Bowl Season is Boring

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Bowl Season is Boring

Postby JohnStOnge » Sat Dec 23, 2017 7:57 pm

Is it just because they have so many bowls now? I am TRYING to watch a bowl game right now but it's the first time I've even tried to watch. It's like they have 40 bowl games and maybe 5 are interesting. I think this quote from the Wikipedia articles on bowls says it all:

he total of 40 team-competitive bowls, including the national championship game, is one less than the previous year, with the folding of the Poinsettia Bowl.[1][2] While bowl games had been the purview of only the very best teams for nearly a century, this was the 12th consecutive year that teams with non-winning seasons participated in bowl games. To fill the 78 available bowl slots, a total of 15 teams (19% of all participants) with non-winning seasons will participate in bowl games—all 15 had scored a .500 (6–6) season.


To me it's a shame that enough fans watch this crap to sustain it. I've got the awful App State vs. Toledo bowl game going in the background right now because there's nothing else on TV and I live to have the TV on. But I doubt it I watch any of the other ones other than the CFP and the LSU/Notre Dame game.

This is just ridiculous. The NCAA needs to say that if you want to be in the NCAA this bowl crap has to stop and we're just going to have a NCAA tournament like they have in all other sports.
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby Mvemjsunpx » Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:04 pm

Perfect example of why moving up to FBS is a waste of time: App State and Toledo are both conference champions, and they're playing in a bowl game in Alabama that's sponsored by a dollar store. I bet the swag gifts for playing in that one are just amazing… :? :lol:

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby Skjellyfetti » Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:20 pm

Mvemjsunpx wrote:App State and Toledo are both conference champions, and they're playing in a bowl game in Alabama that's sponsored by a dollar store. I bet the swag gifts for playing in that one are just amazing… :? :lol:


Who sponsors the FCS championship again? What's the payout like? What swag is given out? :suspicious:
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby Mvemjsunpx » Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:22 pm

Skjellyfetti wrote:
Mvemjsunpx wrote:App State and Toledo are both conference champions, and they're playing in a bowl game in Alabama that's sponsored by a dollar store. I bet the swag gifts for playing in that one are just amazing… :? :lol:


Who sponsors the FCS championship again? What's the payout like? What swag is given out? :suspicious:


But… it's a national championship game. You get a big trophy that, you know, means something. Not to mention that these MAC & Sun Belt athletic departments are ultimately spending way more money just for the hope of getting their players some dollar-store swag.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby AshevilleApp » Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:30 am

Mvemjsunpx wrote:
Skjellyfetti wrote:
Who sponsors the FCS championship again? What's the payout like? What swag is given out? :suspicious:


But… it's a national championship game. You get a big trophy that, you know, means something. Not to mention that these MAC & Sun Belt athletic departments are ultimately spending way more money just for the hope of getting their players some dollar-store swag.


I think that fans of the schools who make the move are largely satisfied, and that is really all that matters.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby AshevilleApp » Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:30 am

AshevilleApp wrote:
Mvemjsunpx wrote:
But… it's a national championship game. You get a big trophy that, you know, means something. Not to mention that these MAC & Sun Belt athletic departments are ultimately spending way more money just for the hope of getting their players some dollar-store swag.


I think that fans of the schools who make the move are largely satisfied, and that is really all that matters.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby Mvemjsunpx » Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:34 am

AshevilleApp wrote:
Mvemjsunpx wrote:
But… it's a national championship game. You get a big trophy that, you know, means something. Not to mention that these MAC & Sun Belt athletic departments are ultimately spending way more money just for the hope of getting their players some dollar-store swag.


I think that fans of the schools who make the move are largely satisfied, and that is really all that matters.


That's just silly. Potentially hemorrhaging money just for a minor increase in fan "satisfaction" is a terrible tradeoff. Everybody moves up because they & their fans think they can be the next Boise, but their chances of actually pulling that off are probably less than 1%. The rest just end up spending more money for, at best, minor financial & football gains that aren't worth the spending. That's money that could be better spent on basketball, or even *gasp* academics.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby AshevilleApp » Sun Dec 24, 2017 9:22 am

Mvemjsunpx wrote:
AshevilleApp wrote:
I think that fans of the schools who make the move are largely satisfied, and that is really all that matters.


That's just silly. Potentially hemorrhaging money just for a minor increase in fan "satisfaction" is a terrible tradeoff. Everybody moves up because they & their fans think they can be the next Boise, but their chances of actually pulling that off are probably less than 1%. The rest just end up spending more money for, at best, minor financial & football gains that aren't worth the spending. That's money that could be better spent on basketball, or even *gasp* academics.


How do you judge what is "worth the spending" though? I'd say fan (alumni) satisfaction is a pretty good indicator. And since they pay a decent chunk of the money for capital improvements on campus, beyond just athletics, keeping them satisfied is very important. Time will certainly tell whether the move was wise, but so far the results have been good.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby SunCoastBlueHen » Sun Dec 24, 2017 9:46 am

JohnStOnge wrote:Is it just because they have so many bowls now? I am TRYING to watch a bowl game right now but it's the first time I've even tried to watch. It's like they have 40 bowl games and maybe 5 are interesting. I think this quote from the Wikipedia articles on bowls says it all:

he total of 40 team-competitive bowls, including the national championship game, is one less than the previous year, with the folding of the Poinsettia Bowl.[1][2] While bowl games had been the purview of only the very best teams for nearly a century, this was the 12th consecutive year that teams with non-winning seasons participated in bowl games. To fill the 78 available bowl slots, a total of 15 teams (19% of all participants) with non-winning seasons will participate in bowl games—all 15 had scored a .500 (6–6) season.


To me it's a shame that enough fans watch this crap to sustain it. I've got the awful App State vs. Toledo bowl game going in the background right now because there's nothing else on TV and I live to have the TV on. But I doubt it I watch any of the other ones other than the CFP and the LSU/Notre Dame game.

This is just ridiculous. The NCAA needs to say that if you want to be in the NCAA this bowl crap has to stop and we're just going to have a NCAA tournament like they have in all other sports.


I mostly agree with the sentiment here, but the first two games yesterday were actually entertaining football games.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby BDKJMU » Sun Dec 24, 2017 10:24 pm

AshevilleApp wrote:
Mvemjsunpx wrote:
But… it's a national championship game. You get a big trophy that, you know, means something. Not to mention that these MAC & Sun Belt athletic departments are ultimately spending way more money just for the hope of getting their players some dollar-store swag.


I think that fans of the schools who make the move are largely satisfied, and that is really all that matters.

Well the Toledo and App fans sure didn’t show it on Sat night. I was watching part of the game, and even mid 2nd Qtr, when the crowd should be at its peak, 40k capacity Ladd Peebles looked maybe 1/3 full...

Now before someone counters with the attendance was listed at 20 some thousand or 30 some thousand, bowls are notorious for grossly inflating attendance #s. It looked like no more than 15k tops..
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby AshevilleApp » Mon Dec 25, 2017 6:28 am

BDKJMU wrote:
AshevilleApp wrote:
I think that fans of the schools who make the move are largely satisfied, and that is really all that matters.

Well the Toledo and App fans sure didn’t show it on Sat night. I was watching part of the game, and even mid 2nd Qtr, when the crowd should be at its peak, 40k capacity Ladd Peebles looked maybe 1/3 full...

Now before someone counters with the attendance was listed at 20 some thousand or 30 some thousand, bowls are notorious for grossly inflating attendance #s. It looked like no more than 15k tops..


Yup, everybody skipped a game on December 23rd because they are dissatisfied with the program. Glad you watched the game though!

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby kalm » Mon Dec 25, 2017 6:28 am

AshevilleApp wrote:
Mvemjsunpx wrote:
That's just silly. Potentially hemorrhaging money just for a minor increase in fan "satisfaction" is a terrible tradeoff. Everybody moves up because they & their fans think they can be the next Boise, but their chances of actually pulling that off are probably less than 1%. The rest just end up spending more money for, at best, minor financial & football gains that aren't worth the spending. That's money that could be better spent on basketball, or even *gasp* academics.


How do you judge what is "worth the spending" though? I'd say fan (alumni) satisfaction is a pretty good indicator. And since they pay a decent chunk of the money for capital improvements on campus, beyond just athletics, keeping them satisfied is very important. Time will certainly tell whether the move was wise, but so far the results have been good.


You're both making valid points and if my team were tonever make the jump I'd probably defend it too.

Question: what's more satisfying...a 10-2 or better season culminating in one extra game and a bowl victory or winning 4 more games probably at home, culminating in a National Championship?
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby BDKJMU » Mon Dec 25, 2017 9:38 am

AshevilleApp wrote:
BDKJMU wrote:Well the Toledo and App fans sure didn’t show it on Sat night. I was watching part of the game, and even mid 2nd Qtr, when the crowd should be at its peak, 40k capacity Ladd Peebles looked maybe 1/3 full...

Now before someone counters with the attendance was listed at 20 some thousand or 30 some thousand, bowls are notorious for grossly inflating attendance #s. It looked like no more than 15k tops..


Yup, everybody skipped a game on December 23rd because they are dissatisfied with the program. Glad you watched the game though!

Where were all the satisfied fans on Sat night? If they were satisfied how come they weren’t at the game?
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby AshevilleApp » Mon Dec 25, 2017 11:54 am

BDKJMU wrote:
AshevilleApp wrote:
Yup, everybody skipped a game on December 23rd because they are dissatisfied with the program. Glad you watched the game though!

Where were all the satisfied fans on Sat night? If they were satisfied how come they weren’t at the game?


Think man. Where else might they be on December 23rd? I know it's a tough one, but crunch real hard here.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby AshevilleApp » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:02 pm

kalm wrote:
AshevilleApp wrote:
How do you judge what is "worth the spending" though? I'd say fan (alumni) satisfaction is a pretty good indicator. And since they pay a decent chunk of the money for capital improvements on campus, beyond just athletics, keeping them satisfied is very important. Time will certainly tell whether the move was wise, but so far the results have been good.


You're both making valid points and if my team were tonever make the jump I'd probably defend it too.

Question: what's more satisfying...a 10-2 or better season culminating in one extra game and a bowl victory or winning 4 more games probably at home, culminating in a National Championship?


Both are satisfying, because it shows you can compete on whatever level you are at. For me personally, the first championship against UNI was the most satisfying win by App. But the first two bowl wins certainly equaled the second NC against U-Mass. Saturday's win against Toledo and the third NC were satisfying blowouts against over matched teams as things played out. ;) Both fun, but not much drama.

And although I didn't get to Mobile for the game, I think as a location by the Gulf it beats Frisco or Chattanooga.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby Gil Dobie » Mon Dec 25, 2017 6:05 pm

Skjellyfetti wrote:
Mvemjsunpx wrote:App State and Toledo are both conference champions, and they're playing in a bowl game in Alabama that's sponsored by a dollar store. I bet the swag gifts for playing in that one are just amazing… :? :lol:


Who sponsors the FCS championship again? What's the payout like? What swag is given out? :suspicious:


What were ticket cost for the bowl game, I really don't know what your's was called. Cheapest tickets for the FCS championship game are at $325 on stubhub. Oh, and I think Celebration Bowl participants got a pretty good payout.
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby BDKJMU » Mon Dec 25, 2017 8:53 pm

AshevilleApp wrote:
BDKJMU wrote:Where were all the satisfied fans on Sat night? If they were satisfied how come they weren’t at the game?


Think man. Where else might they be on December 23rd? I know it's a tough one, but crunch real hard here.

Come down a day or a few days before the game, fly or drive back on the 24th..
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby bandl » Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:10 pm

AshevilleApp wrote:
BDKJMU wrote:Where were all the satisfied fans on Sat night? If they were satisfied how come they weren’t at the game?


Think man. Where else might they be on December 23rd? I know it's a tough one, but crunch real hard here.

Having your bowl game on 12/23 kind of goes with the whole thing that JSO is arguing, no?

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby AshevilleApp » Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:18 pm

bandl wrote:
AshevilleApp wrote:
Think man. Where else might they be on December 23rd? I know it's a tough one, but crunch real hard here.

Having your bowl game on 12/23 kind of goes with the whole thing that JSO is arguing, no?


TV dictates to the NCAA, not vice versa. So the game date is pretty well determined as far as I know.

That aside, I'd be fine with a realignment and larger tournament with the best of the current FCS and most of G5 involved. I was hoping to get more from Santa yesterday too.

In fairness, many of the bowl games are boring. Many of the D1 playoff games this year have been as well. Including both semi finals.
Last edited by AshevilleApp on Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby CAA Flagship » Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:22 pm

bandl wrote:
AshevilleApp wrote:
Think man. Where else might they be on December 23rd? I know it's a tough one, but crunch real hard here.

Having your bowl game on 12/23 kind of goes with the whole thing that JSO is arguing, no?

:troll:

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby dbackjon » Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:46 pm

AshevilleApp wrote:
Mvemjsunpx wrote:
That's just silly. Potentially hemorrhaging money just for a minor increase in fan "satisfaction" is a terrible tradeoff. Everybody moves up because they & their fans think they can be the next Boise, but their chances of actually pulling that off are probably less than 1%. The rest just end up spending more money for, at best, minor financial & football gains that aren't worth the spending. That's money that could be better spent on basketball, or even *gasp* academics.


How do you judge what is "worth the spending" though? I'd say fan (alumni) satisfaction is a pretty good indicator. And since they pay a decent chunk of the money for capital improvements on campus, beyond just athletics, keeping them satisfied is very important. Time will certainly tell whether the move was wise, but so far the results have been good.



Then why has average attendance at App Games gone DOWN from FCS years?
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby andy7171 » Tue Dec 26, 2017 4:32 pm

When hasnt any Bowl below the Rose, Cotton, Orange, Sugar or Fiesta been interesting.

I remember when my parents flew down to see the Terps play Florida in the Orange Bowl during Freidgens first or second years. They got throttled. The next year went to a lesser bowl. It wasn't even a thought to go. If your team(FBS) isn't in those handful of top bowls, BFD. schools outside the SEC or other major conferences outside of major TV markets. There are other things to do, and vastly cheaper near home.
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby AshevilleApp » Wed Dec 27, 2017 11:33 am

dbackjon wrote:
AshevilleApp wrote:
How do you judge what is "worth the spending" though? I'd say fan (alumni) satisfaction is a pretty good indicator. And since they pay a decent chunk of the money for capital improvements on campus, beyond just athletics, keeping them satisfied is very important. Time will certainly tell whether the move was wise, but so far the results have been good.



Then why has average attendance at App Games gone DOWN from FCS years?


It has been nearly the same the past two seasons than the top year (2012) (or some other year?). The move caused some bitter feelings, and there are some people who left and won't be back because of it. No question about it. Aho Old Guy here is one of them. Others were rightfully pissed off about the way the school treated Jerry Moore. And we lost close rivals.

A good number of people who were against the move backed away at first, but are coming around to the new reality. I'm one of them. With that, attendance has improved the last couple of years. Now I think it is within a couple of hundred people per game than peak attendance years.

The real challenge will be when we lose for a few years. We'll see how attendance does then.

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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby Skjellyfetti » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:42 pm

We had multiple games over 30k this year. First time ever.

We had shitty attendance for Savannah State. That wouldn't have been different if we were FCS.
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Re: Bowl Season is Boring

Postby Mvemjsunpx » Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:51 pm

Skjellyfetti wrote:We had multiple games over 30k this year. First time ever.

We had shitty attendance for Savannah State. That wouldn't have been different if we were FCS.


You got 25,000 for Savannah State in 2011. :coffee:


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