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JoltinJoe wrote:Seriously, what has happened to your game? I mean, at least you use to be able to carry your weight for a few posts in a thread before getting mauled, but now even your first salvos are lame.

It seems like you've never recovered from the mauling you took on the mustard tree thread.

D1B wrote:

JoltinJoe wrote:Seriously, what has happened to your game? I mean, at least you use to be able to carry your weight for a few posts in a thread before getting mauled, but now even your first salvos are lame.

It seems like you've never recovered from the mauling you took on the mustard tree thread.

The catholic church has zero credibility. Thats why they were dragged, kicking and screaming to the world court where they were chastized for being a bunch of Joltin Joes.

JoltinJoe wrote:

D1B wrote:

The catholic church has zero credibility. Thats why they were dragged, kicking and screaming to the world court where they were chastized for being a bunch of Joltin Joes.

World court? Don't think so. You're referring to a biased report from a UN ( ) committee which has been already thoroughly discredited.

The sex abuse scandal is over, despite best efforts of enemies of the Church to lie, distort, and twist the issues.

JoltinJoe wrote:In 2012, only six cases of sex abuse cited against over 40,000 clergy -- a percentage of less than .00015%.

How does an institution which ministers and educates hundreds of thousands of children get to the point that sex abuse against minors within the institution is nearly zero percent? By dealing with the real problem, and the real causes and issues, and not being distracted by the noise, false allegations, and lies of ambulance chasers and enemies of the Church.

The ambulance chasers and the enemies of the Church don't give a rat's ass about the children. For them, there is money to be made, or a bigger point to be made. The enemies of the Church couple their lies about the sex abuse scandal with their lies about history in an effort to discredit the institution founded by Christ. They don't really care about protecting children.

Fortunately, the Church cared enough to get to the bottom of the real issues and problem, because it wanted to protect the children.

Great job, Catholic Church!

BREAKING NEWS

An advocate for victims of clergy sex abuse and a prosecutor who handled one of Essex County’s most high-profile murder cases will be recognized Wednesday by the state attorney general for their service to crime victims.

Mark Crawford, the New Jersey director of the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests, and Romesh Sukhdeo, an assistant prosecutor in Essex County, will receive awards during a morning ceremony at the Hughes Justice Complex in Trenton.

"Through their relentless efforts, the men being honored at this week’s ceremony change the landscape every day within their own communities and throughout New Jersey," acting Attorney General John Hoffman said in a statement today.

The awards, the first of their kind bestowed by the attorney general’s office, coincide with Crime Victims’ Rights Week and the 30th anniversary of the Victims of Crimes Act.

Crawford, who was abused as a child by his parish priest, will receive the Ronald W. Reagan Award. He was nominated by state Sen. Joseph Vitale (D-Middlesex), who said Crawford tirelessly listens to and educates abuse victims from across New Jersey and beyond.

"Because of Mark’s efforts, many individuals, after living in years of silence and shame, learned of their predators’ crimes and came forward themselves, finally getting help and holding their offender accountable," Vitale said.

Sukhdeo, who will receive the Gladiator Award, served on the prosecution team that won convictions in the 2007 murders of three college-age friends in a Newark schoolyard. A fourth person was seriously injured. Sukhdeo was an invaluable help to family members of the victims throughout the process, said Deputy Chief Assistant Prosecutor Gwendolyn Williams, who nominated him.

"When victim survivor family members had issues with their employers, he didn’t hesitate to assist them so they could be present at each stage of the court proceedings." Williams said. "All defendants were either found guilty at trial or pled guilty. Whenever the victim survivors have vigils celebrating the life of their loved one, Mr. Sukhdeo is present."

houndawg wrote:If theyd let the nuns put out, the catholic church would be hoppin', including Father Houndawg

JoltinJoe wrote:

D1B wrote:

The catholic church has zero credibility. Thats why they were dragged, kicking and screaming to the world court where they were chastized for being a bunch of Joltin Joes.

World court? Don't think so. You're referring to a biased report from a UN ( ) committee which has been already thoroughly discredited.

The sex abuse scandal is over, despite best efforts of enemies of the Church to lie, distort, and twist the issues.

This issue brings together two strains of church life that NCR has been tracking for some 30 years: the sexual abuse of minors by clergy, and the finances of dioceses. It is in these two areas that church leaders are at their most vulnerable.
The sexual abuse of minors by clergy and the subsequent cover-up by those in the church leadership structure have sapped the hierarchy of much of its moral authority. Many times, the church has seemed to be moving on from the immediacy of that crisis, and then something happens -- a priest in Newark, N.J., who is supposed to be on restricted ministry is found on youth retreats, or leaders in the St. Paul-Minneapolis archdiocese ignore their own guidelines and the Dallas Charter for the Protection of Children and Young People -- and we are plunged headlong back into that morass.

The unprecedented appointment of the new Pontifical Commission for the Protection of Minors should have been greeted with jubilation -- a commission of experts with direct access to the pope is something that could not have been imagined even three years ago. Instead, the announcement comes with many unanswered questions: Who will lead the commission? Where will it fit in the Vatican bureaucracy? What is its exact mandate? Sources have been telling NCR since December that this commission would be decisive in answering concerns of victim advocates, particularly in producing procedures to censure bishops who violate church law on clergy sex abuse. What could have been a watershed moment has done little to assuage critics. It is more than an opportunity wasted. It is the surest sign yet of the tremendous resistance that Pope Francis and his Council of Cardinals are meeting inside the church bureaucracy.

The sexual abuse of minors by clergy cost the U.S. church $109 million in 2013 and a total of $2.74 billion since 2004. But don't look to the bishops' annual report on compliance with the Dallas Charter to learn how much your diocese paid into that lump sum; the report doesn't break down any data that way. Such fundamental information, which Catholics who support their church have a right to know, isn't available because the bishops don't want to share it. No national norms require financial disclosure and no mechanism holds bishops accountable.

Which is why, for the 10th time, the Lincoln, Neb., diocese and three Eastern Catholic eparchies have refused to comply with audits mandated by the bishops' own charter. It is no surprise that each of the annual reports describing the audit displays an increasing frustration on the part of the laypeople commissioned to write them. "Total participation in the audit is one of the few ways to demonstrate to the faithful the commitment of the bishops to right the horrific wrongs done in the past and to do all that they can to prevent such abuse from happening again," National Review Board president Francesco Cesareo wrote in his introduction to this year's report. One hundred percent participation is still the goal, he wrote. "This is a matter of utmost importance in the protection of our children and the restoration of the bishops' credibility."


Take a sneak peak at our Catholic Education special section. This content is only available in the print newspaper and Kindle edition, so subscribe today!
Nine U.S. diocese have declared bankruptcy since 2004, directly as a result of the sex abuse crisis. But other trends in demographics and society are also straining church finances, especially in the East, Northeast and upper Midwest, where news comes regularly of church and school closings, parish consolidations, and cutbacks in diocesan staff and programs. In most dioceses, annual appeals and fundraising drives have become slickly orchestrated operations, more often than not run by professional consultants. Bishops can come to resemble politicians, in constant begging mode for campaign financing, just to keep the coffers from going empty.

This may be one of the reasons why stories about bishops building mansions causes swift and angry responses from the people in the pews, as we have seen in Camden, N.J., Newark, and Atlanta. The questions that follow echo the questions from the sex abuse crisis: What were the bishops thinking? Why don't they get it?

The answers to those questions also echo the sex abuse crisis. The bishop is the lord of his domain, and he can do what he wills. For bishops' compensation, guidelines and best practices exist, as our story shows, and most bishops follow the rules. The trouble is, as Bishop Tom Gumbleton says about his retirement benefits, "nobody ever asks any questions. If I wanted to live in a big house ... I guess I could do it, and nobody would say anything about it. ... I get what I ask for. And each bishop does."

Out of weariness, one is tempted to look at news about sex abuse and church finances and conclude that the system is broken. In reality, what is broken in this 2,000-year-old church that has weathered many crises is the clerical system that has dominated it in the last few hundred years.

The good news out of Newark and Atlanta is that in the information age, people could learn what their archbishops were doing and could respond in a strong voice that demanded answers to questions. To his credit, Atlanta Archbishop Wilton Gregory heard the criticism (albeit after it became front-page news and led local TV newscasts) and is trying to make amends. "What we didn't stop to consider ... was that the world and the church have changed," Gregory said. Meanwhile, Philadelphia seems to be giving financial transparency a try.

The times have changed. An educated and engaged laity is demanding answers and accountability.

D1B wrote:
Breaking news from the National Catholic Reporter categorically refuting Pedo Joes lies and silly, pathetic declarations.

D1B wrote:

houndawg wrote:If theyd let the nuns put out, the catholic church would be hoppin', including Father Houndawg

You ever see a nun?

They're disgusting and most are sexual deviants and or mentally Ill.

Anyone who voluntarily chooses that "profession" is a whack job.

JoltinJoe wrote:

D1B wrote:
Breaking news from the National Catholic Reporter categorically refuting Pedo Joes lies and silly, pathetic declarations.

Breaking news: D1B continues to spout bullshit.

Nothing in his excerpt from NCR undermines anything I've said, or contradicts the fact that the current sex abuse rate in the Catholic Church is nearly zero percent.

GannonFan wrote:

D1B wrote:
You ever see a nun?

They're disgusting and most are sexual deviants and or mentally Ill.

Anyone who voluntarily chooses that "profession" is a whack job.

Wow, descent into vitriolic hyperbole. I think you may have lost the fire. For shame.

ALBANY (NY)
Albany Times Union

Excerpts from Bishop-elect Edward Scharfenberger's comments on hot-button Catholic issues:

On abortion: "Our position on the sanctity of life at every stage of human development from conception to natural death is firm, fundamental and unchangeable. When we get into politics, it gets sticky. I am strong pro-life, but I'm not in-your-face. I don't tell people what to do. This is America."

*Typical Joltian doublespeak.

On women priests: "This is not an issue open to doctrinal development, but I'm open to listening to anything."

On gays in the church: "I have friends who are gay and some who are celibate and live together in the same house. It's up to them. I agree with what Pope Francis said. 'Who am I to judge?' Despite whatever term you use to describe your attractions, are you trying to follow Jesus and to live the Gospel? That's what's important."

*But the Church will still ensure they cannot have equal rights. Typical Joltian doublespeak.

On the priest sexual abuse scandal: "This is going to be with us forever. It has to be cleaned up. We must cooperate fully with civil and criminal authorities with complete transparency. No more cloak-and-dagger stuff. There must be zero tolerance and justice for the victims. Every structural and bureaucratic process has to be put in place to protect children and adults. And we must inspire people to lead moral lives. As bishop, it's up to me to set the tone."

D1B wrote:**** Joe, you ought to tell the new Albany Archbishop its all been cleaned up and you did the right thing all along!

Breaking News

ALBANY (NY)
Albany Times Union

Excerpts from Bishop-elect Edward Scharfenberger's comments on hot-button Catholic issues:

On abortion: "Our position on the sanctity of life at every stage of human development from conception to natural death is firm, fundamental and unchangeable. When we get into politics, it gets sticky. I am strong pro-life, but I'm not in-your-face. I don't tell people what to do. This is America."

*Typical Joltian doublespeak.

On women priests: "This is not an issue open to doctrinal development, but I'm open to listening to anything."

On gays in the church: "I have friends who are gay and some who are celibate and live together in the same house. It's up to them. I agree with what Pope Francis said. 'Who am I to judge?' Despite whatever term you use to describe your attractions, are you trying to follow Jesus and to live the Gospel? That's what's important."

*But the Church will still ensure they cannot have equal rights. Typical Joltian doublespeak.

On the priest sexual abuse scandal: "This is going to be with us forever. It has to be cleaned up. We must cooperate fully with civil and criminal authorities with complete transparency. No more cloak-and-dagger stuff. There must be zero tolerance and justice for the victims. Every structural and bureaucratic process has to be put in place to protect children and adults. And we must inspire people to lead moral lives. As bishop, it's up to me to set the tone."

Joe, better get Fast Eddie on the horn and set him straight.

JoltinJoe wrote:

D1B wrote:**** Joe, you ought to tell the new Albany Archbishop its all been cleaned up and you did the right thing all along!

Breaking News


Joe, better get Fast Eddie on the horn and set him straight.

I agree with what he said 100%. And, having reached a present rate of abuse of nearly zero percent, we must stay on top of the issue so that we don't fall back to the still existing shaky standards of society as a whole when it comes to sex abuse.

JoltinJoe wrote:Nearly zero percent.

Next.

This issue brings together two strains of church life that NCR has been tracking for some 30 years: the sexual abuse of minors by clergy, and the finances of dioceses. It is in these two areas that church leaders are at their most vulnerable.
The sexual abuse of minors by clergy and the subsequent cover-up by those in the church leadership structure have sapped the hierarchy of much of its moral authority. Many times, the church has seemed to be moving on from the immediacy of that crisis, and then something happens -- a priest in Newark, N.J., who is supposed to be on restricted ministry is found on youth retreats, or leaders in the St. Paul-Minneapolis archdiocese ignore their own guidelines and the Dallas Charter for the Protection of Children and Young People -- and we are plunged headlong back into that morass.

The unprecedented appointment of the new Pontifical Commission for the Protection of Minors should have been greeted with jubilation -- a commission of experts with direct access to the pope is something that could not have been imagined even three years ago. Instead, the announcement comes with many unanswered questions: Who will lead the commission? Where will it fit in the Vatican bureaucracy? What is its exact mandate? Sources have been telling NCR since December that this commission would be decisive in answering concerns of victim advocates, particularly in producing procedures to censure bishops who violate church law on clergy sex abuse. What could have been a watershed moment has done little to assuage critics. It is more than an opportunity wasted. It is the surest sign yet of the tremendous resistance that Pope Francis and his Council of Cardinals are meeting inside the church bureaucracy.

The sexual abuse of minors by clergy cost the U.S. church $109 million in 2013 and a total of $2.74 billion since 2004. But don't look to the bishops' annual report on compliance with the Dallas Charter to learn how much your diocese paid into that lump sum; the report doesn't break down any data that way. Such fundamental information, which Catholics who support their church have a right to know, isn't available because the bishops don't want to share it. No national norms require financial disclosure and no mechanism holds bishops accountable.

Which is why, for the 10th time, the Lincoln, Neb., diocese and three Eastern Catholic eparchies have refused to comply with audits mandated by the bishops' own charter. It is no surprise that each of the annual reports describing the audit displays an increasing frustration on the part of the laypeople commissioned to write them. "Total participation in the audit is one of the few ways to demonstrate to the faithful the commitment of the bishops to right the horrific wrongs done in the past and to do all that they can to prevent such abuse from happening again," National Review Board president Francesco Cesareo wrote in his introduction to this year's report. One hundred percent participation is still the goal, he wrote. "This is a matter of utmost importance in the protection of our children and the restoration of the bishops' credibility."


Nine U.S. diocese have declared bankruptcy since 2004, directly as a result of the sex abuse crisis. But other trends in demographics and society are also straining church finances, especially in the East, Northeast and upper Midwest, where news comes regularly of church and school closings, parish consolidations, and cutbacks in diocesan staff and programs. In most dioceses, annual appeals and fundraising drives have become slickly orchestrated operations, more often than not run by professional consultants. Bishops can come to resemble politicians, in constant begging mode for campaign financing, just to keep the coffers from going empty.

This may be one of the reasons why stories about bishops building mansions causes swift and angry responses from the people in the pews, as we have seen in Camden, N.J., Newark, and Atlanta. The questions that follow echo the questions from the sex abuse crisis: What were the bishops thinking? Why don't they get it?

The answers to those questions also echo the sex abuse crisis. The bishop is the lord of his domain, and he can do what he wills. For bishops' compensation, guidelines and best practices exist, as our story shows, and most bishops follow the rules. The trouble is, as Bishop Tom Gumbleton says about his retirement benefits, "nobody ever asks any questions. If I wanted to live in a big house ... I guess I could do it, and nobody would say anything about it. ... I get what I ask for. And each bishop does."

Out of weariness, one is tempted to look at news about sex abuse and church finances and conclude that the system is broken. In reality, what is broken in this 2,000-year-old church that has weathered many crises is the clerical system that has dominated it in the last few hundred years.

The good news out of Newark and Atlanta is that in the information age, people could learn what their archbishops were doing and could respond in a strong voice that demanded answers to questions. To his credit, Atlanta Archbishop Wilton Gregory heard the criticism (albeit after it became front-page news and led local TV newscasts) and is trying to make amends. "What we didn't stop to consider ... was that the world and the church have changed," Gregory said. Meanwhile, Philadelphia seems to be giving financial transparency a try.

The times have changed. An educated and engaged laity is demanding answers and accountability.