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NASCAR has contracted back to about a 1990 level of fan and sponsor support.

It’ll be interesting to see how far Brian France continues to allow it to slide before selling it to somebody who knows how to run a business.

Indy went through this after the IRL split from CART and has never fully recovered. They were king once. Maybe NASCAR will tailspin all the way back to 2nd in the US some day.

93henfan wrote:Indy went through this after the IRL split from CART and has never fully recovered.

There wasn't much bigger than the Indy 500 back in the day. I think I looked forward to that as a kid more than the Super Bowl.

89Hen wrote:

93henfan wrote:Indy went through this after the IRL split from CART and has never fully recovered.

There wasn't much bigger than the Indy 500 back in the day. I think I looked forward to that as a kid more than the Super Bowl.

Hells yeah.

When have you ever seen the first ten rows of the Super Bowl doused in methanol and lit on fire?

Or a tire shot out of a slingshot at 200 mph into someone’s face in the end zone.

You just don’t get that sort of excitement in an NFL game.

93: Swing and a miss. I've never heard of those two, though the one you posted is certainly a looker.

Here's a hint: it's actually a guy this time. Check out the primary sponsors, and I'm sure you'll figure it out....

SuperHornet wrote:93: Swing and a miss. I've never heard of those two, though the one you posted is certainly a looker.

Here's a hint: it's actually a guy this time. Check out the primary sponsors, and I'm sure you'll figure it out....

Is somebody driving a Tampax car?

89Hen wrote:

SuperHornet wrote:93: Swing and a miss. I've never heard of those two, though the one you posted is certainly a looker.

Here's a hint: it's actually a guy this time. Check out the primary sponsors, and I'm sure you'll figure it out....

Is somebody driving a Tampax car?

Har dee har har.

FYI, the title sponsor I was thinking of wasn't in use yesterday. Like Kyle Bush, he rotates title sponsors. Look for his car THIS week at Martinsville. It'll be on his hood then....

Good news on the IndyCar front:

INDIANAPOLIS — IndyCar is no longer a house divided. Beginning in 2019, all of IndyCar’s races will be broadcast on NBC and its properties.

The multi-year deal, which NBC Sports Group confirmed Wednesday morning, puts an end to a year’s worth of negotiations and a decade of the series splitting races between NBC and ABC...

...IndyCar is undoubtedly hoping to build on its past couple of years of a successful partnership with NBC. According to the series, TV ratings on NBCSN increased three percent last year, averaging about 507,000 viewers per race.

Miles told IndyStar recently that he aims to double IndyCar's average TV ratings in the coming years and expects that to be possible with so many races moving to broadcast TV. He also expects to increase the viewership for the Indy 500, which has been around a 4.0 the past few years.

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/m ... 444807002/

Interestingly, IndyCar is getting more popular while NASCAR has been declining the last few years (although NASCAR's viewership is still much higher).

∞∞∞ wrote:Good news on the IndyCar front:

INDIANAPOLIS — IndyCar is no longer a house divided. Beginning in 2019, all of IndyCar’s races will be broadcast on NBC and its properties.

The multi-year deal, which NBC Sports Group confirmed Wednesday morning, puts an end to a year’s worth of negotiations and a decade of the series splitting races between NBC and ABC...

...IndyCar is undoubtedly hoping to build on its past couple of years of a successful partnership with NBC. According to the series, TV ratings on NBCSN increased three percent last year, averaging about 507,000 viewers per race.

Miles told IndyStar recently that he aims to double IndyCar's average TV ratings in the coming years and expects that to be possible with so many races moving to broadcast TV. He also expects to increase the viewership for the Indy 500, which has been around a 4.0 the past few years.

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/m ... 444807002/

Interestingly, IndyCar is getting more popular while NASCAR has been declining the last few years (although NASCAR's viewership is still much higher).

It really has nowhere to go but up with its abysmal current state. As much as we nitpick NASCAR, Indy gets nobody at its tracks other than Indy.

One day until FP1 Australia GP.

LH44, bitches!

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/feat ... watch.html

2018 F1 Rule Changes:

Technical regulations:
- T-wings and shark-fin style engine covers outlawed
- halo cockpit protection device mandatory
- suspension systems that could alter the car’s aero performance over a lap not allowed

Sporting regulations:
- drivers allowed three rather than four power units per season
- simplified grid penalties for power unit changes
- wider range of dry tyre compounds
- possibility for standing starts after red flags
https://www.formula1.com/en/championshi ... anges.html

These are all good changes, IMHO. T-wings and shark-fins are ugly, and T-wings were separating from cars with regularity last year. I would prefer a mini-windshield (ala Indy) instead of the halo, but whatever. They needed something, as one of these days, a guy is going to take a tire to the halo instead of his helmet and live to tell about it. I'm also glad they simplified the grid penalties. There were races last year where guys had 30 grid position penalties in a 20-car field. WTF? Also, standing starts after red flags could be very exciting. You could have some serious late-race shake-ups with guys like Verstappen and Alonso who are standing start wizards (and Hamilton and Vettel are not).

Why are attendance stats hard to find for NASCAR?

dbackjon wrote:Why are attendance stats hard to find for NASCAR?

Because it's way, way down. They stopped reporting after they reached peak NASCAR around 2005 or so. There's obviously little incentive to report declining numbers when you depend on sponsorship dollars.

I can give you a good snapshot on Dover though, since I've attended nearly every race (except my military years) since 1975.

In 1975, track capacity was 22,000 and they sold out.

In 2000, track capacity was 140,000 seats and several thousand in the infield for a count of 150,000+ on raceday and they sold out.

Attendance began to noticeably tumble in the mid-2000s with skyrocketing gas prices, which killed RV traffic to tracks. NASCAR had a huge RV following. In addition, the hits to the economy from 2008 onward (Great Recession, higher blue-collar unemployment) also hurt. Then you had NASCAR itself really alienating its core Southern fanbase, as well as a sense that NASCAR was no longer up-and-coming, as well as a terrible Chase format, as well as Dale Earnhardt died and his son sucked.

With all that, Dover was placing advertising tarps over entire sections of bleachers by 2010. It then began ripping out those stands.

In 2018, seating is down to 85,000 from 140,000 ten years ago, and they are lucky to fill two-thirds of those seats as far as I can see.

No sugar-coating it. They're hurting badly.

Jon, here's what Dover looked like around 1990 (Rt 1 top right is still not yet complete):


15 years ago (stands all the way around turns and double decked - hotel and casino built on left:


Here is a picture I took at the start of last year's first Dover cup race:

Obviously NASCAR's roots are southern, but at its best, it catered to a fanbase that covered the entire nation east of the Mississippi. However, it cultivated an image of being a"Southern" sport and when the economic downturn happened, the South was hit hard, and Americans were more divided, it was left hanging with a cultural image which people in the Great Lakes region and Northeast corridor couldn't relate to.

Then NASCAR ended up alienating the Southern fanbase trying to fix it (which is a whole story in itself).

∞∞∞ wrote:Obviously NASCAR's roots are southern, but at its best, it catered to a fanbase that covered the entire nation east of the Mississippi. However, it cultivated an image of being a"Southern" sport and when the economic downturn happened, the South was hit hard, and Americans were more divided, it was left hanging with a cultural image which people in the Great Lakes region and Northeast corridor couldn't relate to.

Then NASCAR ended up alienating the Southern fanbase trying to fix it (which is a whole story in itself).

Another post where you show your lack of perspective. You can't help being young and living in an urban bubble, so I understand.

NASCAR lost the South when it closed N Wilkesboro and Rockingham and moved Darlington's Labor Day date to California (before finally bringing it back).

Also, Great Lakes and Northern fans who like NASCAR totally relate to their Southern brethren. There are rednecks in Maine and Illinois and California. Trust me. I know them.

93henfan wrote:

∞∞∞ wrote:Obviously NASCAR's roots are southern, but at its best, it catered to a fanbase that covered the entire nation east of the Mississippi. However, it cultivated an image of being a"Southern" sport and when the economic downturn happened, the South was hit hard, and Americans were more divided, it was left hanging with a cultural image which people in the Great Lakes region and Northeast corridor couldn't relate to.

Then NASCAR ended up alienating the Southern fanbase trying to fix it (which is a whole story in itself).

Another post where you show your lack of perspective. You can't help being young and living in an urban bubble, so I understand.

NASCAR lost the South when it closed N Wilkesboro and Rockingham and moved Darlington's Labor Day date to California (before finally bringing it back).

Also, Great Lakes and Northern fans who like NASCAR totally relate to their Southern brethren. There are rednecks in Maine and California. Trust me. I know them.

I'm not saying there aren't people in those regions who can't relate to the Southern culture, but you're making my point for me. What do people think of when they think of NASCAR?

Rednecks, South, Conservative.

NASCAR used to bring in fans from all walks of life...not just specific types. I don't want it to decline, but part of NASCAR's issue was latching to the redneck brand. I desperately want to get my friends, co-workers, or anyone who listens out to the track, but like it or not, NASCAR's brand is unattractive to a lot of people and in today's divided world, it's a big problem.

So either NASCAR needs to dig in, stay "southern," contract, and focus on that fanbase. Or they need a complete image change that may be painful now, but help in the future.

Unfortunately, I think NASCAR's doing the worst thing and alienating everyone.

OK gotcha. I agree with that take.

Step 1: Get Darrell Waltrip the fuck out of the booth.

I make it a point to go take a piss when the cars are on the backstretch and the lights go out on the pace car so I don't have to hear his catch phrase. It's like nails on blackboard to me.

I think one of NASCAR's many issues is FOX's broadcasting. There's so much excitement going on elsewhere in the field, but all they show are the top cars...it gets boring seeing the same thing over and over...and over and over...and over and over. Why should sponsors care if they can't get air time?

MRN is 1000 times more interesting than any of the TV broadcasts IMO. If they could just use their producers and switch to the cameras as you switch announcers... you might have something.

Thanks 93

∞∞∞ wrote:Obviously NASCAR's roots are southern, but at its best, it catered to a fanbase that covered the entire nation east of the Mississippi. However, it cultivated an image of being a"Southern" sport and when the economic downturn happened, the South was hit hard, and Americans were more divided, it was left hanging with a cultural image which people in the Great Lakes region and Northeast corridor couldn't relate to.

Then NASCAR ended up alienating the Southern fanbase trying to fix it (which is a whole story in itself).

I think every year on here we've discussed ad nauseum NASCAR's problems. Here's the one from 2014:
http://www.championshipsubdivision.com/ ... 00#p890495

Probably the only thing not mentioned between 93, 89, and myself is all the cookie cutter 1.5 mile tracks added in the previous 20+ years (93' mentioned it at the top of the page)..
95' 1.5 mile Homestead
96' 1.5 mile Vegas (2 races)
97' 2.0 mile CA Autoclub
97' 1.5 mile Texas
00' 1.5 mile Kentucky
01' 1.5 mile Chicagoland
01' 1.5 mile Kansas (2 races)

Edit: This from last week hits the nail on the head:
http://929thegame.radio.com/articles/na ... it?src=rss

Wasn't able to watch the race Sun. Wasn't able to till yesterday. Truex put an ass whopping on the rest of the field. Won the pole, led 125 of 200 laps, won both stages, and won the race by over 11 seconds, with only 10 cars on the lead lap. As dominant as Harvick was sweeping at Vegas.

Looks like Harvick got pissed at Larson in the 1st stage racing for the lead, tried to side swipe him, and ended up wrecking himself lol.. Even if Harvick didn't wreck or Kyle Busch's (finished 3rd) team didn't screw up their adjustment the last pit stop when they got him the lead but went the wrong way on the wedge, didn't matter They would have just been battling with Larson for 2nd. Neither could have beaten Truex.

Johnson finished 9th, breaking his career long streak of 11 races without a top 10.

Larson finished 2nd. Last 5 2 mile races Larson:
2016 Michigan: won
2017 Autoclub: won
2017 Michigan: won
2017 Michigan: won
2018 Autoclub: 2nd.

∞∞∞ wrote:

93henfan wrote:
Another post where you show your lack of perspective. You can't help being young and living in an urban bubble, so I understand.

NASCAR lost the South when it closed N Wilkesboro and Rockingham and moved Darlington's Labor Day date to California (before finally bringing it back).

Also, Great Lakes and Northern fans who like NASCAR totally relate to their Southern brethren. There are rednecks in Maine and California. Trust me. I know them.

I'm not saying there aren't people in those regions who can't relate to the Southern culture, but you're making my point for me. What do people think of when they think of NASCAR?

Rednecks, South, Conservative.

NASCAR used to bring in fans from all walks of life...not just specific types. I don't want it to decline, but part of NASCAR's issue was latching to the redneck brand. I desperately want to get my friends, co-workers, or anyone who listens out to the track, but like it or not, NASCAR's brand is unattractive to a lot of people and in today's divided world, it's a big problem.

So either NASCAR needs to dig in, stay "southern," contract, and focus on that fanbase. Or they need a complete image change that may be painful now, but help in the future.

Unfortunately, I think NASCAR's doing the worst thing and alienating everyone.

Well, you'll be happy to know this week, NASCAR just got a little less southern redneck, and a little more metrosexual. At Starcom racing, Jeffrey Earnhardt
https://www.speedwaydigest.com/index.ph ... tan-marine
https://twitter.com/JEarnhardt1/status/ ... 4518462465

has been replaced by Landon Cassill:
http://www.championshipsubdivision.com/ ... l#p1060430
https://www.sbnation.com/nascar/2018/3/ ... ille-texas

Radioactive for this week was pretty good:

SuperHornet wrote:So, anyone care to guess who SH's new favorite NASCAR driver is? My money's on 93, SDH, or Andy....

Larson? He’s from the Sacramento area..

SuperHornet wrote:

89Hen wrote: Is somebody driving a Tampax car?

Har dee har har.

FYI, the title sponsor I was thinking of wasn't in use yesterday. Like Kyle Bush, he rotates title sponsors. Look for his car THIS week at Martinsville. It'll be on his hood then....

Larson had DC Solar as the primary sponsor at Autoclub. Think he’s back with Credit One Bank, his primary sponsor for the majority of the season, at Martinsville.