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Pwns wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 2:28 pm

LeadBolt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 12:49 pm A critical difference is that while Israel is content to co-exist, Iran and, as they were correctly identified their sock puppets Hamas and Hezbollah are not.

The Palestinians are exploited by Iran through the sock puppets and caught up and punished in the Israeli response to the sock puppets violence.

The only way that the Palestinians can get out of this downward spiral is to repudiate and expel the sock puppets.


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The more I try to learn about this issue and think about it, the more I think this is close to the truth.

Israel can make concessions and agree to scale down their presence in Gaza but all the hate propaganda that comes from these Iran proxies just helps Hamas win elections and increase their saber rattling, which in turn makes Israel bear down harder on the Palestinians, which in turn pisses off Palestinians emboldens Hamas. Hamas and Hezbollah are the battery that's there is to restart the combustion cycle any time anyone tries to stop it.

People anger needs to be directed at these fanatics and not regular Palestinian people or the Israeli government.

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 12:02 pm

houndawg wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 11:46 am

True dat. And thats why you're off the mark with your "..someone who thinks its 100% Israel's fault .." queefing.
Thoroughout history groups of people have arrived at new lands and displaced/assimilated the locals.

This was an especially ugly incident even by the standards of the area and there is no defending it and it ain't over. Understanding how it came to happen is not condoning it. Nor should we forget that Hamas doesn't give a fuck about the Palestinians and is nothing more than an Iranian sock puppet being used to respond the warming of relations between the Israelis and the Saudis. Iran kills some Jews and Palestinians pay.

So I was a little hyperbolic with the 100%. Sue me.

There are plenty of morons who want to place the majority (more than 60%) of the blame on Israel (or the Palestinians). The reality is that both sides are responsible. Both sides have been aggressors and victims. Palestinians are not getting Palestine back in the foreseeable future. If they continue to terrorize rather than trying to find a way to coexist with Israel, their people are going to suffer.

You are spot on with your sock puppet paragraph.

Pwns wrote:

LeadBolt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 12:49 pm A critical difference is that while Israel is content to co-exist, Iran and, as they were correctly identified their sock puppets Hamas and Hezbollah are not.

The Palestinians are exploited by Iran through the sock puppets and caught up and punished in the Israeli response to the sock puppets violence.

The only way that the Palestinians can get out of this downward spiral is to repudiate and expel the sock puppets.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The more I try to learn about this issue and think about it, the more I think this is close to the truth.

Israel can make concessions and agree to scale down their presence in Gaza but all the hate propaganda that comes from these Iran proxies just helps Hamas win elections and increase their saber rattling, which in turn makes Israel bear down harder on the Palestinians, which in turn pisses off Palestinians emboldens Hamas. Hamas and Hezbollah are the battery that's there is to restart the combustion cycle any time anyone tries to stop it.

People anger needs to be directed at these fanatics and not regular Palestinian people or the Israeli government.

kalm wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 11:54 am

Baldy wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 11:06 am
Since you're really struggling with this, I'll try to help.

Iran knows there is a $6 BILLION windfall coming in within the next few months to pay for food and energy and housing and whatever else 'humanitarian aid' is. There is no way with an influx like that they would they reallocate money in their current budget to fund and support terrorism, no way at all.

If you had made an argument for ending all foreign aid (or in this case, frozen Iranian assets) to all countries who support terrorism as that money will eventually end up in the hands of the terrorists like Hamas, I’m on board.

But that’s clearly not what you said. You were leaching onto Republican propaganda to score political points.

Congrats!

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 1:00 pm

Caribbean Hen wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 12:30 pm

Not a Trump agenda

We defended the border long before Trump rented your spacious head

I support defending the border. I also support helping Ukraine. It's not an either or choice and it's disingenuous to try and make it one.

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 4:18 pm

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 1:00 pm
I support defending the border. I also support helping Ukraine. It's not an either or choice and it's disingenuous to try and make it one.

You want to give Ukraine = importance to defending America. Secure the US border 1st. Then AFTER that is done debate about defending Ukraine.

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 5:19 pm

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 4:18 pm
You want to give Ukraine = importance to defending America. Secure the US border 1st. Then AFTER that is done debate about defending Ukraine.

Kick the groomers (Jim Jordan), pedophiles (Matt Gaetz), and seditionists (Jim Jordan again) out of Congress and then we can debate securing the US border.

If you govern by absolutes (you have to do this then we'll "talk" about doing that) then nothing will get done.

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 5:38 pm

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 5:19 pm
Kick the groomers (jim jordan), pedophiles (matt gaetz), and seditionists (jim jordan again) out of Congress and then we can debate securing the US border.

If you govern by absolutes (you have to do this then we'll "talk" about doing that) then nothing will get done.

You have to stop posting Fake News before can debate securing the border.

And as long as the US border is going to continue to be left open, then I would prefer zero $$$ going to Ukraine.

Baldy wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 3:54 pm

kalm wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 11:54 am

If you had made an argument for ending all foreign aid (or in this case, frozen Iranian assets) to all countries who support terrorism as that money will eventually end up in the hands of the terrorists like Hamas, I’m on board.

But that’s clearly not what you said. You were leaching onto Republican propaganda to score political points.

Congrats!

That was clearly the point I was making. It's not my fault that you couldn't strawman your way out of the corner you painted yourself into.

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 12:02 pm

houndawg wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 11:46 am

True dat. And thats why you're off the mark with your "..someone who thinks its 100% Israel's fault .." queefing.
Thoroughout history groups of people have arrived at new lands and displaced/assimilated the locals.

This was an especially ugly incident even by the standards of the area and there is no defending it and it ain't over. Understanding how it came to happen is not condoning it. Nor should we forget that Hamas doesn't give a fuck about the Palestinians and is nothing more than an Iranian sock puppet being used to respond the warming of relations between the Israelis and the Saudis. Iran kills some Jews and Palestinians pay.

So I was a little hyperbolic with the 100%. Sue me.

There are plenty of morons who want to place the majority (more than 60%) of the blame on Israel (or the Palestinians). The reality is that both sides are responsible. Both sides have been aggressors and victims. Palestinians are not getting Palestine back in the foreseeable future. If they continue to terrorize rather than trying to find a way to coexist with Israel, their people are going to suffer.

You are spot on with your sock puppet paragraph.

What is a kibbutz?
Named for the Hebrew word for “gathering,” a kibbutz is typically an agrarian settlement in Israel. The first kibbutz, a farming commune known as Degania just south of the sea of Galilee, was founded in 1910. It’s now a museum. Today, there are roughly 270 kibbutzim — the plural form of kibbutz — in Israel. Most are now private but rooted in the socialist philosophy of communal and cooperative living.

What was the idea behind them?
“Jewish settlers behind the movement envisioned the kibbutzim as a place where Zionism met Marxism,”

Israel was warned by Egypt of potential violence three days before Hamas' deadly cross-border raid, a US congressional panel chairman has said.

House of Representatives Foreign Affairs Committee head Michael McCaul told reporters of the alleged warning.

Israeli PM Benjamin Netanyahu described the reports as "absolutely false".

Israeli intelligence services are under scrutiny for their failure to prevent the deadliest attack by Palestinian militants in Israel's 75-year history.

"We know that Egypt has warned the Israelis three days prior that an event like this could happen," Mr McCaul told reporters following a closed-door intelligence briefing on Wednesday for lawmakers about the Middle East crisis, according to AFP news agency.

"I don't want to get too much into classified, but a warning was given," the Texas Republican added. "I think the question was at what level."

kalm wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 2:47 pm

Pwns wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 2:28 pm

The more I try to learn about this issue and think about it, the more I think this is close to the truth.

Israel can make concessions and agree to scale down their presence in Gaza but all the hate propaganda that comes from these Iran proxies just helps Hamas win elections and increase their saber rattling, which in turn makes Israel bear down harder on the Palestinians, which in turn pisses off Palestinians emboldens Hamas. Hamas and Hezbollah are the battery that's there is to restart the combustion cycle any time anyone tries to stop it.

People anger needs to be directed at these fanatics and not regular Palestinian people or the Israeli government.

The people of the Muslim world suffer at the hands of authoritarian leadership.

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 8:00 am

houndawg wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 6:40 am

When Moses arrived there were already people living there.

When the Palestinians arrived there were already people living there.

dal4018 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 2:59 am

kalm wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 2:47 pm



The people of the Muslim world suffer at the hands of authoritarian leadership.

Sorry but they are catching hell because of Israel and everyone has known that since the '40s.Winston Churchill was the cause of the suffering of the ppl of Palestine.

kalm wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 4:25 am

dal4018 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 2:59 am

Sorry but they are catching hell because of Israel and everyone has known that since the '40s.Winston Churchill was the cause of the suffering of the ppl of Palestine.

I get that, but it was 80 years ago. Their current problems are mostly due to authoritarian/theocratic leadership. On both sides of this issue. Israeli policies and Iranian backing encouraged Hamas. Hamas’s vicious terrorism will result in Gaza being leveled and more innocent Palestinians dying. And the cycle continues.

dal4018 wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 4:51 am

kalm wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 4:25 am

I get that, but it was 80 years ago. Their current problems are mostly due to authoritarian/theocratic leadership. On both sides of this issue. Israeli policies and Iranian backing encouraged Hamas. Hamas’s vicious terrorism will result in Gaza being leveled and more innocent Palestinians dying. And the cycle continues.

What about the terrorist of Israel they go untouched for all the crimes they committed.Winston Churchill got the ball rolling in '37 speaking in front of the Palestinian Royal Commission saying that he was going to drop the Ashkenazi Jews in their land and leave.

Pwns wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 8:58 am Proposed Ideology Test:

Which of the following are true:

A. Trump voters vote Trump because they're bigots afraid of a changing America.
B. Israel voters vote Netanyahu because they're a bunch of racists.
C. Palestine voters vote for Hamas because they're a bunch of hateful Muslim fanatics.
D. Only A and B
E. None of the above.

Skjellyfetti wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 11:01 am E for sure.

It can't be C as Palestinians haven't voted for Hamas in a couple of decades.

GannonFan wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 11:49 am

Skjellyfetti wrote: ↑Thu Oct 12, 2023 11:01 am E for sure.

It can't be C as Palestinians haven't voted for Hamas in a couple of decades.

Of course, that's also why you don't vote a violent fundamentalist group into power in the first place. They tend not to give up power voluntarily after they have it.