U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by CID1990 »

Chizzang wrote:May I calmly say:
Puerto Rico is one supremely **** up place
That has spent a huge amount of ink and advertising blaming everybody else for their problems
And I'm not talking about the hurricane

They should have had a revolution in 1972 (FALN)
There should have been a revolution there in 1997 /1998

You can't help people that are unwilling to help themselves (Period)
That island is exactly as **** up as it has decided to be...

and somehow it's everybody else's fault
(especially America)
I spent a lot of time there in the 80s and 90s.

In 1991 there were still people living in shanties as a result of Hurricane Hugo - two years after the storm

They cobbled together a rickety grid infrastructure to replace the old rickety grid infrastructure, and there haven't been any moves since then to upgrade or harden against these storms

Roads were in worse shape a month ago than they were after Hugo. There were ZERO pre-positioned goods or emergency supplies ANYWHERE in the country, except for what was already in the container port in San Juan -

and now that stuff is stuck there because, as Jon so eloquently pointed out, there's no cell service to call truck drivers <chuckle chuckle>.... because all the Puerto Rican truck drivers are sitting at home thinking, "I wonder when the port of San Juan will call me?"

Puerto Rico is a hard case. They complain about colonialism, resist statehood, and unfortunately the only tenable solution is to leave them as they are. Independence will be a problem because it will be an independent country where every citizen is also a US citizen (and therefore all their children not yet born will be also). Statehood will be a problem because it will kick off an immediate rebellion by anti-US groups, which will then be an absolute morass

At the end of the day, PR is our rebellious goth stepson - we aren't going to change him, and every other holiday he's going to show up at the family gathering, start fights over how we don't respect him, and then storm out of the house until the next holiday (after getting Mom to loan him enough cash to get him through to his next sales job at the mall)
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by Col Hogan »

This is a pretty good article, even if it is HuffPost...I know the Air Force officer interviewed, and he's no-nonsense honest...

It shoots down the argument that the Feds are not doing enough...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/us- ... c468060dee
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by Col Hogan »

CID1990 wrote:
Chizzang wrote:May I calmly say:
Puerto Rico is one supremely **** up place
That has spent a huge amount of ink and advertising blaming everybody else for their problems
And I'm not talking about the hurricane

They should have had a revolution in 1972 (FALN)
There should have been a revolution there in 1997 /1998

You can't help people that are unwilling to help themselves (Period)
That island is exactly as **** up as it has decided to be...

and somehow it's everybody else's fault
(especially America)

I spent a lot of time there in the 80s and 90s.

In 1991 there were still people living in shanties as a result of Hurricane Hugo - two years after the storm

They cobbled together a rickety grid infrastructure to replace the old rickety grid infrastructure, and there haven't been any moves since then to upgrade or harden against these storms

Roads were in worse shape a month ago than they were after Hugo. There were ZERO pre-positioned goods or emergency supplies ANYWHERE in the country, except for what was already in the container port in San Juan -

and now that stuff is stuck there because, as Jon so eloquently pointed out, there's no cell service to call truck drivers <chuckle chuckle>.... because all the Puerto Rican truck drivers are sitting at home thinking, "I wonder when the port of San Juan will call me?"

Puerto Rico is a hard case. They complain about colonialism, resist statehood, and unfortunately the only tenable solution is to leave them as they are. Independence will be a problem because it will be an independent country where every citizen is also a US citizen (and therefore all their children not yet born will be also). Statehood will be a problem because it will kick off an immediate rebellion by anti-US groups, which will then be an absolute morass

At the end of the day, PR is our rebellious goth stepson - we aren't going to change him, and every other holiday he's going to show up at the family gathering, start fights over how we don't respect him, and then storm out of the house until the next holiday (after getting Mom to loan him enough cash to get him through to his next sales job at the mall)
I've been to third-world countries...and I've been to Puerto Rico...

Get outside of San Juan, and you would think you were in a third-world country, not a U.S. Comonwealth
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by houndawg »

GannonFan wrote:
Skjellyfetti wrote:We were able to mobilize 10,000 sailors and marines, 17 ships, 48 helicopters, and 12 aircraft to Haiti within a week after the earthquake in 2010.



[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ecdsc9tIVEg[/youtube]

Took us almost a full week to bother dispatching the USNS Comfort for Puerto Rico. :roll:
Apparently boots on the ground (i.e. local authorities) wanted the priority to be on restoring power to the hospitals on the island itself, rather than relying on ferrying people to an offshore ship. Once they realized the enormity of that task, it was decided to get the ship. Apparently, from a CNN article, we have 10,000 relief workers there and something like 2,500 military personnel. These things aren't quick to clean up, so some idea that we can clean this thing up and get it back to being spiffy in no time at all sounds like partisan sniping rather than objective observation. Heck, I thought the biggest problem was the Jones Act. :coffee:
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by Col Hogan »

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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by AZGrizFan »

Col Hogan wrote:Image
damn you, Hogan! There's no room for FACTS in this discussion!! :tothehand: :tothehand:
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by ALPHAGRIZ1 »

dbackjon wrote:
Skjellyfetti wrote:
I don't think he's saying we're lacking.

Active duty, National Guard, etc.

bingo!

We have tens of thousands trained and under Uncle Sam's control. USE them!
Why?

Its not Texas or Florida
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by CID1990 »

One thing a lot of people are missing in all this is why PR is a financial basket case to begin with

Hint: Puerto Rico in theory is a Bernie Sanders dream - they have free everything

their unions reign supreme

and therefore on pensions and entitlements alone they are 120 billion dollars in the hole- that's Puerto Rico in practice


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Post by Gil Dobie »

At least some of elite are taking action instead of complaining about Trump.

NBC Link

The devastation in Puerto Rico from hurricane Maria has brought singers and ex-spouses Marc Anthony and Jennifer Lopez together again.

The music artists, who were both born to Puerto Rican parents, created “SOMOS UNA VOZ”, a humanitarian initiative “of artists working together to rush food, shelter, medicine, power and communications to those in need from the effects of recent natural disasters”.

The alliance currently has over 30 celebrities from all over the world like Despacito stars Luis Fonsi and Daddy Yankee, Hamilton’s Lin Manuel-Miranda, Ricky Martin, Maluma, Nacho, Ed Sheeran, Bruno Mars, Jada Pinkett Smith, and Pitbull.
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by HI54UNI »

Puerto Rico governor fires emergency director after aid is found sitting in warehouse


Puerto Rico Governor Wanda Vázquez Garced fired the island's emergency management director on Saturday, after a video showing aid sitting unused in a warehouse went viral on social media. Some of the aid has allegedly been sitting in the warehouse since Hurricane Maria struck in 2017.

"There are thousands of people who have made sacrifices to help those in the south, and it is unforgivable that resources were kept in the warehouse," Vázquez said in a statement.

Garced said in a statement that she has ordered Secretary of State Elmer Roman to conduct a "thorough investigation into the mishandling of emergency aid in a warehouse in Ponce," CBS News correspondent David Begnaud reports.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/puerto-ric ... 020-01-18/
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by Ivytalk »

CID1990 wrote:One thing a lot of people are missing in all this is why PR is a financial basket case to begin with

Hint: Puerto Rico in theory is a Bernie Sanders dream - they have free everything

their unions reign supreme

and therefore on pensions and entitlements alone they are 120 billion dollars in the hole- that's Puerto Rico in practice


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Didn’t PR seek some type of bankruptcy protection a few years back? I see your post is from 2017, but that was a hot issue during my last year of law practice. Creditors were pissed.
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by AZGrizFan »

HI54UNI wrote:Puerto Rico governor fires emergency director after aid is found sitting in warehouse


Puerto Rico Governor Wanda Vázquez Garced fired the island's emergency management director on Saturday, after a video showing aid sitting unused in a warehouse went viral on social media. Some of the aid has allegedly been sitting in the warehouse since Hurricane Maria struck in 2017.

"There are thousands of people who have made sacrifices to help those in the south, and it is unforgivable that resources were kept in the warehouse," Vázquez said in a statement.

Garced said in a statement that she has ordered Secretary of State Elmer Roman to conduct a "thorough investigation into the mishandling of emergency aid in a warehouse in Ponce," CBS News correspondent David Begnaud reports.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/puerto-ric ... 020-01-18/
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by ∞∞∞ »

AZGrizFan wrote:Donks ONCE AGAIN with massive egg on their faces. Doesn’t it ever get old, guys? Being wrong all the time?
The fact that some guy didn't do his job is an indictment of Democrats? The hurricane happened while the GOP controlled all branches; where was FEMA's oversight? The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration.

On top of that, the funding PR received was - and still is - pathetic.

I've been traveling back-and-forth to PR for work and it's pretty sad to see how the US has treated the island. SJU is the major airport and to this day, we're still working on fixing it up (off the back of airlines 'cause this admin sucks). The damage at SJU isn't even that bad compared to the rest of PR.
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by AZGrizFan »

∞∞∞ wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:Donks ONCE AGAIN with massive egg on their faces. Doesn’t it ever get old, guys? Being wrong all the time?
The fact that some guy didn't do his job is an indictment of Democrats? The hurricane happened while the GOP controlled all branches; where was FEMA's oversight? The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration.

On top of that, the funding PR received was - and still is - pathetic.

I've been traveling back-and-forth to PR for work and it's pretty sad to see how the US has treated the island. SJU is the major airport and to this day, we're still working on fixing it up (off the back of airlines 'cause this admin sucks). The damage at SJU isn't even that bad compared to the rest of PR.
That’s right. Let the butthurt flow. Blame TRUMP for the PR government incompetence. Right on que.
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by ∞∞∞ »

AZGrizFan wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote: The fact that some guy didn't do his job is an indictment of Democrats? The hurricane happened while the GOP controlled all branches; where was FEMA's oversight? The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration.

On top of that, the funding PR received was - and still is - pathetic.

I've been traveling back-and-forth to PR for work and it's pretty sad to see how the US has treated the island. SJU is the major airport and to this day, we're still working on fixing it up (off the back of airlines 'cause this admin sucks). The damage at SJU isn't even that bad compared to the rest of PR.
That’s right. Let the butthurt flow. Blame TRUMP for the PR government incompetence. Right on que.
Where do I argue that PR's government doesn't deserve some of the blame as well? Once again, you argue something I didn't say. There can be multiple players at fault and the Trump administration is one.
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Re: RE: Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by UNI88 »

∞∞∞ wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:
That’s right. Let the butthurt flow. Blame TRUMP for the PR government incompetence. Right on que.
Where do I argue that PR's government doesn't deserve some of the blame as well? Once again, you argue something I didn't say. There can be multiple players at fault and the Trump administration is one.
Then you probably should have said ended "The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration" with "and the Puerto Rican government." Otherwise it does appear that you're placing the blame on the Trump administration. It's just more naive "your side bad, my side good" BS.

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Re: RE: Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by ∞∞∞ »

UNI88 wrote:Then you probably should have said ended "The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration" with "and the Puerto Rican government." Otherwise it does appear that you're placing the blame on the Trump administration. It's just more naive "your side bad, my side good" BS.
The PR gov't isn't "my side." And now if you make the case about one topic, you're expected to list every other topic also associated with it (on an internet message board nonetheless)? :roll:
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by CAA Flagship »

∞∞∞ wrote: Where do I argue that PR's government doesn't deserve some of the blame as well? Once again, you argue something I didn't say. There can be multiple players at fault and the Trump administration is one.
"The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration."
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by ∞∞∞ »

CAA Flagship wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote: Where do I argue that PR's government doesn't deserve some of the blame as well? Once again, you argue something I didn't say. There can be multiple players at fault and the Trump administration is one.
"The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration."
"FEMA's oversight."
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by AZGrizFan »

∞∞∞ wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:
That’s right. Let the butthurt flow. Blame TRUMP for the PR government incompetence. Right on que.
Where do I argue that PR's government doesn't deserve some of the blame as well? Once again, you argue something I didn't say. There can be multiple players at fault and the Trump administration is one.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: That's just it. You DON'T.
The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration.
You can't even remember what you posted two fucking posts above. Feel free to reread your posts before you show this level of stupidity.
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by ∞∞∞ »

AZGrizFan wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote: Where do I argue that PR's government doesn't deserve some of the blame as well? Once again, you argue something I didn't say. There can be multiple players at fault and the Trump administration is one.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: That's just it. You DON'T.
The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration.
You can't even remember what you posted two fucking posts above. Feel free to reread your posts before you show this level of stupidity.
Read it again. Slower this time. :roll:
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by GannonFan »

∞∞∞ wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: That's just it. You DON'T.



You can't even remember what you posted two fucking posts above. Feel free to reread your posts before you show this level of stupidity.
Read it again. Slower this time. :roll:
Dude, this is like a pattern with you. You get something wrong, and when you get called out on it you just double and triple down in the hope that people won't see what you did. You're almost Trump-like in that way. :coffee:
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

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∞∞∞ wrote:
AZGrizFan wrote:Donks ONCE AGAIN with massive egg on their faces. Doesn’t it ever get old, guys? Being wrong all the time?
The fact that some guy didn't do his job is an indictment of Democrats? The hurricane happened while the GOP controlled all branches; where was FEMA's oversight? The entire thing has been an organizational and logistical mess on the part of the Trump administration.

On top of that, the funding PR received was - and still is - pathetic.

I've been traveling back-and-forth to PR for work and it's pretty sad to see how the US has treated the island. SJU is the major airport and to this day, we're still working on fixing it up (off the back of airlines 'cause this admin sucks). The damage at SJU isn't even that bad compared to the rest of PR.
Wait, shouldn't you be happy those "rich" companies are forced to cover the costs? :suspicious:
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Re: U.S. denies request for Puerto Rico shipping waiver

Post by SDHornet »

GannonFan wrote:
∞∞∞ wrote: Read it again. Slower this time. :roll:
Dude, this is like a pattern with you. You get something wrong, and when you get called out on it you just double and triple down in the hope that people won't see what you did. You're almost Trump-like in that way. :coffee:
It's TDS, JSO suffers from the same thing and does the same shit on his posts. It's really insufferable, yet extremely entertaining at the same time. :lol: :?
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