used the term "flatten the curve" again. And I just saw that NYC is about to go all virtual in city schools. They may not call it a lockdown again this time, but it's happening again. I don't see things opening up again until the vaccine now.
Infections, hospitalizations, and deaths plateau. Different than lockdowns.
That's not what the health departments are saying - plateau is technically different than flatten, which they used again. Plateau means we stop seeing a rise, but we're still stuck at a high level. Flatten means it basically goes away or at least goes way down. They're using the positivity rate as the metric (not even using hospitalizations or deaths, those are just assumed to follow) and until we get back to under 5% they'll keep things restricted, in this case especially schools. They're not looking at the same data say a Germany looks at, as Germany isn't closing schools, but then again, I'm not sure how much data we're even look at beyond the surface numbers. For all of our talk about following the science, we never seem to really want to look too hard at the science.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:57 pm
UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:48 pm

English please ...
That was pretty bad.

:lol:

Lockdowns are necessary when social distancing and mask wearing aren’t being followed enough. We only have ourselves to blame.
Assuming there's even a level that qualifies as "enough". Like I said, we're not seeing schools as the areas of community spread yet those are the first areas we close down, and we say we're doing it to stop the community spread. That doesn't make any sense at all. Let's take people from a very controlled environment where we can enforce and ensure the proper protocol are being followed, and now let's let them loose to do whatever they want to do in an environment with little control. Again, it's nonsensical and irrational.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by UNI88 »

kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:57 pm
UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:48 pm
English please ...
That was pretty bad.

:lol:

Lockdowns are necessary when social distancing and mask wearing aren’t being followed enough. We only have ourselves to blame.
:D Do you have any scientific proof that the surge isn't at least partially due to seasonality?
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

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Over 2.75 million people have died this year in America, 2.5 million NOT from COVID. Imagine spending the last year of your life with little/no human contact, wasting your last year hiding from something that has < 0.5% chance of killing you, on the off chance you caught it.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by GannonFan »

Heck, even CNN is saying we shouldn't be closing the schools, and yet, here we are. I'm starting to think pubic health officials are where people go after the good jobs in the medical field are already taken.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/13/world/sc ... index.html
The European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control reported in August that children accounted for fewer than 5% of coronavirus cases in the European Union and UK. It said closures were unlikely to provide significant extra protection for children's health.

While they may present a small risk to grandparents, Staines said, "the major risk to grandparents is the older adults in the house."

Many European schools have introduced measures like ventilation, mask-wearing and holding classes outside or in small, distanced groups.

"Both Europe and the United States have made a mess of managing Covid," added Staines.

"Lockdowns are not for controlling infections in populations, lockdowns buy you time to bring in public health measures. They buy you time to do contact tracing," he said.
That last line is great. There is zero talk about bringing in health measures during this lockdown, on the contrary, they're being done specifically to do the former, that is, to control the infections in the population. As I said, we learned absolutely zero from the spring and continue to make the same mistakes now. This isn't even a party-related issue at this point as both Dems and GOP's seem to have zero clue about any of this.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

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Nevada gov tests positive (asymptomatic) for the China Virus. Becomes the 4th Gov this yr to test positive. Others were Missouri, Virginia and Oklahoma.
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by kalm »

UNI88 wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 1:22 pm
kalm wrote: Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:57 pm

That was pretty bad.

:lol:

Lockdowns are necessary when social distancing and mask wearing aren’t being followed enough. We only have ourselves to blame.
:D Do you have any scientific proof that the surge isn't at least partially due to seasonality?
I don’t think anyone is really denying that. :?
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

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Great, comprehensive summary. Buckle up!
Hospitals have put their pandemic plans into action, adding more beds and creating makeshift COVID-19 wards. But in the hardest-hit areas, there are simply not enough doctors, nurses, and other specialists to staff those beds. Some health-care workers told me that COVID-19 patients are the sickest people they’ve ever cared for: They require twice as much attention as a typical intensive-care-unit patient, for three times the normal length of stay. “It was doable over the summer, but now it’s just too much,” says Whitney Neville, a nurse based in Iowa. “Last Monday we had 25 patients waiting in the emergency department. They had been admitted but there was no one to take care of them.” I asked her how much slack the system has left. “There is none,” she said.

The entire state of Iowa is now out of staffed beds, Eli Perencevich, an infectious-disease doctor at the University of Iowa, told me. Worse is coming. Iowa is accumulating more than 3,600 confirmed cases every day; relative to its population, that’s more than twice the rate Arizona experienced during its summer peak, “when their system was near collapse,” Perencevich said. With only lax policies in place, those cases will continue to rise. Hospitalizations lag behind cases by about two weeks; by Thanksgiving, today’s soaring cases will be overwhelming hospitals that already cannot cope. “The wave hasn’t even crashed down on us yet,” Perencevich said. “It keeps rising and rising, and we’re all running on fear. The health-care system in Iowa is going to collapse, no question.”.........

As hard as the work fatigue is, the “societal fatigue” is harder, said Hatton, the Utah pulmonary specialist. He is tired of walking out of an ICU where COVID-19 has killed another patient, and walking into a grocery store where he hears people saying it doesn’t exist. Health-care workers and public-health officials have received threats and abusive messages accusing them of fearmongering. They’ve watched as friends have adopted Donald Trump’s lies about doctors juking the hospitalization numbers to get more money. They’ve pleaded with family members to wear masks and physically distance, lest they end up competing for ICU beds that no longer exist. “Nurses have been the most trusted profession for 18 years in a row, which is now bullshit because no one is listening to us,” Neville said.

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/arch ... rs/617091/
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by SeattleGriz »

Interesting graph. Maybe some of the better data guys could take a guess as to why the percent positive rate seems to be tracking with the testing rate? :geek:

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Weekly deaths still dropping.
The National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS) collects death certificate data from vital statistics offices for all deaths occurring in the United States. Based on death certificate data available on November 12, 2020, the percentage of deaths attributed to pneumonia, influenza, or COVID-19 (PIC) for week 45 was 8.9% and, while it is declining compared with the percentage during week 44, it remains above the epidemic threshold. The weekly percentage of deaths due to PIC declined from a second peak at the end of July through mid- September, remained approximately stable from the week ending September 19 through the week ending October 3, and increased during the first three weeks of October. Data for the most recent two weeks currently show a decline, but percentages for recent weeks will likely increase as more death certificates are processed.
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https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... index.html
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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19

Post by Gil Dobie »

SeattleGriz wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 5:26 pm Interesting graph. Maybe some of the better data guys could take a guess as to why the percent positive rate seems to be tracking with the testing rate? :geek:

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Weekly deaths still dropping.
The National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS) collects death certificate data from vital statistics offices for all deaths occurring in the United States. Based on death certificate data available on November 12, 2020, the percentage of deaths attributed to pneumonia, influenza, or COVID-19 (PIC) for week 45 was 8.9% and, while it is declining compared with the percentage during week 44, it remains above the epidemic threshold. The weekly percentage of deaths due to PIC declined from a second peak at the end of July through mid- September, remained approximately stable from the week ending September 19 through the week ending October 3, and increased during the first three weeks of October. Data for the most recent two weeks currently show a decline, but percentages for recent weeks will likely increase as more death certificates are processed.
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https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... index.html
Curious why Montana set a record for deaths in a day just today? Another state besides Minnesota, not taking care of the vulnerable and elderly.
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