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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63gcCDwJC2U[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JkkS0Msj3s[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NxEIgOK-Bo[/youtube]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uVIP1GrzwU[/youtube]

Not a surprise. The Greeks want their 'entitlements'. EU imposed reforms on them for getting the 'bailout' money and they don't like it. They don't like the reforms that will save their country....spending cuts, taxs, labor and pension reforms.

After Greece joined the EU, public sector wages grew by 50%...wow.

Living beyond your means.....wonder who else does this?......

Bison Fan in NW MN wrote:Not a surprise. The Greeks want their 'entitlements'. EU imposed reforms on them for getting the 'bailout' money and they don't like it. They don't like the reforms that will save their country....spending cuts, taxs, labor and pension reforms.

You've boiled down the essence of the issue, separated the essence from its true context and then filtered said essence through a thick micropore prism of conservative media and we're left with your argument: "The Greeks want their 'entitlements'".

I envy your simple world.

biobengal wrote:

Bison Fan in NW MN wrote:Not a surprise. The Greeks want their 'entitlements'. EU imposed reforms on them for getting the 'bailout' money and they don't like it. They don't like the reforms that will save their country....spending cuts, taxs, labor and pension reforms.

You've boiled down the essence of the issue, separated the essence from its true context and then filtered said essence through a thick micropore prism of conservative media and we're left with your argument: "The Greeks want their 'entitlements'".

I envy your simple world.

Then what exactly are they protesting for? To not be bailed out by the EU?

SDHornet wrote:

biobengal wrote:
You've boiled down the essence of the issue, separated the essence from its true context and then filtered said essence through a thick micropore prism of conservative media and we're left with your argument: "The Greeks want their 'entitlements'".

I envy your simple world.

Then what exactly are they protesting for? To not be bailed out by the EU?

I think because the gov needs to cut wages, pensions and other gov monies that the people expect to keep the country from falling into chaos....

Bison Fan in NW MN wrote:

SDHornet wrote: Then what exactly are they protesting for? To not be bailed out by the EU?

I think because the gov needs to cut wages, pensions and other gov monies that the people expect to keep the country from falling into chaos....

You mean entitlements.

Perhaps they can get another loan from Goldman Sachs...

kalm wrote:Perhaps they can get another loan from Goldman Sachs...

Someone has done the required reading...

I always thought the Greeks were closest to Italians. But I think they are closer to the French.

You've boiled down the essence of the issue, separated the essence from its true context and then filtered said essence through a thick micropore prism of conservative media and we're left with your argument: "The Greeks want their 'entitlements'".

I envy your simple world.

Feel free to explain the situation so we will understand why it does not all boil down to "The Greeks want their entitlements."

Seriously. In my opinion you should not make a post like that without explaining why what you assert is so. Perhaps there will be people who will complain that your post is to long. But you should still do it.

If you think the proper context would change the perception you should provide the context. So on and so forth.

JohnStOnge wrote:

You've boiled down the essence of the issue, separated the essence from its true context and then filtered said essence through a thick micropore prism of conservative media and we're left with your argument: "The Greeks want their 'entitlements'".

I envy your simple world.

Feel free to explain the situation so we will understand why it does not all boil down to "The Greeks want their entitlements."

Seriously. In my opinion you should not make a post like that without explaining why what you assert is so. Perhaps there will be people who will complain that your post is to long. But you should still do it.

If you think the proper context would change the perception you should provide the context. So on and so forth.

You're oversimplifying a complex issue.

BTW I like that "Roof is on Fire" song (third video). I'm going to have to look that up.

Oh yeah my horizons have been expanded:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Adgx9wt6 ... ure=fvwrel[/youtube]

biobengal wrote:

kalm wrote:Perhaps they can get another loan from Goldman Sachs...

Someone has done the required reading...

So in your infinite wisdom, explain how "entitlements' is not the core of their bull**it?


This is exactly why they are protesting.....

You're oversimplifying a complex issue.

Progressives, in particular, use that approach to argument all the time. And many times they're talking about something that, while complex, can be adequately summarized in simple terms.

If someone is going to say something like that they should be willing to follow up by demonstrating how being aware of and understanding the complexity changes the basic perception. They shouldn't cop out by saying something like "go do your research." At the very least they should provide a reference to something someone can look at. I saw an on line article just yesterday or the day before...actually before I got to this thread...about how it wasn't really welfare that caused the problem in Europe (I was trying to research the economic impact of welfare). So it shouldn't be hard to refer people.

Not a surprise. The Greeks want their 'entitlements'. EU imposed reforms on them for getting the 'bailout' money and they don't like it. They don't like the reforms that will save their country....spending cuts, taxs, labor and pension reforms.

BTW, that statement doesn't include any hypotheses about how the Greeks got to where they are. It just addresses the riots. Maybe it is "oversimplified" by just referring "the Greeks" because only a certain proportion of Greeks have the outlook involved. Maybe it's a majority of Greeks who, while not all actually rioting, share the general outlook. Maybe not. But it's just simplified in the same way as saying "Women voted for Obama" is simplified. We do that all the time.

Clearly, at least those that are rioting are upset because they feel like something they are entitled to may be taken away. That seems pretty self evident. I don't think any big study of all of the complex factors that led to where Greece is today is going to change that basic perception. But you guys can at least go ahead and give it a shot.

JohnStOnge wrote:

You're oversimplifying a complex issue.

Progressives, in particular, use that approach to argument all the time. And many times they're talking about something that, while complex, can be adequately summarized in simple terms.

If someone is going to say something like that they should be willing to follow up by demonstrating how being aware of and understanding the complexity changes the basic perception. They shouldn't cop out by saying something like "go do your research." At the very least they should provide a reference to something someone can look at. I saw an on line article just yesterday or the day before...actually before I got to this thread...about how it wasn't really welfare that caused the problem in Europe (I was trying to research the economic impact of welfare). So it shouldn't be hard to refer people.

Entitlements play a role, but that's not the whole story and that's not the sole reason people are rioting. Greece wanted in the EU but needed to hide some of its sovereign debt. The good folks at Goldman-Sachs were more than happy to help, just like they did in Jefferson County, Alabama. This is what happens when government officials get in over their heads with banksters.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-03-0 ... avels.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Greece should take the route of Iceland. Let the banks fail, prosecute bank management and public officials who were involved, and the global financiers.

Come to think of it...so should we.

There ya have it John, a libertarian response for you complete with a link to a Reason magazine article. "Simple as a flower...but that's a complicated thing."

JohnStOnge wrote:

You're oversimplifying a complex issue.

Progressives, in particular, use that approach to argument all the time. And many times they're talking about something that, while complex, can be adequately summarized in simple terms.

If someone is going to say something like that they should be willing to follow up by demonstrating how being aware of and understanding the complexity changes the basic perception. They shouldn't cop out by saying something like "go do your research." At the very least they should provide a reference to something someone can look at. I saw an on line article just yesterday or the day before...actually before I got to this thread...about how it wasn't really welfare that caused the problem in Europe (I was trying to research the economic impact of welfare). So it shouldn't be hard to refer people.

Why don't you follow your own advice from time to time?

Those videos are awesome. I think it's the Irish blood in me that really admires the technique with those Molotovs.

93henfan wrote:Those videos are awesome. I think it's the Irish blood in me that really admires the technique with those Molotovs.

More anti-Semitism?

CAA Flagship wrote:

93henfan wrote:Those videos are awesome. I think it's the Irish blood in me that really admires the technique with those Molotovs.

More anti-Semitism?

I know Molotov was Russian. Was he tight with money too?

93henfan wrote:

CAA Flagship wrote: More anti-Semitism?

I know Molotov was Russian. Was he tight with money too?

No. He relocated to Miami.