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BDKJMU wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:07 pm

FINA, the governing body for international swimming, approved new policies for transgender swimmers which will go into effect on Monday.

The "gender inclusion policy" will only permit swimmers who transitioned before the age of 12 to compete in women’s events. FINA members voted 71.5% in favor of the new policies.

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/fina-gen ... r-swimmers

So this takes care if the issue of men pretending to be women being allowed to compete in international competitons, which is parently unfair to the women competitors..

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:31 pm

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:07 pm
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/fina-gen ... r-swimmers

So this takes care if the issue of men pretending to be women being allowed to compete in international competitons, which is parently unfair to the women competitors..

Their solution is what I was proposing. An open division. Let transgenders compete, but they need a division that is competitive for them.

AZGrizFan wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 2:51 pm

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:31 pm

Their solution is what I was proposing. An open division. Let transgenders compete, but they need a division that is competitive for them.

And any parent who allows or supports their child transitioning before about age 18 should be imprisoned for child abuse.

The ruling body's draft framework has removed its testosterone threshold for transgender women and proposed that footballers should be allowed to compete as their self-identified gender.

Cycling's ruling body, the UCI, last week tightened their eligibility criteria for the female category, having been sparked into a review by the case of the British trans-cyclist Emily Bridges.

The UCI lowered the testosterone limit from five to 2.5 nanomoles per litre and doubled the length of time a trans-athlete must suppress her testosterone to within this range to two years.

Pwns wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 7:25 am Cowardly university administrators.

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:31 pm

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:07 pm
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/fina-gen ... r-swimmers

So this takes care if the issue of men pretending to be women being allowed to compete in international competitons, which is parently unfair to the women competitors..

Their solution is what I was proposing. An open division. Let transgenders compete, but they need a division that is competitive for them.

Winterborn wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 3:42 pm

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:31 pm

Their solution is what I was proposing. An open division. Let transgenders compete, but they need a division that is competitive for them.

Had this discussion last night with a group of friends and this is the exact solution we came up with after debating it.

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 9:13 am Biological Male Who Took 2nd Place in CA Girls' HS Track Meet Would've Come in Dead Last in Boys' Meet
https://redstate.com/jenvanlaar/2023/05 ... et-n750038

Was qualifying meet where top 3 go to compete in the atate finals, so this boy gets to compete in the state finals. Meanwhile, the actual 3rd place finishing female gets bumped to 4th, and doesn’t get to go to the state finals. Patently unfair to every girl who got bumped dowm a place.

This trans assault on womens’ sports will continue in blue states. Thankfully at least the red states have passed bills to protect womens’ sports from this nonesense..

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 9:43 am

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 9:13 am Biological Male Who Took 2nd Place in CA Girls' HS Track Meet Would've Come in Dead Last in Boys' Meet
https://redstate.com/jenvanlaar/2023/05 ... et-n750038

Was qualifying meet where top 3 go to compete in the atate finals, so this boy gets to compete in the state finals. Meanwhile, the actual 3rd place finishing female gets bumped to 4th, and doesn’t get to go to the state finals. Patently unfair to every girl who got bumped dowm a place.

This trans assault on womens’ sports will continue in blue states. Thankfully at least the red states have passed bills to protect womens’ sports from this nonesense..

Unfortunately those red states want to tell the trans people to F off.

Can't we find a middle ground where we respect and include trans people without disenfranchising straight people?

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 9:43 am

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 9:13 am Biological Male Who Took 2nd Place in CA Girls' HS Track Meet Would've Come in Dead Last in Boys' Meet
https://redstate.com/jenvanlaar/2023/05 ... et-n750038

Was qualifying meet where top 3 go to compete in the atate finals, so this boy gets to compete in the state finals. Meanwhile, the actual 3rd place finishing female gets bumped to 4th, and doesn’t get to go to the state finals. Patently unfair to every girl who got bumped dowm a place.

This trans assault on womens’ sports will continue in blue states. Thankfully at least the red states have passed bills to protect womens’ sports from this nonesense..

Unfortunately those red states want to tell the trans people to F off.

Can't we find a middle ground where we respect and include trans people without disenfranchising straight people?

kalm wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 10:12 am

UNI88 wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 9:43 am

Unfortunately those red states want to tell the trans people to F off.

Can't we find a middle ground where we respect and include trans people without disenfranchising straight people?

This.

I too have concerns when it comes to athletics. I’m not sure how one lives with themselves knowing they have an unfair advantage in a sport.

(As an aside, I played high school golf against Kirk Triplett’s little sister Shelly from Pullman - there was no girl’s golf in our league in the 80’s and she played 1 or 2 for the boys team. She was driver-fairway wood short of every par 4, but got it up and down most times and never hit it in trouble. She was a solid mid-70’s player and beat me a few times.)

houndawg wrote: ↑Wed May 24, 2023 5:11 am

kalm wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 10:12 am

This.

I too have concerns when it comes to athletics. I’m not sure how one lives with themselves knowing they have an unfair advantage in a sport.

(As an aside, I played high school golf against Kirk Triplett’s little sister Shelly from Pullman - there was no girl’s golf in our league in the 80’s and she played 1 or 2 for the boys team. She was driver-fairway wood short of every par 4, but got it up and down most times and never hit it in trouble. She was a solid mid-70’s player and beat me a few times.)

This - I think if you were born with a pecker you should compete with the boys regardless. Sure, you're not going to win a lot but the competition is the thing right, not the winning? If its about the winning keep the pecker and increase your practicing.

I was a football and track guy in high school and in my senior year our crosstown rival brought a gal over to our dual track meet to run with the boys. She didn't place but she was in the first wave and ran a 10.5 100 yards - in those days we ran yards instead of meters - which equaled my best time. Fortunately I ran the 440/880/mile. The girl's name was Evelyn Ashford and she has several Olympic medals

houndawg wrote: ↑Wed May 24, 2023 5:11 am

kalm wrote: ↑Tue May 23, 2023 10:12 am

This.

I too have concerns when it comes to athletics. I’m not sure how one lives with themselves knowing they have an unfair advantage in a sport.

(As an aside, I played high school golf against Kirk Triplett’s little sister Shelly from Pullman - there was no girl’s golf in our league in the 80’s and she played 1 or 2 for the boys team. She was driver-fairway wood short of every par 4, but got it up and down most times and never hit it in trouble. She was a solid mid-70’s player and beat me a few times.)

This - I think if you were born with a pecker you should compete with the boys regardless. Sure, you're not going to win a lot but the competition is the thing right, not the winning? If its about the winning keep the pecker and increase your practicing.

I was a football and track guy in high school and in my senior year our crosstown rival brought a gal over to our dual track meet to run with the boys. She didn't place but she was in the first wave and ran a 10.5 100 yards - in those days we ran yards instead of meters - which equaled my best time. Fortunately I ran the 440/880/mile. The girl's name was Evelyn Ashford and she has several Olympic medals

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:31 pm

BDKJMU wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:07 pm
https://www.foxnews.com/sports/fina-gen ... r-swimmers

So this takes care if the issue of men pretending to be women being allowed to compete in international competitons, which is parently unfair to the women competitors..

Their solution is what I was proposing. An open division. Let transgenders compete, but they need a division that is competitive for them.

UNI88 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:06 pm I thought about posting this in Other Sports but knew it would be political and really belonged here.

North Dakota Governor Vetoes Bill That Would Ban Trans Students From Playing Sports

"North Dakota today has a level playing field and fairness in girls' sports," Burgum said. "We have every confidence that they will continue to ensure a level playing field for the 27,000 students who participate in North Dakota high school sports."

My views on this are evolving. I do think it's important to respect the impact on the mental health of the potential trans athletes but I also think it's important to consider the potential impact on the athletes they will be competing against. This isn't happening in a vacuum and lots of people could be impacted and that impact should be considered.

Does a biological male competing in female sports have an advantage similar to taking steroids or HGH? Are there biological females that have an advantage simply from naturally having higher levels of testosterone than other females? Can you quantify, set a limit and test for a chemical advantage regardless of gender identity? I don't know. Are there aspects of this debate that I'm not considering? Almost certainly.

FYI - I viewed the article in incognito.

Winterborn wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 3:42 pm

SeattleGriz wrote: ↑Sun Jun 19, 2022 1:31 pm

Their solution is what I was proposing. An open division. Let transgenders compete, but they need a division that is competitive for them.

Had this discussion last night with a group of friends and this is the exact solution we came up with after debating it.