The Ukraine Crisis

[SeattleGriz]

You're full of crap. Russia is not deliberately targeting civilians. That statement is as bereft of logic as you believing Putin blew up his own pipeline.

You're telling me Russia didn't go all Team USA and bomb all the infrastructure, but they'll target civilians. Put down the NY Times.

What did the ICC say about Putin and his treatment of civilians?

The ICC.

[Silenoz]

Yeah, keep telling yourself that. I guess the Kherson fiasco didn't teach you anything. Stacks of (Russian) bodies indeed.

And keep telling yourself you haven't chosen a horse in this race. You've been rah rah'ing the Russian propaganda since day one

Ok. So not buying the flag waiving narratives is the same a pushing Russian narratives. Sure thing bud.

BTW, Ukraine is losing even harder now since my post 2 months ago. I get a good laugh from the back and forth narratives of "Bakhmut isn't important" and "Bakhmut must be held at all costs" going on in recent weeks. Make up your mind, flag waivers.

BTW, anyone of you flag waivers answer the Zalensky's call to spill American blood over there? Sign up, grab a gun and head to the front. Nothing stopping you from getting directly involved.

Keep telling yourself that's what you're doing brosef.

"I'm just skeptic of the narrative."

Yeah, that's the same thing you dipshits were saying about the election results back in 2020. At some point a spade's a spade.

And keep telling yourself that Russia is doing well. Or accomplishing anything. Remember when you were jizzing in your pants about the "failed" Kherson counteroffensive. How'd that go for you?

Either one of you Putin fanboys want to list the Russian victories from the last 8 months? Anyone? Bueller?

[SeattleGriz]

Ok. So not buying the flag waiving narratives is the same a pushing Russian narratives. Sure thing bud.

BTW, Ukraine is losing even harder now since my post 2 months ago. I get a good laugh from the back and forth narratives of "Bakhmut isn't important" and "Bakhmut must be held at all costs" going on in recent weeks. Make up your mind, flag waivers.

BTW, anyone of you flag waivers answer the Zalensky's call to spill American blood over there? Sign up, grab a gun and head to the front. Nothing stopping you from getting directly involved.

Keep telling yourself that's what you're doing brosef.

"I'm just skeptic of the narrative."

Yeah, that's the same thing you dipshits were saying about the election results back in 2020. At some point a spade's a spade.

And keep telling yourself that Russia is doing well. Or accomplishing anything. Remember when you were jizzing in your pants about the "failed" Kherson counteroffensive. How'd that go for you?

Either one of you Putin fanboys want to list the Russian victories from the last 8 months? Anyone? Bueller?

You sure you're following the same war? Multiple outlets have said Russia has a 9:1 advantage in artillery fire. In what world does that work out to Russians having anywhere near the 130k+ dead of Ukraine?

Secondly, do you not know where the war is happening right now? Along the fortified positions the Ukrainians built up over the last 9 years. Ukraine is dug in big time and very good at digging in, especially in the fly.

As much as you and GF believe the Russians are sending men in head first, it's not true. They have no need if they can keep moving incrementally closer with artillery that has a better range.

[houndawg]

Keep telling yourself that's what you're doing brosef.

"I'm just skeptic of the narrative."

Yeah, that's the same thing you dipshits were saying about the election results back in 2020. At some point a spade's a spade.

And keep telling yourself that Russia is doing well. Or accomplishing anything. Remember when you were jizzing in your pants about the "failed" Kherson counteroffensive. How'd that go for you?

Either one of you Putin fanboys want to list the Russian victories from the last 8 months? Anyone? Bueller?

You sure you're following the same war? Multiple outlets have said Russia has a 9:1 advantage in artillery fire. In what world does that work out to Russians having anywhere near the 130k+ dead of Ukraine?

Secondly, do you not know where the war is happening right now? Along the fortified positions the Ukrainians built up over the last 9 years. Ukraine is dug in big time and very good at digging in, especially in the fly.

As much as you and GF believe the Russians are sending men in head first, it's not true. They have no need if they can keep moving incrementally closer with artillery that has a better range.

Funny how they can't advance.

Putin's War is about to collapse their economy and the brain drain is going to prolong the effect. 10 years from now they won't even be on the list of developed nations.

[Skjellyfetti]

Funny how they can't advance.

Not to mention the ~14k square miles of previously occupied territory they've lost since September.

[SeattleGriz]

You sure you're following the same war? Multiple outlets have said Russia has a 9:1 advantage in artillery fire. In what world does that work out to Russians having anywhere near the 130k+ dead of Ukraine?

Secondly, do you not know where the war is happening right now? Along the fortified positions the Ukrainians built up over the last 9 years. Ukraine is dug in big time and very good at digging in, especially in the fly.

As much as you and GF believe the Russians are sending men in head first, it's not true. They have no need if they can keep moving incrementally closer with artillery that has a better range.

Funny how they can't advance.

Putin's War is about to collapse their economy and the brain drain is going to prolong the effect. 10 years from now they won't even be on the list of developed nations.

Did IQs sharply drop while I was away? Ukraine has had eight years to dig in. Russia is slowly advancing on those positions, but slowly.

Funny how your statements are at odds with each other. Russia is moving too fast, they are wreckless. Russia is moving too slow, they are incompetent.

[SeattleGriz]

Funny how they can't advance.

Not to mention the ~14k square miles of previously occupied territory they've lost since September.

What strategic value is that land worth?

[houndawg]

Funny how they can't advance.

Putin's War is about to collapse their economy and the brain drain is going to prolong the effect. 10 years from now they won't even be on the list of developed nations.

Did IQs sharply drop while I was away? Ukraine has had eight years to dig in. Russia is slowly advancing on those positions, but slowly.

Funny how your statements are at odds with each other. Russia is moving too fast, they are wreckless. Russia is moving too slow, they are incompetent.

The only thing they're advancing on is Russia

[Skjellyfetti]

Not to mention the ~14k square miles of previously occupied territory they've lost since September.

What strategic value is that land worth?

Oh.

Just a regional capital - the only regional capital Russia captured in their 2023 invasion.

And, logistics hubs like Kupyansk and Izyum.

[UNI88]

Did IQs sharply drop while I was away? Ukraine has had eight years to dig in. Russia is slowly advancing on those positions, but slowly.

Funny how your statements are at odds with each other. Russia is moving too fast, they are wreckless. Russia is moving too slow, they are incompetent.

The only thing they're advancing on is Russia

That's the glass is half full attitude we like to see - retreating is just advancing in the opposite direction.

[kalm]

[houndawg]

He's playing 3D chess....we can't possibly foretell what political masterstroke will result from this seeming blunder.

I still maintain that coming so close to having the US out of NATO for the price of a Trump Tower in Moscow pushed him over the edge when his puppet candidate lost in 2020. The whole plan to restore the glory of the Soviet Union was in place and ready to roll and then that loser Trump screwed up everything. He had it in his hand and then Trump fucked up an election, something that couldn't happen in Russia, but he decided to go ahead with his plan anyway and oh my goodness was that a bad decision that was.

[GannonFan]

He's playing 3D chess....we can't possibly foretell what political masterstroke will result from this seeming blunder.

I still maintain that coming so close to having the US out of NATO for the price of a Trump Tower in Moscow pushed him over the edge when his puppet candidate lost in 2020. The whole plan to restore the glory of the Soviet Union was in place and ready to roll and then that loser Trump screwed up everything. He had it in his hand and then Trump fucked up an election, something that couldn't happen in Russia, but he decided to go ahead with his plan anyway and oh my goodness was that a bad decision that was.

Like I said before, Trump was an even worse puppet, if that's what he was, before all of that. Heck, the rest of Europe was already heeding his call to invest in military budgets before he lost in 2020 and before Putin launched his ill-advised war. Putin's probably been fuming since 2016 that things weren't working out for him like he hoped.

[houndawg]

He's playing 3D chess....we can't possibly foretell what political masterstroke will result from this seeming blunder.

I still maintain that coming so close to having the US out of NATO for the price of a Trump Tower in Moscow pushed him over the edge when his puppet candidate lost in 2020. The whole plan to restore the glory of the Soviet Union was in place and ready to roll and then that loser Trump screwed up everything. He had it in his hand and then Trump fucked up an election, something that couldn't happen in Russia, but he decided to go ahead with his plan anyway and oh my goodness was that a bad decision that was.

Like I said before, Trump was an even worse puppet, if that's what he was, before all of that. Heck, the rest of Europe was already heeding his call to invest in military budgets before he lost in 2020 and before Putin launched his ill-advised war. Putin's probably been fuming since 2016 that things weren't working out for him like he hoped.

You think they were doing that because Trump told them to and not because they could smell the coffee by Putin's increasing meddling and his rhetoric about the good ol' days and how Ukrainians are actually Russians?

[GannonFan]

Like I said before, Trump was an even worse puppet, if that's what he was, before all of that. Heck, the rest of Europe was already heeding his call to invest in military budgets before he lost in 2020 and before Putin launched his ill-advised war. Putin's probably been fuming since 2016 that things weren't working out for him like he hoped.

You think they were doing that because Trump told them to and not because they could smell the coffee by Putin's increasing meddling and his rhetoric about the good ol' days and how Ukrainians are actually Russians?

As kalmie is always apt to try to avoid saying, it's complicated.

[houndawg]

You think they were doing that because Trump told them to and not because they could smell the coffee by Putin's increasing meddling and his rhetoric about the good ol' days and how Ukrainians are actually Russians?

As kalmie is always apt to try to avoid saying, it's complicated.

I didn't think you were seriously trying to sell that shit once I saw it wasn't from SG

[UNI88]

He's playing 3D chess....we can't possibly foretell what political masterstroke will result from this seeming blunder.

I still maintain that coming so close to having the US out of NATO for the price of a Trump Tower in Moscow pushed him over the edge when his puppet candidate lost in 2020. The whole plan to restore the glory of the Soviet Union was in place and ready to roll and then that loser Trump screwed up everything. He had it in his hand and then Trump fucked up an election, something that couldn't happen in Russia, but he decided to go ahead with his plan anyway and oh my goodness was that a bad decision that was.

Will Xi be "pushed him over the edge" if his puppet candidate loses in 2024? Will his whole plan to restore the glory of China be fucked up by an American election? Will he he decide to go ahead with his plan anyway?

[SeattleGriz]

He's playing 3D chess....we can't possibly foretell what political masterstroke will result from this seeming blunder.

I still maintain that coming so close to having the US out of NATO for the price of a Trump Tower in Moscow pushed him over the edge when his puppet candidate lost in 2020. The whole plan to restore the glory of the Soviet Union was in place and ready to roll and then that loser Trump screwed up everything. He had it in his hand and then Trump fucked up an election, something that couldn't happen in Russia, but he decided to go ahead with his plan anyway and oh my goodness was that a bad decision that was.

John Mearsheimer says you're wrong, but what does he know, especially as you watch MSNBC! You guys with your "Putin's putting the band back together" is hilarious.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/ ... in-ukraine

With Ukraine, it’s very important to understand that, up until 2014, we did not envision nato expansion and E.U. expansion as a policy that was aimed at containing Russia. Nobody seriously thought that Russia was a threat before February 22, 2014. nato expansion, E.U. expansion, and turning Ukraine and Georgia and other countries into liberal democracies were all about creating a giant zone of peace that spread all over Europe and included Eastern Europe and Western Europe. It was not aimed at containing Russia. What happened is that this major crisis broke out, and we had to assign blame, and of course we were never going to blame ourselves. We were going to blame the Russians. So we invented this story that Russia was bent on aggression in Eastern Europe. Putin is interested in creating a greater Russia, or maybe even re-creating the Soviet Union

[GannonFan]

He's playing 3D chess....we can't possibly foretell what political masterstroke will result from this seeming blunder.

I still maintain that coming so close to having the US out of NATO for the price of a Trump Tower in Moscow pushed him over the edge when his puppet candidate lost in 2020. The whole plan to restore the glory of the Soviet Union was in place and ready to roll and then that loser Trump screwed up everything. He had it in his hand and then Trump fucked up an election, something that couldn't happen in Russia, but he decided to go ahead with his plan anyway and oh my goodness was that a bad decision that was.

John Mearsheimer says you're wrong, but what does he know, especially as you watch MSNBC! You guys with your "Putin's putting the band back together" is hilarious.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/ ... in-ukraine

With Ukraine, it’s very important to understand that, up until 2014, we did not envision nato expansion and E.U. expansion as a policy that was aimed at containing Russia. Nobody seriously thought that Russia was a threat before February 22, 2014. nato expansion, E.U. expansion, and turning Ukraine and Georgia and other countries into liberal democracies were all about creating a giant zone of peace that spread all over Europe and included Eastern Europe and Western Europe. It was not aimed at containing Russia. What happened is that this major crisis broke out, and we had to assign blame, and of course we were never going to blame ourselves. We were going to blame the Russians. So we invented this story that Russia was bent on aggression in Eastern Europe. Putin is interested in creating a greater Russia, or maybe even re-creating the Soviet Union

So you're saying Putin got duped into himself believing that he needed to put the old Soviet Union back again? He's not a real deep thinker, your guy Putin that is.

[houndawg]

John Mearsheimer says you're wrong, but what does he know, especially as you watch MSNBC! You guys with your "Putin's putting the band back together" is hilarious.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and-a/ ... in-ukraine

So you're saying Putin got duped into himself believing that he needed to put the old Soviet Union back again? He's not a real deep thinker, your guy Putin that is.

He sure wasn't this time.

[SeattleGriz]

US intelligence makes its way to the internet. Love how they repeatedly try to claim the "real" casualty numbers were fudged.

"Honestly. We can't even keep our own Intel off the internet, but believe us when we tell you Russia has more casualties...". Yeah, sure. Gotta keep that narrative rolling so the US can send every last Ukrainian to their deaths.

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2023/ ... ts-leaked/

The latest documents were found on Twitter and other sites Friday, a day after senior Biden administration officials said they were investigating a potential leak of classified Ukrainian war plans, include an alarming assessment of Ukraine’s faltering air defense capabilities. One slide, dated Feb. 23, is labeled “Secret/NoForn,” meaning it was not meant to be shared with foreign countries.

I'm old enough to remember when I mentioned Ukraine's limited air defense and was told I was wrong.

[SeattleGriz]

https://www.wsj.com/articles/pentagon-s ... malertNEWS

The Pentagon is investigating social-media posts that purport to reveal highly classified U.S. government documents on the war in Ukraine and other key international topics, in what could be one of the most dangerous intelligence breaches in decades.

Well over 100 images, marked with “Top Secret” and other classifications indicating they represent highly sensitive U.S.-produced intelligence, were posted in the Discord message board of fans of the Minecraft computer game around March 1. While many of them were deleted recently, open-source intelligence researchers have managed to download more than 60 files.

[SeattleGriz]

Now we know why the US leaked documents are out there. Gotta make a new Russia bad narrative and try to distract from Hollande's admission.

18 hours before the leak/story construct. Two Russian gremlins, perhaps state sponsored, or perhaps just state aligned, tricked former French President Francios Hollande into admitting the U.S. government and western alliance were behind all of the events in Ukraine after 2014, with the expressed intention to construct a proxy war against Russia using Ukraine.

Russian Pranksters Vovan and Lexus, posing as former Ukraine President Petro Poroshenko, got French ex-President Francois Hollande to admit the Minsk Accords were a NATO ruse to militarize Ukraine, and Western nations overthrew Ukraine’s democratically-elected government in 2014.

[Skjellyfetti]

[SeattleGriz]

Less than one news cycle later, the Intel story drops. Lame and predictable, but there will still be some clinging to the belief our government doesn't lie to us about starting wars.