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The federal government's financial condition deteriorated rapidly last year, far beyond the $1.5 trillion in new debt taken on to finance the budget deficit, a USA TODAY analysis shows.

The government added $5.3 trillion in new financial obligations in 2010, largely for retirement programs such as Medicare and Social Security. That brings to a record $61.6 trillion the total of financial promises not paid for.
This gap between spending commitments and revenue last year equals more than one-third of the nation's gross domestic product.
Medicare alone took on $1.8 trillion in new liabilities, more than the record deficit prompting heated debate between Congress and the White House over lifting the debt ceiling.

Social Security added $1.4 trillion in obligations, partly reflecting longer life expectancies. Federal and military retirement programs added more to the financial hole, too.
Corporations would be required to count these new liabilities when they are taken on — and report a big loss to shareholders. Unlike businesses, however, Congress postpones recording spending commitments until it writes a check.

The $61.6 trillion in unfunded obligations amounts to $527,000 per household. That's more than five times what Americans have borrowed for everything else — mortgages, car loans and other debt. It reflects the challenge as the number of retirees soars over the next 20 years and seniors try to collect on those spending promises........"
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http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington ... titialskip" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

We are f*cked as a country...

BDKJMU wrote:The federal government's financial condition deteriorated rapidly last year, far beyond the $1.5 trillion in new debt taken on to finance the budget deficit, a USA TODAY analysis shows.

The government added $5.3 trillion in new financial obligations in 2010, largely for retirement programs such as Medicare and Social Security. That brings to a record $61.6 trillion the total of financial promises not paid for.
This gap between spending commitments and revenue last year equals more than one-third of the nation's gross domestic product.
Medicare alone took on $1.8 trillion in new liabilities, more than the record deficit prompting heated debate between Congress and the White House over lifting the debt ceiling.

Social Security added $1.4 trillion in obligations, partly reflecting longer life expectancies. Federal and military retirement programs added more to the financial hole, too.
Corporations would be required to count these new liabilities when they are taken on — and report a big loss to shareholders. Unlike businesses, however, Congress postpones recording spending commitments until it writes a check.

The $61.6 trillion in unfunded obligations amounts to $527,000 per household. That's more than five times what Americans have borrowed for everything else — mortgages, car loans and other debt. It reflects the challenge as the number of retirees soars over the next 20 years and seniors try to collect on those spending promises........"
(continues)
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington ... titialskip" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

We are f*cked as a country...

You think we're dumb enough to honor those obligations?

If the US government had to record its books according to generally accepted accounting principles, it would be hopelessly insolvent. The board of a publicly-traded corporation which did not reflect as liabilities future non-contingent liabilities would be indicted. The government, however, does not record as liabilities its future non-contingent obligations. This is not the first time I have heard a figure of $60 trillion as the actual level of US debt under generally accepted accounting principles.

On the other hand, many of these liabilities are so far in the future that it gives us time to figure out how to address these liabilities. Moreover, while the percentage of accrued current debt as a factor of GNP is still historically high, there are countries whose national debt is far more crippling, including many of the European nations.

That being said, we need to address our situation while we still have time and while we are still a prosperous nation.

JoltinJoe wrote:If the US government had to record its books according to generally accepted accounting principles, it would be hopelessly insolvent. The board of a publicly-traded corporation which did not reflect as liabilities future non-contingent liabilities would be indicted. The government, however, does not record as liabilities its future non-contingent obligations. This is not the first time I have heard a figure of $60 trillion as the actual level of US debt under generally accepted accounting principles.

On the other hand, many of these liabilities are so far in the future that it gives us time to figure out how to address these liabilities. Moreover, while the percentage of accrued current debt as a factor of GNP is still historically high, there are countries whose national debt is far more crippling, including many of the European nations.

That being said, we need to address our situation while we still have time and while we are still a prosperous nation.

Run the debt up to about 100 trillion and strategic default. When the dust settles we'll be better off than those we owe.

houndawg wrote:

JoltinJoe wrote:If the US government had to record its books according to generally accepted accounting principles, it would be hopelessly insolvent. The board of a publicly-traded corporation which did not reflect as liabilities future non-contingent liabilities would be indicted. The government, however, does not record as liabilities its future non-contingent obligations. This is not the first time I have heard a figure of $60 trillion as the actual level of US debt under generally accepted accounting principles.

On the other hand, many of these liabilities are so far in the future that it gives us time to figure out how to address these liabilities. Moreover, while the percentage of accrued current debt as a factor of GNP is still historically high, there are countries whose national debt is far more crippling, including many of the European nations.

That being said, we need to address our situation while we still have time and while we are still a prosperous nation.

Run the debt up to about 100 trillion and strategic default. When the dust settles we'll be better off than those we owe.

What a way to teach the next generation how to not care about doing things the right way. At this point, it looks like we've just thrown all our standards out the door. Will we really be better because of it, or will it just be another delusion of grandeur?

∞∞∞ wrote:

houndawg wrote:
Run the debt up to about 100 trillion and strategic default. When the dust settles we'll be better off than those we owe.

What a way to teach the next generation how to not care about doing things the right way. At this point, it looks like we've just thrown all our standards out the door.

You just figuring that out now?

houndawg wrote:

∞∞∞ wrote: What a way to teach the next generation how to not care about doing things the right way. At this point, it looks like we've just thrown all our standards out the door.

You just figuring that out now?

Well I'd like to think we're gonna at least try our best to climb out of this whole and not just give up. We have some of the brightest minds in the world...we just need to figure out how to solve the puzzle.

∞∞∞ wrote:...we just need to figure out how to solve the puzzle.

The only way to solve it is either:

1. Elect politicians with a conscience. (a very tall order)
2. Suffer a real financial collapse (the last few years have been Disney World compared to the 30s), endure the pain, reprioritize and rebuild.

JoltinJoe wrote:If the US government had to record its books according to generally accepted accounting principles, it would be hopelessly insolvent. The board of a publicly-traded corporation which did not reflect as liabilities future non-contingent liabilities would be indicted. The government, however, does not record as liabilities its future non-contingent obligations. This is not the first time I have heard a figure of $60 trillion as the actual level of US debt under generally accepted accounting principles.

On the other hand, many of these liabilities are so far in the future that it gives us time to figure out how to address these liabilities. Moreover, while the percentage of accrued current debt as a factor of GNP is still historically high, there are countries whose national debt is far more crippling, including many of the European nations.

That being said, we need to address our situation while we still have time and while we are still a prosperous nation.

Agreed, but you know just as well as I do that no politician is going to fight and make the sacrifice and the difficult decisions necessary to correct our path. No poltician is going to step up and it's a damn shame b/c the majority of Americans don't care enough to revolt.

Ibanez wrote:

JoltinJoe wrote:If the US government had to record its books according to generally accepted accounting principles, it would be hopelessly insolvent. The board of a publicly-traded corporation which did not reflect as liabilities future non-contingent liabilities would be indicted. The government, however, does not record as liabilities its future non-contingent obligations. This is not the first time I have heard a figure of $60 trillion as the actual level of US debt under generally accepted accounting principles.

On the other hand, many of these liabilities are so far in the future that it gives us time to figure out how to address these liabilities. Moreover, while the percentage of accrued current debt as a factor of GNP is still historically high, there are countries whose national debt is far more crippling, including many of the European nations.

That being said, we need to address our situation while we still have time and while we are still a prosperous nation.

Agreed, but you know just as well as I do that no politician is going to fight and make the sacrifice and the difficult decisions necessary to correct our path. No poltician is going to step up and it's a damn shame b/c the majority of Americans don't care enough to revolt.

My parents' generation fought World War II to preserve this nation for their children.

We need to fight the new "Battle of the Bulge" if we are to do the same. This is our generation's great fight. Are we up to the sacrifice, for the benefit of our children, or have we become soft and addicted to entitlement? Are we the equal of the "Greatest Generation," or are we the generation which squandered its sacrifices?

93henfan wrote:

∞∞∞ wrote:...we just need to figure out how to solve the puzzle.

The only way to solve it is either:

1. Elect politicians with a conscience. (a very tall order)
2. Suffer a real financial collapse (the last few years have been Disney World compared to the 30s), endure the pain, reprioritize and rebuild.

#1 has proven impossible, which is why I've been against the bailout and stimulus plans from the beginning.

JoltinJoe wrote:

Ibanez wrote:
Agreed, but you know just as well as I do that no politician is going to fight and make the sacrifice and the difficult decisions necessary to correct our path. No poltician is going to step up and it's a damn shame b/c the majority of Americans don't care enough to revolt.

My parents' generation fought World War II to preserve this nation for their children.

We need to fight the new "Battle of the Bulge" if we are to do the same. This is our generation's great fight. Are we up to the sacrifice, for the benefit of our children, or have we become soft and addicted to entitlement? Are we the equal of the "Greatest Generation," or are we the generation which squandered its sacrifices?

Nope. Some are, but not enough to offset the one's that don't care. What's in it for them? They'll be long gone by the time the bill comes due which, when you think about it, is about the only way to look at it without going crazy. Seriously, I'm willing to suffer some initial pain if there is a light at the end of the tunnel. But until that sacrifice is a mandated SHARED sacrifice, what's the fokking point? One of the many reasons I have chosen to stay child-free....alleviates the conscience...

The people of the "Greatest Generation" are so much better than any of the subsequent generations, it's pitiful....

Appaholic wrote:

JoltinJoe wrote:
My parents' generation fought World War II to preserve this nation for their children.

We need to fight the new "Battle of the Bulge" if we are to do the same. This is our generation's great fight. Are we up to the sacrifice, for the benefit of our children, or have we become soft and addicted to entitlement? Are we the equal of the "Greatest Generation," or are we the generation which squandered its sacrifices?

Nope. Some are, but not enough to offset the one's that don't care. What's in it for them? They'll be long gone by the time the bill comes due which, when you think about it, is about the only way to look at it without going crazy. Seriously, I'm willing to suffer some initial pain if there is a light at the end of the tunnel. But until that sacrifice is a mandated SHARED sacrifice, what's the fokking point? One of the many reasons I have chosen to stay child-free....alleviates the conscience...
:

Appaholic wrote:

JoltinJoe wrote:
My parents' generation fought World War II to preserve this nation for their children.

We need to fight the new "Battle of the Bulge" if we are to do the same. This is our generation's great fight. Are we up to the sacrifice, for the benefit of our children, or have we become soft and addicted to entitlement? Are we the equal of the "Greatest Generation," or are we the generation which squandered its sacrifices?

Nope. Some are, but not enough to offset the one's that don't care. What's in it for them? They'll be long gone by the time the bill comes due which, when you think about it, is about the only way to look at it without going crazy. Seriously, I'm willing to suffer some initial pain if there is a light at the end of the tunnel. But until that sacrifice is a mandated SHARED sacrifice, what's the fokking point? One of the many reasons I have chosen to stay child-free....alleviates the conscience...

The people of the "Greatest Generation" are so much better than any of the subsequent generations, it's pitiful....

I have a great fear you are 100% correct. But I still believe that maybe there is a great leader among us who can stand up and get people passionate about what we need to do in order to be the generation we have to become.

Maybe Pres. Obama could be that guy? He's a smart guy. Can he see what needs to be done and, in a Nixon-goes-to China reversal, give it to us straight? Stand up, Mr. President. People like you, even though you've been a big disappointment. Grab the mantle of greatness. Beats proceeding down the road of mediocrity he's traveling. (Damn, I wish I had just one minute with the President. I would tell him exactly what I just wrote).

If Pres. Obama adopted this as his cause, people would really believe it had to be done, because they know he would be going against his instincts. People knew we had to open relations with "Red China" when Nixon said so, because we knew he was going against his instincts and he had seen the truth written on the wall.

citdog wrote:

Appaholic wrote:
Nope. Some are, but not enough to offset the one's that don't care. What's in it for them? They'll be long gone by the time the bill comes due which, when you think about it, is about the only way to look at it without going crazy. Seriously, I'm willing to suffer some initial pain if there is a light at the end of the tunnel. But until that sacrifice is a mandated SHARED sacrifice, what's the fokking point? One of the many reasons I have chosen to stay child-free....alleviates the conscience...
:

Kind of looks like a graph of available ammunition in south circa 1864.....minus the ammunition already re-located in the bodies of the traitors...

Appaholic wrote:

citdog wrote:

Kind of looks like a graph of available ammunition in south circa 1864.....minus the ammunition already re-located in the bodies of the traitors...

Actually, RUBE, these gentlemen had plenty of ammo but lacked food.

citdog wrote:

Appaholic wrote:
Kind of looks like a graph of available ammunition in south circa 1864.....minus the ammunition already re-located in the bodies of the traitors...

Actually, RUBE, these gentlemen had plenty of ammo but lacked food.

...which explains so much regarding why they lost the war....gotta feed yourself before your gun....what fokking dumbasses...guess they figured they could get their food from federal food stamps?

Appaholic wrote:

citdog wrote:

Actually, RUBE, these gentlemen had plenty of ammo but lacked food.

...which explains so much regarding why they lost the war....gotta feed yourself before your gun....what fokking dumbasses...guess they figured they could get their food from federal food stamps?

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who is responsible for starting the 'late united states' on this road to economic ruin?

citdog wrote:who is responsible for starting the 'late united states' on this road to economic ruin?

Who'd you borrow that from?

Appaholic wrote:

citdog wrote:who is responsible for starting the 'late united states' on this road to economic ruin?

Who'd you borrow that from?

I picked it up off the ground in the confusion.

93henfan wrote:

The Greatest Captain in American History. This guy had his picture in the White House.