Trump Tariffs = Tax Hike on all

[SDHornet]

Apparently a skyrocketing deficit in a good economy, funneling money to the top percentage of Americans, and having inflation outpace salaries are "accomplishments" now.

But hey, at least people have jobs. Any job (that's the GOP standard now).

And then Republicans wonder why "it's the economy stupid" isn't speaking to voters. Because unless you have major investments in the market, most Americans aren't reaping the benefits.

You REALLY need to stop spouting that absurdly incorrect drivel if you want to EVER be taken seriously. Infection is NOT outpacing salaries. Inflation is 2.7%. Salary growth YOY is almost 5%.

And Obama’s “recovery” included more underemployed and part time jobs/people than ever before, so there’s that.

Hey now, we are really lucky to have economic growth exceed 4%, remember Obomba told us sub 4% was the new normal...

[Baldy]

Apparently a skyrocketing deficit in a good economy, funneling money to the top percentage of Americans, and having inflation outpace salaries are "accomplishments" now.

But hey, at least people have jobs. Any job (that's the GOP standard now).

And then Republicans wonder why "it's the economy stupid" isn't speaking to voters. Because unless you have major investments in the market, most Americans aren't reaping the benefits.

Welcome to 2008-2016, nice to meetcha...

[CID1990]

China is running out of things to tariff

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/us ... 0a44a6017b

Which is why it is called a "trade deficit".... and nothing illustrates the disparity more than the fact the we still have hundreds of billions more dollars worth of Chinese goods we can tax while China is only going to be able to harass diplomats and businesspeople

I have no idea where this will end up but we'll get a lot closer to learning whether or not we are past the point of no return on manipulating China into playing fair on trade


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[Ivytalk]

China is running out of things to tariff

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/us ... 0a44a6017b

Which is why it is called a "trade deficit".... and nothing illustrates the disparity more than the fact the we still have hundreds of billions more dollars worth of Chinese goods we can tax while China is only going to be able to harass diplomats and businesspeople

I have no idea where this will end up but we'll get a lot closer to learning whether or not we are past the point of no return on manipulating China into playing fair on trade


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Yup, keep those boatloads of shitty clothes and small appliances coming, Wang Hung Lo.

[CAA Flagship]

In reality, there are a lot of options that remain in the economic war. 1st is the tariff % on the goods. Most is now at 10%. They (and we) can ratchet that percentage up. There is also currency manipulation that can offset the tariff impact. But China is not in as good a position as the US to be able to withstand the "war" without significant pain. If we waited another 10 years or so to do something about the imbalance, we would be in trouble.

[GannonFan]

I certainly have a wait and see approach regarding the tariffs. Certainly they aren't a long term fixture, but it is interesting seeing game theory play out right in front of us regarding short term tariffs and a mini-trade war. I still didn't and would never vote for Trump, but you have to admit, without him in the White House we'd never get a look at how this plays out (and right now, it's playing out in the US's favor).

[mainejeff]

One thing that is curious.....My investments have made a lot of money during Obama's Presidency and during Trump's Presidency (so far). How can that be???

My guess is that it really is up to individual investors to make the right moves. There are so many people that claim they have no money to invest yet they spend thousands of dollars very year on cigarettes, booze, eating out, guns, ammo, vacations, sports tickets, concert tickets, movies, plastic crap, etc, etc.

[CID1990]

I certainly have a wait and see approach regarding the tariffs. Certainly they aren't a long term fixture, but it is interesting seeing game theory play out right in front of us regarding short term tariffs and a mini-trade war. I still didn't and would never vote for Trump, but you have to admit, without him in the White House we'd never get a look at how this plays out (and right now, it's playing out in the US's favor).

It is one of the few things that someone like a Trump can do

A run of the mill candidate from either of the landed parties could never touch this with a ten foot pole

It could wind up being a disaster (and I am fairly sure the policy would need to be continued by Trump’s successor)

But it is fascinating to watch fir sure... we are in uncharted territory here and a lot of conventional wisdom is either going to stand, or go out the window after all is said and done

[CAA Flagship]

One thing that is curious.....My investments have made a lot of money during Obama's Presidency and during Trump's Presidency (so far). How can that be???

My guess is that it really is up to individual investors to make the right moves. There are so many people that claim they have no money to invest yet they spend thousands of dollars very year on cigarettes, booze, eating out, guns, ammo, vacations, sports tickets, concert tickets, movies, plastic crap, etc, etc.

But that spending is helping the economy, creates and maintains employment, and spurs competition and innovation. But yeah, there should be a better balance that will produce lower economic highs and higher economic lows.

[GannonFan]

I certainly have a wait and see approach regarding the tariffs. Certainly they aren't a long term fixture, but it is interesting seeing game theory play out right in front of us regarding short term tariffs and a mini-trade war. I still didn't and would never vote for Trump, but you have to admit, without him in the White House we'd never get a look at how this plays out (and right now, it's playing out in the US's favor).

It is one of the few things that someone like a Trump can do

A run of the mill candidate from either of the landed parties could never touch this with a ten foot pole

It could wind up being a disaster (and I am fairly sure the policy would need to be continued by Trump’s successor)

But it is fascinating to watch fir sure... we are in uncharted territory here and a lot of conventional wisdom is either going to stand, or go out the window after all is said and done

Same goes for the Korea thing - that could still end up crapping out, but only someone like Trump could move the way he has with regards to North Korea. Conventional politics on either side of the aisle would never handle this the way he has. Again, it could work, or it could go completely bad, but it's certainly a vastly different approach.

[CAA Flagship]

I certainly have a wait and see approach regarding the tariffs. Certainly they aren't a long term fixture, but it is interesting seeing game theory play out right in front of us regarding short term tariffs and a mini-trade war. I still didn't and would never vote for Trump, but you have to admit, without him in the White House we'd never get a look at how this plays out (and right now, it's playing out in the US's favor).

It is one of the few things that someone like a Trump can do

A run of the mill candidate from either of the landed parties could never touch this with a ten foot pole

It could wind up being a disaster (and I am fairly sure the policy would need to be continued by Trump’s successor)

But it is fascinating to watch fir sure... we are in uncharted territory here and a lot of conventional wisdom is either going to stand, or go out the window after all is said and done

Agree with both of you. As a "fan" of economic policy decisions, I find this interesting.
There are not many things that we can do to reverse the current trade practices, and no true "politician" would do this. So many "experts" say we should work with other countries to gang up on China. But, 1) we have been doing that with little success, and 2) we also have problems with the very countries that we would team up with against China.

So what happens from here?
1. We win and get more favorable trade deals.
2. We reverse the tariffs and go back to pre-2018 trade environment.
3. We adapt to new shifts in trade with other countries as China, and others, look to circumvent the direct trading with us.

We are already seeing #3. China is not buying our soy and is turning to South America. Then we are backfilling South America as they are buying from us. It's a pain in the ass to go in a different direction, but we have the resources to do it.

[JohnStOnge]

China has a totalitarian government. That gives it the ultimate advantage in a situation like this. Its leaders can take a lot more than American leaders can without consequences.

Also, obviously, China is not the one playing the tariffs. Americans are.

[JohnStOnge]

It is one of the few things that someone like a Trump can do

A run of the mill candidate from either of the landed parties could never touch this with a ten foot pole

It could wind up being a disaster (and I am fairly sure the policy would need to be continued by Trump’s successor)

But it is fascinating to watch fir sure... we are in uncharted territory here and a lot of conventional wisdom is either going to stand, or go out the window after all is said and done

Agree with both of you. As a "fan" of economic policy decisions, I find this interesting.
There are not many things that we can do to reverse the current trade practices, and no true "politician" would do this. So many "experts" say we should work with other countries to gang up on China. But, 1) we have been doing that with little success, and 2) we also have problems with the very countries that we would team up with against China.

So what happens from here?
1. We win and get more favorable trade deals.
2. We reverse the tariffs and go back to pre-2018 trade environment.
3. We adapt to new shifts in trade with other countries as China, and others, look to circumvent the direct trading with us.

We are already seeing #3. China is not buying our soy and is turning to South America. Then we are backfilling South America as they are buying from us. It's a pain in the ass to go in a different direction, but we have the resources to do it.

You're buying Trump's bullshit.

[SDHornet]

China has a totalitarian government. That gives it the ultimate advantage in a situation like this. Its leaders can take a lot more than American leaders can without consequences.

Also, obviously, China is not the one playing the tariffs. Americans are.

I dunno, I kinda think some of their "leaders" could end up in a ditch by some non-descript road if things get too sideways for their economy.

Glad to see Trump doing something on trade, God knows no other politico would have the stones to do something meaningful.

[93henfan]

Agree with both of you. As a "fan" of economic policy decisions, I find this interesting.
There are not many things that we can do to reverse the current trade practices, and no true "politician" would do this. So many "experts" say we should work with other countries to gang up on China. But, 1) we have been doing that with little success, and 2) we also have problems with the very countries that we would team up with against China.

So what happens from here?
1. We win and get more favorable trade deals.
2. We reverse the tariffs and go back to pre-2018 trade environment.
3. We adapt to new shifts in trade with other countries as China, and others, look to circumvent the direct trading with us.

We are already seeing #3. China is not buying our soy and is turning to South America. Then we are backfilling South America as they are buying from us. It's a pain in the ass to go in a different direction, but we have the resources to do it.

You're buying Trump's bullshit.

No, he's speaking facts rather than emotion (like you).

[JohnStOnge]

You're buying Trump's bullshit.

No, he's speaking facts rather than emotion (like you).

Seriously? You REALLY think Trump is "speaking facts?" Do you seriously think he EVER does that?

[93henfan]

No, he's speaking facts rather than emotion (like you).

Seriously? You REALLY think Trump is "speaking facts?" Do you seriously think he EVER does that?

Flaggy is speaking facts, dipshit.

[CID1990]

China has a totalitarian government. That gives it the ultimate advantage in a situation like this. Its leaders can take a lot more than American leaders can without consequences.

Also, obviously, China is not the one playing the tariffs. Americans are.

Thanks, Captain Obvious

nobody knew China has the advantage of being a totalitarian state

that fact is fully weighed into the equation when we ask, "will this work?"... As repressive as they are, the leadership still needs to retain power, and if Xi handles this poorly there will still be political consequences that will affect policy

your only opposition here is solely because it is Trump that is trying it- regardless of the fact that it needs to be tried - right now


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[Chizzang]

All we can hope is that "smart people" are learning something about global economics right now...
I say that with a whisper of hope

Look Bozo the clown just landed a forward Aerial Cartwheel with a pike
Give the buffoon some credit - he deserves it

[Ivytalk]

All we can hope is that "smart people" are learning something about global economics right now...
I say that with a whisper of hope

Look Bozo the clown just landed a forward Aerial Cartwheel with a pike
Give the buffoon some credit - he deserves it

Wait until the percentages start going up. It’s just a matter of time before it becomes a worse Game of Chicken.

[CAA Flagship]

All we can hope is that "smart people" are learning something about global economics right now...
I say that with a whisper of hope

Look Bozo the clown just landed a forward Aerial Cartwheel with a pike
Give the buffoon some credit - he deserves it

I don't think he "landed" it yet. At this point in time, he only deserves credit for attempting a maneuver with a high degree of difficulty.

Right now, he is upside down in the air in a blur of orange.

[mainejeff]

All we can hope is that "smart people" are learning something about global economics right now...
I say that with a whisper of hope

Look Bozo the clown just landed a forward Aerial Cartwheel with a pike
Give the buffoon some credit - he deserves it

I don't think he "landed" it yet. At this point in time, he only deserves credit for attempting a maneuver with a high degree of difficulty.

Right now, he is upside down in the air in a blur of orange.

[AZGrizFan]

No, he's speaking facts rather than emotion (like you).

Seriously? You REALLY think Trump is "speaking facts?" Do you seriously think he EVER does that?

Histrionics alert....histrionics alert....JSO just got triggered. Holy shit.

[Chizzang]

Seriously? You REALLY think Trump is "speaking facts?" Do you seriously think he EVER does that?

Histrionics alert....histrionics alert....JSO just got triggered. Holy shit.

[CID1990]

All we can hope is that "smart people" are learning something about global economics right now...
I say that with a whisper of hope

Look Bozo the clown just landed a forward Aerial Cartwheel with a pike
Give the buffoon some credit - he deserves it

Wait until the percentages start going up. It’s just a matter of time before it becomes a worse Game of Chicken.

I’m waiting for the mid-game....

That’s where China literally runs out of US goods to tax, and Trump still has several hundreds of billions in the pocket, ready to go

We’ll see just how robust that coastal economy is over there in Shanghai