Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by UNI88 »

kalm wrote: Sun Sep 11, 2022 4:36 pm
UNI88 wrote: Sun Sep 11, 2022 3:47 pm
Garland wasn't going to be confirmed so his spot wasn't "stolen". They weren't consistent with the Stepford Wife confirmation but plenty of Democratic politicians have been hypocrites and I don't see Al calling them out or questioning the legitimacy of their actions. It's the old, it's ok when my side does it but it's unethical/illegitimate/stealing when the other side does it and will bring about the end of the Republic.
Was it applied to Barrett? Had it happened before? Ever?
BDK can give you the down and dirty nitpick of why Barrett was different than Garland. He can also provide you with examples of Democratic Party hypocrisy on SCOTUS nominations. They've been discussed on this board several times so I'm not going to rehash them.

Maybe Al will stop whining if someone changes his diaper.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

UNI88 wrote: Sun Sep 11, 2022 4:44 pm
kalm wrote: Sun Sep 11, 2022 4:36 pm

Was it applied to Barrett? Had it happened before? Ever?
BDK can give you the down and dirty nitpick of why Barrett was different than Garland. He can also provide you with examples of Democratic Party hypocrisy on SCOTUS nominations. They've been discussed on this board several times so I'm not going to rehash them.

Maybe Al will stop whining if someone changes his diaper.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 5:18 am
And yet it's not the Republicans who are threatening, if they don't think they can win, with packing the Court, abolishing the Electoral College, adding states if they look to be sure Democratic party votes and can therefore pack the Senate, and allowing the Executive branch the ability to spend upwards of a trillion dollars without any input/vote from the legislative branch from which all spending is supposed to originate. Why aren't you scouring the internet for smarmy tweets about that if saving democracy was really something you're interested in? :coffee:
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

GannonFan wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 6:31 am
kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 5:18 am
And yet it's not the Republicans who are threatening, if they don't think they can win, with packing the Court, abolishing the Electoral College, adding states if they look to be sure Democratic party votes and can therefore pack the Senate, and allowing the Executive branch the ability to spend upwards of a trillion dollars without any input/vote from the legislative branch from which all spending is supposed to originate. Why aren't you scouring the internet for smarmy tweets about that if saving democracy was really something you're interested in? :coffee:
Democracy precedes all that you listed. Bill Kristol and David Frum talking about this should give you pause. Why do think I scoured anything? I follow many former Republican traditional conservatives. This stuff lands in my lap.

Just a few points you may have missed. :)
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

Here’s another conservative for you:

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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

And another:



:lol:
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by GannonFan »

kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 6:49 am
GannonFan wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 6:31 am

And yet it's not the Republicans who are threatening, if they don't think they can win, with packing the Court, abolishing the Electoral College, adding states if they look to be sure Democratic party votes and can therefore pack the Senate, and allowing the Executive branch the ability to spend upwards of a trillion dollars without any input/vote from the legislative branch from which all spending is supposed to originate. Why aren't you scouring the internet for smarmy tweets about that if saving democracy was really something you're interested in? :coffee:
Democracy precedes all that you listed. Bill Kristol and David Frum talking about this should give you pause. Why do think I scoured anything? I follow many former Republican traditional conservatives. This stuff lands in my lap.

Just a few points you may have missed. :)
It's in vogue now to say that democracy and the Republic are under threat. They aren't, but entrenched political establishment certainly is. I'm not scared of the future, we have a strong foundation and a robust form of government that even kept a loon like Trump from doing any real damage to it. We're going to be fine, no matter how scared old folks are who see their relevance fading.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by Winterborn »

RIYADH — As in most countries around the world on September 11, a moment of silence was held in the Middle Eastern country of Saudi Arabia on Sunday. Theirs was 15 seconds long, one second for each Saudi national lost in the 9/11 terror attacks in 2001.

“21 years ago, we lost a lot of good pilots,” King Salman reflected during a remembrance ceremony carried live on all major networks from Riyadh. “Sure, we didn’t expect them to return, but I knew some of them quite well. Though Egyptian, Mohammed Atta’s dedication to the cause isn’t to be overlooked, and we grant him the title of ‘Honorary Saudi.’ The man was razor-focused, and I think his body of work speaks for itself.”

The King reflected on sending some of his dear friends to pilot training in San Diego.

“We all thought my brother, the late King Abdullah, would buy us all new Gulfstreams and needed more pilots. It wasn’t until later we learned that a friend of the family was cashing in some favors over construction contracts.” King Salman then chuckled lightly and exclaimed, “Imagine our surprise when a month after 9/11, it was Afghanistan that was being invaded! We really dodged a bullet there.”

The Saudi Foreign Minister, Prince Faisal, was quick to point out that many nations lost citizens on 9/11.

“Today, the King shares the world’s grief. Be it a firefighter going back up the stairs to save one more person, a traffic cop shielding innocent bystanders from debris, or the pilot who cost thousands of dollars and hundreds of man-hours to qualify as a pilot on the 737. From Mecca to Medina, we remember these heroes today.”
https://www.duffelblog.com/p/saudi-king ... dium=email
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by Winterborn »

kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 6:49 am
GannonFan wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 6:31 am

And yet it's not the Republicans who are threatening, if they don't think they can win, with packing the Court, abolishing the Electoral College, adding states if they look to be sure Democratic party votes and can therefore pack the Senate, and allowing the Executive branch the ability to spend upwards of a trillion dollars without any input/vote from the legislative branch from which all spending is supposed to originate. Why aren't you scouring the internet for smarmy tweets about that if saving democracy was really something you're interested in? :coffee:
Democracy precedes all that you listed. Bill Kristol and David Frum talking about this should give you pause. Why do think I scoured anything? I follow many former Republican traditional conservatives. This stuff lands in my lap.

Just a few points you may have missed. :)
:twocents: You might want to change your spam filters to filter out the fringe crap. Because everybody you have posted here I have never heard of and I like to think I am more well read then the average bear. Outside of having a more level headed message (this goes for both sides) nothing you have brought up was in any "serious" discussion I have read or been apart of.

Unless you're trolling. Which then go right ahead and keep your spam settings the same. :lol:
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

Winterborn wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 7:40 am
kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 6:49 am

Democracy precedes all that you listed. Bill Kristol and David Frum talking about this should give you pause. Why do think I scoured anything? I follow many former Republican traditional conservatives. This stuff lands in my lap.

Just a few points you may have missed. :)
:twocents: You might want to change your spam filters to filter out the fringe crap. Because everybody you have posted here I have never heard of and I like to think I am more well read then the average bear. Outside of having a more level headed message (this goes for both sides) nothing you have brought up was in any "serious" discussion I have read or been apart of.

Unless you're trolling. Which then go right ahead and keep your spam settings the same. :lol:
You’re not aware of Kristol, David Frum, Peter Thiel?

Whoa.
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Post by Winterborn »

kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 8:31 am
Winterborn wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 7:40 am

:twocents: You might want to change your spam filters to filter out the fringe crap. Because everybody you have posted here I have never heard of and I like to think I am more well read then the average bear. Outside of having a more level headed message (this goes for both sides) nothing you have brought up was in any "serious" discussion I have read or been apart of.

Unless you're trolling. Which then go right ahead and keep your spam settings the same. :lol:
You’re not aware of Kristol, David Frum, Peter Thiel?

Whoa.
Nope. Guess that means that they may not be as influential as they claim to be?

After a Google search on the three names, I now know why I have not heard of them. Two washed up has-beens and a person I vaguely remember(Peter Thiel) due to his connection to Paypal but I had no idea was republican donor. If money is what we should be listening to as guidance for the direction of both parties, then I guess I should be paying more attention to Soros.

As for the other two, they may have had an idea on the direction conservatives are leaning 20ish years ago, but they probably should get out of their penthouses and talk to people before spouting off. Talk is cheap and it is even cheaper on Twatter.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

Winterborn wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 9:09 am
kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 8:31 am

You’re not aware of Kristol, David Frum, Peter Thiel?

Whoa.
Nope. Guess that means that they may not be as influential as they claim to be?

After a Google search on the three names, I now know why I have not heard of them. Two washed up has-beens and a person I vaguely remember(Peter Thiel) due to his connection to Paypal but I had no idea was republican donor. If money is what we should be listening to as guidance for the direction of both parties, then I guess I should be paying more attention to Soros.

As for the other two, they may have had an idea on the direction conservatives are leaning 20ish years ago, but they probably should get out of their penthouses and talk to people before spouting off. Talk is cheap and it is even cheaper on Twatter.
I agree with much of what you’ve said. You are getting and not getting the point. Democracy is not a new principle. Who are the current conservative voices we should be listening to regarding the conservative movement and governance?
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by Winterborn »

kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 9:20 am
Winterborn wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 9:09 am

Nope. Guess that means that they may not be as influential as they claim to be?

After a Google search on the three names, I now know why I have not heard of them. Two washed up has-beens and a person I vaguely remember(Peter Thiel) due to his connection to Paypal but I had no idea was republican donor. If money is what we should be listening to as guidance for the direction of both parties, then I guess I should be paying more attention to Soros.

As for the other two, they may have had an idea on the direction conservatives are leaning 20ish years ago, but they probably should get out of their penthouses and talk to people before spouting off. Talk is cheap and it is even cheaper on Twatter.
I agree with much of what you’ve said. You are getting and not getting the point. Democracy is not a new principle. Who are the current conservative voices we should be listening to regarding the conservative movement and governance?
So are you (the point not point thing). ;)

It is my opinion that one has to be extremely skeptical of anybody claiming to "speak" for "conservatives" (and I put that in quotes as it is most definitely not a cohesive group and there are many players and wannabe players vying for that title). The players are part old guard who are not really conservative but like the statues quo as they know how it works and got rich off it by peddling their influence. Then there are those who who wish to be like the old guard as the route to power is mapped out. Then you have those that are fringe and are so forefront in peoples minds due to the 24/7 'news" coverage of them making them seem larger than life and amplifying every little belief they hold and painting it as a trend in the Republican Party or among conservatives.

All this is propped up by a network of media that both consumes what the above groups produce and funds it as a way of furthering their influence and bottom line. CNN, Fox, etc. do not care about their content outside of the narrative it pushes. None are interested in finding out what actually happened, just one-upping the others.

If you want to know what conservative voters actually think and believe, one needs to ditch the theatrics and pageantry of our media circus, and talk to voters directly to see where they fall. You are going to get a wide variety of answers but common trends will arise. I have done this over the last decade or so and get a good chuckle out of what the paid "experts" state. It is the only way to give a good foundation to understanding exactly what people are thinking and grants a good basis to weed out the ore from the slag that our media pushes. There is a massive disconnect between what shows up on Twitter and other media sites just due to their publication models. One does not become a "story" unless you stick out. Holding pragmatic or middle of the road views (which is tangentially shown in multiple polls and voting results as the majority has shown to reject the extremes) does not sell stories nor drive clicks.

You and I were discussing skepticism and critical thinking a few days back. Both of these ideas need to be expressed and practiced when viewing any media stories. There are many reasons why information is "published", almost none have to do with the facts. Most people are being controlled/influenced by whatever narrative is being pushed by their respective "side" and they do not realize it. It happens to all of us and it requires us to take a step back and look at something objectively before accepting it.

My above advice goes is the same for the Democrats/"liberals". I do not attribute the entire party by what AOC is blabbing about, but realize that the party and voters is much more complex than that. Granted I will still make fun of her and her little group but there are Republicans/"conservatives" that deserve it just as much.

If one is curious about the reaction to a article, put some thought behind a post and pose a question or two rather than just dropping a tweet with no background on it. I ignore twatter for a reason and it is mainly due to the vapid thought process it encourages.
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“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf

"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by Winterborn »

Wanted to also address you thought that "Democracy is not a new principle". It is not but neither are people and if you can understand people's patterns you can understand how different political structures rise and fall. Along with their strong and weak points.

I think the true wisdom/greatness in what the Founding Fathers had when they outlined our form of Government is that they understood those patterns and did their best to account for our (humanities) inherent tendencies.
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“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” - G. Michael Hopf

"I am neither especially clever nor especially gifted. I am only very, very curious.” – Albert Einstein
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by BDKJMU »

UNI88 wrote: Sun Sep 11, 2022 4:44 pm
kalm wrote: Sun Sep 11, 2022 4:36 pm

Was it applied to Barrett? Had it happened before? Ever?
BDK can give you the down and dirty nitpick of why Barrett was different than Garland. He can also provide you with examples of Democratic Party hypocrisy on SCOTUS nominations. They've been discussed on this board several times so I'm not going to rehash them.

Maybe Al will stop whining if someone changes his diaper.
Garland: Donk nominee, conk Senate.
Barrett: Conk nominee, conk Senate

Control the Senate or STFU.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by GannonFan »

BDKJMU wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 2:39 pm
UNI88 wrote: Sun Sep 11, 2022 4:44 pm

BDK can give you the down and dirty nitpick of why Barrett was different than Garland. He can also provide you with examples of Democratic Party hypocrisy on SCOTUS nominations. They've been discussed on this board several times so I'm not going to rehash them.

Maybe Al will stop whining if someone changes his diaper.
Garland: Donk nominee, conk Senate.
Barrett: Conk nominee, conk Senate

Control the Senate or STFU.
In principle, sure, that is what happened and Constitutionally all permissible. Even more so, the GOP faced an election in 2016 after blocking Garland and still held on to the Senate after this action.

I don't disagree with the principle, per se, of not giving the sitting President his choice of juror. However, I did disagree with the method. I thought if they wanted to block Garland, then they should've had an actual vote on the matter and make it official. Wouldn't have taken a lot to do that and I don't think it would've changed anything other than bringing the process out into the open. By not even bringing it to a vote it just made it a shadier process.

The question will be what happens in the future and how far out from a Presidential election will a party be willing to block a nomination to the SCOTUS? What if the Dems didn't control the Senate right now - would the GOP have blocked any nominations from Biden as long as they controlled the Senate? Would the Dems do the same thing and deny a sitting GOP President a nomination to the court, even if it's for a full Presidential 4 year term? Or heck, even 8 years? A SCOTUS sitting with 8 jurors (or less), for potentially years, because of political deadlock will be quite a new development, but actually in line with current political rancor.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by BDKJMU »

GannonFan wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 2:56 pm
BDKJMU wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 2:39 pm
Garland: Donk nominee, conk Senate.
Barrett: Conk nominee, conk Senate

Control the Senate or STFU.
In principle, sure, that is what happened and Constitutionally all permissible. Even more so, the GOP faced an election in 2016 after blocking Garland and still held on to the Senate after this action.

I don't disagree with the principle, per se, of not giving the sitting President his choice of juror. However, I did disagree with the method. I thought if they wanted to block Garland, then they should've had an actual vote on the matter and make it official. Wouldn't have taken a lot to do that and I don't think it would've changed anything other than bringing the process out into the open. By not even bringing it to a vote it just made it a shadier process.

The question will be what happens in the future and how far out from a Presidential election will a party be willing to block a nomination to the SCOTUS? What if the Dems didn't control the Senate right now - would the GOP have blocked any nominations from Biden as long as they controlled the Senate? Would the Dems do the same thing and deny a sitting GOP President a nomination to the court, even if it's for a full Presidential 4 year term? Or heck, even 8 years? A SCOTUS sitting with 8 jurors (or less), for potentially years, because of political deadlock will be quite a new development, but actually in line with current political rancor.
When the donks are playing no hold barred politics, then the conks should do the same. You play to win.
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Post by BDKJMU »

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Post by BDKJMU »

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..peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard..
..But you have to go home now. We have to have peace…
..I know how you feel, but go home, and go home in peace.
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Post by BDKJMU »

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..peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard..
..But you have to go home now. We have to have peace…
..I know how you feel, but go home, and go home in peace.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

Winterborn wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 10:12 am
kalm wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 9:20 am

I agree with much of what you’ve said. You are getting and not getting the point. Democracy is not a new principle. Who are the current conservative voices we should be listening to regarding the conservative movement and governance?
So are you (the point not point thing). ;)

It is my opinion that one has to be extremely skeptical of anybody claiming to "speak" for "conservatives" (and I put that in quotes as it is most definitely not a cohesive group and there are many players and wannabe players vying for that title). The players are part old guard who are not really conservative but like the statues quo as they know how it works and got rich off it by peddling their influence. Then there are those who who wish to be like the old guard as the route to power is mapped out. Then you have those that are fringe and are so forefront in peoples minds due to the 24/7 'news" coverage of them making them seem larger than life and amplifying every little belief they hold and painting it as a trend in the Republican Party or among conservatives.

All this is propped up by a network of media that both consumes what the above groups produce and funds it as a way of furthering their influence and bottom line. CNN, Fox, etc. do not care about their content outside of the narrative it pushes. None are interested in finding out what actually happened, just one-upping the others.

If you want to know what conservative voters actually think and believe, one needs to ditch the theatrics and pageantry of our media circus, and talk to voters directly to see where they fall. You are going to get a wide variety of answers but common trends will arise. I have done this over the last decade or so and get a good chuckle out of what the paid "experts" state. It is the only way to give a good foundation to understanding exactly what people are thinking and grants a good basis to weed out the ore from the slag that our media pushes. There is a massive disconnect between what shows up on Twitter and other media sites just due to their publication models. One does not become a "story" unless you stick out. Holding pragmatic or middle of the road views (which is tangentially shown in multiple polls and voting results as the majority has shown to reject the extremes) does not sell stories nor drive clicks.

You and I were discussing skepticism and critical thinking a few days back. Both of these ideas need to be expressed and practiced when viewing any media stories. There are many reasons why information is "published", almost none have to do with the facts. Most people are being controlled/influenced by whatever narrative is being pushed by their respective "side" and they do not realize it. It happens to all of us and it requires us to take a step back and look at something objectively before accepting it.

My above advice goes is the same for the Democrats/"liberals". I do not attribute the entire party by what AOC is blabbing about, but realize that the party and voters is much more complex than that. Granted I will still make fun of her and her little group but there are Republicans/"conservatives" that deserve it just as much.

If one is curious about the reaction to a article, put some thought behind a post and pose a question or two rather than just dropping a tweet with no background on it. I ignore twatter for a reason and it is mainly due to the vapid thought process it encourages.
Well again…I agree with a whole bunch of this. It’s a fair bit of neccessary messenger killing.

That said, it’s also just opinion rather than news. To completely disregard the take of a leading conservative mind who’s father founded The National Review and who’s run closely in conservative power circles is similar to not recognizing Trump as the leader of the one major Conservative party in American politics.

I’ve never liked Bill Kristol but I agree with him here and I’m honestly hoping that sane conservatives eventually recognize the ‘you broke it, you fix it” responsibility needed and take back their party.

We’re better as a country when we have a vibrant and rational conservative movement. But it’s broken right now and many prominent conservatives agree. There just needs to be more of them and they need to be even more vocal.

Strip away the political bullshit and most Americans agree on the big issues of limited government, human rights, property rights, and economic stability.

Still friends? :mrgreen:
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kalm
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by kalm »

Winterborn wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 10:18 am Wanted to also address you thought that "Democracy is not a new principle". It is not but neither are people and if you can understand people's patterns you can understand how different political structures rise and fall. Along with their strong and weak points.

I think the true wisdom/greatness in what the Founding Fathers had when they outlined our form of Government is that they understood those patterns and did their best to account for our (humanities) inherent tendencies.
Correct. The human mind machine craves and is comforted by patterns to a fault. That’s why many prefer to just follow.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

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BDKJMU wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 4:07 pm Image
They’re just misunderstood. They really love us, BDK.
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Re: Political memes, Posters, Funny Pics, Etc.

Post by AZGrizFan »

kalm wrote: Tue Sep 13, 2022 6:29 am
Winterborn wrote: Mon Sep 12, 2022 10:12 am

So are you (the point not point thing). ;)

It is my opinion that one has to be extremely skeptical of anybody claiming to "speak" for "conservatives" (and I put that in quotes as it is most definitely not a cohesive group and there are many players and wannabe players vying for that title). The players are part old guard who are not really conservative but like the statues quo as they know how it works and got rich off it by peddling their influence. Then there are those who who wish to be like the old guard as the route to power is mapped out. Then you have those that are fringe and are so forefront in peoples minds due to the 24/7 'news" coverage of them making them seem larger than life and amplifying every little belief they hold and painting it as a trend in the Republican Party or among conservatives.

All this is propped up by a network of media that both consumes what the above groups produce and funds it as a way of furthering their influence and bottom line. CNN, Fox, etc. do not care about their content outside of the narrative it pushes. None are interested in finding out what actually happened, just one-upping the others.

If you want to know what conservative voters actually think and believe, one needs to ditch the theatrics and pageantry of our media circus, and talk to voters directly to see where they fall. You are going to get a wide variety of answers but common trends will arise. I have done this over the last decade or so and get a good chuckle out of what the paid "experts" state. It is the only way to give a good foundation to understanding exactly what people are thinking and grants a good basis to weed out the ore from the slag that our media pushes. There is a massive disconnect between what shows up on Twitter and other media sites just due to their publication models. One does not become a "story" unless you stick out. Holding pragmatic or middle of the road views (which is tangentially shown in multiple polls and voting results as the majority has shown to reject the extremes) does not sell stories nor drive clicks.

You and I were discussing skepticism and critical thinking a few days back. Both of these ideas need to be expressed and practiced when viewing any media stories. There are many reasons why information is "published", almost none have to do with the facts. Most people are being controlled/influenced by whatever narrative is being pushed by their respective "side" and they do not realize it. It happens to all of us and it requires us to take a step back and look at something objectively before accepting it.

My above advice goes is the same for the Democrats/"liberals". I do not attribute the entire party by what AOC is blabbing about, but realize that the party and voters is much more complex than that. Granted I will still make fun of her and her little group but there are Republicans/"conservatives" that deserve it just as much.

If one is curious about the reaction to a article, put some thought behind a post and pose a question or two rather than just dropping a tweet with no background on it. I ignore twatter for a reason and it is mainly due to the vapid thought process it encourages.
Well again…I agree with a whole bunch of this. It’s a fair bit of neccessary messenger killing.

That said, it’s also just opinion rather than news. To completely disregard the take of a leading conservative mind who’s father founded The National Review and who’s run closely in conservative power circles is similar to not recognizing Trump as the leader of the one major Conservative party in American politics.

I’ve never liked Bill Kristol but I agree with him here and I’m honestly hoping that sane conservatives eventually recognize the ‘you broke it, you fix it” responsibility needed and take back their party.

We’re better as a country when we have a vibrant and rational conservative movement. But it’s broken right now and many prominent conservatives agree. There just needs to be more of them and they need to be even more vocal.

Strip away the political bullshit and most Americans agree on the big issues of limited government, human rights, property rights, and economic stability.

Still friends? :mrgreen:
Substitute “democratic” for “conservative” everywhere in your thesis and the point is still valid. It’s not just ONE of the parties that’s trying to destroy democracy. They’re just going about it differently. :coffee:
"Ah fuck. You are right." KYJelly, 11/6/12
"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam." Barack Obama, 9/25/12
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