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ASUG8 wrote:I don't know, but $787B in stimulus didn't create 2 MM jobs or get unemployment below 8% as promised. Maybe we throw a few hundred billion more at it and something positive will happen.

ASUG8 wrote:I could respond with the current administration's mantra on the stimulus by saying "Look at how bad it would have been if we didn't do it" but that is purely MMQB speculation. Bush tax cuts were likely in part to protect his buddies with some light economic theory thrown in to sell it to the masses. Clearly it didn't work for everyone, but a repeal right now would be a nightmare scenario - might as well repeal the mortgage interest deduction while you're at it.

I'm just spitballin' here. Somehow we have to get consumer confidence back up, get the banks extending credit legitimately, and make people feel much more secure in their jobs to get the economic engine moving again. I don't think a one-shot $4000 credit to employers to hire someone full time is enough incentive to get tentative employers off the fence.

Cap'n Cat wrote:

ASUG8 wrote:I don't know, but $787B in stimulus didn't create 2 MM jobs or get unemployment below 8% as promised. Maybe we throw a few hundred billion more at it and something positive will happen.

Understand and appreciate your point, G8r, however, it was a shot - one that had to be taken, because -

The Bush Tax cuts failed us!

How much did his tax cuts cost us and what in the fvck did we get in return except for richer Conks?????

Z:


"Givin' this one to mah daughter fer her dorm room."

AZGrizFan wrote:

Cap'n Cat wrote:

Understand and appreciate your point, G8r, however, it was a shot - one that had to be taken, because -

The Bush Tax cuts failed us!

How much did his tax cuts cost us and what in the fvck did we get in return except for richer Conks?????

Z:


"Givin' this one to mah daughter fer her dorm room."

God, that is a handsome man.

D1B wrote:Sure is. The dude on the right though could use a hair cut and a shower.

AZGrizFan wrote:

D1B wrote:Sure is. The dude on the right though could use a hair cut and a shower.

How would you like to come around the corner of a trail and run headlong into either one of those ugly mugs?

AZGrizFan wrote:

D1B wrote:Sure is. The dude on the right though could use a hair cut and a shower.

How would you like to come around the corner of a trail and run headlong into either one of those ugly mugs?

Col Hogan wrote:Cap, your first mistake is assuming all conservatives supported what Bush did...you're dead wrong on that one...

He did cut taxes...then tried (and pretty much succeeded) to outspend Democrats...hell, he grew government faster than the Democrats ever dreamed of doing...

0bama simply kept the Bush spending spree going and took it to a much higher level...and he wants to increase taxes...

Neither administration was/is correct...so to try and do a comparison as you have is simply wrong...

kalm wrote:

Col Hogan wrote:Cap, your first mistake is assuming all conservatives supported what Bush did...you're dead wrong on that one...

He did cut taxes...then tried (and pretty much succeeded) to outspend Democrats...hell, he grew government faster than the Democrats ever dreamed of doing...

0bama simply kept the Bush spending spree going and took it to a much higher level...and he wants to increase taxes...

Neither administration was/is correct...so to try and do a comparison as you have is simply wrong...

1/3 of the first stimulus was tax cuts. The fed has pumped $9 trillion to the banks. The Bush tax cuts were extended. The proposed jobs plan is more...wait for it tax cuts. Corporation's share of the tax burden has drpped 30 pts in the last 40 years. it ain't workin'.

ASUG8 wrote:

kalm wrote:
1/3 of the first stimulus was tax cuts. The fed has pumped $9 trillion to the banks. The Bush tax cuts were extended. The proposed jobs plan is more...wait for it tax cuts. Corporation's share of the tax burden has drpped 30 pts in the last 40 years. it ain't workin'.

US corporate tax rates are among the highest in the world. US companies continue to send jobs offshore - the NLRB tries to block a US company from expanding into a right to work state in the US. We need to stop shooting ourselves in the foot with all the levels of bureaucracy.

kalm wrote:

ASUG8 wrote:
US corporate tax rates are among the highest in the world. US companies continue to send jobs offshore - the NLRB tries to block a US company from expanding into a right to work state in the US. We need to stop shooting ourselves in the foot with all the levels of bureaucracy.

The effective US corporate tax rate is the 2nd lowest among OECD countries.

ASUG8 wrote:

kalm wrote:
The effective US corporate tax rate is the 2nd lowest among OECD countries.

Really?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Incom ... ountry.svg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

kalm wrote:

Col Hogan wrote:Cap, your first mistake is assuming all conservatives supported what Bush did...you're dead wrong on that one...

He did cut taxes...then tried (and pretty much succeeded) to outspend Democrats...hell, he grew government faster than the Democrats ever dreamed of doing...

0bama simply kept the Bush spending spree going and took it to a much higher level...and he wants to increase taxes...

Neither administration was/is correct...so to try and do a comparison as you have is simply wrong...

1/3 of the first stimulus was tax cuts. The fed has pumped $9 trillion to the banks. The Bush tax cuts were extended. The proposed jobs plan is more...wait for it tax cuts. Corporation's share of the tax burden has drpped 30 pts in the last 40 years. it ain't workin'.

LeadBolt wrote:

ASUG8 wrote:
Really?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Incom ... ountry.svg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

OH, NO! There you go again, confusing them with facts, now there will be h*11 to pay....

Putting U.S. Corporate Taxes in Perspective

The U.S. corporate tax burden is smaller than average for developed countries.[1]  Corporations in 19 of the member states of the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development paid 16.1 percent of their profits in taxes between 2000 and 2005, on average, while corporations in the United States paid 13.4 percent.

End Notes:
[1] U.S. Department of the Treasury, “Treasury Conference on Business Taxation and Global Competitiveness: Background Paper,” July 23, 2007, Table 5-3 (giving data on a sample of 19 of the 30 OECD states).  For an international comparison of corporate-level taxes (taxes paid at the corporate level, including, for example, property taxes, labor taxes and contributions, and sales taxes), see: World Bank and PricewaterhouseCoopers, “Paying Taxes 2008: the Global Picture,” http://www.doingbusiness.org/documents/ ... s_2008.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.  This study compared the corporate-level taxation that a hypothetical company with 60 employees would face in 178 countries.  The study found that the corporate-level taxes the model company would pay, measured as a percentage of its profits, would be higher in 76 other countries (including 15 OECD countries) than in the United States.

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=784" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

kalm wrote:

LeadBolt wrote:
OH, NO! There you go again, confusing them with facts, now there will be h*11 to pay....

Putting U.S. Corporate Taxes in Perspective

The U.S. corporate tax burden is smaller than average for developed countries.[1]  Corporations in 19 of the member states of the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development paid 16.1 percent of their profits in taxes between 2000 and 2005, on average, while corporations in the United States paid 13.4 percent.

End Notes:
[1] U.S. Department of the Treasury, “Treasury Conference on Business Taxation and Global Competitiveness: Background Paper,” July 23, 2007, Table 5-3 (giving data on a sample of 19 of the 30 OECD states).  For an international comparison of corporate-level taxes (taxes paid at the corporate level, including, for example, property taxes, labor taxes and contributions, and sales taxes), see: World Bank and PricewaterhouseCoopers, “Paying Taxes 2008: the Global Picture,” http://www.doingbusiness.org/documents/ ... s_2008.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.  This study compared the corporate-level taxation that a hypothetical company with 60 employees would face in 178 countries.  The study found that the corporate-level taxes the model company would pay, measured as a percentage of its profits, would be higher in 76 other countries (including 15 OECD countries) than in the United States.

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=784" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Conks...shitty at reading and math.

kalm wrote:

LeadBolt wrote:
OH, NO! There you go again, confusing them with facts, now there will be h*11 to pay....

Putting U.S. Corporate Taxes in Perspective

The U.S. corporate tax burden is smaller than average for developed countries.[1]  Corporations in 19 of the member states of the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development paid 16.1 percent of their profits in taxes between 2000 and 2005, on average, while corporations in the United States paid 13.4 percent.

End Notes:
[1] U.S. Department of the Treasury, “Treasury Conference on Business Taxation and Global Competitiveness: Background Paper,” July 23, 2007, Table 5-3 (giving data on a sample of 19 of the 30 OECD states).  For an international comparison of corporate-level taxes (taxes paid at the corporate level, including, for example, property taxes, labor taxes and contributions, and sales taxes), see: World Bank and PricewaterhouseCoopers, “Paying Taxes 2008: the Global Picture,” http://www.doingbusiness.org/documents/ ... s_2008.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.  This study compared the corporate-level taxation that a hypothetical company with 60 employees would face in 178 countries.  The study found that the corporate-level taxes the model company would pay, measured as a percentage of its profits, would be higher in 76 other countries (including 15 OECD countries) than in the United States.

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=784" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Conks...shitty at reading and math.

Ivytalk wrote:

kalm wrote:


Conks...shitty at reading and math.

Typical klam source: Lefty think tank loaded with former "expert" staffers for the likes of Biden and Kerry. And the queen of do-gooders, Marian Wright Edelman, is on the board.

Grizalltheway wrote:klam: since you're obviously not busy, get your ass over to Missoula in time for lunch.