The Official "Making America Great Again" Thread

[CAA Flagship]

That doesnt' change the fact that all that volume isn't being driven by the .01%'ers...It's mutual fund money. And mutual fund money sits in 401k's.

Sure. But in the long term, does it explain the income gap and the low household savings rate?

What's your solution?

[CID1990]

In you first sentence, you left out “making stupid choices” and “buying the latest iPhone”

You sort of danced around it in the next para, but the bottom line is that we are a runaway consumer society and very few people live within their means (which, BTW, is totally do-able)

I don’t do better than my parents. That’s a choice, not some external force keeping me down. I didn’t want to spend my life reaching into people’s mouths or teaching algebra to other people’s brats. But I love what I do and I do it on the cheap. And when it comes time, I’ll have enough for my kids to go to school (I’m pushing trade school.... college is overrated and if I could go back in time I’d go to one of those Yankee maritime schools and study lofting and drafting)

Every one of the industries you mentioned chases our stupid consumerism. Insurance costs chase our desire to live in that gated community. Healthcare costs chase our desire to live forever (MRI machines cost money)... and every doctor wants the 50 foot Hallberg-Rassy instead of the Baba 40.

We can bitch all we want about these “external” forces all we want, but in the end, as Pogo said, “We have seen the enemy and he is us”

CID, I'd be very interested in a pre/early-retirement career in the USFS. I'd probably want to start after my daughter finishes her freshman year of college in 6 years so I would be 58. Would that be a viable option?

When I went through oral assessments when I was 21 all of my cohort was considerably older and more experienced and a couple were retired.

Come on board! FS forced retirement is 65. I had about 10 classmates in my A-100 class who were 50 and over. One who was 61 and could do only one tour. Wanted to do some public service before hanging it up completely.


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[AZGrizFan]

That doesnt' change the fact that all that volume isn't being driven by the .01%'ers...It's mutual fund money. And mutual fund money sits in 401k's.

Sure. But in the long term, does it explain the income gap and the low household savings rate?

I thought we were talking about the stock market? Not savings rates and income gaps.

[kalm]

Sure. But in the long term, does it explain the income gap and the low household savings rate?

I thought we were talking about the stock market? Not savings rates and income gaps.

I thought we defined economic success by the stock market?

[kalm]

Sure. But in the long term, does it explain the income gap and the low household savings rate?

What's your solution?

That's a tough question, dammit! It's way easier to observe and criticize than come up with solutions.

I'll think on it.

[Chizzang]

Sure. But in the long term, does it explain the income gap and the low household savings rate?

What's your solution?

There is no solution...
What happens in the game of Monopoly every time is what will happen here
The goal then becomes to die before the chaotic end

I'm right on course...

[AZGrizFan]

I thought we were talking about the stock market? Not savings rates and income gaps.

I thought we defined economic success by the stock market?

There you go again, doing your own thinking...that'll get you into nothing but trouble, son.

[kalm]

I thought we defined economic success by the stock market?

There you go again, doing your own thinking...that'll get you into nothing but trouble, son.

It was rhetorical.

[AZGrizFan]

There you go again, doing your own thinking...that'll get you into nothing but trouble, son.

It was rhetorical.

Your thinking?

[SDHornet]

Link?

And of those only 52% of millennial take advantage of it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.c ... -401k.html

That article had nothing about people cashing in 401k's to pay medical bills.

But I agree with all the other comments on this issue. People just need to make better choices with their money.

[kalm]

And of those only 52% of millennial take advantage of it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.c ... -401k.html

That article had nothing about people cashing in 401k's to pay medical bills.

But I agree with all the other comments on this issue. People just need to make better choices with their money.

I thought you were referring to the 65% have access to a 401K part. I personally know of someone who just had to do it to keep with mounting medical expenses and I'm guessing she's far from alone. Healthcare at times has represented 50% of personal bankruptcies.

Here's another article with some related facts on personal debt and lack of savings even for the parents of millenials

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/po ... ts-n862376

Two-thirds of millennials, or 67 percent, said they would have difficulty paying an unexpected bill of $1,000 right away. African-America and Latino millennials would have a harder time coming up with the money than other racial subgroups, according to the survey.

Majorities of millennials across every racial subgroup would have a difficult time paying $1,000 right away, but African-American millennials (72 percent) and Latino millennials (74 percent) would have a harder time paying that bill than Asian-American millennials (65 percent) and white millennials (64 percent).

Nearly half of all millennial parents (48 percent) say they would have a lot of trouble covering an unexpected $1,000 bill compared to 39 percent of those without kids.

According to the survey, a majority of millennials have hit pause on major life events because of what they owe. Debt has caused a third of all millennials, or 34 percent, to hold off on buying a home and 31 percent to delay saving for retirement. It has also affected millennials' family structure. Fourteen percent of millennials have delayed getting married due to debt, and 16 percent have delayed having children.

I also agree that people need to make better choices. The reality is they are not but we also need them to keep spending to hold up the economy.

[BDKJMU]

Of course they should but the fact is too many are not. They're paying down college loans, supporting adult children and their kids, paying for medical bills, and trying to keep up with the Joneses.

As I've mentioned before, the cost of modern living has shot through the roof while disposable income has not (thanks to the costs of education, insurance, healthcare, etc). When we were little kids (guessing you and I are close in age) our parents weren't paying for cable, wifi, cell phones, Flaggy's 11 TV's in the house, and gaming systems. It was far easier to spend within their means. I'm not justifying living beyond one's means but the other kicker is that with an economy that is 2/3's reliant on consumer spending, we NEED them to spend money on these things.

Every generation expects to do better than their parents. Just like the federal government, it's far easier to kick the can down the road than to tighten the belt now and save.

That’s their own stupid fault.

[AZGrizFan]

Of course they should but the fact is too many are not. They're paying down college loans, supporting adult children and their kids, paying for medical bills, and trying to keep up with the Joneses.

As I've mentioned before, the cost of modern living has shot through the roof while disposable income has not (thanks to the costs of education, insurance, healthcare, etc). When we were little kids (guessing you and I are close in age) our parents weren't paying for cable, wifi, cell phones, Flaggy's 11 TV's in the house, and gaming systems. It was far easier to spend within their means. I'm not justifying living beyond one's means but the other kicker is that with an economy that is 2/3's reliant on consumer spending, we NEED them to spend money on these things.

Every generation expects to do better than their parents. Just like the federal government, it's far easier to kick the can down the road than to tighten the belt now and save.

That’s their own stupid fault.

come on, klammy, you're smarter than that. There's not a single thing on that list that's an essential. Not one.

[AZGrizFan]

Here's another article with some related facts on personal debt and lack of savings even for the parents of millenials

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/po ... ts-n862376

Two-thirds of millennials, or 67 percent, said they would have difficulty paying an unexpected bill of $1,000 right away. African-America and Latino millennials would have a harder time coming up with the money than other racial subgroups, according to the survey.

Majorities of millennials across every racial subgroup would have a difficult time paying $1,000 right away, but African-American millennials (72 percent) and Latino millennials (74 percent) would have a harder time paying that bill than Asian-American millennials (65 percent) and white millennials (64 percent).

Nearly half of all millennial parents (48 percent) say they would have a lot of trouble covering an unexpected $1,000 bill compared to 39 percent of those without kids.

And those same 2/3 are covered in thousands of dollars in tattoos, have a $1,000 iPhone 10 on an unlimited data plan, drive a leased BMW, etc., etc., etc....my heart bleeds. Not.

You wanna live for the moment? Fine. Great. Be my guest. But don't bitch and come to me with your hand out when life hits you in the face with a frying pan.

[Chizzang]

That’s their own stupid fault.

come on, klammy, you're smarter than that. There's not a single thing on that list that's an essential. Not one.

It's amazing how owning 10 and 12 year old vehicles
cooking your own food and not eating out
Not drinking and partying

literally adding nothing to your life that you do not need
adds an astounding amount of "extra" cash flow

My girlfriend and I started practicing a few simple rules about 8 years ago
it's absolutely crazy how much money flows outward on just complete shyte
which you only recognize after you STOP pouring down the drain

[GannonFan]

come on, klammy, you're smarter than that. There's not a single thing on that list that's an essential. Not one.

It's amazing how owning 10 and 12 year old vehicles
cooking your own food and not eating out
Not drinking and partying

literally adding nothing to your life that you do not need
adds an astounding amount of "extra" cash flow

My girlfriend and I started practicing a few simple rules about 8 years ago
it's absolutely crazy how much money flows outward on just complete shyte
which you only recognize after you STOP pouring down the drain

Agreed.

[AZGrizFan]

come on, klammy, you're smarter than that. There's not a single thing on that list that's an essential. Not one.

It's amazing how owning 10 and 12 year old vehicles
cooking your own food and not eating out
Not drinking and partying

literally adding nothing to your life that you do not need
adds an astounding amount of "extra" cash flow

My girlfriend and I started practicing a few simple rules about 8 years ago
it's absolutely crazy how much money flows outward on just complete shyte
which you only recognize after you STOP pouring down the drain

Some people would define those "things" as "life".

[Chizzang]

It's been a life changing experience (I'm being sincere)

We read a study on upper income American couples and we were stunned
The average America couple that have a combined household income of over $250K

1) have two HUGE car payments / over purchased
2) High Rent or High Mortgage / over purchased
3) They eat out 3 or 4 times a week / spend too much on food
4) They party and spend over $300 a week on entertainment
5) They have over $15k each of revolving credit card debt

an absolute nightmare!
My brother... challenged us to apply this new information to our lives

TODAY:
We now both have 800+ credit scores
Zero revolving debt
We cook at home and we almost never eat out
We ride bikes for entertainment
No car payments

It's amazing

[89Hen]

It's been a life changing experience (I'm being sincere)

We read a study on upper income American couples and we were stunned
The average America couple that have a combined household income of over $250K

1) have two HUGE car payments / over purchased
2) High Rent or High Mortgage / over purchased
3) They eat out 3 or 4 times a week / spend too much on food
4) They party and spend over $300 a week on entertainment
5) They have over $15k each of revolving credit card debt

We have one car payment of $300 and that's only because I got 0.9% financing
My PITI is under $2000
We eat out an average of 2x a week, but one of those is usually carry out
No way we spend that on entertainment per week
Zero revolving debt for over 20 years

However, I estimate that we've spent over $450,000 after tax dollars on tuition on two kids.

[Chizzang]

It's been a life changing experience (I'm being sincere)

We read a study on upper income American couples and we were stunned
The average America couple that have a combined household income of over $250K

1) have two HUGE car payments / over purchased
2) High Rent or High Mortgage / over purchased
3) They eat out 3 or 4 times a week / spend too much on food
4) They party and spend over $300 a week on entertainment
5) They have over $15k each of revolving credit card debt

We have one car payment of $300 and that's only because I got 0.9% financing
My PITI is under $2000
We eat out an average of 2x a week, but one of those is usually carry out
No way we spend that on entertainment per week
Zero revolving debt for over 20 years

However, I estimate that we've spent over $450,000 after tax dollars on tuition on two kids.

Excellent..!
Interesting to note - these couples that fall in this category
Tend to max their credit because everybody will give them max credit

It's a trap
and they end up buried
with a house that was 20% more expensive than they should have purchased but were approved for
two cars that's 50% more expensive than they should have purchased but were approved for



throw in a boat and a motorcycle and bingo...

[CAA Flagship]

It's been a life changing experience (I'm being sincere)

We read a study on upper income American couples and we were stunned
The average America couple that have a combined household income of over $250K

1) have two HUGE car payments / over purchased
2) High Rent or High Mortgage / over purchased
3) They eat out 3 or 4 times a week / spend too much on food
4) They party and spend over $300 a week on entertainment
5) They have over $15k each of revolving credit card debt

We have one car payment of $300 and that's only because I got 0.9% financing
My PITI is under $2000
We eat out an average of 2x a week, but one of those is usually carry out
No way we spend that on entertainment per week
Zero revolving debt for over 20 years

However, I estimate that we've spent over $450,000 after tax dollars on tuition on two kids.

Club membership?

[93henfan]

Yeah man, kids are the killer. Not looking forward to tuition, but child support ends at the same time, so it won’t be that bad.

841 FICO
Zero credit card debt.
I don’t party much at all.
I do eat out most of the time, but that’s because I’m a single guy and hate cooking. It’s totally worth it.
My rental property is a big net positive after taxes.
I have a very stable, well paying job for my means, tons of time off, great benefits, and live in a low-cost area.
Low stress, baby!

I’m with Chizzang. I played the debt game as a 20-something. Not worth it.

[CAA Flagship]

Yeah man, kids are the killer. Not looking forward to tuition, but child support ends at the same time, so it won’t be that bad.

841 FICO
Zero credit card debt.
I don’t party much at all.
I do eat out most of the time, but that’s because I’m a single guy and hate cooking. It’s totally worth it.
My rental property is a big net positive after taxes.
I have a very stable, well paying job for my means, tons of time off, great benefits, and live in a low-cost area.
Low stress, baby!

I’m with Chizzang. I played the debt game as a 20-something. Not worth it.

SELL THAT BITCH NOW

[93henfan]

Yeah man, kids are the killer. Not looking forward to tuition, but child support ends at the same time, so it won’t be that bad.

841 FICO
Zero credit card debt.
I don’t party much at all.
I do eat out most of the time, but that’s because I’m a single guy and hate cooking. It’s totally worth it.
My rental property is a big net positive after taxes.
I have a very stable, well paying job for my means, tons of time off, great benefits, and live in a low-cost area.
Low stress, baby!

I’m with Chizzang. I played the debt game as a 20-something. Not worth it.

SELL THAT BITCH NOW

Context for those not privy to our texts: My tenant just gave notice on Aug 1, so I have to rent again or sell starting Sep 1.

My property manager (also a realtor) broke down the local market for me. In my selling price range, there is currently 10 months of inventory, so I could expect to wait some time on a sale, and we’re not in a prime listing time. You want to list your house in early May, ideally.

So, I’m renting it again. I’ve never had any significant occupancy gap on the home. It’s minutes from Dover AFB and there’s usually always a new pilot and his family looking for a nice-sized home in a great neighborhood.

I’ve built some really nice equity in the house in the last five years or so and that should only keep getting better.

[89Hen]

Club membership?

That's a big pill to swallow.